Transformers questions by newbies, and not-so-newbies

[Verno]

A Spark can't exist outside a living body - Rhinox, Optimal Situation.


A structure is a term used to define the body of a Transformer. Without a spark or a personality component, the structure is a lifeless shell. - TFWiki

So, which is it? Is a Transformers' body alive, or is it simply a lifeless shell?

[GoktimusPrime]

So, which is it? Is a Transformers' body alive, or is it simply a lifeless shell?
A Transformer's body is a lifeless shell unless:
+ It is imbued with a sentient mind, e.g. G1 cartoon Dinobots
+ It is imbued with a "life energy" (Spark), e.g. G1 comics (life essence), G1 cartoon Aerialbots & Stunticons, BW/BM Sparks etc.

Without either a sentient mind and/or life energy, then a Transformer's body is nothing more than a shell. And likewise that mind or Spark can be transferred out of that shell -- look at the G1 cartoon episode "Only Human" where the minds of Ultra Magnus, Rodimus Prime, Arcee and Springer were removed from their bodies by COBRA Commander and then inadvertently placed into human bodies. The human villains were able to operate their lifeless bodies and the humanised Autobots had absolutely no control over their original bodies.

In the G1 Comics when Optimus Prime was killed his mind was backed up onto a floppy disk (lolz) by the human programmer Ethan Zachary, and for a long time Optimus Prime existed purely as an entity in cyberspace believing that he was nothing more than an online entity created by Zachary. It was only later when Goldbug retrieved the diskette that a new Powermaster body was built on Nebulos and his mind transferred to that body that Optimus Prime fully returned.

There have also been numerous cases where Transformer bodies have acted independently in the absence of a sentient mind or life energy; such as in "Only Human". Another example was when Shockwave created a fake head of Optimus Prime and arranged for it to fall into the hands of the Autobots - the Autobots then attached the head onto Optimus Prime's body, who then started attacking the Autobots. Later on when Buster and Jetfire came along with Optimus Prime's real head, Prime was able to remotely command his body to rip off the fake head and replace it with the real one, thus Optimus Prime stopped attacking the Autobots and turned against the Decepticons ("Prime Time!").

Although one interesting case is G1 Zombie Starscream ("Race with the Devil"), because at the time, Starscream had been destroyed after absorbing the powers of the Underbase, but it became driven not by any conscious mind or "spark", but by the residual energy of the Underbase which the body had soaked up prior and at the moment of Starscream's destruction. The interesting thing here is that although Zombie Starscream was lifeless and mindless, because Starscream had undertaken a murderous rampage slaughtering all Transformers indiscriminately, his shell had somehow maintained some form of "body memory" and the lifeless/mindless Zombie Starscream continued on an indiscriminate kill-fest. The story made it clear that Zombie Starscream was not driven by the conscious mind or spark of Starscream, but by residual Underbase energy - because we saw the Backstreet make a connection with Zombie Starscream by appealing to its core consciousness which was the Underbase and pleaded for it to regain emotional control (which inadvertently allowed Hi-Test and Throttle to siphon the Underbase energies from Zombie Starscream, effectively "killing" the undead entity and reducing it to a pile of scrap).

And of course, in the G1 cartoon we saw Starscream's Ghost existing independently of the Matrix. Then again, Beast Wars explained this with their "immortal Spark" retcon, so Starscream is probably a very special case. :) Perhaps it was the unusual nature of Starscream's Spark that allowed his will to continue surviving in his remains which drove Zombie Starscream to continue his murderous rampage.



A Spark can't exist outside a living body
- Rhinox, Optimal Situation.
Generally I would say that this is true, although there have been times when we've seen Sparks exist very briefly outside of a body. e.g. In "Code of Hero" when Dinobot died we see his Spark rise and ascend (presumably to return to the Matrix dimension - similar to the idea of ascension into Heaven or whatever). In Beast Machines we see Sparks being extracted and occasionally surviving for very brief moments of time outside of a body - like when Nightscream chased down Blackarachnia's disembodied Spark.

But I would assume that a Spark cannot survived for any substantial sustained period of time outside of a body -- even when Vehicons captured Sparks, they placed them inside of a vessel and eventually returned them to Megatron where he held them in a massive container. At the end of Beast Machines when the Sparks were released, we see them fly off into the horizon, then hundreds of Cybertronians running along -- so presumably those Sparks must have been united (reunited?) with bodies. Exactly why this happened instead of the Sparks flying off aimlessly I'm not entirely sure -- probably because all of Cybertron was being reformatted at the time and the Oracle/Vector Sigma guided those Sparks to bodies? I dunno... stupid Beast Machines ending... :rolleyes:

[Verno]

Perhaps I should have italisised Rhinox's comment. "Outside a living body". I'm not interested in the spark, but what makes a 'living' Transformer body.

In these post-BW days with the retconned issue of Sparks, you would have to dismiss the 'sentient mind' argument, would you not?

We've had CNA thrown up in G2, is the metal that makes up a Transformer body somehow alive?

[GoktimusPrime]

We've had CNA thrown up in G2, is the metal that makes up a Transformer body somehow alive?
That's an interesting question - and I think one place we can look for an answer to this is the live action movieverse, where the Transformers' bodies are comprised of "living" nanotechnology, much like cells in an organic body. Look at Scorponok's tail - long after it had been severed from Scorponok's body it was still able to move and respond to stimuli. Also the ability for Transformers to self-scan and change their alt modes would probably require nanoscopic restructuring of their bodies. Even externally assisted acquisition of alt modes may require nanoscopic restructuring anyway; in the G1 comics we see the Ark physically rebuilding Transformers after having scanned new alt modes, but in the G1 cartoon we see Teletraan-1 cover the Transformers in an orange light which somehow "magically" imbued them with their new alt modes. Nanotech may be a feasible explanation for this.

The protoforms seen in Beast Wars and Animated appear to have some kind of nanotech - so it's possible that they are comprised of "living" nanotech sized mechanical "cells." In the G1 cartoon the Transformers were portrayed as having "self repair systems" where presumably over time minor wounds could be self-healed... exactly how this work was never explained, but nanotechnology could be possible. Also in the episode "Microbots" when Perceptor, Brawn and Bumblebee were shrunken down and infiltrated Megatron's body, they encountered several microscopic (nanoscopic?) entities that were described as being like Megatron's immune system.

So I guess a "living" body is one where the nanoscopic "CNA" is still in tact and able to house a living spark. Once the body is no longer structurally sound then that body "dies" and thus it is no longer physically fit to continue sustaining a living spark inside it. It certainly appears that Transformers perish when they sustain physical wounds where their body is longer physically capable of sustaining their life functions (Spark)... Dinobot is a visibly notable example of this; in "Code of Hero" we see his body being gradually sustaining increasing amounts of injury -- his internal computer insisting that he shut down into stasis lock to preserve his Spark, but Dinobot ordered override so that he could use what remaining physical energy he had left to continue fighting rather than preserving his Spark. In the end, even when the other Maximals arrived, they knew that his body was already dying beyond the point of repair, and all they could do was say their goodbyes to Dinobot.

Likewise in "Transformers The Movie" when Perceptor says, "I fear the wounds are fatal," - it would have been a similar situation and all the Autobots could do was listen to Optimus Prime give his final words and pass the Matrix onto Ultra Magnus (who should have been Autobot leader and not that whiny Hot Rod kid!! :p).

[Verno]

Who are the most loyal Decepticons? Loyal to Megatron.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Who are the most loyal Decepticons? Loyal to Megatron.Lugnut, Ravage, cartoon Shockwave and Soundwave. I'm sure there are others but they're all the ones that spring to mind atm.

[GoktimusPrime]

Going off their original tech spec profiles - Skywarp.

[Sky Shadow]

Who are the most loyal Decepticons? Loyal to Megatron.

Sky-Byte, BW Scorponok and Inferno.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Movieverse Blackout.

But I was assuming Verno was talking about G1 (as of TF 2010 Lugnut has been retconned in as a G1former...:rolleyes: ).

[Cat]

Soundwave, and associated minions.

They grabbed Megatron's body in the movie, while under heavy fire, and stayed loyal to him despite knowing that many of their comrades were ready to turn in a flash, with Megatron weakened like that.

[Verno]

So dudes like Eject and Rewind, Cat?

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

So dudes like Eject and Rewind, Cat?Close but not quite, those two are Autobots. These guys (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Decepticon_Mini-Cassette) are the ones you're after, though aside from Ravage (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Ravage_%28G1%29) it's hard to say how much of their loyalty is to Megs as opposed to Soundwave.

[Verno]

My bad. I meant Frenzy and Rumble. :rolleyes: N00b.

[kup]

Who are the most loyal Decepticons? Loyal to Megatron.

Ravage. In the comics he seemed to be Megatron's only real friend and as you know, he was fully dedicated to his ideals all the way to the Beast Wars era.

[blackoptimus]

Does anyone know where to get a takara animated sentinel prime? I've looked everywhere and I can't find him online, he seems hard to find, if anyone comes across him could you please lemme know.

[UltraMarginal]

Does anyone know where to get a takara animated sentinel prime? I've looked everywhere and I can't find him online, he seems hard to find, if anyone comes across him could you please lemme know.

sorry, I've had a look around and can't see anything, I haven't looked at Hobbylink or robot kingdome yet.
I'd recommend though unless you're getting all TAKARA that the Hasbro version paint is a bit more show accurate, being not as shiny.

[blackoptimus]

I'm already on a roll with collecting japanese animated, I wanna sell of all my hasbro animated. Thanks for trying though.


sorry, I've had a look around and can't see anything, I haven't looked at Hobbylink or robot kingdome yet.
I'd recommend though unless you're getting all TAKARA that the Hasbro version paint is a bit more show accurate, being not as shiny.

[Cat]

My bad. I meant Frenzy and Rumble. :rolleyes: N00b.

I'd actually put their allegiance as merely to Soundwave. Afterwards in the shuttle, they immediately defend him, and as soon as we see Starscream die, it's Rumble (or Frenzy, whichever) who immediately asks what the name was, for the cheer.

So for cartoon continuity, I'd say it's Soundwave who's the loyal one. The others - minions to the definition. For the most part, they go with Soundwave. (Though grabbing Megatron's gun could be seen as a bit of heroism, seeing it was such a big piece for a little bot to carry...)

[GoktimusPrime]

Yet when Starscream ditched Megatron's body out of Astrotrain, nobody tried to stop him... Soundwave just stood there and let him do it -- then tried to vie for leadership after Megatron had been chucked out (as opposed to say demanding that Astrotrain turn around and rescue him or something).

In the Marvel Comics Soundwave showed a fair bit of loyalty to Megatron ("I, Robot Master") -- he only ever assumed command when other superiors were no longer 'available'; i.e. when he perceived himself as the highest ranking remaining Decepticon, barring Starscream whom he didn't seem to care about ("Crisis of Command").

Although it could be argued that Soundwave's loyalty is toward whoever happens to be the top dog, even if that top dog usurped Megatron ("The New Order", "The Worse of Two Evils"). But Soundwave ultimately abandoned his loyalty toward Megatron when it became apparent to him that Megatron was in violation of Regulation 121 Section A^exhibited behaviour that indicated emotional compromise serious impaired professional judgement and was no longer fit to command ("Prey!"); but one could see that as Soundwave executing his professional duty as a Decepticon officer, irrespective of his personal feelings for Megatron ("Gone But Not Forgotten").

And of course, Soundwave happily served under Ratbat's command and later Scorponok. In fact, it was Soundwave who led the counter-offensive against the coup d'état in New Jersey ("All This and Civil War 2," "Out of Time!"). Soundwave then served under Bludgeon after the battle with Unicron and after Megatron resumed leadership again in G2, Soundwave became loyal to Megatron again.

So it seems that - with the exception of Starscream - Soundwave is loyal to whichever Decepticon leader is currently in command. It could be argued that he is more loyal to the Decepticon cause than to Megatron per se. The same could be said about Ravage too - who swore piety to the Decepticon cause right to his spectacular end ("The Agenda Part 3"). ;)

[sanbot]

I spotted a blue alternity megatron for about AUD33 in Taiwan and I thought that was quite cheap. It is supposedly new. I was wondering are there different versions of the blue alternity megatron?

[Cat]

I spotted a blue alternity megatron for about AUD33 in Taiwan and I thought that was quite cheap. It is supposedly new. I was wondering are there different versions of the blue alternity megatron?

Yep. Silver, and black are the other colour variations.

Most Alternity's got clearanced, so that price isn't all that unusual. I got Thundercracker for something like $20 INCLUDING the shipping from Japan.

[sanbot]

Yep. Silver, and black are the other colour variations.

Most Alternity's got clearanced, so that price isn't all that unusual. I got Thundercracker for something like $20 INCLUDING the shipping from Japan.

Are there variants of the blue? Or Japan and US versions?

[Cat]

Are there variants of the blue? Or Japan and US versions?

Alternity figures were never released in the west. So they aren't like Binaltech/Alternators. There's just Alternity. Japanese version or nothing.

As for variants of the blue - none that I'm aware of, other than the choice of colour, as previously mentioned.

[Hursticon]

Ravage. In the comics he seemed to be Megatron's only real friend and as you know, he was fully dedicated to his ideals all the way to the Beast Wars era.

Yep, I totally agree there as my list would read as follows:

Soundwave
Ravage
Laserbeak
(Beast Wars) Inferno
(Animated) Lugnut
(Movieverse) Blackout


They've been the stand-outs in my mind anyway. :cool:

[Verno]

What do the Decepticons actually want?

[UltraMarginal]

What do the Decepticons actually want?

chocolate, lots of Galaxy conquest chocolate. :D

[griffin]

Depends on the Universe (Marvel, Sunbow, IDW, Bayverse (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Decepticon)).
Ideologically, I see the IDW universe as being most different from the rest, as Megatron appears to have started off being a champion of the lower class... rather than just chasing after power and conquest.

