Toy Review - Generations FOC Optimus Prime

[griffin]

(Please post photos, comments or even a fully comprehensive review - these are just brief details to start you off)

Series - Generations
Sub-line - Fall of Cybertron
Size/class - Deluxe
Wave - 1
New/remould/redeco - New
Released here - Should be soon (in Asia - June 2012, US - July 2012)
Approximate Retail Price - $25-$30
Approximate Size - 13cm
Allegiance - Autobot
Alt-mode - Cybertonian Truck
Main Features/Gimmicks - none
Main Colours - Red, blue, grey, black
Main Accessories - gun

http://www.toycollectors.com.au/tftoys/gen22.jpg

[Tallestblue]

It's much simpler and a lot smaller than WFC Optimus.
That said It's a neat figure and would be good for younger fans of the line for sure.

[Decepticon]

Looks 100% better than that WFC blobtimus prime.

[Sutton]

Looks 100% better than that WFC blobtimus prime.

:confused:

[griffin]

Size comparison with the WFC Optimus...
http://www.toycollectors.com.au/blog/510.jpg
.
http://www.toycollectors.com.au/blog/511.jpg
.
http://www.toycollectors.com.au/blog/513.jpg

So tiny... :(

[5FDP]

Wow... didn't realise he was that much smaller :eek: I'll be sticking with WFC Prime so he's at least in scale with Megatron.

[SuspectimusPrime]

Oh well... At least the box art looks fantastic :rolleyes:

[kup]

Weird how he also appears shorter than Jazz and Shockwave.

[Trent]

Wow :eek: That is small.

[Paulbot]

Ultra Magnus is going to look like Optimus Prime's younger brother. But at least we'll know he'll grow up big and strong over the 4 million year gap.

[Shirokaze]

..... and with that, I don't think I'll be picking him up. :(

[Decepticon]

Yes, I am annoyed he is on the small side. But I like him as a stand alone figure. I'm even thinking of repurposing him as Orion Pax.

[kup]

Yes, I am annoyed he is on the small side. But I like him as a stand alone figure. I'm even thinking of repurposing him as Orion Pax.

If he had a different head, that is not a bad idea.

[GoktimusPrime]

FoC Optimus Prime comparison pics and comments (http://otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?p=312723).

Overall FoC Optimus Prime is disappointing, not only in size but also in design and weight (it's as light as a feather). I think the size can be overlooked somewhat if the design were more satisfying and if it just had more bulk to it. This is like "Optimus Lite", which makes it difficult to justify its Deluxe price point. The colours are quite light, somewhat similar to Optimus Prime's colours in the G1 cartoon. I prefer the darker colours on WfC Optimus Prime. The lighter red actually borderlines a rose-pink.

The transformation to vehicle mode is quite simple - which does make it more fun to play with (WfC Optimus Prime's transformation is far too fiddly for its own good, and I've never been fond of how WfC OP has various little panels that keep flopping around when playing with it in robot mode). The alt mode is a definitive looking truck, as opposed to WfC Optimus Prime's 'ride-on-lawnmower' mode. But having said that, it was a pretty neat looking ride-on-lawnmower, whereas this is a really disappointing looking truck. There are these unsightly gaps and the hands are poorly concealed. I like how the forearms transform to conceal and reveal the front wheels, but I do wish that the arms themselves could fold or tuck into the truck more rather than just hang out the sides. Then there's those hands again... but looking at the forearm design I guess there's nowhere that they can go, and to HasTak's credit they have sculpted the back of the hands to be quite broad so that they do conceal the fingers and thumbs in vehicle mode. Sort of. I don't know what it is about the head sculpt, but I'm not a huge fan of it. When transforming to truck mode, there are several tabs which lock into place to keep the truck mode solid, and I like that. But the same can't be said for robot mode - the most disappointing part being the mid-torso section that swings down and doesn't appear to have any locking mechanism. So expect this part to become easily deformed during play. :(

The Autobot logos on the shoulders are silver, which looks better than the pink logos on WfC Optimus Prime. The designs of the wheels look quite nice.

