A report on Hasbro factory

[VERT]

I just found this report on a Hasbro factory. This is where some of our TF are made.

Kinda expected this bit its not a nice place. :mad:

issuu.com/iglhr/docs/hasbro/search/13

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Probably standard Chinese factory etiquette...

[griffin]

It makes me sad reading that. So much of my happiness has been at the expense of slave labour. Hands up anyone who would want to sit at a cramped table for 11 hours a day, building 7 Transformers an hour, for about $1 an hour? If only there was some way of changing that situation.
(see, isn't this one of those situations that a UN should be addressing - protecting the rights and welfare of any disadvantaged people in the world... so that one country isn't taking advantage of others because they wouldn't be allowed to have slave labour in their own country)

This explains why Hasbro repeatedly refused my requests for some info or pics of the construction process (I've always been curious to see how these complex things are constructed, from start to finish).
It's a sad, but not surprising report. The western world is so dependant on cheap foreign "slave" labour, that economies would collapse if there were universal workers' rights and minimum wages... because we are so used to "cheap" imported goods, it now drives our economies (retail is apparently our biggest employment group, so imagine the reduced turnover of sales if we had to pay 10 times as much for the stuff that is imported - due to them being paid a tenth of what people here would be paid).

I remember a recent "off the record" comment from someone high up at Hasbro, talking about Mattel's manufacturing ethics and standards... either they are both as bad as each other, or Mattel is even worse... or propaganda within Hasbro isn't allowing too many employees realise how the company is managing to generate so much profit from such cheap product.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

It makes me sad reading that. So much of my happiness has been at the expense of slave labour.Yeah, this.
It's not totally unexpected but kinda disappointing all the same.:(

[griffin]

At least with buying Australian made where-ever possible (which isn't easy these days), there is less chance that what you are buying was produced with slave labour like this.
(we do have sweat shops in Australia, often from people taking advantage of migrant workers who either don't know their entitlements, or don't want to risk being deported... they are illegal and should be shut down)

[GoktimusPrime]

The link doesn't work for me. :( However I remember Tiby posting this article from Choice magazine (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=1693) which showed Hasbro's ETI rating as - while certainly having room for improvement - being relatively okay by the standards of factories in developing nations.

Another alternative is to do what companies like Lego do and move their manufacturing to more developed countries (like Denmark, Germany, Croatia etc.) -- but then that would massively increase the cost of the toys... and even with the dirt-cheap Chinese labour, Transformers are expensive enough as it is. Makes you kinda wonder why Transformers are so expensive if their manufacturing costs are so cheap... (-_-)

[griffin]

It's only expensive outside of America and HK, thanks to the extra profit margin imposed on other Hasbro markets like ours. And keep in mind that Hasbro America is making billions each year of profit... funded by the huge gap between the price and the costs we now know.
Like if a Deluxe figure is about US$12 at retail in America, Hasbro is selling it for about $7-8 to the retailers (RRP is usually set at about 40% margin for profit and other costs). Take that same ratio for Australian Deluxe figures, a retail price of $25 here would mean about $14-16 pre-GST price to retailers here.
So if Hasbro America is already making $3-4 profit from their standard $7-8 price to America retailers for every Deluxe toy sold in America, every Deluxe toy in Australia would have to be earning Hasbro America an *extra* $8-10... which gives a total profit margin (up to $14 per figure) that is MORE than what Americans are paying for their Deluxe toys.
That's why the toys are disproportionately expensive here. And knowing how little Hasbro pays to make these toys (about $2 per Deluxe), makes it even more frustrating that we are forced to pay $25-30 here for that $2 Deluxe toy.

[kup]

I think it's been pulled. I can't see anything on the link.


Makes you kinda wonder why Transformers are so expensive if their manufacturing costs are so cheap... (-_-)

One doesn't have to wonder, it's to get a higher profit margin rather than saving costs for the consumer.

[reillyd]

A followup on http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/12/21/hasbro-responds-allegations-of-harsh-conditions-for-transformers-workers-china/

includes hasbro's response.

Now I don't feel guilting buying loose Star Wars figures for a buck, from people who slip them out of the factory!

[primatives]

i feel so bad for those guys and its not right but i'd find it hard not to buy TF's its something we all share the same passion for.

[kup]

I remember reading some time ago that Slave labor is a lot more common today than what it was during colonial times when slaves were openly bought and sold.

I think that the only difference is that Slavery is now more subtle or 'masked' than it was before but it is still there.

[reillyd]

The Institute also draws irony from Hasbro’s allowance of a voluntary code for the conditions of labour, with the very strong legal remedies they enforce for copyright and trademark infringement.

Gee. I wonder if anyone is going to be going to bat for Hasbro's Intellectual Property in a certain thread after considering this. But I guess that's one of the advantages of working in some of these countries, where laws are flexible or absent of protections. Do you think Takara toys are made in the same factories, or just Hasbro? That would be one factor that would shift me completely to TakaraTomy products over Hasbro.

[kup]

Here is a link to the full report from the website reillyd provided:

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/12/21/hasbro-hit-by-sweatshop-allegations-over-bumblebee-other-transformers/


Workers housed in filthy, over-crowded dorms, infested with rats and bed bugs. Workers report theycannot sleep at night from the bed bug bites.Workers describe factory food as “Pretty much like swine food.”Workers allowed less than 9 minutes to assemble each Hasbro Transformer, for which they are paid 17 cents .