[UltraMarginal]

Does the Hasbro US store accept australian cards and ship to an address in the states?

I have a mate going over to the US and I want to buy something and send it to his address while he's there so he can bring it back.

[Verno]

In other words: nothing less than total universal conquest..? For the most part.

[Hursticon]

What do the Decepticons actually want?


Depends on the Universe (Marvel, Sunbow, IDW, Bayverse (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Decepticon)).
Ideologically, I see the IDW universe as being most different from the rest, as Megatron appears to have started off being a champion of the lower class... rather than just chasing after power and conquest.

Yeah, it really does depend on which you most subscribe to; I think there is a greater amount of narrative and growth with the IDW approach than the typical oppressive dictator angle. ;):)
(Though it's not without it's own merits :D)


chocolate, lots of Galaxy conquest chocolate. :D

Hells yes! - Gotta get those Chocwave (http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=chocwave&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CC0QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Flaughingsquid.com%2Fsnoballimus-prime-chocwave-transformers-hostess-cupcakes%2F&ei=7BApT9XSA-WTiQfez9zgAg&usg=AFQjCNFIzBOHMvbTVe1VikUgqkWBbeeCug&cad=rja) snacks! :p:D


Does the Hasbro US store accept Australian cards and ship to an address in the states?

I have a mate going over to the US and I want to buy something and send it to his address while he's there so he can bring it back.

Have you read Griffin's thread (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=12843) on this dude? :)


In other words: nothing less than total universal conquest..? For the most part.

Indeed, just the reasons why, ideals & outlook seem to differ really. ;):p

[UltraMarginal]

Have you read Griffin's thread (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=12843) on this dude? :)



I had but I must have missed that first paragraph. cheers

[Hursticon]

I had but I must have missed that first paragraph. cheers

Ah ok, no probs dude. ;):)

[i_amtrunks]

So going to India in a few weeks, and I get an hour or two layover at Singapore airport. Sorry to lump in here, but I don't think that this inquiry is worth opening a new topic for.

Obviously not enough time to get out and about and see anything, but does anyone know if any stores at Singapore airport (or heck even New Delhi in India!) sell any Tf toys?

Need something to kill the time, and if I could pick up a new tf toy that'd be nice. If any Singaporean based members know if there are any Dragonball or Lego items to lookout for in the limited stores?

Thanks in advance.

[GoktimusPrime]

If you have a TFW account there are some Indian TF collectors here (http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-sightings/155094-india-transformers-sightings.html). If you have an account on any other international boards, maybe try starting a thread there and asking if there are any New Delhi based fans there. Maybe you can organise a fan meet? :)

Info about New Delhi toy stores in general (no idea if they stock TFs):
http://www.indiamike.com/india/delhi-f19/toy-shops-in-delhi-t61981/

This reminds me of when I went to China last year... I Googled and Googled for local toy stores and found sweet bugger all (other than LOTS of KOs - even in major dept stores!). When I was in Beijing I asked some local uni students, and one of them pointed me out to this one area that was known for collectible stuff, and lo and behold I found some cool stuff! :D I recommend hitting shopping centres and dept. stores, and if possible, ask locals. :) Maybe hotel staff?

As for Singapore, check out the Singapore Sightings thread here (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=9476) :cool:

[i_amtrunks]

Thanks Gok, was going to post in the thread but its been dead for 9 months and I doubt the departures side of the international terminal really gets much business form the Singapore based members! :D

Wish I had time to look for toys in India, would be a different experience, but too much sightseeign and wedding ceremony stuff to be done!

[5FDP]

What happened to the transforming case TF3? I had a reminder on my phone that it was due to be released today but no one has it listed :confused: (I did find a listing for TF4 (http://www.ezydvd.com.au/home/transformers-4/dp/6107553) though...)

[Cat]

This one? http://www.jbhifionline.com.au/dvd/dvd-genres/action-adventure/transformers-3-movie-boxset-blu-ray-bonus-usb-stick/653917

Next week, if it is. Feb 16th.

Also, semi-related, have you seen this? (Okay, it's not really related, but it's a transforming case that is AWESOME).

http://www.amazon.com/Book-Sith-Secrets-Dark-Side/dp/1612182615/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1328796356&sr=8-1

Star Wars:Book Of The Sith.

Scroll down and check out the video of it in action.

WANT SO BAD!!!!

[5FDP]

This one? http://www.jbhifionline.com.au/dvd/dvd-genres/action-adventure/transformers-3-movie-boxset-blu-ray-bonus-usb-stick/653917

Next week, if it is. Feb 16th.



Nah, not that one. Remember the transforming cases from the first and second movies - Prime (http://www.seibertron.com/images/news/gfx/1191625810_Target_DVD_ecxlu.gif) and Bumblebee (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attach/7/1/5/9/0/TF2_BB_Package02_1253388327.jpg) (there was also a Megatron one but it wasn't released here).

[swoop]

Does anyone know of a website that has information on the exact height of transformer toys?

I'm drawing up the plans for new shelving for my tf and as space is a issue I'm trying to get it as exact as I can. My collection is boxed away and it'll take ages to sort through them to get the measurments so I'm hoping to avoid that if I can

[Hursticon]

Does anyone know of a website that has information on the exact height of transformer toys?

I'm drawing up the plans for new shelving for my tf and as space is a issue I'm trying to get it as exact as I can. My collection is boxed away and it'll take ages to sort through them to get the measurments so I'm hoping to avoid that if I can

As someone who also shares space as an issue I can only agree as to how much this sort of info would be of massive help, but unfortunately man not a single site comes to mind that even mentions the height of a figure let alone many figures. :(

My advice would be to take Armada/Classicsverse Unicron and base each shelf height off of his dimensions and as Liege has suggested to me; make liberal use of Obitsu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4I7qNzQPThM) (or akin) figure stands, of course for Fort Max at least 1 shelf will have to be an exception. ;):cool:

Really, the trick is to make the most efficient use out of the shelf space you'll have, so consider also making use of a stepped display using foam or something - sort of how they do it for School Photos you know? :)

[UltraMarginal]

Does anyone know of a website that has information on the exact height of transformer toys?

I'm drawing up the plans for new shelving for my tf and as space is a issue I'm trying to get it as exact as I can. My collection is boxed away and it'll take ages to sort through them to get the measurments so I'm hoping to avoid that if I can

Off the top of my head, no.

but a design consideration you might want to include would be how close you want your figures to be to the ceiling height of each shelf. and how close the shelves are together.

if you have wooden shelves and only have a 1cm clearance above your figures on every shelf, for the lower and higher shelves you're only really going to be able to clearly see the figures at te front at all. and it will be quite dark towards the back.

If you can afford it in your budget, i'd recommend at least some glass shelves, they let in more light.

If you can also afford to get those evenly spread 5mm holes included in the design, you'll be able to roughly customise your shelf heights for different series or sizes of figures however you feel at the time. unless you have good template hardware I would strongly recommend against manufacturing this design yourself though as a single unevenly spaced hole will render that shelf space unuseable.

Hope there's a little food for thought there.

[Paulbot]

Does anyone know of a website that has information on the exact height of transformer toys?

I'm drawing up the plans for new shelving for my tf and as space is a issue I'm trying to get it as exact as I can. My collection is boxed away and it'll take ages to sort through them to get the measurments so I'm hoping to avoid that if I can

Dave Van Domelen gives dimensions in his reviews (http://www.eyrie.org/~dvandom/BW/). He's reviewed most Transformers since he started in the Beast Wars era. It might be of some help?

[1orion2many]

I haven't been on that page in ages, I used to read his reviews all the time:)

[GoktimusPrime]

cliffbee.com's reviews also gives sizes of toys too.

[swoop]

Off the top of my head, no.

but a design consideration you might want to include would be how close you want your figures to be to the ceiling height of each shelf. and how close the shelves are together.

if you have wooden shelves and only have a 1cm clearance above your figures on every shelf, for the lower and higher shelves you're only really going to be able to clearly see the figures at te front at all. and it will be quite dark towards the back.

If you can afford it in your budget, i'd recommend at least some glass shelves, they let in more light.

If you can also afford to get those evenly spread 5mm holes included in the design, you'll be able to roughly customise your shelf heights for different series or sizes of figures however you feel at the time. unless you have good template hardware I would strongly recommend against manufacturing this design yourself though as a single unevenly spaced hole will render that shelf space unuseable.

Hope there's a little food for thought there.

Height is the real limitation I have and if I can fit everything I want in and only have a clearance of 1cm then I can live with that. What I lack in height I can make up in width.

I don't like glass furniture and have had some really bad experiences with it and avoid it whenever I can.

I've already considered the adjustable shelf option and decided against because what I'm building now will have a fixed display of beast era, unicron trilogy, rid, animated, universe, alternators and the movie trilogy so I wont need to have adjustable shelving.

thanks for the advise :)

I checked out that link paulbot and it seems to have almost everything I want, thanks.

Gok I'll check out cliffbee.com's and see if they have what the other site is missing.

Thanks everyone

[5FDP]

cliffbee.com's reviews also gives sizes of toys too.

That guy (I hear he's pretty good looking :p) doesn't update his site that often anymore.

[UltraMarginal]

Height is the real limitation I have and if I can fit everything I want in and only have a clearance of 1cm then I can live with that. What I lack in height I can make up in width.

I don't like glass furniture and have had some really bad experiences with it and avoid it whenever I can.

I've already considered the adjustable shelf option and decided against because what I'm building now will have a fixed display of beast era, unicron trilogy, rid, animated, universe, alternators and the movie trilogy so I wont need to have adjustable shelving.

thanks for the advise :)

I checked out that link paulbot and it seems to have almost everything I want, thanks.

Gok I'll check out cliffbee.com's and see if they have what the other site is missing.

Thanks everyone

sounds like it's going to be epic once it's done, you'll definitely have to take pictures to show it all off.

[Cat]

What I lack in height I can make up in width.



*Tee-Hee*

[reillyd]

Has anyone had any luck with the Energon Weapon Glow for Voyager Megatron or Voyage Prime in the TF:Prime line?

I don't know if my megatron cannon is broken, or just poorly designed. But the cannon doesn't glow, only the blade, and doesn't really light up. its just a little red led, but it doesn't shine through the light-pipe. Anyone had better success?

[GoktimusPrime]

Cannon doesn't light up, only the blade (and even then, only kinda... the G2 Laser Rod gimmick worked better). The cannon can illuminate the opaque purple parts of Megatron's torso when attached to his back

[jazzcomp]

Has anyone seen in store the legends 3pk DOTM bbee, soundwave with rodimus?
Is soundwave here a Benz? Figure in blue looks like ROTF.

http://www.bigw.com.au/media/BIGW/Product/1000x1000/8212298_0_9999_lge_v1_m56577569836314385.jpg

[Paulbot]

Big W sold this pack. Soundwave is a repaint of the ROTF figure.

[jazzcomp]

Yes, it's still in big W online. Haven't seen it in store though.
But shouldn't Soundwave be a DOTM figure if he is sold as DOTM?

Thanks, PB.

[Quickstrike]

I wanted that pack but I never saw it anywhere. I didn't know I could get it online though... hmmmmm. (http://www.bigw.com.au/toys/dolls/bpnBIGW_0000000271755/transformers-3-legends-3pk)

[Verno]

Anyone got any ideas on the command structures of of the Autobots, Decepticons and Beast Era faction, but not the Japanese crud.

[Hursticon]

Anyone got any ideas on the command structures of of the Autobots, Decepticons and Beast Era faction, but not the Japanese crud.

Well, this all depends on continuity again dude but I'd just like to say that I like TF: Primes use of Soundwave in that it seems that he is of the highest rank without even really being ranked! :D

I would imagine that their command structures are very much like our own real life counterparts; with the Autobots being a Military force answering to a civilian government headed by a monarch/s (The Primes) and the Decepticons being not all to different from the Nazi-led German army of WWII.

But again, this is all dependant on continuity; Beast Wars seems to follow similar lines except the Maximals and Predacons seem more like neighbouring Nations with a peace treaty, sort of like the Ancient Egyptians and the Hittites of Kadesh. ;):cool:

[Sky Shadow]

Anyone got any ideas on the command structures of of the Autobots, Decepticons and Beast Era faction, but not the Japanese crud.

In Beast Wars, I think the Maximal Elders/Maximal Imperium (Magnaboss) is at the top, followed by the rest of the Maximal High Council. Obviously the Tripedacus Council lead the Predacon Alliance. And there's a Bi-Partate Committee for State Affairs. Everyone else would be beneath these.

The Autobots and Decepticons had countless structures depending on the particular time within the relevant millions of years and various continuities.

[Verno]

Does anyone know where I could find a copy of the page in TF: G2 A Rage in Heaven where Leadfoot cuts Razorclaw's head off? Online preferably.

(Or provide me with a scan on the quiet)

[GoktimusPrime]

Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Transformers-Rage-Heaven-Simon-Furman/dp/1840235772/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1330057951&sr=8-1-fkmr0) has copies of that reprint from $32.96 new, $9.99 used (I'm assuming these are USD, so should be cheaper after converstion to AUD - but not sure about postage costs). Otherwise I found one on eBay AU for $25.19 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Transformers-Rage-Heaven-Marvel-trade-paperback-/230716326689?pt=AU_GraphicNovels&hash=item35b7c3c321).

[Verno]

We'll leave that as a last resort. It's a rather expensive option for only wanting to see 1 page.

[Paulbot]

We'll leave that as a last resort. It's a rather expensive option for only wanting to see 1 page.

I'll help you out tonight

[Verno]

I'll help you out tonight

You, my friend, are an absolute gem!

[Paulbot]

http://www.otca.com.au/boards/attachment.php?attachmentid=5021&stc=1&d=1330077490

Full page 23 and 24 attached (but I'll delete those in a day or two)

[Verno]

You're a marvel, mate. Thank you very much!

