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View Full Version : Universe 2.0 Sidswipe In-Package


Golden Phoenix
9th August 2008, 10:39 PM
This (http://cgi.ebay.com/Transformers-Universe-Classic-Series-Sideswipe-MISB_W0QQitemZ270263308712QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item 270263308712&_trkparms=72%3A1076|39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A12&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1318) eBay auction has appeared with a clear shot of Universe 2.0 Sideswipe
It has a really good picture of him in the box and he appears to have suffered the same fate as his brother at the hands of Hasbro.
http://i2.ebayimg.com/04/i/001/03/9a/b602_1.JPG
As you can see there is a fairly visible difference between the red on the windshield and the rest of his body.
Is it just me or hasn't Hasbro learned anything from what happened with Sunstreaker?
Maybe it just needs another layer of paint or something, because it can't be a problem with the design since Takara seemed to have made it work

Gutsman Heavy
9th August 2008, 10:42 PM
blarg, two-tone sideswipe.

GoktimusPrime
9th August 2008, 11:10 PM
That looks a LOT worse than Sunstreaker! Faaaaaaaaaaaaaar out!

kup
10th August 2008, 12:04 AM
I guess that its just 'us' picky collectors who notices such things and Hasbro slacking off in the quality department is purely a matter of opinion :rolleyes:

I was actually thinking of getting Universe Sideswipe as it has a more G1 accurate paint job (no chromed spoiler), similar paint details to henkei (black) and Hasbro generally gets reds right in figures (until now) but after this, I will be going for Henkei Sideswipe instead. The red color difference is very noticeable even through the package on a low res pic. At least with Universe Sunstreaker, you don't notice the different color shades so obviously in pictures

Some things are not a matter of 'opinion'. Hasbro is clearly slacking off for the sake of profiteering more by cutting on production costs. Some of us may not agree with the Chrome application on some Henkei but its hard to deny that Hasbro's overall production quality is inferior unless you want to pretend otherwise.

People should speak out if Hasbro wants to continue this agenda of diminishing overall quality instead of blind praise or silence from people. I may be ridiculed and laughed at for my statements on this but at least I have my eyes open.

Robzy
10th August 2008, 12:10 AM
You're absolutely right Kup! I was hoping Universe Sideswipe would be good enough for me, but sadly it isn't! :(

MV75
10th August 2008, 12:42 PM
I guess that its just 'us' picky collectors who notices such things and Hasbro slacking off in the quality department is purely a matter of opinion :rolleyes:

I was actually thinking of getting Universe Sideswipe as it has a more G1 accurate paint job (no chromed spoiler), similar paint details to henkei (black) and Hasbro generally gets reds right in figures (until now) but after this, I will be going for Henkei Sideswipe instead. The red color difference is very noticeable even through the package on a low res pic. At least with Universe Sunstreaker, you don't notice the different color shades so obviously in pictures

Some things are not a matter of 'opinion'. Hasbro is clearly slacking off for the sake of profiteering more by cutting on production costs. Some of us may not agree with the Chrome application on some Henkei but its hard to deny that Hasbro's overall production quality is inferior unless you want to pretend otherwise.

People should speak out if Hasbro wants to continue this agenda of diminishing overall quality instead of blind praise or silence from people. I may be ridiculed and laughed at for my statements on this but at least I have my eyes open.

There's a good chance that the spoiler is red under that chrome anyway. ;)
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gamblor916
10th August 2008, 02:38 PM
Household bleach will strip chrome before your eyes.

GoktimusPrime
10th August 2008, 03:00 PM
I've heard from Japanese kitbashers/customisers who use regular dishwashing detergent to strip chrome off TFs.

kup
10th August 2008, 04:49 PM
I've heard from Japanese kitbashers/customisers who use regular dishwashing detergent to strip chrome off TFs.

well if air itself (over time) is enough to get the chrome off many plastics, I am sure that removing it will not be hard at all. The trick is how to get the chrome off while leaving an unspoiled red surface.

MV75
10th August 2008, 05:30 PM
Dishwashing detergent won't damage the under plastic. :)

kup
10th August 2008, 05:34 PM
Dishwashing detergent won't damage the under plastic. :)

I mean about removing the chrome clean off. Does it just wipe away or does it leave imperfections or stains. Will it be glossy like the rest of the Red plastic?