“We are drenched in sweat,” workers say. Factory temperatures soar to 104 degrees F in summer.

During peak season, workers toil 12-hour shifts, seven days a week, while earning a take-home wageof just 92 cents an hour.

Workers undergo three body-searches each day, are not permitted to talk or lift their heads to look around, and need permission to use the bathroom.

Hasbro is open to the hiring of 14 and 15-year-olds on a “case-by-case basis.”

Workers in the spray paint department fear they are being exposed to dangerous solvents.

There are no fire drills and some emergency exits are locked.

During the slow season, hundreds of workers are fired under false charges so management does not have to pay their legal severance.

Workers are cheated of paid sick leave and maternity leave.

Workers describe their work as mindless, miserable, constantly monotonous, yet furious and exhausting.

[SharkyMcShark]

It's not been pulled, you've just got to click on the pamphlet cover (its in the top right hand corner) to get the full thing in the link from the OP

[reillyd]

It makes me sad reading that. So much of my happiness has been at the expense of slave labour. Hands up anyone who would want to sit at a cramped table for 11 hours a day, building 7 Transformers an hour, for about $1 an hour? If only there was some way of changing that situation.

So imagine the reduced turnover of sales if we had to pay 10 times as much for the stuff that is imported - due to them being paid a tenth of what people here would be paid).


Well considering that we pay at least double what the RRP should be, and that deep sales in the US sometimes have toys at 30-60% off that, I'd gladly pay a little more if it would ACTUALLY get to the workers. And I'd much rather they get the markup than distributors like HasbroAU. Heck, I'd probably be willing to donate a portion of my purchases to a charity that would pass it directly on to the workers. I suspect many collectors would. Since we have big budgets anyway, if we have just a few less plastic robots in our collection to know that we weren't preying on the misery of others, it wouldn't be such a bad thing.

[VERT]

Im still disgusted at how hasbro is doing this. I always said they had slaves but never anything like this. And this is just one place in china. What about Vietnam? Wonder what that factory is like.

If Takara make them in a better factory I should boycott Hasbro TFs. Makes me feel better about all the shonky loose figure deals over the years.

Would be happy if some of the money would actually go to the workers

[Sam]

As I read this, a few thoughts are going through my mind.

By buying Hasbro's products, in a sense I am contributing to this system of practice, because I demonstrate that I am fulfilling the supply that they generate.

(By the way, just to clarify, I don't say this as a way of judging people that buy TFs, I am only referring to myself personally)

China also needs to shoulder its fair share of responsibility. The nation overall has serious ethical / corruption problems at all levels of society. Its people are not valued as human beings. In such an environment, it is not surprising that workers are not afforded the rights that workers in other nations have.

I am struggling with whether to continue buying TFs. Although I only buy a few each year, when I do see a nice TF figure I usually buy it.

[Paulbot]

Hasbro's response (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/12/21/hasbro-responds-allegations-of-harsh-conditions-for-transformers-workers-china/)


Hasbro takes all claims involving working conditions very seriously, and we are immediately investigating. The Company has a strong track record and has had long-standing policies and processes in place for years to help ensure good working conditions, including health and safety, at factories making our products. We strive to conduct business throughout our supply chain in accordance with the highest ethical standards, and we utilize not only ICTI– but also our own on-the-ground workforce– to monitor social compliance. For more information about Hasbro’s comprehensive corporate social responsibility (CSR) activities, including more detail regarding Hasbro’s policies and practices related to ethical product manufacturing, please visit Hasbro.com/csr.

[Quickstrike]

Do you think Takara toys are made in the same factories, or just Hasbro?

I'm pretty sure all Transformers are made in the same factories. Hasbro and Takara.

[Robzy]

This is disgusting :mad:, but sadly not surprising :(

I agree that China has a lot to answer for... so does Hasbro. I was having this conversation with someone the other day, in regard to China's bad social and work practices.

I notice this hasn't been discussed on any other forum except here (at least at the time I'm writing this). Will be interesting to see what happens once it hits the international sites, and also what Hasbro's next move is. I will be following this closely.

[Prowl]

Most of the goods we consume are made by "slave" labour in little more than concentration camps. Just a hard reality of a global marketplace.

You can take a moral stand & not purchase their products & only buy products that are ethically & sustainably sourced or you can not care & buy them anyway.

[griffin]

Forcing a cultural change from this dependency that western/developed countries have of the poorer countries cheaply produced goods, is something that will take time, but can happen.... just see how we now have things like "free range" (a response to caged animals), and "ethical" coffee, tea and chocolate (a response to western corporations taking advantage of the desperate impoverished people in developing nations, who's governments use them as mere commodities instead of as citizens or people).

[griffin]

I notice this hasn't been discussed on any other forum except here (at least at the time I'm writing this). Will be interesting to see what happens once it hits the international sites, and also what Hasbro's next move is. I will be following this closely.