I'd say Razorclaw totally survived that. Wouldn't you?

[Paulbot]

Instant removal of a Transformer's head in the comic was fatal. But then Razorclaw's beast mode head isn't his actual head.

In the post G2 fanfic I wrote back in high school, Razorclaw survived and was later seen in a medbay in robot mode on life support, with a wound dressing on his chest where his beast head should be. But he was actually conscious and just biding his time (as per his tech spec bio) until the right moment. And that moment came when he heard about a new type of organic beast mode technology.... :)

[Verno]

I like the way you think. I mean, how are the Predacons supposed to come into being in pre-BW times without Razorclaw?!

[jazzcomp]

Did G1 jefire's gun really fire like Macross valkyries? w/missiles?

[GoktimusPrime]

Jetfire's gun is a missile launcher, but the toy didn't come with missiles. Not sure if the launching mechanism in Jetfire was retained or if they weakened it like with many other early G1 missile launchers.

[Sky Shadow]

Did G1 jefire's gun really fire like Macross valkyries? w/missiles?


Jetfire's gun is a missile launcher, but the toy didn't come with missiles. Not sure if the launching mechanism in Jetfire was retained or if they weakened it like with many other early G1 missile launchers.

The front of Jetfire's missile launcher was 'plastered over' so it couldn't shoot even if it did have missiles, but the 'trigger' on the top of the launcher still goes up and down - you can shake it if you want to make shooting sounds. :)

[Skullcruncher]

Why are sealed bags of accessories called baggies?

Shouldn't then a sealed box be called a boxie? or a sealed sack a sackie? :rolleyes:

[GoktimusPrime]

"Baggies" is the name of a brand of sealable food storage bags manufactured by the Pactiv Corporation. So referring to plastic storage bags as "baggies" is similar to referring to how Americans call tissues "Kleenexes" -- I've personally never seen/heard an Australian refer to them as baggies, only from Americans.

Mind you, how many Australians call adhesive bandages "Band Aids" (even if it's not the Johnson & Johnson's brand)? The use brand names as synonyms for the actual product isn't quite as culturally ingrained here.

[griffin]

People use baggies and band aids (and roller blades) for the non-branded versions all the time here... I hear them very often.

[Hursticon]

People use baggies and band aids (and roller blades) for the non-branded versions all the time here... I hear them very often.

I agree, that sort of thing is really common around here where I live; such as 'Juice Tetra-Cubes' always being called 'Poppas' and long thin 'Ice-Blocks' being called 'Super-Dupers' or 'Icey-Poles', I think it might be more common than what you think Goki. ;)

[Slag]

Why are sealed bags of accessories called baggies?

Shouldn't then a sealed box be called a boxie? or a sealed sack a sackie? :rolleyes:

Thats what i'm calling them from now on. :D Now, off to find something "mint on sealed cardie"

[GoktimusPrime]

I've hear "Band Aid," "Poppas" and "Roller Blades" lots, but not those others.

Anyway - the point is unless there's a brand of boxes called Boxies (http://www.iloveboxie.com/) or a brand of Sacks called Sackies (http://www.littlebigplanet.com/en/news/article/the_sackies_the_first_annual_sackademy_awards/) or a brand of card-backs called Cardies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cardigan_%28sweater%29), then those terms can't be compared with "Baggies".

[Paulbot]

When the Armada kids went to Cybertron, did they wear spacesuits. I think they did but can't find my DVDs to double check.

[Hursticon]

When the Armada kids went to Cybertron, did they wear spacesuits. I think they did but can't find my DVDs to double check.

Though I've never watched the series for any great length or amount, I do vaguely remember seeing a frame or so of them wearing Space Suits - I would be the worst person to quote on that though. :o:p

[griffin]

Screenshot (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Screenshot-arm-47-3.jpg) from tfwik.net, and this one (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Sshot-71-1-tendrils.jpg).

[Gouki]

What's Energon Rodimus' articulatuon like? Is it a good figure overall?

[Paulbot]

Screenshot (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Screenshot-arm-47-3.jpg) from tfwik.net, and this one (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Sshot-71-1-tendrils.jpg).

Thanks. I thought so but had forgotten that they joined the Voltron Force. ;)


What's Energon Rodimus' articulatuon like? Is it a good figure overall?

His legs are a bit restricted, because the shins are so big. His arms are also a little limited because of the way the shoulders work. At the time it was a great figure overall as it was a new Rodimus Prime toy, but most Autobot Energon figures suffer because of their shirt/pants modes.

[Sky Shadow]

What's Energon Rodimus' articulatuon like? Is it a good figure overall?

It's not abysmal, but like most Energon Autobots, certain elements are sacrificed for the sake of potential 'Powerlinxing'. His head can't really turn, his legs are fairly blocky, his 'wings'/heels can come off somewhat easily and he looks hollow from behind like the unfilmed side of a movie set.

[Cat]

I don't like Energon Rodimus much.

But then again, I also don't like Classics Rodimus much.

My pick for that sorta size would be the Titanium version.

[gantz]

Titanium Rodimus Rocks! :)

[GoktimusPrime]

I'm not a fan of Titanium Rodimus - overall I'm not a fan of Titanium Series. Those figures aren't designed by Takara engineers and - IMO - it shows. :( Although the idea of incorporating the trailer into the robot is ambitious... but yeah, not a fan of Ti Series. I find all of them to be cumbersome to play with too.

Energon Rodimus is a fair figure but a lot of its limitations are due to the sacrifices made for the Powerlinxing gimmick. Unfortunately it was during the time when Hasbro put gimmicks in front of engineering (Armada was arguably worse - but Cybertron was generally better). I like Classics Rodimus; not the greatest Classics toy, but he's a reasonably solid Deluxe figure.

[LordCyrusOmega]

Why do the universe 2.0 Insecticons have different names then original release?
Bombshell - Hardshell
Kickbakc - Kickback
Shrapnell - Sharpshot

I looked on TFwiki but they didn't say

[Cat]

Why do the universe 2.0 Insecticons have different names then original release?
Bombshell - Hardshell
Kickbakc - Kickback
Shrapnell - Sharpshot

I looked on TFwiki but they didn't say

Lost trademarks, or the term is too generic nowadays.

[Cat]

I'm not a fan of Titanium Rodimus - overall I'm not a fan of Titanium Series. Those figures aren't designed by Takara engineers and - IMO - it shows. :( Although the idea of incorporating the trailer into the robot is ambitious... but yeah, not a fan of Ti Series. I find all of them to be cumbersome to play with too.

Energon Rodimus is a fair figure but a lot of its limitations are due to the sacrifices made for the Powerlinxing gimmick. Unfortunately it was during the time when Hasbro put gimmicks in front of engineering (Armada was arguably worse - but Cybertron was generally better). I like Classics Rodimus; not the greatest Classics toy, but he's a reasonably solid Deluxe figure.

You'll forgive me for not caring that the grown man finds them difficult to play with.

Some of them are great. Hell, War Within Prime is better than my Palisades statue of him, and was a fraction of the price.

I also rate others highly, like Rodimus, Ultra Magnus, Prowl. We got some great figures we wouldn't otherwise had had.

[griffin]

Why do the universe 2.0 Insecticons have different names then original release?
Bombshell - Hardshell
Kickbakc - Kickback
Shrapnell - Sharpshot

I looked on TFwiki but they didn't say

They mention it on their individual pages, that it's due to trademark issues (as in, after a period of non-usage, they lose names).

Bombshell (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Bombshell_%28G1%29#Generation_1)
Shrapnel (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Shrapnel_%28G1%29#Generation_1)
Kickback (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Kickback_%28G1%29#Generation_1)

[VERT]

You'll forgive me for not caring that the grown man finds them difficult to play with.

Some of them are great. Hell, War Within Prime is better than my Palisades statue of him, and was a fraction of the price.

I also rate others highly, like Rodimus, Ultra Magnus, Prowl. We got some great figures we wouldn't otherwise had had.

Love all of them...Well Soundwave was not that great. But that Rodimus was one of the best.

[gantz]

I believe Goks problem with Soundwave was the crotch/cock piece area. I have no issue with it, although I admit it can stand out a little, so I made mine shorter for proportions sake.

[GoktimusPrime]

I didn't bother getting Ti Series Soundwave - but I've seen it IRL... the "nappy" look isn't flattering. Music Label Soundwave superior: Titanium Soundwave inferior. ;)

[Hursticon]

I didn't bother getting Ti Series Soundwave - but I've seen it IRL... the "nappy" look isn't flattering. Music Label Soundwave superior: Titanium Soundwave inferior. ;)

I agree the size of the 'T' crotch on Ti Soundwave is a bit unfortunate, but my problem with the figure lies elsewhere; namely, the inability to stand up under his own wait as the leg's construction relied purely on friction to brace and bare the weight of the diecast torso above - a fundamental flaw that shouldn't have gone without notice by the engineers/quality testers. :rolleyes:

Hence why my own resides nigh permanently in Alt mode, his box/packaging though was awesome! :D

[Verno]

http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/1/13/TransformersVault_stingray.jpg

How good would this guy be as a Pre-BW Depth Charge?!

Apparently its an unreleased Decepticon mold.

[GoktimusPrime]

I highly doubt it. Entirely different toy that was conceived for G1. Other than transforming into a robotic sting ray, I see no similarities between this design and the Depth Charge mould. Seawing (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Seawing_%28G1%29) transforms into a stingray too but that mould is nothing like Depth Charge at all. The Seawing mould was reused in Beast Wars as Terrormander (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Terrormander).

A proper "pre-design" would be something that was conceived but then altered/modifed for the final product - an example would be prototype Godbomber (http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/7/7f/ProtoGodBomber.jpg) or the various Pre-Transformers (Diaclone, Microman et al.). Some toy designs/concepts have served as inspirations for later Transformers, for example Takara's Koutetsu Zeag (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel_Jeeg) - the head of that robot was probably the inspiration for Diaclone Lancia Stratos Normal Type (Wheeljack) and Takara have admitted that the Headmaster gimmick was inspired from Koutetsu Zeag (re: Ono Koujin interview).

[Verno]

Umm, what?! I was asking people's opinion, not for it's factual validity. The only skeric of opinion I can get from your post, Gok, is 'I highly doubt it' which isn't really an opinion at all, is it?!

[GoktimusPrime]

Oh sorry, I misread your post. My bad.

[liegeprime]

I agree the size of the 'T' crotch on Ti Soundwave is a bit unfortunate, but my problem with the figure lies elsewhere; namely, the inability to stand up under his own wait as the leg's construction relied purely on friction to brace and bare the weight of the diecast torso above - a fundamental flaw that shouldn't have gone without notice by the engineers/quality testers. :rolleyes:



True, mine "leans" to one side coz the lag can't support the heavy body, sigh


I highly doubt it. Entirely different toy that was conceived for G1. Other than transforming into a robotic sting ray, I see no similarities between this design and the Depth Charge mould. Seawing (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Seawing_%28G1%29) transforms into a stingray too but that mould is nothing like Depth Charge at all. The Seawing mould was reused in Beast Wars as Terrormander (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Terrormander).

A proper "pre-design" would be something that was conceived but then altered/modifed for the final product - an example would be prototype Godbomber (http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/7/7f/ProtoGodBomber.jpg) or the various Pre-Transformers (Diaclone, Microman et al.). Some toy designs/concepts have served as inspirations for later Transformers, for example Takara's Koutetsu Zeag (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel_Jeeg) - the head of that robot was probably the inspiration for Diaclone Lancia Stratos Normal Type (Wheeljack) and Takara have admitted that the Headmaster gimmick was inspired from Koutetsu Zeag (re: Ono Koujin interview).

Oooh Jeeg robot I rmember him back in the eighties... its one of the casualties of the Marcos regime in TV shows in Phils along with Voltez V, Mazinger Z and all great robots shows plus the Super Sentai series that all got cancelled - his reason - it's too violent for kids - they emulate such violence ... pffft yeah right...:rolleyes:


Umm, what?! I was asking people's opinion, not for it's factual validity. The only skeric of opinion I can get from your post, Gok, is 'I highly doubt it' which isn't really an opinion at all, is it?!

Well, it is a stingray mold but it has that "decepticon" vibe to it Verno, probably a little tweaking to it to make it more "friendlier" in look and color and make it bigger, say deluxe size big.... then I can see it as a pre BW DC

[griffin]

Depth Charge wasn't very "friendly"... so maybe that sort of Vigilante/Decepticon aesthetic would work on him?
He was kinda like a Gen1 (comic) Dinobot - barely an Autobot/Predacon by choice, or had grown so bitter by the wars, that rules no longer mattered.

[Verno]

A little bit of tweaking for sure Liege, ballpoints for starters :p But as a base to work from, and indeed enlarge, he's got all the makings of a 'Dawn of Futures Past'-esk Depth Charge, back when we was battling X on Colony Omicron!

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/1/13/TransformersVault_stingray.jpg

How good would this guy be as a Pre-BW Depth Charge?!

Apparently its an unreleased Decepticon mold.Meh, it's kinda blocky IMO. I'd go for something more like RotF Mindwipe (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Mindwipe_ROTF_Voyager_toy.jpg) or G2 Dreadwing (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Dreadwing_%28G2%29) myself.

[Hursticon]

http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/1/13/TransformersVault_stingray.jpg

How good would this guy be as a Pre-BW Depth Charge?!

Apparently its an unreleased Decepticon mold.

