Universe 2.0 Cyclonus Pics

[sifun]

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attachment.php?do=fullview&attachmentid=10221

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attachment.php?do=fullview&attachmentid=10222

I'm hoping these aren't the final colours.
Plastic quality is dull looking. Much like classics starscream. HOPING they add more paint.

[MV75]

That would be a prototype.

EDIT: Read the comments there. Classic. Makes you want to hit them in the face with a big fish for being so dumb. :D

[iceburn]

hmmm Cyclonus a Targetmaster?

[Pulse]

It's hard to judge him when he's unfinished like this...


hmmm Cyclonus a Targetmaster?

Why yes he is :)

[kup]

It's hard to judge him when he's unfinished like this...



Why yes he is :)

Yeah, it seems like a hand painted prototype. It looks way too dodgy even by Hasbro standards.

However I hope that they fix the face on Nightstick. I hate it how it shows in gun mode like that.

[Pulse]

Hmmm, Why isn't Nightstick attached to Cyclonus' alt-mode in this pic (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attachment.php?do=fullview&attachmentid=9898)?

[Paulbot]

Hmmm, Why isn't Nightstick attached to Cyclonus' alt-mode in this pic (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attachment.php?do=fullview&attachmentid=9898)?

Because it's a prototype that has found it's way into the hands of a Chinese fan. Now it's fair to make assumptions on how that happened...

but it's not fair to make assumptions about the final toy based on pictures like this.

[kup]

Hmmm, Why isn't Nightstick attached to Cyclonus' alt-mode in this pic (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attachment.php?do=fullview&attachmentid=9898)?

I think that they didn't have Nightstick on that pic mainly because it would cover a large section of the jet mode. I don't see anything dubious about that as I may have done the same in their place for a promo pic as the buyer will want to see the whole alt mode.

However I am still concerned about Nightstick's face showing. It was ok back in the 80s but that was over 20 years ago!

[SilverDragon]

I still cannot figure out how he transforms.

[FFN]

I think that they didn't have Nightstick on that pic mainly because it would cover a large section of the jet mode. I don't see anything dubious about that as I may have done the same in their place for a promo pic as the buyer will want to see the whole alt mode.

However I am still concerned about Nightstick's face showing. It was ok back in the 80s but that was over 20 years ago! Nightstick is mistransformed there. The chinese dude attached him to Cyclonus without bothering to actually transform Nightstick.

his legs are supposed to flip over to cover his torso and head, becoming two extra gun barrels.

[Pulse]

Ah mis-transformations... (The pet-hate of Transfans everywhere... :D)

[MV75]

I still cannot figure out how he transforms.

Well just looking at it, looks like the legs telescope out, the wings fold back and that whole section on both sides become the arms, and the nosecone flips over the back behind this back.

Looks close to the g1 version to me. :)

[sifun]

http://www.tfw2005.com/resources/attachment.php?do=fullview&attachmentid=7729

In package pic of cyclonus.

Yuck, gummy grey. Seems like they were the final colours

[iceburn]

looks fairly alright and would match up with Galvatron
now we need is Scourge... :P

[kup]

This figure is looking like a definite 'Henkei only' buy thanks due to Hasbro both creating false expectations and severe cost cutting.

[i_amtrunks]

Reminds me of Universe Depth Charge with the paint apps. :(

Otherwise looks decent, and a nice larger deluxe figure for a change.

[kurdt_the_goat]

Universe Cylconus has gone from my most awaited figure to my most repulsed! God, the paint apps look like they're going for the 'yellowing plastic' effect..... Either that or they've got a huge vat of old coffee that they randomly dipped the figures into! I wish TakaraTomy would put my mind at ease and reveal the Henkei colours sometime soon! Just to clarify, i was *not* expecting the toy to look like the first released photoshops, but i was hoping it would resemble it somewhat!

[kup]

Universe Cylconus has gone from my most awaited figure to my most repulsed! God, the paint apps look like they're going for the 'yellowing plastic' effect..... Either that or they've got a huge vat of old coffee that they randomly dipped the figures into! I wish TakaraTomy would put my mind at ease and reveal the Henkei colours sometime soon! Just to clarify, i was *not* expecting the toy to look like the first released photoshops, but i was hoping it would resemble it somewhat!

What they have done with Cyclonous is utterly disgraceful. Even I thought that the earlier loose toy pics were nothing more than a prototype and that Hasbro would not release a figure with such appallingly bad paint finish.

This is very wrong now and I see no conceivable way that this sort of cost cutting can be excused. What was an Excellent mold has been turned into a crap release thanks to Hasbro's utter lack of pride in their products.

It looks like a freaking KO!!!

[Pulse]

IMO...

Cyclonus = not too bad :)

Nightstick = All I can think of is that he's a gun & guns are sometimes grey? *shrugs*

[Borgeman]

hey, at least the package art looks nice... :D

George

[kup]

hey, at least the package art looks nice... :D

George

Yeah its better than the standard 'dull surprise' of the other Universe packaging.

[MV75]

WHAT THE HOLY FREAKING GARBAGE!?!?!?!

THAT IS THE FINAL COLOUR SCHEME?


..... bloody freaking hell man.

I hope beyond hope they do a henkei of this. It looks like a prototype. That was an excellent looking mould too.

Like Kup said, I never thought that Hasbro would release something that looked like that (a prototype), these days. Looks like we gave them far too much credit. This has officially set the bar to the lowest level that their aesthetics have reached over the past couple of years. I'd actually prefer slightly wonky paint apps to this.

[dirge]

It's... okay. I'm more annoyed with the huge gulf in class than the end result. I'll probably grab the Henkei version anyway (:

[Stompy]

I thought Classics Deluxe Starscream pretty much had the same cheap KO plastic and paint look as Cyclonus. It is highly unfortunate that these new figures are turning out quite poor in regards to colour choices/job (Prowl, Galvatron) and yet it puzzles me that there's some decent ones too like Acid Storm and Sunstreaker. I repeat... DECENT.

Personally, I guess I'm in the fortunate position that I tend to admire the engineering side of the figures and I can _just_ overlook the horrible paint jobs in most of the figures. I do feel the pain though, especially when you actually look at other "cheaper" toys out now having a much better paint scheme. Heck even the Bumper Battlers have excellent paint jobs in general.

[Zippo]

Looks to be a rather nice toy, though the final product pictures do not live up to the photoshopped pictures of before.

[FFN]

I am amused by the fact that unimpressive paint jobs are inspiring people to declare holy war on Hasbro compared to a relatively expensive, highly sought-after Henkei seeker exclusive being kinda broken almost across the board.