MV75
10th August 2008, 05:55 PM
Ah, that will depend on how quality the plastic was (it was to be chromed), and if the chroming damages it, but, you can get plastic polish. :) Just use a dvd/CD disc scratch remover kit. Otherwise you can get a container of it, I just can't remember what it's called. It should be a light brown paste. But I think auto stores have plastic polishes for cars now as well. Don't use regular car polish though, it stuffs plastic.

There we go:

http://www.meguiarsdirect.com/product_detail.asp?T1=MEG+G12310&.

An example to try. I've never tried it on toys though, so you might want to test it first, as with all polishes.

The above can be done if you need to mechanically remove any chrome. :)

STL
11th August 2008, 12:30 AM
People should speak out if Hasbro wants to continue this agenda of diminishing overall quality instead of blind praise or silence from people. I may be ridiculed and laughed at for my statements on this but at least I have my eyes open.

I don't like it but don't think for a moment Hasbro give a crap about my "blind praise" or "silence". They care about whether the toys move off the shelves and they sure as hell aren't going to care about a bunch of collectors moping and whinging on their boards.

I think everyone has their eyes opened. It's just some of us realise that saying how much we hate Hasbro and trying to rally an army of collectors at their doors with pitchforks ain't gonna happen. Parents aren't going to care and kids aren't sure as hell going to either. Quite frankly most of them don't notice. At the end of the day, we are a minority and I don't like it either but I've come to accept the reality is Hasbro plays a numbers game. It's brand is more important for it to build sales volumes to the mass market, not to a bunch of collectors raving madly in front of their computer screens.

When you use the word "agenda" it makes it seem like some systematic ploy that Hasbro has of alienating us. That they set out with the intent to maliciously deprive of us of the perfect toys we deserve. They don't. They're negligent and that's spun out of the fact that they honestly just don't give a stuff. They want high volumes moving and high sales. They don't care what you, me, or joe blow want. And that's their business model. Like it or not, it works for them on the back of the strength of the brand at the moment. But let's not kid ourselves for a moment and think that Hasbro are setting out with this vendetta against us. They aren't. They're just a lazy bunch of cost cutting profit seekers who see little value in high quality paint applications.

Do I like it? Hell no. But I don't have much of a choice. Hence why I turn to Takara.

If you really want to complain about someone, go complain at Takara. They're supposed to be collector focused so if they screw up majorly like they did with Sideswipe or Henkei Wildrider, then there's cause for uproar. Those are major stuff ups for a company supposedly trying to build itself on being more collector and quality orientated.

gamblor916
11th August 2008, 09:40 AM
From what I've found the vacuum chrome plating actually protects the plastic underneath. Bleach will take off the chrome in seconds leaving the clear conductive coating intact. If you want to get rid of that layer soaking in something like Simple Green (a concentrated detergent) will get rid of that. After that it's just plain plastic.
Also Meguiars Scratch X is great for polishing.

roller
11th August 2008, 10:39 AM
I'd buy it only if it was in G2 colours

GoktimusPrime
11th August 2008, 11:29 AM
I don't like it but don't think for a moment Hasbro give a crap about my "blind praise" or "silence". They care about whether the toys move off the shelves and they sure as hell aren't going to care about a bunch of collectors moping and whinging on their boards.

I think everyone has their eyes opened. It's just some of us realise that saying how much we hate Hasbro and trying to rally an army of collectors at their doors with pitchforks ain't gonna happen. Parents aren't going to care and kids aren't sure as hell going to either. Quite frankly most of them don't notice. At the end of the day, we are a minority and I don't like it either but I've come to accept the reality is Hasbro plays a numbers game. It's brand is more important for it to build sales volumes to the mass market, not to a bunch of collectors raving madly in front of their computer screens.

When you use the word "agenda" it makes it seem like some systematic ploy that Hasbro has of alienating us. That they set out with the intent to maliciously deprive of us of the perfect toys we deserve. They don't. They're negligent and that's spun out of the fact that they honestly just don't give a stuff. They want high volumes moving and high sales. They don't care what you, me, or joe blow want. And that's their business model. Like it or not, it works for them on the back of the strength of the brand at the moment. But let's not kid ourselves for a moment and think that Hasbro are setting out with this vendetta against us. They aren't. They're just a lazy bunch of cost cutting profit seekers who see little value in high quality paint applications.

