War in Ukriane

[Autocon]

Thoughts to those with family and friends in the Ukriane

[DELTAprime]

Russia is all anyone can talk about in the chat for the F1 day 2 of testing. Largely because there is a Russian pay driver that is closely affiliated with Putin and paid for Uralkahli.

[jimoinj]

It's disgusting that Putin can launch a war to wipe a country off the map, in 2022. He really needs to be cut off from all finances especially the SWIFT system. Anyone who trades with his regime should also be sanctioned.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Serious question - I've been dealing with some things for the past week or two and am not super-knowledgeable about the geopolitics of that particular region...

What's the point/advantage for Russia in taking Ukraine?

[Seraphim Prime]

This is what a friend posted the other day on Facebook (ie - I haven't been able to verify) but it puts much of the importance of Ukraine into perspective. The other aspect of it is that Putin considers Ukraine part of "historic Russia" (like China's claims to Taiwan and Hong Kong) and is part of his push against NATO and the former USSR nations that since signed up to it. Ukraine had not yet joined NATO, but had expressed interest in doing so.


It is the second largest country by area in Europe by area and has a population
of over 40 million - more than Poland.

Ukraine ranks:
1st in Europe in proven recoverable reserves of uranium ores;
2nd place in Europe and 10th place in the world in terms of titanium ore reserves;
2nd place in the world in terms of explored reserves of manganese ores (2.3 billion tons, or 12% of the world's reserves);
2nd largest iron ore reserves in the world (30 billion tons);
2nd place in Europe in terms of mercury ore reserves;
3rd place in Europe (13th place in the world) in shale gas reserves (22 trillion cubic meters)
4th in the world by the total value of natural resources;
7th place in the world in coal reserves (33.9 billion tons)

Ukraine is an important agricultural country:

1st in Europe in terms of arable land area;
3rd place in the world by the area of black soil (25% of world's volume);
1st place in the world in exports of sunflower and sunflower oil;
2nd place in the world in barley production and 4th place in barley exports;
3rd largest producer and 4th largest exporter of corn in the world;
4th largest producer of potatoes in the world;
5th largest rye producer in the world;
5th place in the world in bee production (75,000 tons);
8th place in the world in wheat exports;
9th place in the world in the production of chicken eggs;
16th place in the world in cheese exports.

Ukraine can meet the food needs of 600 million people.

Ukraine is an important industrialised country:

1st in Europe in ammonia production;
Europe's 2nd’s and the world’s 4th largest natural gas pipeline system;
3rd largest in Europe and 8th largest in the world in terms of installed capacity of nuclear power plants;
3rd place in Europe and 11th in the world in terms of rail network length (21,700 km);
3rd place in the world (after the U.S. and France) in production of locators and locating equipment;
3rd largest iron exporter in the world
4th largest exporter of turbines for nuclear power plants in the world;
4th world's largest manufacturer of rocket launchers;
4th place in the world in clay exports
4th place in the world in titanium exports
8th place in the world in exports of ores and concentrates;
9th place in the world in exports of defence industry products;
10th largest steel producer in the world (32.4 million tons).

[Golden Phoenix]

Serious question - I've been dealing with some things for the past week or two and am not super-knowledgeable about the geopolitics of that particular region...

What's the point/advantage for Russia in taking Ukraine?

My understanding is that it is basically to put space between Russia and NATO territories. It also stops Ukraine joining NATO and putting their equipment right next door.

Putin claimed it was to get rid of Neo-Nazi's, stop Ukraine from killing ethnic Russians in the 2 break away areas, and to demilitarize the area. Putin's claim about Neo-Nazi's in Ukraine and the killings of ethnic Russians have been well debunked even before he said it the other day.

His mention of the break up of the USSR makes it sound more like he's just trying to reclaim the territories that were lost when the USSR broke up.
Almost like this Simpsons gag (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKzesTq0Wo)

[Handsprime]

This is what a friend posted the other day on Facebook (ie - I haven't been able to verify) but it puts much of the importance of Ukraine into perspective. The other aspect of it is that Putin considers Ukraine part of "historic Russia" (like China's claims to Taiwan and Hong Kong) and is part of his push against NATO and the former USSR nations that since signed up to it. Ukraine had not yet joined NATO, but had expressed interest in doing so.


It is the second largest country by area in Europe by area and has a population
of over 40 million - more than Poland.