The competing Global fan forums probably don't want to highlight it or front-page it as news, in case Hasbro cuts them off, and they are then at a disadvantage to the other sites.
I was reading through the comments on TFW2005 (http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-general-discussion/508020-news-story-about-hasbro-working-conditions-11.html), and there was talk about it not being Hasbro's fault (as in, it is okay to be blissfully ignorant of what goes on in factories they don't own, as long as they get their product in the end), as well as justifying it as being in the best interests of those being exploited (because they have a job, no matter how bad it is).
Both are true, but the point people are making here (and are most disgusted by) is that Hasbro are making $500 million profit each year, with its Exec earning $23million, but don't want the people creating that profit, earn anything more than a $1 an hour, or make sure that they have clean living & working conditions.
Yes, a lot of those workers are desperate for any employment, and would be worse off without the factory job, but should we be happy with squalled living & working conditions, or question why their own government would allow its people to be exploited... not to mention, leaving western corporations unchecked, to employ people in a manner that they wouldn't be allowed to in their own country.
Conversely, for all we know, Hasbro/Tomy have made sure that those working & living conditions are actually better than other factories. It may not be worth boasting about, but unless we find out that this is normal or worse than other Chinese factories, we may just have to give Hasbro/Tomy the benefit of the doubt on this. (remember, Hasbro uses Tomy to find and contract these chinese factories - so Hasbro aren't as directly responsible as Tomy or the factory owners are)


Ultimately, the whole concept of outsourcing (or privatisation, when the government does it) causes these problems. Companies or entrepreneurs bid to win a contract, so the lower they go to win the contract, means less to spend on resources and employees.
In this case, we have factories in China & Vietnam bidding for these big toy contracts, and if one had to quote (say) $2 per Deluxe toy just to win the contract, then that is the rate that the factory owner is paid - and that's all the factory owner has available to spend to produce those products, as well as to end up with their own profit.
So if Hasbro were using a factory that was quoting $3 per unit, and another one said they could do it for $2 per unit (because they weren't wanting to pay their employees as much or provide good working conditions), what do you think the "bonus driven" execs would want to do to boost their own pay packet.
I'd much rather see companies share the success to all employees, not just the elite at the top of the pyramid... after all, if a business is successful enough to give the execs a double-digit percentage pay rise, it's a double standard to only give other people within the business (the lower level workers) a 2-4% pay rise that most get these days. The reverse would be worth asking as well - if execs claim to only be able to afford an extra 3% to their employees during wage negotiations, then they should be held to that same "affordability rate".

Yeah I know, it'd never happen. I guess I'm just too idealistic... :o

[GoktimusPrime]

Also remember that living and working conditions/standards are different from the Western world. Looking at those photos, they just look typical of how a lot of places in China look like... I've seen worse. I've also seen better.

So while I'm not disagreeing that worker conditions should improve, we need to be careful not to use Western standards as a measuring bar... look at what conditions exist in an average Chinese factory and get them to lift their bar up to the standard for their country. I think that is a far more realistically achievable and sustainable goal.

And I hope that Hasbro pays for this through reducing their substantial profit margins and not passing the cost onto consumers. Corporations like Cadbury made a decision to use non-slave labour and absorbed the costs themselves for their Dairy Milk chocolates - choosing not to increase the cost of their products and passing the additional cost to consumers. I hope that Hasbro follows suit with this.


Gee. I wonder if anyone is going to be going to bat for Hasbro's Intellectual Property in a certain thread after considering this.
I don't even see how that's relevant... this notion/suggestion that just because Hasbro's factory may be lacking in work standards, that it justifies stealing from them?? (either in a physical sense, such as toys from factories, or intellectual sense) That's like saying, "That man underpays his workers. I'm gonna break in and steal his TV... justice!!" <---what?! :confused:

Stealing from Hasbro or encouraging stealing from Hasbro doesn't help improve working conditions for their factory workers. If you really want to take action you can do something like boycott their products (admittedly I can't do this :p), sign a petition, contact Hasbro directly and let them know how you feel (e.g. letter, email etc.) -- take more positive and/or proactive measures.

The idea of using the lack of standards in HasTak's factory to justify purchasing stolen or counterfeit goods seems utterly illogical and nonsensical to me.


But I guess that's one of the advantages of working in some of these countries, where laws are flexible or absent of protections.
I honestly don't think that was HasTak's motivation for basing their manufacturing in countries like China... the reason would be because of the very cheap labour costs. And this is something that China encourages, because it's a big source of their economic prosperity.

I've seen no evidence to show that HasTak were actively aware of the conditions in their Chinese factory -- even when they do inspections it's too easy for the bosses to cover things up. And to Hasbro's credit they have said that they are investigating these allegations -- which I think is a reasonable act at this stage.


Do you think Takara toys are made in the same factories, or just Hasbro? That would be one factor that would shift me completely to TakaraTomy products over Hasbro.
Pretty sure it's the same factory.

[kup]

Unfortunately all this is a reality of modern consumerism and the global economy. Economically the world is now one big nation with some countries serving as the factories and labour force and others as the raw resource providers and end consumers.

From this system, exploitation is bound to happen as not all nations place value in enforcing human rights and corporate culture is all about money not the morality of how that money is obtained.

It is a horrible amoral system but unfortunately the world now runs and depends on it and even if you actively choose not to support it by boycotting Hasbro, you are probably still contributing to the system by buying mundane things like shopping, tools and other products made in China. The only way not to contribute to it would be to give up society and go and live in the bush and of course that is not an option for most.

When it comes to the people in the international boards being apathetic or excusing Hasbro, that is to be expected. A lot of people have been brought up in very a centric consumerist culture and are very insular in their way of thinking. If working conditions were found to be like that in their own nation, they would be in uproar.