The gun reminds me of G1 Ultra Magnus' gun - it has a handle on the top and bottom which are used in the toy's different configurations. When the gun is placed in the robot fists, it bears more resemblance to the original G1 Optimus Prime's gun... a bit, but "tanked out." There's a post on the top for the vehicle mode and also to plug into other holes on the outer forearms and back. Unfortunately, the angle of this top post makes plugging them into those spots look really stupid, so it's best to either just leave it in the fist or put it aside when in robot mode. As I mentioned in the comparison page, the articulation on FoC OP is more limited and just no where near as clever, with parts of it being more incidental rather than intent of design.

I voted "Only if..."; WfC Optimus Prime is a superior toy, so unless you just _want_ to have a Fall of Cybertron Optimus Prime (in which case, let's face it, you've either already got the toy or you're going to buy it regardless of what people say), then run for the hills and find something better to spend your money on. Try to get this toy below RRP and by NO means should you be paying above RRP for it.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/focoptimusprimeleia.jpg

[Autocon]

Werent WOF deluxes also shorter than previous deluxes? So they have gone down in size twice.

[theheretic]

So disappointed to see how much smaller FOC figures are. Does this mean voyager Soundwave will be the same as deluxe WFC Soundwave? Probably the same mould and they will charge voyager prices for him.

[kurdt_the_goat]

Not to say anything of his size, but the Voyager Soundwave is definitely a new mould, since he can fit the disc shaped minions they're planning to sell (as legions, i think?).

[Sutton]

The real issue for me isn't the size with other FOC/WFC figures. It's that this means that all TF's from here on in are going to be in this new scale. So if Hasbro gets off their butt and decides to finish the classics line some day, the new figures are going to be massively out of scale with the old ones.

Crap.

[Sutton]

Kmart charges, what, $23 for deluxes? I could have handled $25 or $27 if it meant keeping sizes as they were.

[theheretic]

Not to say anything of his size, but the Voyager Soundwave is definitely a new mould, since he can fit the disc shaped minions they're planning to sell (as legions, i think?).

Doesn't the current Soundwave have a chest that stores his weapons? I'm pretty sure I saw some figures on shapeways that also fit into his chest. Thuggers or something like that.

I'm disappointed because it ruins any chance of displaying WFC with FOC without having weird sizing. And yeah I'm disappointed that any future classics figures are going to be out of size too. And unfortunately for us, the collectors community isn't the target market so we probably won't have a chance of getting Hasbro to change its sizing back.

I'm glad there's a bunch of 3rd party figures and combiners coming or I would really be disheartened. I'm surprised Has/Tak hasn't gone into making figures that collectors want, besides the MP line that is. When people are willing to pay between 50-100 per (roughly) deluxe figure from a 3rd party then they should really look at making a line like this for collectors. Rant rant rant. LOL

[GoktimusPrime]

The scale itself doesn't bother me. Transformer toys have never really been scaled well with each other - and to be fair, at 13cm this toy is the size of a small Deluxe like RtS DLX Optimus Prime. It's marginally (but noticeably) shorter than most other Deluxes, but significantly taller than a Scout.

What bothers me more is a simplicity and plainness of the toy. While RtS Optimus Prime is small, it has a reasonably decent design for a Deluxe (not great, but okay), and the sword-weapon becoming the trailer hitch is cool, and the backward compatibility with the original 1995 G2 Laser Optimus Prime was an unexpected but neat touch. RtS Optimus Prime is well articulated and able to strike an array of dynamic poses with his sword, with both single and double handed grips. FoC Optimus Prime on the other hand is not only short, but it just doesn't give you much for a Deluxe. It's incredibly light and the design and articulation are mediocre at best. And I swear this toy looks pink. Not bright Barbie-pink, but like a reddish rose-pink... like the pink they used on that Hasbro G1 Optimus Prime reissue w/ the comic book ("Pinkimus Prime").

