Gestalt, does it bug anyone else?

[TF76]

Not meaning to upset anyone it just really annoys me.

I have been a long time fan but only recently taken any notice/or even known there was a large community of fans worldwide.

My love of transformers was always a pretty inward and I had been into Transformers over 20 years before even seeing the word.

I just thought of them as a combiner back then and now.

It just seems almost wanky to me and hard to embrace.

Do new(ish?) :confused: terms like this bug anyone else?

[Sky Shadow]

Gestalt has been a part of the fandom for at least a decade and used officially by Hasbro over the past few years. It was also used in the Animated comic that came with Jetstorm and Jetfire. Although I do suspect it's often mispronounced by the fan community (the word is pronounced "geshtolt") it doesn't bug me - it's better than Special Team which was canonical back in the eighties but sounds like it's a robot made up of retarded Transformers. Seeker used to annoy me, but then it turned out that it had actually been used in print in 1984 except no one remembered where it came from for twenty years. I even got my own fan name for seekers into the Transformers FAQ: http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~sstoneb/tf/faq/appendices/glossary.php

"non-blundersrounge

A silly synonym for "seeker", coined as a joke in a post by ATTer Sky Shadow. (A blunderscrounge is any Decepticon jet who is not of the skyraider/seeker design.)

See also: seeker."

[turtle boy]

I don't care TBH. I like saying combiner, thats just my pursonal favoret. But I don't mind Gestsalt.

[kup]

Oops! Almost misposted something that was meant for another board.

Anyways as a kid I knew them as combiners but now I know them as both Gestalt teams and combiners. I don't really mind usage of any term but Gestalt refers more to the combined form while combiners is more to reference the actual combining team.

[jacksplatt11]

I have called them combiners for as long as I can remember, but I first noticed gestalt being used probably 5 or so years ago, saying combiner just always felt more comfortable to me though

[Bartrim]

I'm not saying ones right or wrong but I definitely prefer the term combiner. I can understand where you are coming from as on some international forums I've seen some fan boyz have an absolute spaz over the term.

[GoktimusPrime]

I used to call them Combiners until 1990 when Hasbro officially used the term to describe the Micromaster Combiners (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dfXzor4EGs). Thus the term "Combiners" came to refer to multiple robots who combine to become one alt mode. Officially it was used for the Micromaster Combiners but the term could also be applied to Reflector and others like that.

As a result the fan-term "gestalt" was coined by a German-speaking fan in 1994 and it spread from there - basically so that we wouldn't confuse gestalts with combiners. The term "Combiners" was not officially used to describe gestalts until 2001 when Hasbro classified the RiD gestalts as, you guessed it, "Combiners," causing a whole new level of confusion for fans!! Why... it's almost as if Hasbro wasn't paying attention!

I like the term "gestalt" because it's less ambiguous than "Combiner." When you say gestalt, fans know precisely that you're talking about a sub group of Transformers who unite to form a super-robot, e.g.: Constructicons --> Devastator. Thanks to Hasbro, the term "Combiner" has become confusing and ambiguous because officially it can now refer to either multiple Transformers who combine to form a single alt mode or a team of Transformers who combine to form a super-robot.

If someone says "G1 Combiner", I immediately think of the G1 Combiners (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dfXzor4EGs), not the G1 gestalts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFQUnL3VucE). Thinking of "combiners" as gestalts is counter-intuitive for me now because I've been used to calling them gestalts for nearly a decade and a half now. (-_-)

The term "gestalt" has now entered official currency btw (reference (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Rise_of_Safeguard))

[TF76]

I noticed that in the comic too, why i think the word started to bother me, is how some people considered it to be correct name and calling it a combiner (when it always was known as that.) is now wrong and they get so rude about it. :rolleyes:

Thanks

[jaydisc]

I, too, have been put off by those attempting to correct people for allegedly incorrectly using the word "combiner". I think the term/word gestalt seems a bit pretentious as well.

[roller]

i hate the word 'The' man i wish i could find an alternative to that word, but what?

[Sky Shadow]

i hate the word 'The' man i wish i could find an alternative to that word, but what?

I know! Indefinite articles like 'a' or 'an' are okay as a stand in, but they suck when I'm trying to be specific. I think 'that' and 'those' work best, although they're sometimes a bit too specific. To demonstrate, using the words 'that' and 'those', here's some lyrics from 'That Touch' by Stan Bush:

You got that touch./You got that power./Yeah./After all is said and done/You've never walked, you've never run./You're a winner./You got those moves, you know those streets./Break those rules, take that heat./You're nobody's fool/You're at your best when that going gets rough./You've been put to that test, but it's never enough./You got that touch./You got that power./When all Hell's breaking loose/You'll be riding that eye of that storm./You got that heart./You got that motion./You know that when things get too tough/You got that touch.

No thanks necessary, Roller, I'm just glad to help. :cool:

...

;)

[Paulbot]

I much prefer "combiner" to "gestalt" and have gone on record on this topic before :)

But usually most people know what you mean when you say either.

[roller]

i also hate the word puberty and 'like' when they use it like this "Hes like so totally like going to smoke"

i call the ones that turn into bigger ones, ones that turn into bigger ones.