[Robzy]

The competing Global fan forums probably don't want to highlight it or front-page it as news, in case Hasbro cuts them off, and they are then at a disadvantage to the other sites.


When it comes to the people in the international boards being apathetic or excusing Hasbro, that is to be expected. A lot of people have been brought up in very a centric consumerist culture and are very insular in their way of thinking. If working conditions were found to be like that in their own nation, they would be in uproar.

Certainly says A LOT about the integrity of those US sites doesn't it?!! :rolleyes:

Goes to show that they're exactly like many media outlets... they edit their news and only give out info they think we need to know (or only what they want us to know). Another reason why I don't interact on those sites anymore; it's pretty pathetic tbh.

I'm glad this site is not like that!



the point people are making here (and are most disgusted by) is that Hasbro are making $500 million profit each year, with its Exec earning $23million, but don't want the people creating that profit, earn anything more than a $1 an hour, or make sure that they have clean living & working conditions.

Similar (but not the same) as what's going on in our own country... take a look at QANTAS for example! I don't know how many of these CEOs justify the money they earn, let alone doing it on the back of "slave labour".

[5FDP]

I am struggling with whether to continue buying TFs. Although I only buy a few each year, when I do see a nice TF figure I usually buy it.

^ This. I guess we'll wait and see what Hasbro reports back after their investigations.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

I'm glad this site is not like that!Yeah, thanks for telling it like it is @Griff.

[kup]

I don't even see how that's relevant... this notion/suggestion that just because Hasbro's factory may be lacking in work standards, that it justifies stealing from them?? (either in a physical sense, such as toys from factories, or intellectual sense) That's like saying, "That man underpays his workers. I'm gonna break in and steal his TV... justice!!" <---what?!

http://nicedisneyworld.com/disney-pic/robin-hood-18.jpg

[GoktimusPrime]

#OCCUPYHASBRO

Anyone feel like camping out at Epping? :p

[VERT]

http://nicedisneyworld.com/disney-pic/robin-hood-18.jpg


Thats right hahahahahahah ;):D

[GoktimusPrime]

Of course the main differences being that:

1. Robin Hood stole from the rich and gave to the poor. When was the last time anyone here received free counterfeits from counterfeit manufacturers? Fansubbers create and distribute their works for free and stop fansubbing/distribution once licence is acquired by a company like ADV. I might understand KOers selling their products at a cost that just covers their manufacturing costs, but not making a profit - that's what a lot of fan artists do, like people who make/sell doujinshi. One example was Ichikawa Hirofumi who sold his Cybertron Chronicles comic at BotCon Japan 2000; the price calculated for him to break even and cover his costs... he had no intention of profiting. Takara then stepped in and ordered him to give his comics away for free which generated massive negative fan backlash against Takara because Ichikawa was clearly providing a product made by fans for fans (and also, it was his own original works and not a pirated product). Takara have since made amends by letting Ichikawa work with them on several projects. But as I understand it, KO toys are sold with a profit margin... so unless KO makers reduce the price of their toys so as to reduce their profits to around break even points (as is the case with doujinshi), then I really cannot see how they can take any kind of moral high ground. It puts them in the same boat as Hasbro -- people out to make a profit; and there's nothing necessarily wrong with this... but we do question profiteering when it comes at an unacceptable expense -- in the case of the allegations regarding Hasbro's factory, it's a human expense, in the case of KO makers, it's at the expense of intellectual property. Two wrongs don't make a right.

2. The Sherriff of Nottingham consciously knew and permitted his practices to worsen the lives of the people. So far it doesn't seem apparent that Hasbro were consciously aware that these questionable practices were happening, and to Hasbro's credit, they did say that they will investigate (whereas please for the Sherriff to help people fell on deaf ears).

3. The story of Robin Hood is about an uprising against corrupt authority - much like say the Rebel Alliance or the movements we saw in Tunisia, Egypt and Libya recently. Hasbro may be a big toy corporation... but they're hardly a government. But I understand that corporations do have massive influence over governments... hence the suggestion to #occupyHasbro. If I were a single dude without needing to worry about a family... I'd seriously consider pitching a tent in Epping (or Pawtucket Rhode Island if I lived around there).

Could Hasbro have been more proactive rather than reactive? Absolutely... but it's not like they're ignoring the problem and doing nothing about it.

[VERT]

don't think anyone said a thing about ko stuff gok.

[SkyWarp91]

Yes we know it's horrible and harsh what these workers endure to make us our beloved toys, and we do wish somehow they are better off - but at the end of the day, i.e. realistically, do we care enough and are willing to dedicate ourselves to changing these conditions?

We could somehow contribute to having toys being made in much better circumstances, but if in that situation the costs arise would we be willing to pay higher prices at our expense?

Some of us would, some of us won't. It's one of the odd ways how societies and the values they hold works.

Slave labouring has been around forever unfortunately and though we would like to think we can put an end to it, it's much, much easier said than done.

I don't know a solution to this problem, but in the meantime I guess the best I could do is to take greater appreciation for all the toys I have. We do live in a very privileged side of the world after all...

[colin78]

Hey boys and girls,

Here is a pdf link to the complete report. I downloaded it a few days ago before it got removed.

http://www.globallabourrights.org/admin/reports/files/Holidays-by-Hasbro.pdf

[GoktimusPrime]

don't think anyone said a thing about ko stuff gok.