Do I like it? Hell no. But I don't have much of a choice. Hence why I turn to Takara.
I mostly agree with that. Money talks and you-know-what walks. And kids aren't stupid... they'll also boycott toys or toy lines if it's below their standards. Look at how Transfandom took a sharp nosedive after the introduction of Action Masters and Generation 2.

If you really want to complain about someone, go complain at Takara. They're supposed to be collector focused so if they screw up majorly like they did with Sideswipe or Henkei Wildrider, then there's cause for uproar. Those are major stuff ups for a company supposedly trying to build itself on being more collector and quality orientated.
Overall while I agree that TakaraTOMY's actions appear to be more collector orientated, I don't think it's accurate to say that the company is intentionally established to be that way. They're a toy company just like Hasbro and their primary target market is also kids. It's just that TakaraTOMY seem to be more attentive and take greater care in their work, so as a result they seem to produce quality that is more appeasing to discerning collectors. And yes, there are some lines which are exclusively aimed at collectors such as G1 reissues, Binaltech, Masterpiece etc. So it really depends on which line you're talking about.

Henkei is a line that is primarily being marketed at kids. This is very obvious when you look at the comics that are packaged with these figures - it's a very kiddie level comic, unlike say the text stories in Binaltech which are very much written for adult collectors.

Having said that, I have found in my experience that TakaraTOMY are far more receptive to feedback and criticisms than Hasbro. Some of you may remember the incident we had with the Encore Ironhide and Ratchet online surveys and how TakaraTOMY updated their database after I reported the problem within less than a day. When my MP Convoy was missing a piece Takara FedExed me replacement parts within less than a week.

MV75
11th August 2008, 11:52 AM
I mostly agree with that. Money talks and you-know-what walks. And kids aren't stupid... they'll also boycott toys or toy lines if it's below their standards. Look at how Transfandom took a sharp nosedive after the introduction of Action Masters and Generation 2.




I'd say that would be more of a "I already have that toy" type of situation there. :)

Yep, and if toys keep falling to bits, kids arn't going to keep asking their parents for them either. Our original toys may be bricks, but they're built like bricks too with pins and screws and diecast aplenty. :)

And look at the new speed racer toys, they all appear to be plastic to me, if I were still buying toy cars, I'd stick with hotwheels.

And look at the tech line, I've never seen it move ever. The same ones are still at my local bigw.

JuzMel
11th August 2008, 11:53 AM
Hehe, which is why my itchy fingers hasn't clicked the "Add to Basket" button for the Universe figures cause I'd rather wait for Takara ones.. :p

MV75
11th August 2008, 11:57 AM
Price and underwealming has stopped me so far. But mind you, I've only seen the few repainted legends and the ultras, which I've recently decided that I won't get any version of.

I'm going to just get a select few deluxes and the new legends moulds.

STL
11th August 2008, 12:52 PM
I mostly agree with that. Money talks and you-know-what walks. And kids aren't stupid... they'll also boycott toys or toy lines if it's below their standards. Look at how Transfandom took a sharp nosedive after the introduction of Action Masters and Generation 2.


I personally wouldn't mind Hasbro gettin' a wake up call. But with a very big movie on the way and a strong brand, I don't think they'll be getting that anytime soon. Quality issues, paint apps issues, whatever.


Overall while I agree that TakaraTOMY's actions appear to be more collector orientated, I don't think it's accurate to say that the company is intentionally established to be that way. They're a toy company just like Hasbro and their primary target market is also kids. It's just that TakaraTOMY seem to be more attentive and take greater care in their work, so as a result they seem to produce quality that is more appeasing to discerning collectors. And yes, there are some lines which are exclusively aimed at collectors such as G1 reissues, Binaltech, Masterpiece etc. So it really depends on which line you're talking about.


I'm talking about the relative disparity of criticism when it comes to Takara. Takara to be honest deserve a lot criticism for the two aforementioned releases. They're very lazy and yet no one's cooking up a storm. I think that if you're going to be angry you should be angry at the company who's supposed to be more quality orientated, the company who cares. But I hardly ever see that. All I see is the same jumping up and down and screaming at Hasbro cursing them for some sort of "systematic" plot against customers/collectors.

Hasbro cares about delivering a product but I think most of us are aware and agree that quality isn't one of their highly prioritised factors. And I don't like that. But if I were being fair and complaining, I'd have a fair crack at the avenue to the same toys, Takara, who's supposed to be more "quality-orientated" and "care a lot" too.