More importantly, what do you home boys call transformers who sound alike, like Scavenger and Ratchet. id call em sound alikes

[turtle boy]

Goki has a good argument me thinks. Roller, mate. How do you expect to not use a word as globaly needed as "the" Skyshadow has a good point, but I mean, It's just so much effort. I only usaed that word once:) lol

[Lord_Zed]

I'd have called them Chazwazzers. :D

[The_Damned]

i dont think i have ever called them gestalt and will only only ever call them combiners, i don think i even know how to pronounce it......;)

[Burn]

I use both but lean more towards using "Combiners" more than "Gestalt".

I thought it was odd too, but eh, not a major issue.

[Sky Shadow]

In All Hail Megatron #7 Devastator is described as a gestalt. I don't quite get why everyone's so hot for 'combiner' - since it was never used for anything other than Micromaster pairs until RiD in 2001 it has no more validity than gestalt. It's also interesting that no one seems interested in the names that were official in the 80's and 90's - 'Special Teams' and 'Fusilateral Quintrocombiners'. Unless 'Combiner' is short for that. :)

[turtle boy]

It's also interesting that no one seems interested in the names that were official in the 80's and 90's - 'Special Teams' and 'Fusilateral Quintrocombiners'. Unless 'Combiner' is short for that. :)

cause those names suck;)

[GoktimusPrime]

"Quintrocombiners" sounds like it would only apply to 5-robot gestalts such as the Scramble City gestalts. "Gestalt" covers all gestalts.

[turtle boy]

That maybe true gok, but, Quintrocombiners would, 1. Take waaaay to long to say and 2. I have to say it slowly to pronounce it right. How are 5 and 10 year old kids going to fare up with that one???

Although I agree that Gestalt would correctly and officaly sepperate, say, Combiner Teams, such as Reflector from Teams that are otherwize considered Combining Teams. Cause they can combine with one another to make one big robot. You say the name of the Combiner in particular and everyone knows what your talking about.

IE "I like the combiner team, The Stunticons" no one, anywhere is going to get that and Reflector mixed up. Unless they live in some kind of warped world where dogs walk people and I am the ruler of the Ant world.

[GoktimusPrime]

That maybe true gok, but, Quintrocombiners would, 1. Take waaaay to long to say and 2. I have to say it slowly to pronounce it right. How are 5 and 10 year old kids going to fare up with that one???
It's only 5 syllables - same as "Fortress Maximus" and I was able to say that as a kid. Grimlock called him "Forky Maxi-face" though, which is still 5 syllables, but I think Grimlock was doing that on purpose to mock him. :p

Gelshark/Sky-Byte to make a haiku out of it!

Quintro-Combiners
The gestalt obstructs the sky
Five robots in one


Although I agree that Gestalt would correctly and officaly sepperate, say, Combiner Teams, such as Reflector from Teams that are otherwize considered Combining Teams. Cause they can combine with one another to make one big robot. You say the name of the Combiner in particular and everyone knows what your talking about.

IE "I like the combiner team, The Stunticons" no one, anywhere is going to get that and Reflector mixed up.
True, but it would be confusing if the word was used in isolation without specification. e.g.: if you said, "G1 combiners" (e.g.: "I like G1 Combiners") then you could be talking about non-gestalt combiners or gestalts. Or both. Gah!


Unless they live in some kind of warped world where dogs walk people and I am the ruler of the Ant world.
"My Queen!"http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/bwinferno.jpg

[Sky Shadow]

It's only 5 syllables - same as "Fortress Maximus" and I was able to say that as a kid. Grimlock called him "Forky Maxi-face" though, which is still 5 syllables, but I think Grimlock was doing that on purpose to mock him. :p

Grimlock called him Forktongue Maxiface, Fullstrength Motleypuss and Fruitloop Multipuck. That made me LOL as a kid. :)

[GoktimusPrime]

Those are the ones! :D You stick it to thatthe man, Grimmie!

[Robzy]

Perhaps we should look to the characters themselves... In the cartoon they never referred to themselves as either Combiners or Gestalts!

Maybe they should be called "Uniters" - as in "Constructicons - Unite!"

Or "Mergers" - as in "Constructicons - Merge for the kill!"

:p

[Golden Phoenix]

Or "Mergers" - as in "Constructicons - Merge for the kill!"

Mergers sounds like something else
http://www.majhost.com/gallery/jimmey-11/other/dragon-ball-z-capitulo-248-parte-2-3_imagengrande.jpg

[MV75]

That's fusion..... and I think a picture of the animated twins would convey that exact same message.....

[griffin]

Combiners have, and always will be, the generally accepted common term by fans for the multi-teams that merge into a larger robot. It is easy to pronounce correctly (unlike quntro-thingy and gesHtalt), and unless you try to obsessively argue against it, no one would NOT know what actual toys you were referring to. We all know that the usage of the term combiner relates to those 5 or 6 'special teams' that form a larger robot, there is no need to make the majority change for the benefit of the majority. If you prefer to use Combiner or Special Team or Gestalt, then continue to do so, as the words as common fan terms are intechangable.

Stubbornly trying to change the common perseption of a common fan term, like combiners, seekers, matrix, BB, etc, just creates *unecessary* confusion.

[GoktimusPrime]

According to TFwiki the term "combiner" is very broad. The article has a fairly comprehensive list of what counts as "Combiners" and even what sub-class of "Combiner" that they fall under. Source (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Combiner).

The article does fail to mention the fact that "gestalt" has now entered official currency though in Animated and IDW. In Animated the term was used to describe Jetfire + Jetstorm = Safeguard, whereas in IDW it was used to describe Devastator (re: AHM).