Simplified overview (for more detail, please review the actual posts themselves):

Post #9: reillyd said he feels less guilty now for buying cheap toys stolen from Hasbro's factory.

Post #12: reillyd said he wondered if anyone was going to continue supporting Hasbro's IP considering the recent allegations regarding their factory workers.

Post #24: I said that I didn't see the logic behind this - i.e. how Hasbro having poor factory employee standards justifies stealing from Hasbro. Two wrongs don't make a right.

#29: kup responded with his post of Robin Hood.

#31: you implied agreement with this analogy.

#32: I discussed the differences between the analogy and what's actually happening here with Hasbro (and those who choose to steal their property for profit).

Likewise those who steal toys from factories sell them later at profit. When I was in China I found one collectable toy store that sold out-of-factory DotM toys for close to what we would pay here for the toys MOSC! Although hopefully if working conditions/wages in Hasbro's factory improved it may discourage workers from stealing in the first place... they probably do it to make more money to supplement their paltry wages/conditions.

Again, I really hope that if this happens Hasbro won't pass the cost onto consumers. Considering the massive profit margins Hasbro already makes on these toys, they should be able to absorb the costs without passing it onto customers. After all, we see chocolate manufacturers improve the ethical standards of their cocoa harvesting without increasing the cost of their chocolates (the companies having publicly admitted that they are absorbing the added costs themselves).

[Sutton]

I wouldn't just be thinking about your TF collection. Look around your house at all the plastic appliances and knick-knacks you have that are made in China and cost a lot less than they should. We're all pretty good at blinding ourselves to the evil we perpetrate every time we buy a cheap toaster or kettle. It's like the defense that sickos who look at kiddie porn use, 'I didn't abuse the kid personally so it doesn't count'. But the kids are abused in the first place because the market exists. We buy these cheap items in the first place and continue to buy these things. It's our fault, there's no way around it. It's the failing of a capitalist society.

I wouldn't worry about having to do anything about it as such, China is close to hitting critical mass in terms of population/food supply/power supply. When that happens and the rapid expansion stops, things will change. Big companies may look to other developing nations for a time, but it won't last long. Boycotting Hasbro will only mean something if you're prepared to forgo all the other items in your house bought so cheap.

People talk about Hasbro being proactive rather than reactive, but in the history of society this just doesn't happen. No country or company ever does anything until after a critical event happens. Germany built up military equipment and personnel and marched them right to the French border in complete breach of the existing treaties. No one did a thing until they rolled through Belgium. We've been talking about ozone layers, el ninos and global warming since the early 80's, and only now talking about doing something.

We're the mouse that keeps coming back to the electrified cheese.

I wonder what the cost of a deluxe TF would go up to if they moved production back to the US, or improved conditions and wages in asia? Would you be willing to pay $35 - $40 for a deluxe TF? Add to that the rising cost of oil and it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect a $50 price tag in the next decade.

Your TFC Hercules suddenly doesn't seem so expensive.

[kup]

#29: kup responded with his post of Robin Hood.



Note that my post with Robin Hood was in direct response to what you said (which is quoted on the same post).

What you basically said there is the reason why figures such as Robin Hood are admired. However there may not be a Robin Hood in this situation but Hasbro (along with several other US corporations) do behave like Prince John or the Sheiff of Naughtingham not through direct evil but outright amorality and selfishness.

What the Sheriff wanted was to fill up his coffers without any regard for how this action was affecting their peasant class. Hasbro is pretty much doing the same thing and I am pretty sure that their 'we'll investigate' is pure PR. Once this blows over it will be 'business as usual'.

[Sutton]

Hasbro is pretty much doing the same thing and I am pretty sure that their 'we'll investigate' is pure PR. Once this blows over it will be 'business as usual'.

Absolutely.

I'm astonished they replied at all, since that can sometimes dig a deeper hole...

[Arcee]

What the Sheriff wanted was to fill up his coffers without any regard for how this action was affecting their peasant class. Hasbro is pretty much doing the same thing and I am pretty sure that their 'we'll investigate' is pure PR. Once this blows over it will be 'business as usual'.

Exactly. Both classic and modern economics advocate that the only purpose of companies is to profit; and corporate value lies in the maximization of shareholder value, which is the residual profit anyway. Performances of executives and staff and share prices are all linked to revenue increase and cost reduction. Those executives are brought up in an economic morale and profit is their only belief; whoever even tries to uphold social responsibilities (beyond what their local legislation requires) would never end up climbing to their executive chairs in the first place.

And yes, to be fair, indeed the Hasbro factories' working conditions are far from the worst in China. Nor is Foxcom for Apple, whose product many of us cannot live without, and whose workers are not opting for suicide only because they were forced to sign the agreement to no compensation. White collar workers in China are nowhere near better off; >18hrs of continuous stressful work per day that last for most months of the year has caused death rate among young people aged 22 to 35 to soar, and they are not getting paid one extra cent for putting their blood into their work.

Yes there is legislation and all that. But what choice do you have when there are one billion population (with 8 million fresh uni graduates each year adding to the ever growing work force) fighting their life for far less jobs, there's always someone who's willing to kill both you and themselves to get the job? Let alone say the whole system is bureaucratic and inefficient and rotten as hell. Western companies are shifting manufacturing to Vietnam as China has gradually becoming slightly more expensive; and the whole nation's (not just the government) mentality is to maintain the current high GDP growth rate at ANY cost.