I can easily see the Japanese engineers flicking through their old design prototypes and sketches back in '95-'96, when tasked with looking for an equal to Rampage figure, and coming across this design and working off of it/taking design cues to achieve what Depth Charge would eventually become. :eek::)

Clearly it's an old G1 Decepticon design sketch, but I can see some very heavy cues and similarities and IMO it would make an awesome Pre-Beast Wars Depth Charge, hell, even a Depth Charge before the 'Great Upgrade'. ;):cool:


True, mine "leans" to one side coz the lag can't support the heavy body, sigh

It really sucks eh! :(

[Sky Shadow]

Hey - I just bought this... this is the non Brown Plastic Syndrome version of Transmetal Megs, right? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Transformers-Japanese-Beast-Wars-Metals-Optimus-Primal-Vs-Megatron-VS-40-Boxed-/280837427331?pt=UK_ToysGames_ActionFigures_ActionF igures_JN&hash=item4163371083

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Hey - I just bought this... this is the non Brown Plastic Syndrome version of Transmetal Megs, right? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Transformers-Japanese-Beast-Wars-Metals-Optimus-Primal-Vs-Megatron-VS-40-Boxed-/280837427331?pt=UK_ToysGames_ActionFigures_ActionF igures_JN&hash=item4163371083Takara, so yep.:)

Also, your new OP will have clearish purple plastic instead of brown, which doesn't look as bad as it sounds.

[Sky Shadow]

Cool - thanks Odie. I bid on it for that purpose and it wasn't until I won that I thought hmm... what if there was more than one version of Takara Transmetal Megatron and I got the wrong one? :)

[Slag]

Hi People. Whats the deal with the g1 ultra magnus with the silver painted face as opposed to the no paint face. (besides the silver paint)
is one rarer than the other?

Also, my friend has a box of transformer cards ( he's thinking of selling it hopefully) I can't find any pics on the net.
It's stamped 1986
The box is pink, i think
It has 60 card packs in it
They have bubblegum in them too
seems to have a pop up display with optimus standing ,gun in air, in front of a tf symbol.
It's still sealed/wrapped.
Thats all i can remember, I'll try and get a pick of it up soon.
Any idea of the type of cards inside?
what might he expect to get for it?

[Sky Shadow]

Hi People. Whats the deal with the g1 ultra magnus with the silver painted face as opposed to the no paint face. (besides the silver paint)
is one rarer than the other?

Ultra Magnus is one of the most variant Transformers ever. Generally the ideal variant combination would be the one with painted-face helmet and painted antenna, painted small head, rubber wheels, 'glass' windscreen, long smokestacks, short missiles, metal toes, chromed legs and gastanks.

To see the insane Magnus variations, check this out: http://fredsworkshop.com/vmagnus.html


Also, my friend has a box of transformer cards ( he's thinking of selling it hopefully) I can't find any pics on the net.
It's stamped 1986
The box is pink, i think
It has 60 card packs in it
They have bubblegum in them too
seems to have a pop up display with optimus standing ,gun in air, in front of a tf symbol.
It's still sealed/wrapped.
Thats all i can remember, I'll try and get a pick of it up soon.
Any idea of the type of cards inside?
what might he expect to get for it?

If the box says Transformers Action Cards, your friend should get a lot for a sealed box. Definitely in the hundreds.

[heroic_decepticon]

If the box says Transformers Action Cards, your friend should get a lot for a sealed box. Definitely in the hundreds.

It actually sounds like it could be something like that (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330695700643+&item=330695700643&lgeo=0&vectorid=229466#ht_2174wt_1350), due to the "pink" part....

[Sky Shadow]

Also, my friend has a box of transformer cards ( he's thinking of selling it hopefully) I can't find any pics on the net.
It's stamped 1986
The box is pink, i think
It has 60 card packs in it
They have bubblegum in them too
seems to have a pop up display with optimus standing ,gun in air, in front of a tf symbol.
It's still sealed/wrapped.
Thats all i can remember, I'll try and get a pick of it up soon.
Any idea of the type of cards inside?
what might he expect to get for it?

Oh, hold on - is it possible that you might mean stickers rather than cards? If so then I'm 99% sure you're talking about the Panini stickers for the Transformers Sticker Book. I used to have one of the boxes and it had Optimus Prime in front of a Decepticon symbol like on the cover of the book. Here's a box for sale - does it look a bit like this, only in English? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Box-100-Pacchetti-Figurine-Transformers-Borba-come-Panini-1986-/110834184587?pt=Album_e_Figurine&hash=item19ce3b718b If not then I still think it could be the Action Cards (only the box might by now be faded to a pink instead of its original reddy black.)

[Slag]

Oh, hold on - is it possible that you might mean stickers rather than cards? If so then I'm 99% sure you're talking about the Panini stickers for the Transformers Sticker Book. I used to have one of the boxes and it had Optimus Prime in front of a Decepticon symbol like on the cover of the book. Here's a box for sale - does it look a bit like this, only in English? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Box-100-Pacchetti-Figurine-Transformers-Borba-come-Panini-1986-/110834184587?pt=Album_e_Figurine&hash=item19ce3b718b If not then I still think it could be the Action Cards (only the box might by now be faded to a pink instead of its original reddy black.)

I think that looks like it . similar pic on the front. i'll check next time i head over. thanks
although i thought it said 60 card packs?

[Skullcruncher]

Also, my friend has a box of transformer cards ( he's thinking of selling it hopefully) I can't find any pics on the net.
It's stamped 1986
The box is pink, i think
It has 60 card packs in it
They have bubblegum in them too
seems to have a pop up display with optimus standing ,gun in air, in front of a tf symbol.
It's still sealed/wrapped.
Thats all i can remember, I'll try and get a pick of it up soon.
Any idea of the type of cards inside?
what might he expect to get for it?

Nice, I collect the cards (japanese, US, Australia, greek) - depending on what set it is could go from $40 to a couple of hundred.
I actually need to add some more info to tfwiki when I get a chance... :D

It actually sounds like it could be something like that (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330695700643+&item=330695700643&lgeo=0&vectorid=229466#ht_2174wt_1350), due to the "pink" part....

Was that you scoring that lot HD?

[Sky Shadow]

Does Soundwave ever talk in Transformers Prime. And am I the only one who thinks that's odd from a real-life point of view. I mean - they already have Frank Welker there in the recording room and the scriptwriters don't want to use him?

[Hursticon]

Does Soundwave ever talk in Transformers Prime. And am I the only one who thinks that's odd from a real-life point of view. I mean - they already have Frank Welker there in the recording room and the scriptwriters don't want to use him?

He can talk but has just chosen to remain silent, for what reason? - He hasn't said. :p

The writers have apparently stated at last years NYCC that he will speak but it is being saved for the right moment - It's a pretty cool take on the character though don't you think? :cool:
(It's like he takes his Alt mode to spark, so to speak. :D)

[Slag]

Anyone know where i can get a face upgrade kit for megatron? There were some for sale on that computer auction site a while back. (it's for a re-issue don't panic) I think they called it M3G5 upgrade or someting.

Also is this a pre transformer or a k.o.
Is it worth $150+ for all 6??

[GoktimusPrime]

That's KO dude. Real Pre-TF Constructicons look like this:
http://diaclone.net/orid/diabuild/index.html

[Slag]

That's KO dude. Real Pre-TF Constructicons look like this:
http://diaclone.net/orid/diabuild/index.html

Cool. It's been for sale for a while. Saved us some money there.
Thanks.

[Slag]

Is anyone working on a cure for Gold Plastic Syndrome?
Is it not a matter of if, but when?
Will it be, to own an original G1 Black Zarak will be to own some cool black and red plastic and a sandwich bag full of gold shards and powder? :(

[GoktimusPrime]

Not sure how you can "cure" a toy of the fact that it's made from shoddy inferior brittle plastic. :( That's why I settled with BotCon Pyro -- didn't get G1 Pyro and I don't like the odds of me paying some expensive aftermarket price for one, then having the gold plastic break on me when I handle/play with it. BotCon Pyro may not be G1, but at least I can play with it without fear of it breaking on me (plus it was a lot cheaper than what I'd pay for a G1 Pyro). There was a Black Zarak at the last Parra Fair -- someone picked it up and showed it to me... gold plastic broken all over! :eek:

Bad enough having gold plastic break on toys I purchased at regular retail price ... but I definitely wouldn't pay an inflated secondary market price for a toy that's likely to break. Pray for an Encore Mega Zarak w/ e-Hobby Black Zarak?

[Cat]

Is anyone working on a cure for Gold Plastic Syndrome?
Is it not a matter of if, but when?
Will it be, to own an original G1 Black Zarak will be to own some cool black and red plastic and a sandwich bag full of gold shards and powder? :(

There is no cure.

It's simply not possible.

Sorry mate.

[Slag]

no...... no................... Nooooooooooooooooo! :(:(:(:(:confused:

It's not fair. snif snif

[Cat]

It's the plastic itself that's degrading from within (and outside too).

It's falling apart, and nothing you can do will stop it. I've seen MOC figures that were never moved that have just spontaneously fallen apart.

You can minimise your risk by leaving it out of sunlight, and touching/transforming it as little as possible, but that's really not a cure, as it can (and will) fall apart all on its own anyway, without any cause.

EDIT: Goktimus, you make it sound like Hasbro knowingly used an inferior plastic. They didn't. They were as surprised as us.

They've since cut down on the number of metallic flakes in it, and that should have fixed it. Of course, time is the only thing that will give a real answer.

[Slag]

^^^ but i neeeeeeeed to touch it...
Maybe hasbro could re-release the parts we need for free:rolleyes: (good luck).
Aren't they* (more recently) having probs with gold and brown plastic now?
Didn't they# learn?






*By they i mean we.
#By they i mean them

[Cat]

^^^ but i neeeeeeeed to touch it...
Maybe hasbro could re-release the parts we need for free:rolleyes: (good luck).
Aren't they* (more recently) having probs with gold and brown plastic now?
Didn't they# learn?






*By they i mean we.
#By they i mean them

IIRC, 2003 was the last time that particular mix was used.

[Sky Shadow]

IIRC, 2003 was the last time that particular mix was used.

2007? (I think - the Micromasters Universe Aerialbots' Superion kibble accessories for Storm Jet and Air Raid and before that it was Crossovers Chewbacca.)

[Slag]

So this crap is going to plague us for years to come??

[Doubledealer]

Does Soundwave ever talk in Transformers Prime. And am I the only one who thinks that's odd from a real-life point of view. I mean - they already have Frank Welker there in the recording room and the scriptwriters don't want to use him?

Maybe he does talk, we just can't hear him because he communicates on a frequency band we humans can't pick up. :p Pushing this theory even further, maybe he authenticates those he speaks with using a method similar to pre-shared keys in a wireless network, that is, when establishing comms with another Decepticon he gives them a temporary virtual key to his frequency band. When he wants the conversation to end he simply takes away their virtual key. Those who don't have access can only hear a scrambled signal if trying to listen in. Eh, it's fun to imagine anyway. :p

[UltraMarginal]

Maybe he does talk, we just can't hear him because he communicates on a frequency band we humans can't pick up. :p Pushing this theory even further, maybe he authenticates those he speaks with using a method similar to pre-shared keys in a wireless network, that is, when establishing comms with another Decepticon he gives them a temporary virtual key to his frequency band. When he wants the conversation to end he simply takes away their virtual key. Those who don't have access can only hear a scrambled signal if trying to listen in. Eh, it's fun to imagine anyway. :p

ypu're such a nerd.:D I love the way you think :cool:

at Botcon they did say that Soundwave can talk and that he eventually would, they are just waiting for the right moment. in the meantime though your theory holds a lot of sonic water.

[Doubledealer]

ypu're such a nerd.:D I love the way you think :cool:

at Botcon they did say that Soundwave can talk and that he eventually would, they are just waiting for the right moment. in the meantime though your theory holds a lot of sonic water.

Cheers UM. :) Hope they get the voice spot on. I'm thinking something cold and heavily synthisized with a monotone delivery that's devoid of any kind of emotion. :cool:

[GoktimusPrime]

Imagine Soundwave and Bumblebee engaged in an intense dialogue.

Bumblebee: Beep beep badoop beep bleep!
Soundwave: .........................?
Bumblebee: Beep boop bawoop breep beep?!?
Soundwave: ...
Bumblebee: Booooooop!
Soundwave: ....................... ......... ................ ... . .................. .., .............. ... .. ......... ....? ...................... .! ................ . .........
Bumblebee: Beep! Baroop bleep boop!!
*they fight*

[Sky Shadow]

So this crap is going to plague us for years to come??

Only if you buy toys with gold/brown/bronze plastic syndrome. I try to avoid it, getting recolours where possible (i.e. I own Elephorca rather than Torca, Megabolt Megatron instead of Megabolt, Metals Megatron rather than TM Megatron etc.)

I actually had it happen to me recently with a yellow toy (you might appreciate this, Geigerrock) - a MIB Machine Robo F1 Robo. I was transforming it for the fist time ever out of the box and the whole thing just crumbled to pieces. Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcjAUN5Ssj8 (Definitely a video you wouldn't want to more than one take to film.) So I bought a MOSC GoBots Slicks to replace him. :)


There is no cure.

According to the AllSpark Almanac II there is one. Animated Red Alert discovered it. :p

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

So, am I the only one who thinks of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smEjlLFC8I0&feature=related) when it comes to Soundwave talking?
Seriously, I'd be happy with the classic heavily modulated Frank Welker Dr Claw voice.

[i_amtrunks]

Figured that it is a SOPA stunt, so didn't want to start a new thread, but is Seibertron.com working for anyone at the moment?

It's gone back to an old version from about 4 years ago for me.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

It's doing that for me too.

[UltraMarginal]

same and the article about mini transforming robots reminds me more of replicators than transformers.

[UltraMarginal]

Cheers UM. :) Hope they get the voice spot on. I'm thinking something cold and heavily synthisized with a monotone delivery that's devoid of any kind of emotion. :cool:

I think Frank Welker could modernise soundwave in a similar vein to how he's modernised Megatron and it would be great, especially with some modulation.

[Paulbot]

Figured that it is a SOPA stunt, so didn't want to start a new thread, but is Seibertron.com working for anyone at the moment?

It's gone back to an old version from about 4 years ago for me.