[GoktimusPrime]

Remember that you can leave feedback for Takara-TOMY (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=201). :)

[Pulse]

I am amused by the fact that unimpressive paint jobs are inspiring people to declare holy war on Hasbro compared to a relatively expensive, highly sought-after Henkei seeker exclusive being kinda broken almost across the board.

We're a fickle bunch, us Transfans. When something that wanted & sought after is put into production, We're more than happy to pull out our wallets :).

[FFN]

I think we tend to keep quite when expensive imported things are busted to lessen our buyer's remorse. Not me, if it's busted crap, I'll say it's busted crap :D

[GoktimusPrime]

I've only ever purchased one Japanese Transformer that was "broken" - being Masterpiece Convoy that was missing a panel. But Takara fixed me up on that pronto. :) Again, if there's anything wrong with a Takara TF please do not hesitate to contact Takara either via their customer support and/or their online survey.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transfandom%20Comic/transfandom10.jpg

[jaydisc]

Remember that you can leave feedback for Takara-TOMY (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=201). :)

This doesn't seem to be the proper channel for taking issue with a defective product. Also, are you also taking for granted the fact that most of us don't speak Japanese or have access to Japanese addresses?

[Gutsman Heavy]

I think we tend to keep quite when expensive imported things are busted to lessen our buyer's remorse. Not me, if it's busted crap, I'll say it's busted crap :D

same, Henkei TC is an expensive floppy turd

[GoktimusPrime]

This doesn't seem to be the proper channel for taking issue with a defective product. Also, are you also taking for granted the fact that most of us don't speak Japanese or have access to Japanese addresses?
FFN made a comment and I've tried to lend him some assistance. There's no need to take it further than that.

[kup]

I am amused by the fact that unimpressive paint jobs are inspiring people to declare holy war on Hasbro compared to a relatively expensive, highly sought-after Henkei seeker exclusive being kinda broken almost across the board.

I am peed off at TakTom for such blunder (it seems the whole range of Henkei Thundercrackers released) and it does suck and its very disappointing. It also goes back to show that despite them not willing to implement severe production cost cutting measures like Hasbro, they are gradually slacking off when it comes to Quality Control making purchases from them a 'risk' of sorts.

Does TakTom doing the above suddenly excuse Hasbro for presenting us with a vastly superior promo pic and then a severely inferior final product with blatant and clear cost cutting measures for profit maximizing?

Hell NO!

[jaydisc]

FFN made a comment and I've tried to lend him some assistance. There's no need to take it further than that.

But you've made similar comments elsewhere which give (me at least) the impression that if you have a problem with a Takara product, a replacement or fix is a quick contact away. Your comic seems to reinforce that. I'm simply asking if that quick contact requires knowledge of the Japanese language or a Japanese address.

[liegeprime]

whoa I dont think Id want to work in Takara anymore, they tie people up for a mistake ... harsh!:D:D:p. Erm kup what problem on the henkei Thundercracker are you saying? Can you enlighten me on the issue as I dont have one. :(

Oh and on the Cyclonus final product...meh knew theyd scrimp on it as usual. not surprising for me. It all about the packaging this days not the toy itself.

[GoktimusPrime]

But you've made similar comments elsewhere which give (me at least) the impression that if you have a problem with a Takara product, a replacement or fix is a quick contact away. Your comic seems to reinforce that.
That comic is actually based on what really happened to me when I got MP Convoy ('cept for the very last panel :p). You should've heard the guy when I told him I was in Australia - he nearly fell off his freakin' chair!

So my advice is just based on my personal experience. I have never guaranteed that others will necessarily receive the same results, but the option of accessing Takara's customer support (either online and/or via telephone) and/or using their feedback survey (they want customers to tell them what they think about their products).


I'm simply asking if that quick contact requires knowledge of the Japanese language or a Japanese address.
Obviously it involves the use of the Japanese language. If you were to contact Hasbro you would be required to use the English language. As for requiring a postal address, I've already addressed that in the linked sticky.

[kup]

That comic is actually based on what really happened to me when I got MP Convoy ('cept for the very last panel :p). You should've heard the guy when I told him I was in Australia - he nearly fell off his freakin' chair!

So my advice is just based on my personal experience. I have never guaranteed that others will necessarily receive the same results, but the option of accessing Takara's customer support (either online and/or via telephone) and/or using their feedback survey (they want customers to tell them what they think about their products).


Obviously it involves the use of the Japanese language. If you were to contact Hasbro you would be required to use the English language. As for requiring a postal address, I've already addressed that in the linked sticky.

Jay's point is that this option is non pratical to those who don't speak Japanese so its pointless to suggest it.

When it comes to Hasbro skimping on quality, that appears to be corporate policy now. People can defend it all they like but there is a huge difference between standard bad QC and Production Cost cutting.

Both Takara and Hasbro have recently been guilty of slacking off in the Quality Control department in recent times.

However Hasbro seems to have the systematic agenda of promoting vastly superior toy pictures in their catalogs and advertising and then provide a considerably inferior final product to the consumer in order to save on production costs but not the consumer price.

THAT rubs me the wrong way more than bad QC.

[dirge]

jaydisc, of course the methods Goktimus suggests aren't quite ideal - remember, we're leaving feedback from outside their intended market. The feedback mechanisms he suggests might not be _convenient_, but it's about as good as we'll get. We're not going to get a 13 number to a call centre in Albury for Takara feedback.

At any rate, let's bring this thread back to discussion of Cyclonus.

[Pulse]

Erm kup what problem on the henkei Thundercracker are you saying? Can you enlighten me on the issue as I dont have one. :(


Mate, I'll show you mine in person very soon :)

[kup]

whoa I dont think Id want to work in Takara anymore, they tie people up for a mistake ... harsh!:D:D:p. Erm kup what problem on the henkei Thundercracker are you saying? Can you enlighten me on the issue as I dont have one. :(

Oh and on the Cyclonus final product...meh knew theyd scrimp on it as usual. not surprising for me. It all about the packaging this days not the toy itself.

Several people who have opened their figure have encountered the issue in which Thundercracker's arm holes are too large for the launcher pegs. So the launchers barely stay on his arms or not at all.

[FFN]

All of the joints on mine are much looser, with a loose as a goose arm. The smaller fins attached to the tail fins don't fold up as far as my Classics, but on the plus side, they fold up much more easily.


I am peed off at TakTom for such blunder (it seems the whole range of Henkei Thundercrackers released) and it does suck and its very disappointing. It also goes back to show that despite them not willing to implement severe production cost cutting measures like Hasbro, they are gradually slacking off when it comes to Quality Control making purchases from them a 'risk' of sorts.