Deluxe isn't really about size, it's a price point. And for what you pay, compared to what the average Deluxe toy gives you, you just don't get that much out of it. It's like Hasbro's given us this smaller and simpler toy, but selling it at the same price point as previous Deluxes which gave us more bang for our buck. I can forgive the smallness if it compensated in other ways like articulation, design/transformation, accessories or something like that. But it doesn't.


Doesn't the current Soundwave have a chest that stores his weapons? I'm pretty sure I saw some figures on shapeways that also fit into his chest. Thuggers or something like that.
He does have a cavity in his chest that fits his weapons. But the weapons are pretty small, you wouldn't be able to fit a Legion Class Transformer in there.


I'm disappointed because it ruins any chance of displaying WFC with FOC without having weird sizing. And yeah I'm disappointed that any future classics figures are going to be out of size too.
Eehhh... maybe. With Optimus Prime it bothers me, but for Jazz and Shockwave (which I don't have but assuming they're similarly sized), not so much. The original G1 Jazz was much shorter than Optimus Prime. Shockwave towered over others, but there's no reason why he can't be shorter than Megatron. Having Starscream being shorter than Megatron is fine too. It's the lack of anything else that bugs me more. I mean, a big stupid toy sucks just as much as a small stupid toy... I think most fans just like good toys, whether they be big or small.


I'm surprised Has/Tak hasn't gone into making figures that collectors want, besides the MP line that is. When people are willing to pay between 50-100 per (roughly) deluxe figure from a 3rd party then they should really look at making a line like this for collectors. Rant rant rant. LOL
FoC Optimus Prime is a toy that collectors would want, since he'll appear in the upcoming game. So I'm glad they made the toy... I just wish they did a better job of it. But yeah, there were SO many characters from War For Cybertron that never got toys -- including my beloved Warpath, KA-POW!! Every WFC & FOC TF needs to be made into toys, damnit. Aaargh, just another reason why I dislike TF series where the Transformers are designed as media characters first and toys second. :( :(

[SuspectimusPrime]

From the reviews and everybody's feedback, it appears to be a tiny bit taller than a DOTM HA Basic, however unlike HA Basics, has a very simple transformation. The bang for my buck is really in a fig's ingenuity (if not for its nostalgia). I was considering holding out for the TakTomy release, but it going to have to be a damn fine paint job & plastic quality (I'm thinking United Wreck-gar level of sweetness) if its going to cost upwards of $40 shipped if I'm lucky (assuming I can get the set together with Jazz and Shockwave). I've seen FOC OP self-warming a bit lately so not too worried about missing out at this point.

[GoktimusPrime]

See the link in my earlier post for FoC Optimus Prime comparison pics. The toy is definitely taller than a Scout, which IIRC is the same scale as the HA Basics. If you like I can also do a comparison pic with a HA Basic and add it to that thread.

If ingenuity is something you're looking for, then this toy will disappoint you. And there's no amount of superior colour apps or plastic quality that can compensate for the utterly ordinary standard of this toy's design. If you want this toy, get it for $25 or less, I do NOT recommend paying full $30 RRP for it, let alone paying above RRP! Honestly, if you end up missing out on this toy, you're really not missing out on much. :rolleyes: ;)

[SuspectimusPrime]

See the link in my earlier post for FoC Optimus Prime comparison pics. The toy is definitely taller than a Scout, which IIRC is the same scale as the HA Basics. If you like I can also do a comparison pic with a HA Basic and add it to that thread.