Hey you have a heap of news threads on Seibertron.com's homepage. Good on you :) :p

[griffin]

I get a more electronic, higher pitched voice for Soundwave (in my head)... probably because he doesn't have a big bulky frame to sound "heavy, booming and deep" - like Dr Claw or unaltered Gen1 Soundwave. He's got too much of a delicate, dainty, spiky frame... it'd be like Mini-Me with that deep booming voice - it'd probably more amusing than intimidating.
Either way, I think the no-talking concept has gone on long enough. I want to see some character development happening with Soundwave. We know a fair bit now about the other Decepticons... just not Soundwave.

[Cat]

2007? (I think - the Micromasters Universe Aerialbots' Superion kibble accessories for Storm Jet and Air Raid and before that it was Crossovers Chewbacca.)

Yep, you're right.

I was thinking of Superion, but I always forget that blasted Chewbacca.

[Slag]

does anyone know who cyclonus ,scourge and the sweeps actually were before unicron got to them,

[Hursticon]

does anyone know who cyclonus ,scourge and the sweeps actually were before unicron got to them,

There's a can of worms... :p

Generally, it's considered that Thundercracker ended up as Scourge and either Bombshell? or Skywarp ended up as Cyclonus, with the loser of that confusion and the other Insecticons making up the 'Armada'. :p

I think the Clear versions of the Classicsverse figures had their Bios explain (They were in Japanese) that Scourge=Thundercracker & Cyclonus=Skywarp, but how canonically acceptable to the greater fanbase this has been? - I'm not sure. :o

[Cat]

does anyone know who cyclonus ,scourge and the sweeps actually were before unicron got to them,

Scourge was Thundercracker.

Cyclonus was either Skywarp or Bombshell, depending on your interpretation and preference.

EDIT: Damn you, Hursti.

EDIT 2: He's right, and apparently a quicker typist than me. Even though I KNOW that sometime soon there'll be a post containing an essay providing 'the definitive canon answer', ignore it. Go with what works for you. It's been switched around that many times by that many departments etc, that it's ultimately your choice. For me, it works better with him as Skywarp. But go with what works for you.

[GoktimusPrime]

Scourge was Thundercracker. The initial Sweeps were forged from Shrapnel and Kickback.

Cyclonus was either Bombshell or Skywarp - there have been conflicting retcons, but the law of retroactive continuity says that the latest version is the most correct... so Skywarp.

[Cat]

Not an essay, but that's what I mean.

'Law Of Retro-Active Continuity'.

Come on.

That's ludicrous.

It's been retconned back and forth so many times, it's up to the individual.

To claim a 'law' like that is utterly ridiculous.

Law....lmao....

[GoktimusPrime]

That's just how retcon works; the most recent version is the most officially correct. Individual fans can choose to ignore retcons if they like but as far as official continuity is concerned, the most recent version is the most correct.

And sure, the Bombshell/Skywarp thing has been retconned back and forth a LOT and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if future official material reverts it back to Bombshell. But the fact is that Cyclonus has been Bombshell or Skywarp depending on different retcons - but the most recent retcon (2011) says it Skywarp. But if someone would rather believe it's Bombshell then go for it.

[Slag]

Thanks for the answers. . Bombshell = Cyclonus seems like quite an upgrade.

but ultimately Scourge Cyclonus and sweeps = bombshell, kickback, shrapnel t-cracker and skywarp.. Damn i really like all those guys and now???.. to know that they never existed together.... i'll have to re-adjust my plans for display. I can't even have cyclonus and the insecticons together::mad:....
I WISH I'D NEVER BEEN BORN!:mad:
me chucking a wobbly

[Slag]

actually. were there 2 or 3 sweeps.... 3 yeah?

[Paulbot]

Thanks for the answers. . Bombshell = Cyclonus seems like quite an upgrade.

but ultimately Scourge Cyclonus and sweeps = bombshell, kickback, shrapnel t-cracker and skywarp.. Damn i really like all those guys and now???.. to know that they never existed together.... i'll have to re-adjust my plans for display. I can't even have cyclonus and the insecticons together::mad:....
I WISH I'D NEVER BEEN BORN!:mad:
me chucking a wobbly

Learn to love the IDW comics. Cyclonus, Scourge and the Sweeps (and Galvatron) weren't anybody.

Or watch TFTM again: Shrapnel and Thundercracker (and I'm not sure of the others) appear after Unicron creates Scourge and Cyclonus and the Sweeps.

Or remember that Cyclonus and Scourge travelled back in time in the UK comics and could have met those characters then.

There was some discussion of Sweep numbers here (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=10209) that might enlighten/confuse.

[Slag]

Learn to love the IDW comics. Cyclonus, Scourge and the Sweeps (and Galvatron) weren't anybody.

Or watch TFTM again: Shrapnel and Thundercracker (and I'm not sure of the others) appear after Unicron creates Scourge and Cyclonus and the Sweeps.

Or remember that Cyclonus and Scourge travelled back in time in the UK comics and could have met those characters then.

There was some discussion of Sweep numbers here (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=10209) that might enlighten/confuse.

Um yeah.. that stuffs me around a bit. I only remember the movie. So unicron only created 2 sweeps, Scourge, Cyc and Gavintron. 5 beings from 6 beings. (i'm happy that they travel through time and all)
. wait. thundercracker ,shrapnel and the other insecticons (i'm guessing) appear with :confused: hang on.
O.K. So maybe unicron creates them from seekers and insects. but the damaged tf's continue floating off into space, only to return?
But galvatron was definitely megatron.... yeah?

[GoktimusPrime]

In Transformers The Movie we see Unicron rebuild Thundercracker, Shrapnel and Kickback into Scourge and two Sweeps respectively. He also rebuilds Skywarp and Bombshell into Cyclonus and his armada (of one :p). In the next shot we see only Cyclonus fly into the Decepticon ship and Scourge is followed by three Sweeps! We never ever see that "armada Cyclonus" ever again.

So some people believe that Bombshell or Skywarp (whichever you believe isn't Cyclonus) became that third Sweep and chalk down "armada Cyclonus" as an error. Either that or maybe he became Cyclonus II (aka Krunix) (http://s90690880.onlinehome.us/jhiaxus/uscomics/cyclonus2krunix.htm) :p :p :p

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Um yeah.. that stuffs me around a bit. I only remember the movie. So unicron only created 2 sweeps, Scourge, Cyc and Gavintron. 5 beings from 6 beings. (i'm happy that they travel through time and all)
. wait. thundercracker ,shrapnel and the other insecticons (i'm guessing) appear with :confused: hang on.
O.K. So maybe unicron creates them from seekers and insects. but the damaged tf's continue floating off into space, only to return?
But galvatron was definitely megatron.... yeah?Galvatron was definitely Megatron in TFTM. After that it all gets a bit iffy.
I prefer Skywarp as Cyclonus personally, mostly because the Sweeps and Cyclonus' armada numbers make more sense to me as a reformatting of the Inscticons' cloning abilities, but really...it's a massive can of worms you're better off just ignoring and going with whatever you want. Bombshell is foregrounded as Cyclonus in the reformatting shot which suggests Cyclonus was Bombshell, the latest retcon (which does have priority for official canon) has Skywarp as pre-Cyclonus. Then the Insecticons and both Skywarp and Thundercracker show up in the coronation scene (http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/a/a5/Coronation_.jpg) right after their bodies have supposedly been reformatted into Scourge and Cyclonus and/or their followers.

So yeah, you can put pretty much any of them into a display together and it'll have just as much fictional continuity as TFTM.
EDIT...
In Transformers The Movie we see Unicron rebuild Thundercracker, Shrapnel and Kickback into Scourge and two Sweeps respectively. He also rebuilds Skywarp and Bombshell into Cyclonus and his armada (of one :p). In the next shot we see only Cyclonus fly into the Decepticon ship and Scourge is followed by three Sweeps! We never ever see that "armada Cyclonus" ever again.

So some people believe that Bombshell or Skywarp (whichever you believe isn't Cyclonus) became that third Sweep and chalk down "armada Cyclonus" as an error. Either that or maybe he became Cyclonus II (aka Krunix) (http://s90690880.onlinehome.us/jhiaxus/uscomics/cyclonus2krunix.htm)Sorta.
There is Dirgeclonus/this guy (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:FFOD5_Decepticons_attack.JPG), and IIRC (which is a bit iffy) there's another Cyclonus clone who get destroyed in Five Faces of Darkness. There may even be one who gets destroyed by the Dinobots as they're not boarding the shuttle in TFTM, though again my memory's a bit fuzzy.
Either way, thanks to the wonders of AKOM animation errors there's a certain amount of leeway there for poor 'Armada'.

EDIT #2: Yep, here we go (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Cycloni_ffod5.jpg)...5 Cyclonus clones. Maybe they were just really shy most of the time, or Galvatron killed them in a fit of insane rage between 5FoD and The Killing Jar.

[griffin]

Not an essay, but that's what I mean.

'Law Of Retro-Active Continuity'.

Come on.

That's ludicrous.

It's been retconned back and forth so many times, it's up to the individual.

To claim a 'law' like that is utterly ridiculous.

Law....lmao....

I don't see how it is a ridiculous term. If anything, it was more "tongue in cheek" at the contradictory nature of canon, which itself, is supposed to be as reliable/enforceable as laws.
Concepts like, the Transformers coming from Cybertron, or crashing on Earth in the Ark, or even Megatron being the leader of the Decepticons instead of the Autobots - these are "set in stone", undeniable "laws" of the TFs Gen1 Universe... it may sound like a lame term, but it's technically an accurate description of what Canon (even re-worked or retroactive canon) *should be*.
Otherwise, how can we rely on or agree on certain fundamentals if there was no canon to fall back on?

The less important elements though are more of a frustration, but can also be a way for more fans to enjoy Transformers, or their collections... by having an alternative canon they prefer or like better than a new or old version.

Like, for me, I hate the way they keep changing the "canonical" colours of Rumble/Frenzy (IDW just changed it again last year). I might support one version (Frenzy being blue), but many others who grew up on the cartoon instead of the toys, would be happy to have the new/current canon of Frenzy being red. Both are technically correct... which means fans of both can enjoy what they prefer.

[Cat]

I don't see how it is a ridiculous term. If anything, it was more "tongue in cheek" at the contradictory nature of canon, which itself, is supposed to be as reliable/enforceable as laws.
Concepts like, the Transformers coming from Cybertron, or crashing on Earth in the Ark, or even Megatron being the leader of the Decepticons instead of the Autobots - these are "set in stone", undeniable "laws" of the TFs Gen1 Universe... it may sound like a lame term, but it's technically an accurate description of what Canon (even re-worked or retroactive canon) *should be*.
Otherwise, how can we rely on or agree on certain fundamentals if there was no canon to fall back on?

The less important elements though are more of a frustration, but can also be a way for more fans to enjoy Transformers, or their collections... by having an alternative canon they prefer or like better than a new or old version.

Like, for me, I hate the way they keep changing the "canonical" colours of Rumble/Frenzy (IDW just changed it again last year). I might support one version (Frenzy being blue), but many others who grew up on the cartoon instead of the toys, would be happy to have the new/current canon of Frenzy being red. Both are technically correct... which means fans of both can enjoy what they prefer.

Problem there is that you're equating two different terms, to be one.

'Retcon' and 'canon' are two very different terms.

[Sky Shadow]

And sure, the Bombshell/Skywarp thing has been retconned back and forth a LOT and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if future official material reverts it back to Bombshell. But the fact is that Cyclonus has been Bombshell or Skywarp depending on different retcons - but the most recent retcon (2011) says it Skywarp. But if someone would rather believe it's Bombshell then go for it.

That is not right at all, Goktimus. Bombshell is reformatted into Cyclonus in the movie itself. That is how it was storyboarded* Are you honestly going to argue that because some recent pack-in comic suggests that Cyclonus was Skywarp it changes the film itself, contradicting common sense, author intent and the way it is visually narrated? That means the Dinobots must have always been a combining gestalt because a comic pack-in says so and it hasn't been retconned since. Or that Hot Rod was in his Classics form in Transformers: The Movie because that too was in a recent pack-in comic.


Cyclonus was either Bombshell or Skywarp - there have been conflicting retcons, but the law of retroactive continuity says that the latest version is the most correct... so Skywarp.

If "the law of retroactive continuity says that the latest version is the most correct" then the "correct" answer is that Cyclonus is not Skywarp, since the most recent G1 retcon was More Than Meets The Eye #3 which came out yesterday and explicitly states that Cyclonus is an ancient Transformer who was never reformatted from Skywarp or Bombshell, since they are both still around.

Goktimus, what you are saying makes no sense.

*http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/4140/bombshelltocyclonusstor.jpg

[Demonac]

Doesn't 'retcon' mean 'retroactive canon'?

[Sky Shadow]

Doesn't 'retcon' mean 'retroactive canon'?

Retroactive continuity.

[Cat]

Doesn't 'retcon' mean 'retroactive canon'?

Retro-Active Continuity.

*Like me claiming I posted the answer before Sky Shadow.

[Demonac]

Close enough :P

[Sky Shadow]

Retro-Active Continuity.

*Like me claiming I posted the answer before Sky Shadow.

LOL. Well you said it the most recently so the law of retroactive continuity says that you are correct, regardless of fact. :p

[Cat]

LOL. Well you said it the most recently so the law of retroactive continuity says that you are correct, regardless of fact. :p

In that case I wish I'd made it something juicier... :p

[Slag]

Galvatron was definitely Megatron in TFTM. After that it all gets a bit iffy.
I prefer Skywarp as Cyclonus personally, mostly because the Sweeps and Cyclonus' armada numbers make more sense to me as a reformatting of the Inscticons' cloning abilities, but really...it's a massive can of worms you're better off just ignoring and going with whatever you want. Bombshell is foregrounded as Cyclonus in the reformatting shot which suggests Cyclonus was Bombshell, the latest retcon (which does have priority for official canon) has Skywarp as pre-Cyclonus. Then the Insecticons and both Skywarp and Thundercracker show up in the coronation scene (http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/a/a5/Coronation_.jpg) right after their bodies have supposedly been reformatted into Scourge and Cyclonus and/or their followers.