For someone who's born and raised in that very country, I know the origins of problems and difficulties of changes there. It'll sure evolve over time; but that's a historical process taking place in hundreds of years. China boasts that it's leaped the historical process in 50 years; it has not. No country ever can. Simply applying the western way wouldn't help in a country like that, as its government is only one of the product of its most original problems, but not the origin itself.

For the near future that's relevant to our life, I see no way out of the problem, peaceful or not.

[Prowl]

like Cadbury made a decision to use non-slave labour and absorbed the costs themselves for their Dairy Milk chocolates - choosing not to increase the cost of their products and passing the additional cost to consumers.

That is simply not true. Kraft instead chose to decrease package sizes (like most other food manufacturers) to increase profit margins whilst maintaining the same shelf price to mislead the consumer.

[Prowl]

So far it doesn't seem apparent that Hasbro were consciously aware that these questionable practices were happening, and to Hasbro's credit, they did say that they will investigate (whereas please for the Sherriff to help people fell on deaf ears).


Hasbro know through their gross margin lines the type of conditions their subcontracted labour force works under. They just choose like so many others to ignore it & hope it will go away. As for their "investigation" the only thing they will investigate is how to minimise the global impact on their products due to the negative publicity. I am not saying Hasbro are any different or worse than the other global corporations who profit from others misery. It is what it is unfortunately.

Are Hasbro signatories to some form of global fair trade/sustainability agreement? Not sure what it is called but I do quite a bit with PEFC & FSC certified products & the companies that have those certifications pay a huge premium to do so & are regularly audited to ensure they comply on all levels globally. It is the same deal with Rainforest Alliance & Fair Trade coffee/tea manufacturers.

[1orion2many]

Yes we know it's horrible and harsh what these workers endure to make us our beloved toys, and we do wish somehow they are better off - but at the end of the day, i.e. realistically, do we care enough and are willing to dedicate ourselves to changing these conditions?

We could somehow contribute to having toys being made in much better circumstances, but if in that situation the costs arise would we be willing to pay higher prices at our expense?

Some of us would, some of us won't. It's one of the odd ways how societies and the values they hold works.

Slave labouring has been around forever unfortunately and though we would like to think we can put an end to it, it's much, much easier said than done.

I don't know a solution to this problem, but in the meantime I guess the best I could do is to take greater appreciation for all the toys I have. We do live in a very privileged side of the world after all...

I would have thought the price we pay would already cover a better wage, Unfortunately it doesn't go to the people who need just the Fat Cats at the top.

[Prowl]

Exactly. Both classic and modern economics advocate that the only purpose of companies is to profit; and corporate value lies in the maximization of shareholder value, which is the residual profit anyway. Performances of executives and staff and share prices are all linked to revenue increase and cost reduction. Those executives are brought up in an economic morale and profit is their only belief; whoever even tries to uphold social responsibilities (beyond what their local legislation requires) would never end up climbing to their executive chairs in the first place.


That is not strictly true. Working for one of the top 100 corporations globally they have a vested interest in ethical sourcing & sustainability. We are more interested in healthy profits of course but many of my customers who are some of the top companies in this country demand a certain percentage of products are "green" & ethically sourced. This of course looks better on investor statements & annual reports for both client & corporation.

[GoktimusPrime]

People talk about Hasbro being proactive rather than reactive, but in the history of society this just doesn't happen. No country or company ever does anything until after a critical event happens.
Seems to be human nature. :(

You won't believe how frequently I see teachers allow students (either passively or sometimes even directly) violate school rules... often with the justification of "I got better things to do," or "This isn't part of my job." -- and the first excuse probably is true... but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be done.

Hasbro might be thinking, "Our job is to make toys, not to make the world a better place for factory workers in developing countries."

Another difficulty -- and this is something that others have touched on before -- is the level of corruption in places like China. It's so widespread and endemic it's not funny. When I was in China I witnessed things like:

+ People openly ignoring traffic rules. I met a Canadian guy who'd be living in Guangzhou for 8-9 years and I told him that being Canadian must be useful when it comes to driving in China because they drive on the right hand side of the road, and said, "There's no advantage, people here drive anywhere they like! Left, right, middle..." -- so true! In fact, several times I almost got run over while walking on the footpath!! (because people were driving cars or riding motorcycles on the footpath where I was walking!)

+ Police openly ignoring traffic rules! Possibly also ignoring OH&S regulations (if they exist like they do here), such as cops riding bikes without helmets - sometimes wearing sneakers instead of hard-top shoes or boots! If they can't even be bothered to enforce safety regulations for police officers, what can we expect for factory workers??

+ Counterfeits GALORE! It was actually much harder to find legit toys than it was to find fakes!! :mad:

Now I'm not saying that all police and officials in China are corrupt - in fact, I had the pleasure of meeting two really nice police officers who found my wallet after I'd dropped it in a coach (after I'd gotten up to help a woman and child with their luggage -- climbing over a young man who was seated at the aisle who couldn't be bothered helping the woman who was just across from him :mad:) ... but the amount of corruption there is clearly visible and anyone from China will admit that it's rampant.