Does TakTom doing the above suddenly excuse Hasbro for presenting us with a vastly superior promo pic and then a severely inferior final product with blatant and clear cost cutting measures for profit maximizing?

Hell NO! My point was that in my observation of various boards, people who do have Henkei Thundercracker and have the problems seem to be going "eh" about it for the most part, while people are EXPLODING over Cyclonus, which, while painted poorly, isn't broken to the best of our knowledge. I never said it excused Hasbro for their paint deco.

And profit maximization leads Hasbro to not suffer the fate of Takara, buddy ;) You need to think long-term brand health!

[Soundwarp]

I'm going to weight in and say that i am a big fan of the finished product!

[MV75]

And profit maximization leads Hasbro to not suffer the fate of Takara, buddy ;) You need to think long-term brand health!

It's not all just immediate profit that keeps a company afloat. Good thing you don't run a business. :p

You can only ream people for so long before they discover that they can just sit on the broom handle themselves.

[GoktimusPrime]

People will get miffed over a crappy Transformer, regardless of whether it's from Hasbro or Takara. Just look at the general fan reaction over Takara MP Starscream vs Hasbro MP Starscream. Takara copped a lot of flak while Hasbro got kudos. To Takara's credit they realised that they dropped the ball and that Hasbro improved on their effort and followed Hasbro's cue with their USA Edition MP Starscream. People want quality Transformers and will praise/criticise whoever gives them a good or bad toy.

A lot of people don't - and I agree with FFN's sentiment; there are a lot of people out there who refuse to be critical of the toys they buy to avoid buyer's remorse. You see this in the majority of TF toy reviews (especially on YouTube) where they lavish every Transformer with tonnes of praise but without even justifying why. Most so-called reviews are nothing of the sort - reviews are supposed to critical and analytical - but most reviews I see are really just about boasting their acquisitions. They're mostly about "zOMG I have this toy and it's teh rOxXOrZ!!1!" rather than actually explaining why they hold certain opinions of a toy.

[jaydisc]

Jay's point is that this option is non pratical to those who don't speak Japanese so its pointless to suggest it.

Well, if Japanese language and address is truly required (as I now realize it is), there is little point to suggest it, but my goal was simply ascertaining if it was a requirement.


Obviously it involves the use of the Japanese language. If you were to contact Hasbro you would be required to use the English language.


jaydisc, of course the methods Goktimus suggests aren't quite ideal - remember, we're leaving feedback from outside their intended market. The feedback mechanisms he suggests might not be _convenient_, but it's about as good as we'll get.
(emphasis mine)

I don't think this is obvious at all. I've successfully pursued customer service from Lego in Denmark and TomTom in Netherlands for products outside their market without knowing their native language. So, again I'll repeat it: I didn't want to upset or embarrass anyone. I just wanted clarity, and now that I (and others) have it, I'm happy to consider that matter closed.

As far as local, more attainable options, I have contacted Hasbro Australia personally with regards to the quality control of Deep Space Starscream. They told me to go return it, and if for whatever reason I did not obtain satisfaction, to contact them again. They additionally offered me the ability to write down my thoughts for submittal to the product designer!!! So, until I hear the contrary, I believe that Hasbro Australia has and can step up to the plate with regards to customer issues.

On top of that, you also have retail protection. Target, Kmart and everyone else, will be more than happy to accept your returned product and forward it back to Hasbro without charge. This is not really an option for [the majority of] us here with Takara products. Even if it was, the cost to ship back and forth would make it instantly cost prohibitive.


However Hasbro seems to have the systematic agenda of promoting vastly superior toy pictures in their catalogs and advertising and then provide a considerably inferior final product to the consumer in order to save on production costs but not the consumer price.

THAT rubs me the wrong way more than bad QC.

This is no different than the tactics employed by companies ranging from McDonald's to Playboy magazine and virtually the marketing department of every product-based company in between. The marketing department's job is to make the product look attractive. Realizing that, Hasbro seems to focus on the retail experience. This is evident by their behavior and of course the effort they make on packaging. If you walk into a store and see Cyclonus and buy it, you really can't blame the back of the package. Although, since robot mode is obscured in the clear package, I think you would have the legal right to return the product on the grounds that it is "not as described".... yet another benefit of using the intended retail channel.

[kurdt_the_goat]

Aren't Hasbro covered from false advertising with photos, because of the line on the box "Photos and colours may vary"? Not that i agree that that should be enough!

Perhaps not as many ppl are whinging about Henkei TC, because they've already got say 5 or 6 of the same damn toy? :D

[kup]

Aren't Hasbro covered from false advertising with photos, because of the line on the box "Photos and colours may vary"? Not that i agree that that should be enough!

Perhaps not as many ppl are whinging about Henkei TC, because they've already got say 5 or 6 of the same damn toy? :D

There is a different between varying colors and a lesser than advertised paint job.

However legally they are covered but to me, its offensive from an end consumer's point of view.

[GoktimusPrime]

It's legally covered, but of course it also means that whenever we see a Hasbro promotional photo we know that we cannot necessarily fully trust what we're seeing and that it needs to be taken with a massive grain of salt.


Well, if Japanese language and address is truly required (as I now realize it is), there is little point to suggest it, but my goal was simply ascertaining if it was a requirement.
*sigh* That's why I went and translated the online survey into English and asked the mods to sticky the thread... (-_-) All you need to do is point and click.

Otherwise does anyone have a better suggestion?

[dirge]

If you walk into a store and see Cyclonus and buy it, you really can't blame the back of the package. Although, since robot mode is obscured in the clear package, I think you would have the legal right to return the product on the grounds that it is "not as described".... yet another benefit of using the intended retail channel.

This ties in to Hasbro's perception of the _stores_ as their customer, not the actual end customer. They care not if the end customer enjoys the product, as long as the retailer buys the assortment in the first place.

Even if you do return the products to the store, the store loses out - not Hasbro - since it's the store which loses out. They have to try and resell an opened toy. It's not cost effective for them to return it to Hasbro, and that would require a lot of negotiation anyway.

I've already given up on Hasbro's products, for the most part. I'm not boycotting them, but I'm quite happy to simply pass over something rather than spend my money on a poor effort. I'm knowledgable enough about their packaging tricks (and photoshopping is a big part of that) to know that emphasis is on making the packaged toy look good - not on delivering the best product. Which is why I'm willing to wait for an imported option from TT if that provides a better option. Granted, that means the local retailers misses their cut, but if I'm spending my hard earned, I'll do it because I believe it's worth the money, not because the packaging convinces me. I learnt the hard way from some of the poor toys I've bought down the years, only to end up regretting it.