So yeah, you can put pretty much any of them into a display together and it'll have just as much fictional continuity as TFTM.
EDIT...Sorta.
There is Dirgeclonus/this guy (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:FFOD5_Decepticons_attack.JPG), and IIRC (which is a bit iffy) there's another Cyclonus clone who get destroyed in Five Faces of Darkness. There may even be one who gets destroyed by the Dinobots as they're not boarding the shuttle in TFTM, though again my memory's a bit fuzzy.
Either way, thanks to the wonders of AKOM animation errors there's a certain amount of leeway there for poor 'Armada'.

EDIT #2: Yep, here we go (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Cycloni_ffod5.jpg)...5 Cyclonus clones. Maybe they were just really shy most of the time, or Galvatron killed them in a fit of insane rage between 5FoD and The Killing Jar.
I don't even remember those scenes.
If i ever get a cyclonus junker and some time i'll do that repaint
Dirgeclonus :rolleyes:





*http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/4140/bombshelltocyclonusstor.jpg
Bombshell it is for now.
I'll never mention it again.

[heroic_decepticon]

does anyone know who cyclonus ,scourge and the sweeps actually were before unicron got to them,

This has been discussed to death over the past decade and then the decade before that. However, I feel very much for it and have put my thoughts down permanently.

This is what I think (http://heroicdecepticon.blogspot.com/2007/10/which-decepticon-reformatted-into_07.html) and a full explanation of why (http://heroicdecepticon.blogspot.com/2007/10/which-decepticon-reformatted-into.html) - in a nutshell Cyclonus = Skywarp and Scourge = Thundercracker. (the article is actually the very first result in google if you type "who became cyclonus", wow).

Therefore, in my world, the below is just wrong! :D


Bombshell it is for now.
I'll never mention it again.

I accept that G1 continuity is messy and inconsistent and all that. However, my BIGGEST gripe is that Bob Budiansky didn't take the opportunity to set the score straight when he 'wrote' The Transformers Animated Movie for IDW (aka the modern adaptation of TFTM).

If there is one person that could authoritatively conclude this issue one way or another, it is Bob, one of the key creative talents behind the original Transformer profiles and stories. This was the perfect opportunity to set the Cyclonus record straight but sadly no move was made to clarify Cyclonus’ reformatting. Don Figueroa drew the reformatting scene as an almost exact reproduction of TFTM (1986), that is with Bombshell and Skywarp being reformatted into 2 Cyclonus’.

[Sky Shadow]

If there is one person that could authoritatively conclude this issue one way or another, it is Bob, one of the key creative talents behind the original Transformer profiles and stories. This was the perfect opportunity to set the Cyclonus record straight but sadly no move was made to clarify Cyclonus’ reformatting. Don Figueroa drew the reformatting scene as an almost exact reproduction of TFTM (1986), that is with Bombshell and Skywarp being reformatted into 2 Cyclonus’.

But again, the way it is drawn, Thundercracker is Scourge, Kickback is a Sweep, Bombshell is Cyclonus and Skywarp is his armada.*

Yes HD you have good arguments as to why Skywarp could be Cyclonus, but anyone can do the same with Bombshell.

Bombshell is Cyclonus because:

- Function: A saboteur is someone who secretly subverts and obstructs, either physically or psychologically in order to cause some kind of damage or change. It requires intelligence and finesse. Thus - Bombshell. Also, Cyclonus is constantly gauging and adapting to Galvatron's psychological problems in the cartoon, to the point where he checks him in to see a psychiatrist. Cyclonus is far from just a warrior.

- Weapons: Cyclonus has an incendiary bomb rack. Bombshell fired mortar bombs.

- Balance: It is poetic if Galvatron's two offsiders each represent one of Megatron's teams from Season 1 - one from the Seekers and one from the Insecticons.

- Colour and curves and pointy things on their heads: Bombshell and Cyclonus are both purple and curvy with pointy things on their heads.

(And so on and so forth.)

I'm sure nobody involved in the making of Transformers: The Movie cared at the time about why they made Bombshell into Cyclonus - there was no big plan, it was just something they did. They never thought anyone would care about what they did in a kids' cartoon - they had to replace the old toys with new ones.

*http://img864.imageshack.us/img864/9197/idwwhoiscyclonus.jpg

[Paulbot]

Doesn't 'retcon' mean 'retroactive canon'?

One of my favourite jokes in Dan Slott's She-Hulk comics, was when she fought a villian who used a Retroactive Cannon: it didn't kill you, it erased you from having ever existed at all. :D

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

I don't know that 'authorial intent' is gonna help much here either, hey. The script directions just list 'the remains of dead Decepticons' for old' Bunny-Ears and Batwings both IIRC.
I'm half surprised they got Megatron into Galvatron without any major animation screwups TBH.

[GoktimusPrime]

That is not right at all, Goktimus. Bombshell is reformatted into Cyclonus in the movie itself. That is how it was storyboarded* Are you honestly going to argue that because some recent pack-in comic suggests that Cyclonus was Skywarp it changes the film itself, contradicting common sense, author intent and the way it is visually narrated? That means the Dinobots must have always been a combining gestalt because a comic pack-in says so and it hasn't been retconned since. Or that Hot Rod was in his Classics form in Transformers: The Movie because that too was in a recent pack-in comic.
Well... yes. AFAIK that is how retcon works. It doesn't mean it's any good... but it's how it works. I think this blog explains it well:
"Retroactive Continuity is Bullspit" (http://conformer.livejournal.com/726300.html) (parental advisory: this article uses another word for bullspit ;))

"The unspoken law of retroactive continuity basically says that the most current truth is the only true truth, all other history is apocrypha. And while this makes perfect sense from a marketing perspective, especially when attempting to manage the tangled plot threads and multiple personalities of comic book timestreams, or in an effort to maintain the public's interest in an aging franchise such as the expanded universes of Star Wars or Star Trek; but at its core, it's essentially bullspit."

Just because I acknowledge retcon doesn't mean I always like it or agree with it.

[Sky Shadow]

I don't know that 'authorial intent' is gonna help much here either, hey. The script directions just list 'the remains of dead Decepticons' for old' Bunny-Ears and Batwings both IIRC.
I'm half surprised they got Megatron into Galvatron without any major animation screwups TBH.

The thing is, if one shows that scene (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5NPGyXGQvM&feature=player_detailpage#t=1880s) to anybody on the planet who has no bias and ask them who became Cyclonus, they'll say it's the guy in front and his armada is the ships that follow him. The only people who will argue are people who personally want Skywarp to be Cyclonus. Which particularly makes no sense because those exact same people will eagerly accept that of the three guys who turned into Sweeps, the one in front (Thundercracker) is Scourge. The visual narrative makes it Bombshell; it's not something that should ever have been debated, but it goes on and on and on, like when people will swear blind that the blue cassette on a MOSC Frenzy and Laserbeak is called Rumble. <head explodes>


That's not a retcon, that's a different continuity. I'm talking about stories that are intended to retroactively "correct" a specific continuity or continuity event(s) - in this case the G1 cartoon continuity.
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Cyclonus_%28G1%29#Who_is_Cyclonus.3F

But how is a Japanese pack-in story for United toy moulds the same continuity as the US G1 cartoon? It's not. Even in the unlikely event that it affects Japanese cartoon continuity, that is a continuity in which Rumble was red, Headmasters are completely different and Scramble City somehow happened. If that Japanese toy story comic thing retcons what happened in the US G1 cartoons, then by the exact same lack of logic, the IDW comic retcons it.

[GoktimusPrime]

The thing is, if one shows that scene (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5NPGyXGQvM&feature=player_detailpage#t=1880s) to anybody on the planet who has no bias and ask them who became Cyclonus, they'll say it's the guy in front and his armada is the ships that follow him. The only people who will argue are people who personally want Skywarp to be Cyclonus. Which particularly makes no sense because those exact same people will eagerly accept that the three guys who turned into Sweeps, the one in front (Thundercracker) is Scourge. The visual narrative makes it Bombshell; it's not something that should ever have been debated, but it goes on and on and on,
Umm... yeah, that's pretty much what I said with the quote and link to the "retcon is bullspit" article. Again, just because I acknowledge retcon doesn't mean I like or agree with it.


like when people will swear blind that the blue cassette on a MOSC Frenzy and Laserbeak is called Rumble. <head explodes>
That's not a proper retcon, that's people mixing up different continuities.


But how is a Japanese pack-in story for United toy moulds the same continuity as the US G1 cartoon? It's not. Even in the unlikely event that it affects Japanese cartoon continuity, that is a continuity in which Rumble was red, Headmasters are completely different and Scramble City somehow happened.
Yeah alright, I'll concede to that. The most recent Anglophone retcons would be in 2006 with:
+ Sony edition of the TFTM DVD featuring a lenticular cover showing Skywarp being replaced by Cyclonus
+ IDW comic adaptation of TFTM identifies Bombshell as Cyclonus (and Skywarp as "armada")
I'm inclined to accept the IDW retcon of Bombshell over the DVD cover personally. Woo... confusing! :D

[5FDP]

Walked into this thread and it's like Groundhog Day :p Okay.... Rumble is red *runs away* :D

[Hursticon]

Walked into this thread and it's like Groundhog Day :p Okay.... Rumble is red *runs away* :D

LOL! :p:D

For me, personally, it's sits better that Skywarp ended up as Cyclonus seeing as though Thundercracker is Scourge but yeah; each to their own. ;):)

[Slag]

LOL! :p:D

For me, personally, it's sits better that Skywarp ended up as Cyclonus seeing as though Thundercracker is Scourge but yeah; each to their own. ;):)

After watching the scene again. you could stretch it to say Unicron was talking about the cyclonus in the background and armada in the foreground? big stretch i know.

Either way, i now have a proper reason to buy more Cyclonei..

[Hursticon]

Either way, i now have a proper reason to buy more Cyclonei..

It's an awesome mold (Classicsverse) and I've been fairly tempted to pick up more versions myself on a number of occasions. :D

[Slag]

It's an awesome mold (Classicsverse) and I've been fairly tempted to pick up more versions myself on a number of occasions. :D

I was thinking more g1. but yeah classics. Thats the same as henkei mold isn't it, it's great. Or that one done by jizatoys or whatever (careful what you type into google there) the one thats more of a pastel colour and they did a wheelie too, and some try to sell them as a pair for a K.......
that one:rolleyes:
next for me.
Targetmaster g1
Blue ear variant g1

[UltraMarginal]

Walked into this thread and it's like Groundhog Day :p Okay.... Rumble is red *runs away* :D

TROLOL:D

[Cat]

LOL. Well you said it the most recently so the law of retroactive continuity says that you are correct, regardless of fact. :p

Sorry but there's been another retcon.

*heavy breathing*

Sky Shadow... I am your father.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

The thing is, if one shows that scene (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5NPGyXGQvM&feature=player_detailpage#t=1880s) to anybody on the planet who has no bias and ask them who became Cyclonus, they'll say it's the guy in front and his armada is the ships that follow him. The only people who will argue are people who personally want Skywarp to be Cyclonus. Which particularly makes no sense because those exact same people will eagerly accept that of the three guys who turned into Sweeps, the one in front (Thundercracker) is Scourge. The visual narrative makes it Bombshell; it's not something that should ever have been debated, but it goes on and on and on, like when people will swear blind that the blue cassette on a MOSC Frenzy and Laserbeak is called Rumble. <head explodes>Yeah, but if you show them this scene (http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/a/a5/Coronation_.jpg) right afterwards they'll probably wonder why Cyclonus nearly runs over his formerly-deceased former self.
My point was simply that TF continuity is, shall we say, a less-than-precise science...to put it generously. We're really not talking high literature with meticulous attention to backstory and plot here. HasTak would probably happily retcon Cyclonus into the reformatted version of Devastator if they thought it'd sell more toys.
For the purposes of displaying your TFs just put whoever you want in and it's fine.

[theheretic]

"At secret staging grounds on two of cybertrons moons"

What are the names of those two moons?

[Sky Shadow]

Hey - has anyone ever sorted their collection by colour? I was just thinking it would look really cool - a predominately red shelf; an orange one; yellow; green; blue; purple.


"At secret staging grounds on two of cybertrons moons"

What are the names of those two moons?

One may have been named only named a couple of months ago in the comics as Luna 1. (Swerve says, he hasn't "been on a quest since the whole Luna 1 thing. The Moonquest.") Presumably the second one is Luna 2. Otherwise, Moonbase One and Moonbase Two may describe the entirety of the moons. Surprisingly I don't recall anyone ever naming them anything more interesting.

[GoktimusPrime]

Their names have never been revealed. It's possible that Cybertronians don't name their satellites like humans do. <shrug>

Also, the number of moons that Cybertron has varies between different continuities (I guess they're not multiversal singularities like Cybertron ;)):
+ G1 Marvel Comics: 2 moons
+ G1 Sunbow cartoon: 3 moons (only 2 of them had moonbases though)
+ Beast Wars/Machines: 2 moons
+ Armadaverse: 1 moon... it had a name! (Unicron ;))
+ Timelines: 4 moons
+ Aligned: 2 moons (and an asteroid belt)

Reference: http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Cybertron_%28planet%29

Sky Shadow: TFwiki redirects "Luna 1" to "Moonbase One" and treats it as a synonym for Moonbase One. <shrug>

[Paulbot]

Hey - has anyone ever sorted their collection by colour? I was just thinking it would look really cool - a predominately red shelf; an orange one; yellow; green; blue; purple.

I had the same thought last year (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?p=277337#post277337) ;)


This reminds me of a random thought I had a while ago, how I'd like to see a collection themed to a rainbow of colours: a shelf of primarily red toys, then one of orange bots, then yellow and so on. (Inspired by the Pride flag :o)

Still haven't seen one though.