Having said that, I have found in my experience that TakaraTOMY are far more receptive to feedback and criticisms than Hasbro. Some of you may remember the incident we had with the Encore Ironhide and Ratchet online surveys and how TakaraTOMY updated their database after I reported the problem within less than a day. When my MP Convoy was missing a piece Takara FedExed me replacement parts within less than a week.

Ah, the perks of being able to communicate in Japanese. I knew I should've studied that in year 12. :rolleyes:

lcz128
11th August 2008, 01:20 PM
If you really want to complain about someone, go complain at Takara. They're supposed to be collector focused so if they screw up majorly like they did with Sideswipe or Henkei Wildrider, then there's cause for uproar. Those are major stuff ups for a company supposedly trying to build itself on being more collector and quality orientated.

:o DID they stuff up on Sideswipe? :o Where? I thought the pics looked good for Swipe! :O

Or am I confused now? I'm personally a bit undecided on Wildrider, but it does look quite alright :)

kup
11th August 2008, 01:20 PM
I don't like it but don't think for a moment Hasbro give a crap about my "blind praise" or "silence". They care about whether the toys move off the shelves and they sure as hell aren't going to care about a bunch of collectors moping and whinging on their boards.

I think everyone has their eyes opened. It's just some of us realise that saying how much we hate Hasbro and trying to rally an army of collectors at their doors with pitchforks ain't gonna happen. Parents aren't going to care and kids aren't sure as hell going to either. Quite frankly most of them don't notice. At the end of the day, we are a minority and I don't like it either but I've come to accept the reality is Hasbro plays a numbers game. It's brand is more important for it to build sales volumes to the mass market, not to a bunch of collectors raving madly in front of their computer screens.

When you use the word "agenda" it makes it seem like some systematic ploy that Hasbro has of alienating us. That they set out with the intent to maliciously deprive of us of the perfect toys we deserve. They don't. They're negligent and that's spun out of the fact that they honestly just don't give a stuff. They want high volumes moving and high sales. They don't care what you, me, or joe blow want. And that's their business model. Like it or not, it works for them on the back of the strength of the brand at the moment. But let's not kid ourselves for a moment and think that Hasbro are setting out with this vendetta against us. They aren't. They're just a lazy bunch of cost cutting profit seekers who see little value in high quality paint applications.

Do I like it? Hell no. But I don't have much of a choice. Hence why I turn to Takara.





No vendeta against collectors, I am sure we barely register on Hasbro's radar, they are marketing at kids after all; it would be irresponsible if they didn't. As Gok mentioned, Takara's Henkei and many of their recent past main stream releases (Galaxy Force, etc) have also been marketed at kids, not collectors, so both are focusing on the same age groups, in that regard Takara is not doing any 'extra mile' to please us, just functioning as normal. They just want to produce a toy that little Yoshi san and his parents will be satisfied with.

The agenda has nothing to do with Collectors, its all about cost cutting for the sake of profits at the loss of the end consumer (kids and parents primarily). That's the problem. If the general population is unaffected by this and continue buying, then that's their problem but it will not stop me from speaking my mind about deteriorating production standards.



If you really want to complain about someone, go complain at Takara. They're supposed to be collector focused so if they screw up majorly like they did with Sideswipe or Henkei Wildrider, then there's cause for uproar. Those are major stuff ups for a company supposedly trying to build itself on being more collector and quality orientated.


Yeah, I am annoyed that Takara placed chrome on Sideswipe and that is why I am talking about removing it with others. However I can see this chrome addition as more in the line of bad judgment (IMO) than deliberate cost cutting or laziness. Also I would have gone for Hasbro's version if they hadn't gotten cheap with the paint as that is beyond repair unless you are skilled enough to repaint the whole figure itself, it also affects the overall look of the alt mode negatively.