I once watched a documentary about a police detective in China who was following up cases of girls abducted from rural villages and sold to couples who want to have a daughter (but cannot have their own due to the one-child policy), or because their only sons are having trouble finding brides. This detective was constantly thwarted at every turn by a system that was completely indifferent toward the plight of these missing girls, and indeed, several members of the police who were even working to destroy evidence and cover up the abductions!

China doesn't have the shiniest track record when it comes to human rights... so considering that the Chinese bureaucracy itself doesn't seem keen on improving standards for some of its people, how much can foreign companies do? China probably tolerates it because:
1/ Doing something about it requires effort and money, and the problem is massive,
2/ Keeping workers impoverished means cheap labour which means more foreign investment which means more money for officials and the government. Individuals may suffer, but the nation prospers - arguably the core tenet of Communism.

Now I am not for a moment saying that Hasbro shouldn't be doing anything... they should... but just saying that there are limitations to what they can do. It's all good for Hasbro to demand new practices, but ensuring that these practices are consistently enforced and implemented across the board in the factory is difficult.

It's bloody difficult enough to get things consistently implemented on a LOCAL basis (which is something that personally bugs me - see my signature ;)) let alone on an international scale.


This of course looks better on investor statements & annual reports for both client & corporation.
Which is probably why Hasbro has said that they will investigate these allegations, and if there's any visible truth to it, take some action. Not necessarily out of the goodness of their hearts, but because it will make them look good to shareholders and investors. That's why Nike when had had their Malaysian factory overhauled when a media exposé revealed that they were using slave labour... Nike immediately cried foul and said that they were unaware of this situation, then moved quickly to change conditions at that factory.

But I suppose no matter the reasons, so long as conditions improve for the workers without hitting the hip pocket of consumers, then it's all good. Some people say that many great acts of 'compassion' have occurred out of ethically/morally dubious motives.

[Seraphim Prime]

Do you think Takara toys are made in the same factories, or just Hasbro?
I'm pretty sure all Transformers are made in the same factories. Hasbro and Takara.

I'm pretty sure that, when I read the article, one of the packing slips was addressed with TakaraTomy as the client.

On the topic of the article, and what we can do about. I've actually been pretty impressed by Hasbro's response to the article.

Sadly, to do anything about this would require a substantial impact on our standard of living, something that many people are not willing to do, and would have to be far reaching. Many of these decisions are made because managers are forced into ever increasing returns, to appease shareholders, the majority of whom are superannuation/insurance companies, who in turn are expected to be showing great reutrns on investment to those who are with them. So to change the system, not only would you be changing your own purchases, but would need to change where your superannuation investments were made and what you were willing to pay.

This is not to say that change can not be made. Look at where we are now in terms of even simple things like recycling and E-Waste disposal. 15 years ago, we were still trying encourage recycyling, nopw everyone does it almost second nature (except in some majors shopping centres where there is still no option...).

Another example, in terms of commitment to a cause, is the commitment of William Wilberforce and the others who aimed to stop Britain's use of slavery, who vowed to not use sugar in their tea because it was produced with slave labour. A small action, but showed how their principles permeated all areas of their life, and was able to send a public message of contempt to the sugar companies.

[Paulbot]

Hasbro's latest response (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/12/27/hasbro-responds-harsh-transformers-labour-allegations/)


Immediately following some unsubstantiated allegations posted by an outside group regarding working conditions at the Jet Fair factory, Hasbro, together with ICTI, deployed a team to investigate, as we take such claims very seriously. Following an unannounced, nine-hour inspection of the facility this past week, we are satisfied that Jet Fair meets with Hasbro’s rigorous requirements.

While Hasbro is committed to continual improvement in all facets of corporate social responsibility, including continued ethical product manufacturing at Jet Fair and all factories that produce Hasbro products, the inflammatory allegations made by the NGO in their report were unsubstantiated by our investigation. As a matter of course, Hasbro will continue to monitor conditions at Jet Fair and all of our factories.

The Company has a strong track record and has had long-standing policies and processes in place for years to help ensure good working conditions, including health and safety, at factories making our products. We strive to conduct business throughout our supply chain in accordance with the highest ethical standards, and we utilize not only ICTI– but also our own on-the-ground workforce– to monitor social compliance.

[griffin]

But that's just a textual claim, with no photographic proof of what they are saying.
At least the "unsubstantiated allegations" were backed up with photographic proof, while Hasbro couldn't even substantiate its own claims.

Who's the one who's "unsubstantiated" then... hmmm?

[GoktimusPrime]

In all honesty, the photographs I saw just... looks like China. Actually, looks better than a lot of parts of China I've seen. :/ By Western standards they may look appalling, but by Chinese standards they don't look unusual. I'm just talking about the photos, and not the text description - which does sound worse than what I have seen in Chinese factories - and I have been in a Chinese toy factory before (albeit a very small one that just manufactured components for toys and didn't assemble full toys themselves). At this one place we stayed at this hired apartment -- the toilet didn't have a cistern... we had to "manually" flush it with a big bucket of water. :( And this was the conditions in a hired apartment building for guests!! :eek: Alright, it wasn't five star or anything... but still!

But I do agree that it would have helped Hasbro's defence if they'd elicited the investigating company to provide photo and/or video evidence... aren't there legal implications for the company and/or Hasbro if they falsify anything on their report findings though?

[reillyd]

They just choose like so many others to ignore it & hope it will go away.

People have short memories. We're all addicts anyway, jonesing for our next plastic fix. I wish there were some roundabout way to make a difference, like a fund for the workers that you could contribute to.