[GoktimusPrime]

This is no different than the tactics employed by companies ranging from McDonald's to Playboy magazine and virtually the marketing department of every product-based company in between. The marketing department's job is to make the product look attractive. Realizing that, Hasbro seems to focus on the retail experience. This is evident by their behavior and of course the effort they make on packaging.
Takara makes their products look attractive in photos too, but the photos tend to match the products better. With Takara when it comes to comparing their promotional photos and toys it's pretty much a case of WYSIWYG.

Let's look at the promotional images for Henkei (http://www.takaratomy.co.jp/products/TF/products/henkei/lineup.html) just as an example. I currently only have Henkei Megatron and Astrotrain, but IMO the photos in those promotional images on the site and on their packaging pretty much look just like the toys. Generally when buying Takara TFs I know that the toys will look like the photos whereas with Hasbro's photos I always have to take it with a grain of salt - and like images in McDonald's or Playboy, I know that the real thing doesn't look like what's in the photo. Well, maybe except for griffin's avatar - that thing freaks me out. Cosmetic & shampoo companies do it too but they sometimes include disclaimers telling you that it's enhanced.

In the end I learn to never fully trust images from McDonalds, Hasbro etc. I'll trust Playboy though. ;) Seriously... Megan Fox is not that good looking IRL IMO. But IMO she looks pretty hawt in the Transformers movie - and I like to believe in that image despite having seen how ordinary she actually looks IRL. Movies are fantasies and I'll happily escape into it. :D Megan Fox may not be that hot, but Mikaela is! (^_^)

meh--> http://s6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/Movie%20Premiere/th_tfm08.jpg (http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/Movie%20Premiere/tfm08.jpg) http://blog.wired.com/underwire/images/2008/05/30/foxtransformers250darker_3.jpg <--yeah!

[kup]

The whole topic has become kind of funny now.

I kept thinking of someone buying a Megan Fox and then returning her because she wasn't as advertised :D

When it comes to taking Hasbro's pics with a grain of salt, I used to do that before now I have to take it with a spoon full.

[Pulse]

The whole topic has become kind of funny now.

I kept thinking of someone buying a Megan Fox and then returning her because she wasn't as advertised :D


Hey, I know she's got tats in weird places but it doesn't bother me in the slightest... :D

[King Atlas]

Seems to be a pretty sweet mould, just needs the right paint app. Whoa, now were using Megan Fox as an example? :eek::p

[STL]

I dunno, it's like buying a Zinger burger. The pictures all look so fresh, crispy, saucy and green. Yet when I open it up, it's shriveling but I still eat it. ;) :D

[Pulse]

I dunno, it's like buying a Zinger burger. The pictures all look so fresh, crispy, saucy and green. Yet when I open it up, it's shriveling but I still eat it. ;) :D

that's a strange analogy... :confused: :D (Well, maybe if TFs were blended up into something tasty (http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=k7SKDnhI3Eg)... :D)

[kup]

I like the mold too but the awful paint finish is enough to make me wait for a Henkei release.

If for whatever reason that doesn't happen, only then would I buy the Universe figure (with the intension of finishing the paint job) but I wouldnt be surprised if a year from now we get 'Premium Editions' from Hasbro.

[FFN]

It's not all just immediate profit that keeps a company afloat. Good thing you don't run a business. :p

You can only ream people for so long before they discover that they can just sit on the broom handle themselves. They're not reaming anybody. Besides, the majority of people who would care about this issue to such an extent that they would display real anger would be internet collectors. Most of their other customers aren't so discerning.

Obviously, Hasbro's profitability and success with Transformers is the reason why the brand is so strong in the west. Good brand strength means long-term viability. You don't want Hasbro or Transformers to be in the same position as it is in Japan where it's not doing nearly as well, is obscure and the company that originated the toys that led to the creation of the brand is now owned by Tomy.

If anybody remembers, when Hasbro 'merged' with Milton Bradley, the company was briefly known as Hasbro Bradley, before going back to Hasbro. Internationally, TakaraTomy is known as Tomy. All TF copyrights now say Tomy, no more Takara.


This ties in to Hasbro's perception of the _stores_ as their customer, not the actual end customer. They care not if the end customer enjoys the product, as long as the retailer buys the assortment in the first place. Hasbro balances the need to run a profitable, successful company (hey, their shares are worth nearly twice as much as Mattel's), with the needs of providing X products at X cost per unit, which ends up affecting the price you get charged as a consumer. I think it's extremely, exceptionally cynical to say they don't care if the end consumer enjoys the product or not. Sure, they mostly don't sell directly to the consumer, but they hope you enjoy their work and their wares.



Even if you do return the products to the store, the store loses out - not Hasbro - since it's the store which loses out. They have to try and resell an opened toy. It's not cost effective for them to return it to Hasbro, and that would require a lot of negotiation anyway. Don't stores have insurance for such things? If things are returned or stock is unsold, usually retailers have some kind of insurance where the manufacturer or distributor has to pay them back for the faulty or unsold stock.

[dirge]

I think it's extremely, exceptionally cynical to say they don't care if the end consumer enjoys the product or not. Sure, they mostly don't sell directly to the consumer, but they hope you enjoy their work and their wares.


No, they hope end consumer _buys_ their wares. Whether or not they enjoy isn't as important to Hasbro, who have stated in the past that they see retailers as the customer. Remember, Hasbro are assuming that this year's customers will largely outgrow Transformers in a year or two, anyway. If the end consumer buys a few toys, has a bad experience and moves on, it only matters to the manufacturer if that end consumer would have otherwise returned. Hasbro are driven by profit and keeping shareholders happy. They only need to care about the end consumer as far (s)he affects profits.

Obviously collectors are more dedicated, but I think Hasbro take for granted that dedication (that's not meant in a cynical way - they know collectors will be around for longer, without them necessarily having to strive to keep the collectors interested).



Don't stores have insurance for such things? If things are returned or stock is unsold, usually retailers have some kind of insurance where the manufacturer or distributor has to pay them back for the faulty or unsold stock.

Remember that I was referring to fans returning "not as described" toys. Which is essentially a change-of-mind thing, rather than a fault. It's not easy for a retailer to claim that back from Hasbro - particularly when the return is likely within the store's refund policy.

I doubt that too many retailers would go to the trouble of exercising their right to return unsold stock when it comes to a clutch of opened, returned stock. That sort of thing is normally for excess volume.