Ukraine ranks:
1st in Europe in proven recoverable reserves of uranium ores;
2nd place in Europe and 10th place in the world in terms of titanium ore reserves;
2nd place in the world in terms of explored reserves of manganese ores (2.3 billion tons, or 12% of the world's reserves);
2nd largest iron ore reserves in the world (30 billion tons);
2nd place in Europe in terms of mercury ore reserves;
3rd place in Europe (13th place in the world) in shale gas reserves (22 trillion cubic meters)
4th in the world by the total value of natural resources;
7th place in the world in coal reserves (33.9 billion tons)

Ukraine is an important agricultural country:

1st in Europe in terms of arable land area;
3rd place in the world by the area of black soil (25% of world's volume);
1st place in the world in exports of sunflower and sunflower oil;
2nd place in the world in barley production and 4th place in barley exports;
3rd largest producer and 4th largest exporter of corn in the world;
4th largest producer of potatoes in the world;
5th largest rye producer in the world;
5th place in the world in bee production (75,000 tons);
8th place in the world in wheat exports;
9th place in the world in the production of chicken eggs;
16th place in the world in cheese exports.

Ukraine can meet the food needs of 600 million people.

Ukraine is an important industrialised country:

1st in Europe in ammonia production;
Europe's 2nd’s and the world’s 4th largest natural gas pipeline system;
3rd largest in Europe and 8th largest in the world in terms of installed capacity of nuclear power plants;
3rd place in Europe and 11th in the world in terms of rail network length (21,700 km);
3rd place in the world (after the U.S. and France) in production of locators and locating equipment;
3rd largest iron exporter in the world
4th largest exporter of turbines for nuclear power plants in the world;
4th world's largest manufacturer of rocket launchers;
4th place in the world in clay exports
4th place in the world in titanium exports
8th place in the world in exports of ores and concentrates;
9th place in the world in exports of defence industry products;
10th largest steel producer in the world (32.4 million tons).

Obviously when I see posts like this on Facebook I tend not to share them unless I can prove that it's factual. Apparently some of the facts are true, some are outdated, and some are false. (https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/why-does-ukraine-matter/)

Apparently some of the outdated posts are misleading because the figures went up, for example it says Ukraine was #8 in wheat exports, when in reality it has risen to #5 (which is why some news websites were talking about how this might affect bread prices).

[klystron]

I'm wondering about the NATO thing. I think it might be just one of the convenient 'justifications' for Putin.
Estonia, Lativa, Lithuania, Poland, Norway, and Turkey are all NATO members, and they all share a border with Russia.

And as a massive F1 fan, I agree they should totally cancel the Russian GP. (I'm less sure how to deal with HAAS and its Russian money...)

[DELTAprime]

And as a massive F1 fan, I agree they should totally cancel the Russian GP. (I'm less sure how to deal with HAAS and its Russian money...)

Well, Haas has removed Uralkahli as a sponsor and they have said Mazepin's drive is in question. Also, McLaren has said that they believe the Russian GP is untenable and to expect F1 to make a statement shortly.

Also, I've heard a major football tournament has moved its Russian final to another country.

I hope the sanctions bankrupt Putin and his friends.

[Autocon]

The live announcement putin made was pre recorded.

So shocking. If putin invades another country it is war.

Nothing will happen to stop Ukraine being taken by putin

[Dkaris]

Thermobaric weapons have been spotted moving toward Kyiv. Those things are no joke, they make the air burn all around. I hope the Ukrainians have some NLAW'S or javelins.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Thermobaric weapons have been spotted moving toward Kyiv. Those things are no joke, they make the air burn all around. I hope the Ukrainians have some NLAW'S or javelins.

Just had to google that one. Dang, that's an oxygen destroyer! Just like Dr Serizawa and the first Godzilla film(but real). If this is true, dang Putin's becoming the villian in 80s James Bond movies....

[DELTAprime]

You know you've f'd up when Switzerland imposes sanctions on your country and freezes your assets. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/28/switzerland-adopts-wholesale-eu-sanctions-against-russia

Also, the economy in Russia is collapsing. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-03-01/sanctions-russia-economy-rouble-financial-collapse/100872126

Even if Russia wins the ground war, they have destroyed their economy.

[Dkaris]

40 mile convoy of Russians heading for Kyiv. If only they had some A10's. Regardless of what happens to Zelenskyy, he's going to go down in history as a hero to his people. I can't think of any Australian politician who would do the same for their state or country.

[DELTAprime]

I'm watching an EU parliament meeting right now. They are talking about fast-tracking adding Ukraine to the EU and NATO. Meaning if Russia doesn't call off the war all of the EU and NATO will join in the defence of Ukraine. About time.


Just had to google that one. Dang, that's an oxygen destroyer! Just like Dr Serizawa and the first Godzilla film(but real). If this is true, dang Putin's becoming the villian in 80s James Bond movies....

Ukraine has said Russia has used vacuum bombs against it.