In my opinion Takara made a similar mistake with Grimlock by going overboard with the chrome and as a result I prefer the Hasbro version and have already praised them on that. However I cannot criticize Henkei Grimlock nor Sideswipe in the same way as the bad paint on Universe Prowl, Sunstreaker and Sideswipe because one is an artistic choice that I disagree with while the other is distinct cost cutting at the expense of quality. Disagreement about chrome implementation has nothing to do with quality just bad creative choice depending on your point o view, however dirty looking white paint on Prowl, mismatched colors and other factors are hardly creative choices in nature.

kup
11th August 2008, 01:21 PM
:o DID they stuff up on Sideswipe? :o Where? I thought the pics looked good for Swipe! :O

Or am I confused now? I'm personally a bit undecided on Wildrider, but it does look quite alright :)

He is referring to the silver chrome on the rear spoiler which I personally don't like either.

dirge
11th August 2008, 10:29 PM
Yep, and if toys keep falling to bits, kids arn't going to keep asking their parents for them either.

Parents will also boycott the line if they buy one and it breaks straight out. Like 1974 Bumblebee. My first one broke before I even tried to tranform it :eek:


I'm talking about the relative disparity of criticism when it comes to Takara.

I think on the whole, a lot of the criticism aimed at Hasbro is the end result of a lot of frustration. Generally speaking, Takara tend to learn from their mistakes, so while they misstep from time to time, they rarely make the same mistake twice. Hence avoiding that frustration.


All I see is the same jumping up and down and screaming at Hasbro cursing them for some sort of "systematic" plot against customers/collectors.


Yeah, I think that was a poor choice of words. I don't for a second think Hasbro give collectors a thought either way most of the time (okay, on some toys they do, but for most, the collectors don't come into it). I don't mind that, TBH. It's the lack of focus & laziness that bothers me.

Just as an example - on Armada Starscream & Thundercracker Hasbro bothered to sculpt the Decepticon logos on the wings. And painted the whole thing purple. When Wheeljack rolled around, they did the same thing on his more prominent Autobot logo, which really served to dilute the whole point of his scratched out Autobot logo. At this same stage, Takara's Rampage had unpainted relief on the same logo - they'd already realised that a little effort makes the toy significantly better.

The same fans who get frustrated with Hasbro still experience disappointment with Takara's products - I know I was spectacularly unimpressed with Greenscream's soft, weak plastic, and was only too happy to sing Hasbro's praise on that one. Takara realised they missed it up, mind you - Skywarp's plastic is a _lot_ better.

I'll probably get Henkei Swiper - for the sake of matching reds. And just live with the chrome.

Golden Phoenix
11th August 2008, 11:47 PM
He is referring to the silver chrome on the rear spoiler which I personally don't like either.

I agree that it doesn't look the best but I struggle to find a better place to put it. Takara is doing the whole "chrome on each figure" and they are doing it in at least 2 spots. The gun is obvious, but where else could they plausibly do it?
Possibly the vents on top of the car, but is he coming with those?

MV75
12th August 2008, 10:51 AM
I agree that it doesn't look the best but I struggle to find a better place to put it. Takara is doing the whole "chrome on each figure" and they are doing it in at least 2 spots. The gun is obvious, but where else could they plausibly do it?
Possibly the vents on top of the car, but is he coming with those?

Part of the robot, say the waist maybe, or even the wheels. But silver spoilers are in fashion, more or less over there, but these are factory spoilers, so they wouldn't be chromed anyway irl.

Either way I don't think it really ruins the figure, at least they've made it more accurate by taking off the air dams and fixed the paint. If you still don't like the spoiler, it's an easy fix.

And yea, there's a reason they call them spoilers. ;)

Zippo
12th August 2008, 04:21 PM
Don't like the chrome because Sunstreaker has it, but I don't hate it enough to try and get rid of it. Maybe if I could get a Hasbro Sideswipe without two tone paint then ...

GoktimusPrime
12th August 2008, 04:27 PM
See... I kinda think that the chrome on Sideswipe is cool because it matches with Sunstreaker. *shrug* As kup said, it's purely a matter of opinionated taste here - Takara hasn't stuffed up in terms of cheaping out or through lack of attention/care by using mismatching shades of the same colour. You can see that Takara are really making an effort here to make the toy look cool. Whether you think the results are cool or not is a matter of taste, but you can't fault the effort. Having two different shades of yellow on Universe Sunstreaker or two vastly different shades of red on Sideswipe on the other hand... that's just sloppy IMHO. :/

Gutsman Heavy
12th August 2008, 04:37 PM
eh, I like the chrome spoiler, however I hate it on Bumblebee and Mirage.

Robzy
12th August 2008, 06:45 PM
It's simple... just get both versions! ;)