Refunding a Transformer because of discontent with the finished product vs advertised pictures hurts the store only - in the short term. They have to pay the wages covering both sale & refund, and end up with imperfect stock. Hasbro wouldn't care about that unless the sheer number of refunds impacts on the store's likelihood to order again. I suspect this was the case with 1970s Bumblebee (with that faulty trigger), because reports of problems were widespread - and a running change was made.

[MV75]

They're not reaming anybody. Besides, the majority of people who would care about this issue to such an extent that they would display real anger would be internet collectors. Most of their other customers aren't so discerning.

Obviously, Hasbro's profitability and success with Transformers is the reason why the brand is so strong in the west. Good brand strength means long-term viability. You don't want Hasbro or Transformers to be in the same position as it is in Japan where it's not doing nearly as well, is obscure and the company that originated the toys that led to the creation of the brand is now owned by Tomy.



Yes, they are reaming everybody, collecters or not with the decline in quality and craftsmanship. Not so discerning? Why do certain toys set the shelves on fire then? ;) As you quite rightly preach, collecters are the minority, it's the majority of others that are leaving them behind, and that is something to think about. They arn't vocal like we are, they voice their opinions silently by passing on the toy and buying something else. We are the ones to give the companies the why in writing in places such as this.

You can only ride the success of a movie for so long before people get tired of lower and lower quality appearing.

Do I see the need of a beast wars 2 in the near future (5-7 years)? Quite possibly.

[STL]

No, they hope end consumer _buys_ their wares. Whether or not they enjoy isn't as important to Hasbro, who have stated in the past that they see retailers as the customer. Remember, Hasbro are assuming that this year's customers will largely outgrow Transformers in a year or two, anyway. If the end consumer buys a few toys, has a bad experience and moves on, it only matters to the manufacturer if that end consumer would have otherwise returned. Hasbro are driven by profit and keeping shareholders happy. They only need to care about the end consumer as far (s)he affects profits.



Yes, but I'm sure they do care. Just not enough to go that extra yard. There's a distinction that needs to be made in hte level of care we're talking about here. You seem to be suggesting that they only care about this year's stock movement and their relationship with retailers. That's a pretty cynical if not callow view. Most companies have focus group testing these days to try and determine what matters to the consumer which in turn keeps their product offering relevant and their shareholders and stakeholders such as retailers happy.

Certainly they care about the customer as far as he/she affects profit but they also make sure they meet the demands of the target market. I find it naive to suggest that it this modern day and age, a large corporation would as you suggest just design toys and care only about its retailer as its primary customer. Hasbro cares about its target demographic primarily which essentially is the 7-13 year old range and I am certain they designed a show around Animated and have designed Classics 2.0/Universe with the end target market in mind.

I understand there are disgruntled fans of which I am one, but I do believe that Hasbro does not aspire to a higher level of quality control and care purely b/c it does not matter to the market that they are selling to. If it did, then certainly, they'd be paying meticulous attention issues of quality control. But as far as most kids go, near enough is close enough so what bothers me in a gap-ridden Transformer doesn't even register with a kid. Do I like that? No. But I'm not about to peevishly turn around and claim that Hasbro doesn't give a stuff what all customers think. Fact is, they do. It's just their target market isn't necessarily collectors.

And as much as I'd love that to be the case, I'd certainly not entertain that thought.

[dirge]

Yes, but I'm sure they do care. Just not enough to go that extra yard. There's a distinction that needs to be made in hte level of care we're talking about here. You seem to be suggesting that they only care about this year's stock movement and their relationship with retailers. That's a pretty cynical if not callow view.

Perhaps... but I think the recent media exposure of large corporations going _bust_ without forewarning (usually due to creative accounting concealing operating losses), and many executives getting perfomance incentives regardless of share price movment suggest that the American corporate model has problems. It's hard not to be cynical when the boardroom can be so detached from the reality of the business.

A lot of companies take a short term approach, because the directors care more about being reelected by large shareholders than the company's products/services, reputation or (in some cases) long term survival.

I'm not suggesting that the designers don't care - some probably don't and others probably do. But if those in the position to make the end decisions regarding cost-to-retail price ratio and acceptable QC standards cared about customer satisfaction, we wouldn't be seeing some of the QC problems we're facing in current lines. I'd be surprised if marketing guys cared about quality of the product - their job is to make you want to buy it - how poor the product is simply outside their sphere of thinking. Which isn't to say that lazy marketing decisions (such as some of the early name uses in Universe, back in 03/04) don't influence the overall quality of the product - but they're not employed to care about product _quality_.



Certainly they care about the customer as far as he/she affects profit but they also make sure they meet the demands of the target market.


But the target market is retailers. In which case they only have to keep the retail buyers happy. That's the whole point. So long as it does what the retailer wants (ie _sells_), Hasbro see the target market's demands fulfilled.



I find it naive to suggest that it this modern day and age, a large corporation would as you suggest just design toys and care only about its retailer as its primary customer.


But they're on record saying that they see the retailer as the customer. They see their job as selling the stock to the retailer. I believe that it's naive of Hasbro to view the marketplace that way.



Hasbro cares about its target demographic primarily which essentially is the 7-13 year old range and I am certain they designed a show around Animated and have designed Classics 2.0/Universe with the end target market in mind.


They care that the 7-13 year old buys the product, because that keeps the retailer coming back for more. Which is why everything Ultra or bigger has electronics - more callouts on the box. The reason why the movie leaders all have gimmicks set into their chests - Megatron & Brawl are sucky purely as leader-sized Transformers, but the kid can be wowed by the button he can press in store. The packaging is geared towards convincing the kid to buy the toy, to the point where the toy itself is geared towards selling itself on the shelf, even at the expense of the experience later (ie once the kid opens leader Megatron and realises that the springs don't work, since he's hopelessly misassembled - which wasn't changed between batches - unlike the refund-inducing Bumblebee trigger problem).

Hasbro also see the 7-13 year olds as being fertile (as consumers!) for a year or two, tops. Most kids these days stop buying toys around the age of 10. So they don't have to really take customer satisfaction into account as part of their business model. Which isn't to say they shouldn't - but it's effect is fairly minimal.

If those making the decisions see their job as keeping the stockholers happy, and believe that customer satisfaction won't affect the end result for stockholders, they can disregard customer experience. I don't believe - based on the evidence of the last few years - that the corporate culture in Pawtucket places much emphasis on Customer Satisfaction.



But as far as most kids go, near enough is close enough so what bothers me in a gap-ridden Transformer doesn't even register with a kid.