[Sky Shadow]

I had the same thought last year (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?p=277337#post277337) ;)

Great minds? :)

Yeah, a friend of mine asked me to guess how she'd sorted her books in her bookshelf. My guesses went through alphabetical order, chronological order, size, etc. and finally she showed me - it was by colour. And it looks really good. Shops do it well too - like... Accessorise? (Does that still exist?) One of the best things about Transformers is their colours - someone's collection should take advantage of that. (If I have my own collection room when I'm back in Australia I'll do it and take photos.)

[theheretic]

I guess haven't named our moon really either

[griffin]

We did, it's a satellite called "the Moon".
It's kinda like our star being called "the Sun"... they were probably named back when people thought they were the only ones in the Universe.

[theheretic]

They aren't the only ones?

[griffin]

It's easier to say "Moon or Moons" than referring to them as "Satellites or Natural Satellites (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_satellite)".
It wasn't until the 17th Century that telescopes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_Galilei) were able to see other planets and their "Moons" to know that it was actually quite common, but since the Western world had named The Sun (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun) and The Moon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon) almost 800 years prior to the revelation of the Earth being round and that we weren't the only planet with Natural Satellites, it was more indoctrinated in the Western World to believe that every Star was called a Sun, and that every natural Satellite was called a Moon.
It was about that time that the "Earth being the Centre of the Universe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geocentric_model)" was finally proven to be wrong as well.

As strange as it seems, many Ancient cultures, from 600BC, already believed the Earth was round, but when the Church-led western world was the dominant influence on Earth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth) for Theology & Science, it took a thousand years (the 15th Century) before it could be proven and accepted that the Earth was not flat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Columbus).

A bit of an educational side-track... but I find such historical journeys of things we take for granted, as fascinating.
(if you think about it, if Moon is a generic term for orbiting natural objects of planets, then ours is the only one in the Universe without a name)

[Demonac]

As strange as it seems, many Ancient cultures, from 600BC, already believed the Earth was round...



Eratosthenes (276–194 BC) worked out the circumference of Earth pretty accurately, so it wasn't just a belief.

[GoktimusPrime]

More about moons! :D
Some satellites we've seen in Transformers include:
+ The Moon (Earth)
+ Luna 1-4 (Cybertron), depending on continuity
+ Titan (Saturn) - the natives mistook TFs for their Sky Gods and worshipped them. The Quintessons later established a base there. Metrotitan was also constructed there.
+ Blurr and Wheelie once crashed on the Jovian satellite of Io.
+ Styx - ice satellite to the planet Charon where there's a Decepticon penal colony
+ Charon is also the name of Pluto's satellite which was seen in the G1 episode "Five Faces of Darkness Part 3"
+ In Revenge of the Fallen the Nemesis appeared to have crashed on one of Saturn's satellites (not sure which one - it has 61) <--debatable

Unnatural satellites:
+ Unicron - Cybertron's satellite in the Armadaverse cartoon
+ Planet Buster - Prehistoric Earth's second moon that turned out to be a Vok weapon

Also...
+ The Decepticon allied Microman Ga'Mede (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Ga%27mede)'s name is derived from Ganymede, the name of the largest of Jupiter's 63 satellites.
+ Whirl's pre-Transformer name was "Oberon Gazette," and Oberon is the name of one of Uranus' satellites. I don't know enough about Dorvack to tell if this was an intentional reference or not.
+ In the G1 comics there was a Decepticon double-spy named Triton, sharing with one of Neptune's satellites.
+ In Beast Wars there's a character named Moon who finishes his sentences with the word "moon."
+ Waspinator once mooned Inferno and Quickstrike... who shot him. :p

[5FDP]

^ Seriously... did all that just pour out of your head or did you cut-n-paste from a wiki article? You need a hobby... oh, wait :p

[Hursticon]

All hail the mighty Aten, know that I am not a heretic... :D

[theheretic]

All hail the mighty Aten, know that I am not a heretic... :D

I'm not a heretic either. I'm THE Heretic

[i_amtrunks]

So deciding to try and hunt down some MP figures to go with Magnus.

Megatron is too much effort, so not bothering with him, so want to get a Roddy, Grimlock and a seeker, preferably Skywarp as I wasn't a massive fan of the Hasbro MP Starscream I had (sold it ages ago).

So what I am asking is for advice and thoughts on the Hasbro and Takara versions for each figure and where if anyone has any recommended sellers that have them for reasonable prices.

I am pretty happy to go with the Hasbro Rodimus from TRU for around $60, but all thoughts and comments are greatly appreciated as to why to get the Takara one instead.

Grimlock will need to be imported, I know! Just hard to get a scope on a good price as they fluctuate greatly on ebay and the like.

And Skywarp is the one I really want thoughts and info on.. I can get a Hasbro one for around $80 shipped, and a takara one for $170ish if memory serves. Mostly wondering if it as worth the extra and why.

Only on a teachers salary so can probably only get one at a time, unless there is a stellar deal somewhere!

Thanks for the assistance!

[Cat]

I think I know someone who may be able to get you a Megatron. One of the good ones from the second batch too (no rust).

As for seekers, remember that TakTom have got the new seeker sculpt coming out, and we've already seen the Sunstorm exclusive (which is a thing of beauty). I'd say work out which sculpt you like better, and go from there.

If you decide on TakTom Rodimus, MAKE SURE YOU GET A SECOND BATCH ONE. I CANNOT stress the importance of that!

[5FDP]

Megatron is too much effort, so not bothering with him, so want to get a Roddy, Grimlock and a seeker, preferably Skywarp as I wasn't a massive fan of the Hasbro MP Starscream I had (sold it ages ago).

Good choices. They're all the ones I have excluding Rodimus.


If you decide on TakTom Rodimus, MAKE SURE YOU GET A SECOND BATCH ONE. I CANNOT stress the importance of that!

How can you tell the difference?

[canofwhoopass_87]

I reckon it might be worth picking up the new MP Starscream coming out end of this month. I'm holding out for Skywarp/Thundercracker repaints as well.

Since the announcement of the new MP seeker mould, the prices for the original MP seekers has dropped significantly.

and yeh I agree - Megatron is too much of a hassle. I went through the pain of acquiring one and it just ain't worth it. The MP just doesn't do Megsy any justice. His gun alt mode is alright though.


Good choices. They're all the ones I have excluding Rodimus.

How can you tell the difference?

Most online stores will state in the listing whether or not it's the 2nd run release. However, it'd be nice to know if there are any differences on the box or figure to look out for

[i_amtrunks]

I think I know someone who may be able to get you a Megatron. One of the good ones from the second batch too (no rust).

Thanks for the offer Cat, but with all the security measures needed to own MP Megsy, it's not worth the bother.

I'm leaning towards getting the Hasbro versions of the figures mostly to save cash, but it also make Magnus all the more special!

Still would appreciate others advice/thoughts/suggestions too.

[Autocon]

In the resource section, should there be a thread with all the faction symbols and what they represent? I am looking up the top on the banner and trying to work out what every faction symbol is for?

Having trouble with all the non face ones:o

[Cat]

I reckon it might be worth picking up the new MP Starscream coming out end of this month. I'm holding out for Skywarp/Thundercracker repaints as well.

Since the announcement of the new MP seeker mould, the prices for the original MP seekers has dropped significantly.

and yeh I agree - Megatron is too much of a hassle. I went through the pain of acquiring one and it just ain't worth it. The MP just doesn't do Megsy any justice. His gun alt mode is alright though.



Most online stores will state in the listing whether or not it's the 2nd run release. However, it'd be nice to know if there are any differences on the box or figure to look out for

There's a few tells. The upper arm construction is a good one.

There's other changes, google it as I know comparisons have been made, listing every alteration. Not all are visible.

Any good retailer will specifically list it as being a second batch piece (Ie BBTS does).

If you're getting the Hasbro version, well, this doesn't apply. They're all the same, and all fixed from the first run TakTom (but uses a different upper arm set-up than either of the TakTom ones. A lot of people don't like it. It's a complete non-issue for me, as I think it's just fine. YMMV, of course)

It's basically down to whether or not you want to spend over $150 extra just for the trailer.

[griffin]

In the resource section, should there be a thread with all the faction symbols and what they represent? I am looking up the top on the banner and trying to work out what every faction symbol is for?

Having trouble with all the non face ones:o

Check tfwiki.net (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Faction_symbols), as they have a page full of them.

[Cat]

In the resource section, should there be a thread with all the faction symbols and what they represent? I am looking up the top on the banner and trying to work out what every faction symbol is for?

Having trouble with all the non face ones:o

http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Faction_symbol

This has them all listed and pictured. Extremely comprehensive!

[Cat]

JINX

You owe me a coke.

[Hursticon]

Can anyone inform me as to whether the Madman issues of the G1 DVDs use the Rhino footage or not? :o

[GoktimusPrime]

I have the original Madman DVDs (pre-tin box set) and yeah, they use the Rhino stuff with their stoopid added sound effects. I bought them heaps cheap from a second hand store after my entire DVD collection (including my original US Rhino G1 DVD box sets) were stolen in a burglary. :(

[Verno]

So, in the Marvel comics, Megatron never turned into Galvatron?

[Paulbot]

So, in the Marvel comics, Megatron never turned into Galvatron?

That's right. But the US and UK Marvel comics did feature Galvatron (who was once Megatron) who came back in time from the future where TFTM happened.

[Verno]

You mean where TF:TM never happened? Otherwise I'm still confused.

[Paulbot]

Most of Marvel's comics were set in the present (80s/90s). By the end of the Marvel comics (Generation 2 #12) the Megatron we knew never became Galvatron.

Megatron became Galvatron in 2005 in a possible/alternate future timeline where the events of the movie happened. Then he travelled back in time and interacted with the present day. The Galvatron in the comics was Megatron but not "our" Megatron.

The puzzles of the 4th dimension.

[Verno]

That's all pretty twisted, but clears it up for me.

And in the Cartoon universe, the Megatron that became Galvatron, never went back to be Megatron?

[Paulbot]

That's all pretty twisted, but clears it up for me.

And in the Cartoon universe, the Megatron that became Galvatron, never went back to be Megatron?

Only in wacky and obscure Japanese fiction, but what happens in Japan stays in Japan. If you're not Japanese feel free to ignore it.

[Hursticon]

I have the original Madman DVDs (pre-tin box set) and yeah, they use the Rhino stuff with their stoopid added sound effects. I bought them heaps cheap from a second hand store after my entire DVD collection (including my original US Rhino G1 DVD box sets) were stolen in a burglary. :(

Sorry to hear Goki but cheers for your help. :o

Urgh...

Well, I have the Tin-Box set and I have a suspicion that it might be utilising said Rhino Masters; I've found it basically impossible to find any proper comparison video so as to discern what to look for, the seasonal intros just have something odd about them that I can't put my finger on and I've felt this way for many years now. :(

[GoktimusPrime]

The tell tale signs are the really stupidly loud laser and explosion noises that Rhino added in. The original G1 track never had those. (-_-)

[Hursticon]

The tell tale signs are the really stupidly loud laser and explosion noises that Rhino added in. The original G1 track never had those. (-_-)

That's what I'm thinking is tipping me off... :(

Sigh,
Now to investigate American DVD prices... :o

[Gouki]

I know that this question shouldn't be in this thread and that I am cheating ti get a quick answer, but where are the best places to get Transformers from (in general--old or new) around/Melbourne and the surrounding suburbs?

And anybody seen an SDCC Arcee/Bumblebee pack in any Melbourne anime/comic/general geekery store around Melbourne? Would be nice to find on my birthday tomorrow.

[Paulbot]

Sorry haven't seen any around.

Comics R Us (on Bourke St) stocks old TFs and Minotaur (on Elizabeth St) tends to stock new TFs (but pricey) as well as other anime/comic/geekery stuff

Target (Bourke St) and Big W (Swanston St) both have TF Prime toys in stock but not alot. Target might be a place you could get the TF:Prime Bumblebee/Starscream 2-pack but that's not really a subsitute. (I want to get that SDCC pack too but have been put off by eBay prices)

[griffin]

I know that this question shouldn't be in this thread and that I am cheating ti get a quick answer, but where are the best places to get Transformers from (in general--old or new) around/Melbourne and the surrounding suburbs?


Known Independent stores (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=11614) in Victoria.
Known comic shops (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=11615) in Victoria (some may have toys or other collectables).

[Firestorm]

out of the 2 deluxe TF Prime Cliffjumpers (First Edition and TFPRIDE) which one is more acurate to his show model?

[GoktimusPrime]

FE is hands down the better toy. The PRiD version feels like a KO by comparison. Both are fairly show-like, but the PRiD version cheats with faux-kibble parts whereas the FE toy actually incorporates the vehicle parts into the robot, making it a less kibble-licious and better engineered toy.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

out of the 2 deluxe TF Prime Cliffjumpers (First Edition and TFPRIDE) which one is more acurate to his show model?It's kind of a toss-up. From what I can see the FE (http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/toys/transformers-prime-first-edition/cliffjumper/2561/) has more accurate forearms especially with the transforming arm-cannons, but PRiDE (http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/toys/transformers-prime-robots-in-disguise/cliffjumper/2589/) has more accurate legs, abdominal section, and upper arms. The head looks to be very slightly off in both, but not by much - PRiDE has a slightly better facial expression IMO. The legs are really noticeably different for the FE, while the forearms are noticeably different for the PRiDE. Also, the FE is slightly larger than PRiDE, though both are pretty small.

If you've got the budget to spare and it's worth the outlay to you, I'd chase down the FE for the transforming arm-cannons, but really they're both pretty decent show-accuracy wise. Also note that the Zombie CJ uses the FE mold, so that's a consideration one way or the other.