I'm also a little disappointed, if it is true that that Takara toys are manufactured under the same conditions, with Takara. Maybe I'm just idealistic, but I always believed that Takara stood for quality, listened to the fans, and genuinely just wanted to make really awesome toys that sold really well. Maybe I had some misguided notions about Japanese honour and integrity. I wouldn't have thought Takara would use sweatshops.

[griffin]

Hasbro have said on quite a few occasions (usually at BotCon and the Q&A sessions) that Takara/Tomy is the only one dealing with the Factories. Hasbro has to go through Tomy like an agent to get their toys produced and then sent to America.
Different levels of "quality" or paint-apps are just designated by Tomy based on what they want and what Hasbro want off their separate production runs.
If Hasbro really is upset about this report, they would be chasing up Tomy first, to get them to investigate "their" factories, and/or attend to the situation.

[pw_sd]

I red this topics. I'm form China.
That's what happened over there. The owner of the factory only needs money, never care about workers.
Now a bad news for Hasbro, in China recently appeared a lots of very cheap Movie 3 DOTM Leader Class Toys in all 3 models ( S Prime, Ironhide, BBB).
They call it " 厂货", which means a toy released by factory, not from you Hasbro! It has no difference from a normal toy in Kmart or Target, but the price is now less than RMB150, about $23.5! All fans went to TAOBAO (a online sale website like EBAY) to buy a cheap one including orders from overseas.
I got one Ironhide in China when I was on holiday there in Nov. The only different thing I found from him is the battery, usually is GP or Hasbro brand, but the factory released toy had a unknown brand battery inside.
It is said factory they used pattern and material from Hasbro to produce much more quantity than the orders. Once they send orders pallets to America, rest of the toys will be released to the market at low price, also some of them have no package with a more lower price (Chinese call it '散货' ), for example a duluxe movie toy sealed in a plastic bag the price is only RMB70, about $11. A factory released one priced RMB110, about $17.2

[ike_ike]

Once they send orders pallets to America, rest of the toys will be released to the market at low price, also some of them have no package with a more lower price (Chinese call it '散货' ), for example a duluxe movie toy sealed in a plastic bag the price is only RMB70, about $11. A factory released one priced RMB110, about $17.2

huh, i saw a few rotf scouts packaged like that in hong kong. didn't buy them because i thought their super low price was dodgy but that explains a lot.

[Arcee]

Yeah, very true. All those human rights and environmental and piracy issues in our great mother country. All Hail China. :(:(

[Arcee]

So what really is the conclusion on the Hasbro factories? Are we going to keep buying Hasbro TFs believing that we are acting in our best conscience? Or are we not?

It kinda sounds like neither party is credible now :(:mad:

[kup]

So what really is the conclusion on the Hasbro factories? Are we going to keep buying Hasbro TFs believing that we are acting in our best conscience? Or are we not?

It kinda sounds like neither party is credible now :(:mad:

Unfortunately it is what it is. It is what modern market and industry is like and there isn't much we can do about it unless there is some major crisis and the whole world collapses. The Global economy is not something that can be 'winded back' and neither is human greed or apathy.

There is no point in boycotting Hasbro products because for every Transformer you don't buy due to this reason, there are thousands upon thousands of other consumer goods out there that one uses on a daily basis made in similar or worst conditions. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the only way to boycott this 'system' would be to forfeit everything and go and live of the land in the bush.

The Global economy has changed much of how the world works. Back when we were kids, most of our toys were normally made in the local areas where we lived - Australia was part of the European market so it probably got the toys from the factories which provided to European markets. This is because globalized economy didn't exist and several countries had protectionist policies disallowing the import of manufactured goods in order to preserve local industries. I know for a fact that Hasbro had factories in Peru for example where My Little Pony and Transformers were manufactured and each of these factories had to conform to locally acceptable standards of legal and social workforce treatment which varies from country to country.

Now with the global economy, several nations have closed down their local manufacturing industries and countries like China have become the factory of the world. Almost everything now comes from Chinese factories. As horrible as the working conditions there may be, there is no way to stop that now nor enforce human rights when the local authorities and social norms don't put much regard on them. Hasbro's 'inspections' may improve working conditions for the next month, maybe two and then it will just go back to what it normally is.

The world's consumer good manufacturing industry is what it is and unless the world totally collapses economically requiring a restart, there is no way of fixing that.

[GoktimusPrime]

Boycotting Transformers alone wouldn't be enough - you'd have to boycott a modern Western lifestyle. Short of living in a self-sustainable commune or as a hermit, you are inevitably going to use products made in sweatshops. As someone mentioned before, a LOT of things in our households are probably made in sweat shops... computer parts, TV parts, appliances, clothing etc.

Otherwise other options include:
+ Contact Hasbro and tell them how you feel
+ Starting/signing a petition
+ Organising/participating in a demonstration/protest, e.g. #OccupyHasbro

The first option is the easiest but arguably has the lowest impact on Hasbro (it's easy for them just to ignore you), the third option is the hardest but has a higher impact on Hasbro. Imagine if a group of Transfans were camped outside Hasbro's head office in Epping NSW (or in the case of US fans, Pawtucket RI <--this would be more effective but of course, none of us live there; and unless anyone is in a position to travel there for the sake of an occupational demonstration, it's not an available option for folks here).