Well, it most likely does. As a 7 year old, I was spectacularly unimpressed with Wheelie's weird bodyshape and hood thing. I was also unimpressed with the transformation being shunted to the accessories a few years later when half the line was Actionmasters. The fact that Hasbro US wound up the line after Actionmasters suggests that I probably wasn't the only one. I'm sure that everyone on this board remembers getting a toy as a kid and being disappointed by some feature or other.

Kids _are_ discerning, and are quite capable of thinking for themselves, but there's an assumption out there that kids aren't as smart as adults. When it comes to stuff like running a household or planning a family, that assumption is pretty much correct. When it comes to evaluating a toy, I think kids are often underestimated.

As MV75 mentioned above, if a kid is unimpressed with a Transformer he doesn't come online and talk about it, instead he heads into the next aisle and buys (say) a Star Wars toy or a console game. If enough kids start passing up on the line, then it'll choke the shelves. At that point Hasbro will either 1) work harder to please the retailer or 2) move onto something else, believing the market has changed (rather than the product, or the overall quality of it.) This happened when G1 was awash with Micromasters and Actionmasters. It happened when kids largely rejected G2's cr4ppy repaints and (generally better) new toys that didn't even appear in the dated cartoon which was trying to sell them.

What troubles me is the possbility of the line shutting down _again_. I've seen it happen twice - I was part of the online fandom when G2 was cancelled, and there was no guarantee of Transformers coming back. Kenner took a chance and really worked hard to make BW work, but nowadays if the line was canned, we don't know if Hasbro would take that same chance.

[GoktimusPrime]

You don't want Hasbro or Transformers to be in the same position as it is in Japan where it's not doing nearly as well, is obscure and the company that originated the toys that led to the creation of the brand is now owned by Tomy.
1/ Transformers has a lot of competition in Japan where it is only one of many super robot franchises. In Western markets Transformers has no viable competition (Roadbots isn't a viable competitor unlike say Gundam or Macross).

2/ Takara's marketing of Transformers wasn't directly responsible for Takara's financial woes in 2000 and their later merger with TOMY. But after Takara announced that they were in financial trouble they actually managed to rescue themselves by reviving Beyblade. Beyblade became a gianormous success. Other Takara lines like Transformers suffered as a result because Takara decided to put all their eggs in the one Beyblade basket. Japanese Transfans complained about the neglect that Takara was showing toward Transformers as a result (i.e.: after Car Robot there was nothing new from Takara - they spent 2 years just pumping out G1 reissues, it wouldn't be until Micron Legend came along that broke the drought). But Beyblade did work fantastically in saving Takara. Takara then merged with TOMY not because they were in trouble anymore and needed TOMY to rescue them - they'd already rescued themselves. I'm not entirely sure why the merger occured, but perhaps Takara saw it as a way to strengthen themselves to prevent the downturn of 2000 from happening again.

Takara is not the giant corporate "Microsoft" conglomerate that Hasbro is - they never have been and frankly don't seem to intend on being (unlike Hasbro Takara doesn't have a long history of buying out their competitors).

So I would say that it's not entirely accurate to say that Takara's more end-customer-satisfaction driven marketing was the reason for Takara's downturn in 2000 and their subsequent merger with TOMY. I'd say the latter occured in spite of the former, not because of it.


Well, it most likely does. As a 7 year old, I was spectacularly unimpressed with Wheelie's weird bodyshape and hood thing. I was also unimpressed with the transformation being shunted to the accessories a few years later when half the line was Actionmasters. The fact that Hasbro US wound up the line after Actionmasters suggests that I probably wasn't the only one. I'm sure that everyone on this board remembers getting a toy as a kid and being disappointed by some feature or other.

Kids _are_ discerning, and are quite capable of thinking for themselves, but there's an assumption out there that kids aren't as smart as adults. When it comes to stuff like running a household or planning a family, that assumption is pretty much correct. When it comes to evaluating a toy, I think kids are often underestimated.

As MV75 mentioned above, if a kid is unimpressed with a Transformer he doesn't come online and talk about it, instead he heads into the next aisle and buys (say) a Star Wars toy or a console game. If enough kids start passing up on the line, then it'll choke the shelves. At that point Hasbro will either 1) work harder to please the retailer or 2) move onto something else, believing the market has changed (rather than the product, or the overall quality of it.) This happened when G1 was awash with Micromasters and Actionmasters. It happened when kids largely rejected G2's cr4ppy repaints and (generally better) new toys that didn't even appear in the dated cartoon which was trying to sell them.
+1 QFT

When Action Masters and G2 came out, it's not as if we hopped onto local dial-up BBSs and complained about them... we just didn't buy them! (well I bought a few... but overall I was very unimpressed with them - to this day my G2 collection remains quite small, only 2 shelves*)

P.S.: *including the fact that I display my Laser Prime's trailer in it's massively spread-out battle-platform mode and I have Laser Magnus on that shelf in truck mode. ;p

[kurdt_the_goat]

Perhaps this is a bit off topic, but I was really surprised when i visited japan, to see the prevalance of advertising for company identities. Check out this shot -
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v654/heffem/blog/posts/2006/11-november/05-dendentown/11-joshin-super-kids-land/1F/01-front.jpg

It gives me the impression the littler companies are just lost in the sea.. perhaps this is one of the reasons for merging.

[STL]

I was going to reply but maybe we should start up a Hasbro complaint thread? Too often are we in these topics straying onto issues of Hasbro's quality control and lack of customer focus. It does detract from the main news item here. While the odd comment about Hasbro's QC or customer ignorance is cool, I feel getting into long winded expositions about Hasbro's deficiencies obstructs the purpose of many of the news threads.

Perhaps in the Kup's Discussion area?

[kup]

I was going to reply but maybe we should start up a Hasbro complaint thread? Too often are we in these topics straying onto issues of Hasbro's quality control and lack of customer focus. It does detract from the main news item here. While the odd comment about Hasbro's QC or customer ignorance is cool, I feel getting into long winded expositions about Hasbro's deficiencies obstructs the purpose of many of the news threads.

Perhaps in the Kup's Discussion area?

If this sort of thing didn't happen so often we wouldn't have to.

It would not have hurt Hasbro to paint silver on the exposed plastic parts of this release. We know they can because they have released figures this year with much more complex paint jobs such as deluxe Crasher. I am sure if they had painted those exposed bits silver, we would not be complaining like we are now.

[Demonac]

It would not have hurt Hasbro to paint silver on the exposed plastic parts of this release. We know they can because they have released figures this year with much more complex paint jobs such as deluxe Crasher. I am sure if they had painted those exposed bits silver, we would not be complaining like we are now.