If ingenuity is something you're looking for, then this toy will disappoint you. And there's no amount of superior colour apps or plastic quality that can compensate for the utterly ordinary standard of this toy's design. If you want this toy, get it for $25 or less, I do NOT recommend paying full $30 RRP for it, let alone paying above RRP! Honestly, if you end up missing out on this toy, you're really not missing out on much. :rolleyes: ;)

I'll take your word for it :)

If it shelf-warms, then I'll pick it up during a sale.

[Decepticon]

But he looks sooooooo cute! How can anyone resist those cute bunny ears!:p

[GoktimusPrime]

I've posted a comparison pic between FoC OP and HA Backfire (my only HA Basic toy) on the comparison thread (http://otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=14192). As I predicted, Backfire comes up the same as a Scout and is significantly shorter than FoC OP.

So it's fair to say that FoC OP is definitely taller than a Scout -- but short for a Deluxe.

[griffin]

From the reviews and everybody's feedback, it appears to be a tiny bit taller than a DOTM HA Basic, however unlike HA Basics, has a very simple transformation. The bang for my buck is really in a fig's ingenuity (if not for its nostalgia). I was considering holding out for the TakTomy release, but it going to have to be a damn fine paint job & plastic quality (I'm thinking United Wreck-gar level of sweetness) if its going to cost upwards of $40 shipped if I'm lucky (assuming I can get the set together with Jazz and Shockwave). I've seen FOC OP self-warming a bit lately so not too worried about missing out at this point.

Toys are meant to be fun, playable things, which is why most of us prefer not leave them sealed in packaging. During the Movie Era, and the WFC Optimus & Bumblebee, one of the reasons they didn't do too well was because the engineering/conversion was too complex/complicated for them to be "fun" or "playable" to kids (the target demographic). Adult collectors complain about TFs being too simplistic, but then complained quite a bit about the less fun complicated figures... so in the end it comes down to if you value complexity, or playability (like kids playing with them among themselves).
For those of us who were around for Gen1, it was their simplicity (the speed at which we could convert them) that made them so popular and fun to play with among friends, or by ourselves. Something Hasbro didn't keep in mind with the Movie toys... which were more often a puzzle, for older minds to enjoy. Minds that don't play with their toys any more.
(I'd love to be able to play with mine, but lack of time and more complicated "puzzles" in recent years, makes it difficult to "play" if you have to spend 10-30 minutes just to convert each toy in the battle)

Because of that, I think the FOC Optimus is a more "fun" toy, because it isn't as annoying to transform as the WFC one. It is just disappointing how much smaller it is, as well as having poor shoulder articulation.
Other adult collectors will see it as "simpler" as if it is a bad thing, but it was the simple Gen1 engineering that us older collectors loved.

Over time, toys like all things, will get more expensive by volume, so paying more for less is just something we have to (grudgingly) accept. And it is only a problem for long-time collectors, as those are the ones who are around long enough to see price-rises or size-reductions.

My point is, most toys you'll decide straight away if you want to buy or not... but if one is line-ball, try to get a test-play with someone else's first (like at a meet), to help you decide. As you'll be able to see for yourself if it meets your own preference on difficulty.

[Decepticon]

Totally agree Griffin. I personally hate the transformation of the WFC Bee and Op.....both are ugly too! This FOC Op, despite it's size, is a nice all round figure.

[Autocon]

I've posted a comparison pic between FoC OP and HA Backfire (my only HA Basic toy) on the comparison thread (http://otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=14192). As I predicted, Backfire comes up the same as a Scout and is significantly shorter than FoC OP.

So it's fair to say that FoC OP is definitely taller than a Scout -- but short for a Deluxe.

interested to see foc prime next to scouts along with dlx movie toys

[5FDP]

For those of us who were around for Gen1, it was their simplicity (the speed at which we could convert them) that made them so popular and fun to play with among friends, or by ourselves.

Couldn't agree with you more. Being able to transform most of the toys in under a minute was key to playing out scenes from the cartoon. It would be impossible to do the same with any of the movie toys.