One of the things we were shown at the Hasbro tour was that they have 'x' hours & 'y' dollars to design 'z' number of toys.
So what happens is that they will go the extra yard for some toys, at the expense of others.

I think its still pretty good that we DO get obscure references like Crasher, or any of the classics toys.
Who remembers the absolute laziness that was RiD?
With great tributes like 'Prowl 2', 'Movor', & 'X-Brawn'.

[FFN]

Also, Fracture was a redeco of a mold they already got their money's worth out of. Generally Hasbro puts more paint in redeco releases (see Energon Galvatron's bucketloads of paint) than then initial release.


Gok, would it be utterly impossible for a franchise such as Transformers, with the right marketing and promotion, to challenge the might of Gundam and (whatever else is really big in japan in the mecha subculture)? Personally, I think it was a mistake to obscure the robots in one of the Japanese theatre poster designs.

In the west, Transformers actually does have one main competitor: Power Rangers, which has consistently beaten Transformers since it's inception.

[Soundwarp]

Umm guys this thread is about Cyclonus 2.0, i come in to read about that not all of your opinions on other stuff.

A new thread perhaps?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v739/soundwarp/attachment1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v739/soundwarp/attachment2.jpg

I think his face is a little too fat.
Perhaps the Takara version will fix the little paint app mistakes, i hope so as i think the mould is a winner.

[lcz128]

Agreed Soundwarp - the mould looks to be a winner!
And the more and more i look at this, it just makes me think of how much better it'd look with several coats of paint...
Thanks to TDD for asking me to repaint his sscreams - given me a whole new appreciation for the mould and hence I can 'see' the potential this one has :D

[GoktimusPrime]

Gok, would it be utterly impossible for a franchise such as Transformers, with the right marketing and promotion, to challenge the might of Gundam and (whatever else is really big in japan in the mecha subculture)? Personally, I think it was a mistake to obscure the robots in one of the Japanese theatre poster designs.

In the west, Transformers actually does have one main competitor: Power Rangers, which has consistently beaten Transformers since it's inception.
Heh, outdoing Gundam is nigh-impossible... nothing comes close to the scale of Gundam in Japan. ;) But what I'm basically saying is that Transformers is up against more competition in Japan compared to Western markets. In fact, Transformers was born from the Japanese henkei-mecha market (Diaclone, Micro-Change, Dorvack, Beetras, Macross, Mechabot-1 et al.).


One of the things we were shown at the Hasbro tour was that they have 'x' hours & 'y' dollars to design 'z' number of toys.
So what happens is that they will go the extra yard for some toys, at the expense of others.
Then perhaps Hasbro should cut back on the scale of their production and focus on making Transformers better quality across the board? e.g.: if they scrapped things like those Bumper-Battlers, Cyber-Stompers etc. - the money saved on developing those toys could be re-injected into say Animated.

[kurdt_the_goat]

Gok, would it be utterly impossible for a franchise such as Transformers, with the right marketing and promotion, to challenge the might of Gundam and (whatever else is really big in japan in the mecha subculture)?

Can you imagine a multi-level store dedicated entirely to Transformers?
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/40/82665828_1d3d0dbe86.jpg?v=0
Actually there's supposed to be a store dedicated to TF's but a) i'm yet to find it, and b) there's no way it'd be on the scale of Osaka Gundams!

[jaydisc]

Shortpacked today (http://www.shortpacked.com/d/20081008.html). SO topical. :D

[GoktimusPrime]

So the moral of the story is, don't trust Hasbro*. ;)


(*'s promotional photography - notice how that Vector Prime looks just like the Galaxy Force version though)

[kup]

Shortpacked today (http://www.shortpacked.com/d/20081008.html). SO topical. :D

Having them side by side really shows how dodgy it looks to the promo pic. When it comes to final product difference (as in budgeted out paint) I say that Cyclonus is the winner.

[kup]

So the moral of the story is, don't trust Hasbro*. ;)


(*'s promotional photography - notice how that Vector Prime looks just like the Galaxy Force version though)

That's why I jumped at Sky Shadow's Galaxy Force Vector Prime even though I originally had the Hasbro version :)

Hopefully Takara will give us a more presentable release of the mold, preferably without chrome.

[iceburn]

i guess they could have made Cyclonus brighter and more appealing!
curses to Hxxxxo...

[1orion2many]

:rolleyes:Goodness I just spent my lunch time at work reading this whole thread. Mostly complaints with the occassional positive. If you don't like it don't buy it, be constructive not destructive with critiscism. I would prefer better colours but I can easily get past that if the moulds are good. As I have said before, I don't believe you can make an honest judgement on something until it is in front of you. Pictures do not always give true colour indications so wait and see people. I like it and will more than likely buy it but I do hope the issue with the silver gray colour difference in limb parts is rectified.

[Soundwarp]

And the more and more i look at this, it just makes me think of how much better it'd look with several coats of paint...



Yeah i see a definate custom paint job.

[kup]

Yeah i see a definate custom paint job.

You know, it doesn't seem to be that hard to do. All that it really needs is the exposed plain plastic to be painted silver which is fairly easy to apply.

It looks bad because there are too many large areas of unpainted plastic and it makes it look like a half finished figure.

[King Atlas]

Now that I take a second look, and by that I mean this article, I can see why there are so many complaints. Its similar to the dissapointing classics ultramagnus. You look at the box-art/stockphoto and think wow, a nice blue face plate and bright red eyes and generous highlights. But the real thing is totally different and just a lazy effort.

[Pulse]

Man, those guys/gals working in Hasbro's photoshop-department deserve a raise... :D

[FFN]

From Jin Satomi on Walky's blog about photoshopped, hand-painted prototypes:


I inquired as to that a while back, why we'd get these awesome looking figures at the SDCC and press releases and all the paint was cut back. Here's what I was told by a reputable source. Budgeting paint is part of it but most of those killer paint apps are never really meant to show up in the first place. They need to sell these figures to retailers like Walmart. In order to do so they have to make them look like the most amazing figure you'll ever see on the shelf. Mr Marketing Director of store X has to sort through thousands of Elmo and Polly Pocket promotions all day. The toy companies need something to grab his attention and make him say, "Hey, that looks great." so they can actually get their product on the shelf in many cases.

So apparently those fancy photos and well-painted prototypes at conventions/trade shows are meant to fool retailers, not the end customer.

[TheDirtyDigger]

From Jin Satomi on Walky's blog about photoshopped, hand-painted prototypes:



So apparently those fancy photos and well-painted prototypes at conventions/trade shows are meant to fool retailers, not the end customer.


Oh well that makes it alright then....