[kup]

There is nothing wrong with simple engineering as long as it's effective. Previous Classics and Universe toys have simple but effective engineering, you can transform them quickly and both modes are satisfying for the most part. Most Movie scouts also had simple but satisfying engineering.

By the sounds of it, it seems that FOC Optimus is not only simplistic but has overall an unsatisfying design making it disappointing.

Simplicity does not make a toy disappointing but ineffective and lazy design does.

[GoktimusPrime]

I'm not fond of over complex counter intuitive transformations, but overtly simplistic and uninteresting transformations don't interest me either -- there needs to be some kind of balance, and even kids can appreciate that. If we think back to our childhoods, some of the less popular toys were those with lacklustre engineering, like the Firecons. I personally found Doubledealer to be a far more satisfying double-spy toy than Punch Counterpunch -- even with a non-humanoid Decepticon robot mode, I really liked how the Autobot and Decepticon modes were substantially different... instead of say Counterpunch who'd have to keep his back against a wall at the Decepticon base at all times (or always walk at the back of a group and ensure nobody stood behind him. :p). One kid in my year 8 class transformed FOC Optimus Prime pretty quickly and easily -- as opposed to say one of my friends at uni (an engineering student) who had trouble transforming RiD Side Burn! :D

So even looking at it from a kid's POV I find FOC OP to be a fairly mediocre toy. Not terrible per se, but nothing special. The lighter colours, particularly the pinkish red, doesn't do the mould any justice. And yeah, having a smaller and simpler toy for the same price point bugs me as a long time collector. Newer collectors may not notice it (ignorance is bliss I suppose), but I sure do. :(

[kup]

So even looking at it from a kid's POV I find FOC OP to be a fairly mediocre toy. Not terrible per se, but nothing special. The lighter colours, particularly the pinkish red, doesn't do the mould any justice. And yeah, having a smaller and simpler toy for the same price point bugs me as a long time collector. Newer collectors may not notice it (ignorance is bliss I suppose), but I sure do. :(

I measure Hasbro against their own previous work and the latest stuff I have seen from them feels more like regression than progression. These newer toys are lesser than what the Classics/Henkei toys were and they are charging as much or more for them. Even toys that are over 10 years old are better like RID. It's a shame but I guess a lot of it comes down to pleasing Walmart and the bottom line over the end costumer.

[GoktimusPrime]

By the sounds of it, it seems that FOC Optimus is not only simplistic but has overall an unsatisfying design making it disappointing.

Simplicity does not make a toy disappointing but ineffective and lazy design does.
That's a good way of putting it, and I would agree. :) I'll bring FOC OP along to this Sunday's meet so people can judge for themselves first hand. :cool:

[SuspectimusPrime]

Seems like the TakaraTomy release will include chrome parts (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/japanese-transformers-40/new-takara-tomy-solicitations-fall-of-cybertron-toys-coming-to-japan-175710/). Keen to see their version of FOC Shockwave.

Too bad I won't have a chance to see Goki's this weekend. I can see myself getting the Hasbro version of FOC OP for the right price, but since I was a kid, the bang for my buck was in how interesting/unique a robot could transform (this was even before I had a concept of money). Simpler transformers had the feel of generic underlings (say Throttlebots) and were used as cannon fodder during play. As I kid I subliminally attributed low intelligence/skill/rank to simpler toys as well.

[Sutton]

We should be referring to this guy as Gimli Prime.

[GoktimusPrime]

At least the Throttlebots had a fun pull-back motor gimmick! Plus they were cheap (you could buy them with pocket change)!

[kup]

I saw Gok's FOC Prime at the fair. I will admit this for fairness, it does look a lot better in person than it does in photos. The photos makes it look like that horrible Hasbro pink and although the red is still not very good, it is no where near as pink in real life.

The sculpt also does not seem as bad in person and looks worse in photos. This must be the least photogenic toy ever!