[GoktimusPrime]

Which reinforces what dirge was saying about Hasbro's consumers being retailers (e.g.: Target, Kmart etc), not end-customers (e.g. kids, collectors etc).

[FFN]

From a business perspective, Hasbro doesn't deal directly with the consumer (even Hasbro Toy Shop is run by another company on behalf of Hasbro), so yes, retailers are their main customers.

But I still think it's quite cynical to believe Hasbro doesn't give a crap about their customers (especially the kids) enjoying their products. One of the reasons you get a job in this field is the satisfaction in knowing your work makes kids happy.

[jaydisc]

These aren't pics posted on Hasbro's website. They're dug up leaks and should be treated accordingly. You wanna ride the bleeding edge? Expect to get cut.

[MV75]

Easy to say that now that you've only just read that's what they are. :p

So what happens when businesses come into the situation we are then? The product isn't what is shown to them, and would then actually be something they otherwise would have passed on?

[jaydisc]

Easy to say that now that you've only just read that's what they are. :p

So what happens when businesses come into the situation we are then? The product isn't what is shown to them, and would then actually be something they otherwise would have passed on?

I can see how it might seem that way, but I've always felt that some here are very quick to judge and those judgements are rarely based on fact or first hand experience, but rather rumor and conjecture.

As far as the stores' perspective, I have no insight to that, but generally, I fail to ever feel sympathy for Kmart and their ilk.

[MV75]

So how are photochopped pictures and then followed by pictures of the real thing rumour or conjecture?

And it's not just this case either, happens all the time.

[kup]

So how are photochopped pictures and then followed by pictures of the real thing rumour or conjecture?

And it's not just this case either, happens all the time.

True but this time it was worse. The difference between one and the other is massive.

Even Hasbro's Vector Prime doesn't look that bad when compared to the promo and Galaxy Force version.

[MV75]

Yes, it is a massive difference. All complaining here is highly justified.

I'll make it clear again, I love the look of the mould, no arguements there, but the finished product is so far off the "burger shot" that you can't ignore it. It's not right when even myself is thinking that I HAVE to paint it to get it looking like it should.

[jaydisc]

So how are photochopped pictures and then followed by pictures of the real thing rumour or conjecture?

Well, i think any of the following events could be interpreted as conjecture:

The assumption that the initial photos were official product shots.
The assumption that the next set of photos was a prototype.
The assumption that the next set of photos is not a prototype.

Possibly more. Since no one has seen anything in person, it's all conjecture.

[jaydisc]

http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/new-official-images-of-tf-animated-and-universe-20/14159/

They don't like like "burger shots" to me. :)

[MV75]

No it's not.

The first pictures were clearly chopped. No assumptions that it was a final toy, but an indication of what to expect. And don't try and argue this point, you and everyone else knows exactly what I mean.

The second lot of pictures were factory shots, and yes, they looked like a prototype in comparison. Of course we don't expect the colours to look as deep and stunning as the promo pictures, but until this toy, we did expect the colour schemes to match as they always have in the past. The promo and the finished product are very radically different.

It was then revealed by an in box shot that they indeed were the real thing.

And now you start another thread with the same pictures in it. Are you digging yourself into your own arguement for the sake of it?

[jaydisc]

I think were on different pages, but in hindsight, I shouldn't have started a new thread. Mods, can we merge?

[Paulbot]

I think were on different pages, but in hindsight, I shouldn't have started a new thread. Mods, can we merge?

Merged

[Lord_Zed]

http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/new-official-images-of-tf-animated-and-universe-20/14159/

They don't like like "burger shots" to me. :)

Those Pics don't do those toys any favours. I'll probably get one or two, but no longer am I eager for thier release.

[kup]

Those Pics don't do those toys any favours. I'll probably get one or two, but no longer am I eager for thier release.

yeah same. Those final product pics have also killed my enthusiasm for these figures.

[iceburn]

From the IDW forum under Global fan-forums Oct Hasbro Q&A:



Sometimes test shots come in and all of the molds are not cast in the correct colors. But that's why test shots exist, so that we can catch those problems before the toy is produced. In this example, an image of a Cyclonus testshot was released and fans had issues. But rest assured, the mold is going to remain purple and match the initial prototype image.


woot!!

[kup]

From the IDW forum under Global fan-forums Oct Hasbro Q&A:



woot!!

I am skeptical of this answer as we have already seen final production pics (in card) and they are the dodgy colored.

[blackie]

i would have to agree with kup, don't get your hopes up icy, the paint will still be crap methinks

[iceburn]

:( not even a tiny 10% chance of being happy?

[kup]

:( not even a tiny 10% chance of being happy?

Maybe 1% :)

[kurdt_the_goat]

Remember the Brawn packaging pics also had green wheels, yet the latest loose toy photo showed black wheels... so there is a chance, more than 1%!
Still, we all know Henkei will get it right regardless :)

[Pulse]

But I bet you (just like me) will still buy a Classics Cyclonus :) (either Hasbro or Henkei) because at the end of the day, We luv the Classics Line of figures! :)

[kup]

But I bet you (just like me) will still buy a Classics Cyclonus :) (either Hasbro or Henkei) because at the end of the day, We luv the Classics Line of figures! :)

I have nothing against the mold itself, I love it! My only issue is the paint finish so I will certainly get this mold but willing to wait and see if there is a better version available before I jump in.

[Zippo]

Maybe the purple will be a running change?

[Golden Phoenix]

Maybe they just use the test shots in package shots so that they aren't as big of a target for thieves...or something

[kup]

Good news.

Cyclonus has been announced as a Henkei release:

January 2009: D-07 Cyclonus

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/classics-11/silhouette-of-alternity-megatron-robot-mode-and-confirmation-of-new-henkei-figures-166006/

[iceburn]

hopefully its a better purple and hmmm chrome all the way?

[kup]

hopefully its a better purple and hmmm chrome all the way?

I am concerned about the chrome as it would be inappropriate on Cyclonus unless they use a transmetal like dark purple chrome.

[kurdt_the_goat]

I think Cyclonus' crown/spikes are a good candidate for regular chrome, and possibly his engines, similar to Henkei Astrotrain.

[kup]

I think Cyclonus' crown/spikes are a good candidate for regular chrome, and possibly his engines, similar to Henkei Astrotrain.

Yeah that's good too, preferably the engines.

[MV75]

Chrome:

Face
Ears
Engines
Wing connectors (at least make it grey plastic).
Possibly the target master barrel.

Plenty of opportunity.

[griffin]

As long as they are separately individual parts, they are candidates for chroming. Maybe the TM gun perhaps?