However the toy still remain sub-par for a deluxe, the truck mode is a little on the mediocre as Gok mentioned and his midget size is pretty discouraging. However the robot is fairly good and his head sculpt is fairly nice.

Overall, still not worth it for a deluxe but it isn't as bad as the promo and other photos we have seen online. I am still waiting to see what Tomy does and if the paint job is good enough, I may bite but otherwise, nope.

[5FDP]

Seems like the TakaraTomy release will include chrome parts (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/japanese-transformers-40/new-takara-tomy-solicitations-fall-of-cybertron-toys-coming-to-japan-175710/). Keen to see their version of FOC Shockwave.

Ah, good ol' TakTom - adding chrome just for the hell of it :rolleyes: Shockwave with chrome just wouldn't look right.

[GoktimusPrime]

Heh, yeah... adding chrome looks great on some toys (e.g. Henkei Sunstreaker), on other toys it looks neither good nor bad (e.g. Henkei Astrotrain), and on others it actually looks detractive (e.g. the upcoming Sixshot reissue). <---JMHO But with Optimus Prime having chrome on the grill and pipes could very well improve the look of the mould (as it did with Henkei Convoy)... but whether it's enough to "salvage" this ordinary mould... I don't know. No amount of improved colours can hide the toy's underwhelming design/engineering.

[i_amtrunks]

I don't hate the mold, but it is not the best figure ever created. Transformation is too easy, dimensions are very strange and the feet are just there in alt mode sticking out like a sore thumb.

Yet I still like it. Visually it is nowhere near as good as the WFC version, but the simplicity of transformation is a positive when compared to the original.

It is very small, so I can only recommend if you can get it cheap, love the FoC Prime model and do not have the original/do not like it.

[Bidoofdude]

It' s actually quite detailed, mostly the head. Although small, it fits well with Shockwave. Looks better from the side than straight on. I have him side on with one foot forward on a rock. Really reminds me of him going: "I am Optimus Prime, and I send this message bla bla." He looks better in person but still kind of mediocre. Better than nothing though. I think it's good to add to a Foc scene but not by its self as lots of other deluxes tower.

[GoktimusPrime]

It's not a terrible mould... it's just not worth the full Deluxe RRP IMO. Would be nicer with darker colours too. Had this toy been sold for $20-23, then I'd have less gripes... but $28-30? :/

[Decepticon]

Yet I still like it. Visually it is nowhere near as good as the WFC version, but the simplicity of transformation is a positive when compared to the original.

Am I the only one here that thinks FOC version is waaaaaay better than the WFC version? Yes it's small buts the only downside IMO.

[Bidoofdude]

Am I the only one here that thinks FOC version is waaaaaay better than the WFC version? Yes it's small buts the only downside IMO.


Yeah, it looks a lot better in appearance than WFC and that simple transformation is way better than the over-complicated one. It's much more accurate and G1 looking at the same time.

[Mythirax]

It's not a terrible mould... it's just not worth the full Deluxe RRP IMO. Would be nicer with darker colours too. Had this toy been sold for $20-23, then I'd have less gripes... but $28-30? :/

I always see him for $23.75 at Kmart. Every Kmart I've been to has 10+ of the things. I'm seeing him to much now :D


Yeah, it looks a lot better in appearance than WFC and that simple transformation is way better than the over-complicated one. It's much more accurate and G1 looking at the same time.

I agree. It's a shame his so small though, but I absolutely love him. For some reason I find him quite the center piece.

[GoktimusPrime]

I got this toy in August and made that comment in October -- I hadn't seen it in Kmart (had anyone else?). At that time, as far as I knew, it was only available at Uncle Pete's for $29-something (close to $30). So I paid full RRP and I don't think it's worth it. If you can get it for less than that - at Kmart's price, then yeah sure, that's not so bad.

[Jim_jim]

Look, if your kids want something to play with, this is a good toy. For prime lovers, this is one of the worse prime.