[Firestorm]

Thanks for sharing your opinions guys

I was at K-mart last night and I was tossing up weather or not I should get TFPRiDE Cliff, since I wasn't sure which one was more accurate to Show Model Cliff

To those who have seen and played with both Cliffjumpers is there any way that the legs from TFPRiDE Cliffjumper can be swapped onto FE Cliffjumper while still keeping him transformable?



Also note that the Zombie CJ uses the FE mold, so that's a consideration one way or the other.

but from what I've heard Zombie Cliff is only being released by takara and is gonna be completly blue. so I'd need to give him a new coat of paint to make him screen accurate

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Thanks for sharing your opinions guys

I was at K-mart last night and I was tossing up weather or not I should get TFPRiDE Cliff, since I wasn't sure which one was more accurate to Show Model Cliff

To those who have seen and played with both Cliffjumpers is there any way that the legs from TFPRiDE Cliffjumper can be swapped onto FE Cliffjumper while still keeping him transformable?




but from what I've heard Zombie Cliff is only being released by takara and is gonna be completly blue. so I'd need to give him a new coat of paint to make him screen accurateHaven't seen both, but I really doubt it hey. FE Cliff is really tightly packed in alt mode, and the leg halves fold together for bot mode. You might be able to do the swap but he almost definitely won't transform.

Didn't know that about Zombiejumper, that sucks.:( The FE mold is pretty cleverly engineered, it's a shame most people will miss out on it.

[GoktimusPrime]

I've seen and played with both. I really think the PRiD one is rubbish - FE is far superior. I highly doubt the legs can be swapped around as the engineering on these two toys are completely different. FE Cliffjumper is a far more satisfying Deluxe. PRiD Cliffjumper may have more show-accurate legs, but it's because that toy's transformation cheats by using faux-kibble whereas FE Cliffjumper incorporates far more of its alt mode parts into the vehicle. IMO better engineering > show accuracy. Also I reckon FE Cliffjumper looks more show accurate every where else besides the legs. And the legs don't look that bad anyway.

Anyway, here are some piccies:
FE & PRiD Cliffjumper comparison pics (http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/transformers-prime-cliffjumper-first-edition-vs-robots-in-disguise-pictorial-review/23799/)
Show model (http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/attach/4/0/5/9/7/8_Cliffjumper_1293833645.jpg)

FE Cliffy's also a slightly larger toy (robot is taller, vehicle is longer) and the vehicle lacks the unsightly holes that PRiD Cliffy has. The red plastic used on FE Cliffjumper also looks nicer that PRiD's. For the same price* you're far better off getting FE Cliffjumper. Also, PRiD Cliffjumper comes with that failtastic weapon whereas FE Cliffjumper's hands both transform into arm-guns like in the cartoon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WqNmARDAr6o#t=92s). FE Cliffjumper also has Autobot insignia silhouettes sculpted and painted on his forearms like on the cartoon model (can't remember if PRiD Cliffjumper has this too or not). So overall I find FE Cliffjumper to be more show-accurate than PRiD Cliffjumper (the latter is only more accurate with the legs, that's it).

-------------------------------------------------------
*While you may need to pay for postage for FE Cliffjumper overseas prices are often cheaper (even moreso w/ the high AUD) - or the same as AU RRP at the most. So for essentially the same price you might as well go for FE

[UltraMarginal]

-------------------------------------------------------
*While you may need to pay for postage for FE Cliffjumper overseas prices are often cheaper (even moreso w/ the high AUD) - or the same as AU RRP at the most. So for essentially the same price you might as well go for FE

Hve you looked on eBay for anything FE lately!!??:(

[GoktimusPrime]

Hve you looked on eBay for anything FE lately!!??:(
What's eBay, precious? :p
I was referring to normal store prices, not inflated aftermarket prices. FE was only released in Dec/Jan... they can't be sold out in regular stores unless they're being massively scalped! :eek: But I would strongly advise never paying scalper prices. Better off getting PRiD than giving a cent to a scalper. :mad:

[UltraMarginal]

What's eBay, precious? :p
I was referring to normal store prices, not inflated aftermarket prices. FE was only released in Dec/Jan... they can't be sold out in regular stores unless they're being massively scalped! :eek: But I would strongly advise never paying scalper prices. Better off getting PRiD than giving a cent to a scalper. :mad:

If you can find me a FE cliffjumper for under $40 shipped I'll buy it .

[GoktimusPrime]

My FEs all cost me approx. AU$17~20 from Toys R Us (in HK and JP). Can't imagine it exceeding $40 with postage. I must confess that I haven't paid much attention to First Edition since mid-January as I'd completed my FE collecting by then - they were in plentiful supply in stores then, but not sure if they are now. Considering that they only came out a few months ago, if they're in short supply now then I suspect the work of ruthless scalpers.

But I'm not a great fan of paying above RRP for a toy, so if you can't find FE Cliffy for RRP then by all means go for PRiD Cliffy. FE Cliffjumper is an excellent Deluxe -- but at the end of the day, he's only a Deluxe; worth $30... $40 tops if you're really desperate and not a dollar more. Besides, Kmart's selling PRiD Deluxes cheap for about $23 atm. :)

[UltraMarginal]

My FEs all cost me approx. AU$17~20 from Toys R Us (in HK and JP). Can't imagine it exceeding $40 with postage. I must confess that I haven't paid much attention to First Edition since mid-January as I'd completed my FE collecting by then - they were in plentiful supply in stores then, but not sure if they are now. Considering that they only came out a few months ago, if they're in short supply now then I suspect the work of ruthless scalpers.

But I'm not a great fan of paying above RRP for a toy, so if you can't find FE Cliffy for RRP then by all means go for PRiD Cliffy. FE Cliffjumper is an excellent Deluxe -- but at the end of the day, he's only a Deluxe; worth $30... $40 tops if you're really desperate and not a dollar more. Besides, Kmart's selling PRiD Deluxes cheap for about $23 atm. :)

I wish I"d had that opportunity, since Hasbro confirmed that they would not be releasing them anywhere other than TRU and in limited supply which has totally dried up in the states and Canada, the aftermarket price for all the FE toys has gone through the roof. It's very much a scalpers world out there right now.:(

[Paulbot]

I've got a question about the IDW Collection Hardcovers (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Transformers-The-IDW-Collection-Volume/dp/1600106676/ref=pd_sim_sbs_b_1/280-1347672-6376605). I had a flick through Volume one in store (at a Dymocks) and I was impressed with the presentation. Are all the volumes of equal quality? Importantly are there any issues with page spreads being hard to read (see some recent problems of DC hardcovers (http://marvelmasterworksfansite.yuku.com/topic/19150/Binding-Books-Laying-Flat--related-DC-Hardcover-Complaints?page=1#.T3bsIWGwzog) for instance)?

I'm not convinced about collecting them all (as I have hardcovers featuring everything sold before AHM and hardcovers of AHM and Wreckers) but I might start buying them for the more recent IDW stuff (since Premiere Hardcover Volume 3 doesn't look it's coming).

[Cat]

I've got a question about the IDW Collection Hardcovers (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Transformers-The-IDW-Collection-Volume/dp/1600106676/ref=pd_sim_sbs_b_1/280-1347672-6376605). I had a flick through Volume one in store (at a Dymocks) and I was impressed with the presentation. Are all the volumes of equal quality? Importantly are there any issues with page spreads being hard to read (see some recent problems of DC hardcovers (http://marvelmasterworksfansite.yuku.com/topic/19150/Binding-Books-Laying-Flat--related-DC-Hardcover-Complaints?page=1#.T3bsIWGwzog) for instance)?

I'm not convinced about collecting them all (as I have hardcovers featuring everything sold before AHM and hardcovers of AHM and Wreckers) but I might start buying them for the more recent IDW stuff (since Premiere Hardcover Volume 3 doesn't look it's coming).

All are high quality, and thankfully, NOTHING like DC and their damn mousetrap binding (I hate having to fight the book just to read Hawkman, damnit.)

The only oddity is just so inconsequential, but it's literally the ONLY negative I can think of. One of the volumes doesn't have a ribbon. Gasp. Shocking, I know.


I have both volumes of the Premiere Editions, and while they were great, they were also too big to be read comfortably, and if you dropped them, you'd put a hole through to China.

The IDW Collections are still oversized, but are much lighter, and an overall more pleasant reading experience.

I recommend them.

EDIT: Oops, just saw the Premiere Edition comment of yours. Yeah, Premiere aren't being done anymore. Personally, I'm fine with that, because the two we did get tell a complete enough story to satisfy me.

I also have all the single issues, regular trades, the digests, Premiere Editions, and the IDW Collections.

When I want to read something, I grab the IDW Collections for it, over any other version.

[Paulbot]

Thanks for that answer.


I have both volumes of the Premiere Editions, and while they were great, they were also too big to be read comfortably, and if you dropped them, you'd put a hole through to China. ... Personally, I'm fine with that, because the two we did get tell a complete enough story to satisfy me.

I agree. Those books are nice to have but aren't something you read easily. I'm a little bugged that the second doesn't include Maximum Dinobots because that would have wrapped up all the Furman/pre-AHM storylines nicely into the two books. That story would have seemed out of place in a Volume 3 - which is what I thought the AHM hardcover was going to be.

I'm only missing the issues from Ongoing #7 forward in a collected format now (oh and Spotlight: Prowl but meh), so I should be right if I start buying the Collections from Volume 7. And then we'll see if I cave in and collect the others, although Volume 5 seems superfluous when I have the AHM hardcover.

And I'm still wondering where Movie Collection Vol 3 is... I purposely didn't buy the DOTM tie-in comics expecting that volume will appear eventually.

[Cat]

Those movie collections didn't sell all that well, so I wouldn't be surprised if they'd cancelled any further volumes.

If you were planning on getting volumes 4 and 5 of the IDW collections, I'd probably be inclined to grab them soonish, as they seem to be getting harder to get.

Of course, you don't need volume 5 seeing you have the AHM hc.

I don't know if you get omniboo from other companies, but I personally think Marvel's are the gold standard, with IDW closely behind (I think it's the covers that do it for me, Marvel's are nicely stamped with a dustjacket, whereas IDW's are just printed on the hardcover itself. And of course, DC is now just not stamping anything on the actual cover itself, so if you lost the dustjacket, good luck finding which one you wanted on the shelf!).

Marvel's presentation is just that little bit nicer.

But there's nothing negative about the IDW Collections. They're well worth it, and a lot cheaper than Marvel omniboo, and miles and miles and miles above the awful quality from DC.

You'll definitely be happy with them.

[GoktimusPrime]

I wish I"d had that opportunity, since Hasbro confirmed that they would not be releasing them anywhere other than TRU and in limited supply which has totally dried up in the states and Canada, the aftermarket price for all the FE toys has gone through the roof. It's very much a scalpers world out there right now.:(
While I was able to pick up my Japanese FEs from Japan, I didn't do so with my Hasbro FEs from HK. I'd actually gotten a contact in HK to run around and get those toys for me (along w/ Generations Sky Shadow and Junkheap) and send them to me. :) So physically travelling overseas to get these toys isn't necessary (and would offset the cost of getting them at RRP unless you were already going to be there anyway) -- if you know anyone in say Japan, HK, Singapore etc. you could try asking them if they'd be willing to help you out. :)

Just a suggestion. But yeah, as I said before, if you can't get the FEs for RRP then I wouldn't bother (I'd rather get the PRiDs at Kmart).

[kup]

Dumb question regarding WFC for the PS3:

How does the control method work in regards to aiming? Is it free movement like if you were using a mouse (only with the thumb stick) or do you auto aim by trigger as you would in Gears of War?

[Verno]

Does anyone know who Hasbro's liaison is with the dudes at IDW?

[Cat]

Does anyone know who Hasbro's liaison is with the dudes at IDW?

Currently?

IIRC there's more than one.

Easy way to find out for yourself is to check the credits in the comics. They usually list them as a thank you (Last time I checked).

[Seraphim Prime]

IDW has an editor in charge of Hasbro properties - currently John Barber. It was previously Andy Schmidt who has sinced moved across to Hasbro itself, and probably has somthing to do with Hasbro IDW relations.

[Verno]

A comic writer went to work for Hasbro?!

What could those sneaky people at Hasbro be up to? Perhaps thinking of going into the comic business themselves, rather than going through a 3rd party?

[KalEl]

Dumb question regarding WFC for the PS3:

How does the control method work in regards to aiming? Is it free movement like if you were using a mouse (only with the thumb stick) or do you auto aim by trigger as you would in Gears of War?

fairly certain its free moving, though I haven't played the game for a very long time so if im wrong so be it :P

[Cat]

A comic writer went to work for Hasbro?!

What could those sneaky people at Hasbro be up to? Perhaps thinking of going into the comic business themselves, rather than going through a 3rd party?

No, nothing like that at all.

He's simply working for them now. No such plans.

[kup]

fairly certain its free moving, though I haven't played the game for a very long time so if im wrong so be it :P

Can anyone confirm this?

If so, this doesn't bode well for me as I tried using a PS3 controller on the PC game and it's aiming was horrible, zapped the enjoyment out of the game.

[kup]

A comic writer went to work for Hasbro?!

What could those sneaky people at Hasbro be up to? Perhaps thinking of going into the comic business themselves, rather than going through a 3rd party?

Bumblebee and his 'bee' friends. :p

[Cat]

Can anyone confirm this?

If so, this doesn't bode well for me as I tried using a PS3 controller on the PC game and it's aiming was horrible, zapped the enjoyment out of the game.

Well they're not doing FOC for PC anyway.

I have it on 360 and DS. Love the 360 version. I've had no problems aiming. Haven't played it on PC though.

[kup]

Well they're not doing FOC for PC anyway.

I have it on 360 and DS. Love the 360 version. I've had no problems aiming. Haven't played it on PC though.

I know and that's actually the reason for my question since I would have to play FOC with a PS3 controller and hence why I was trying it out with the WFC PC game. The PS3 controller was responsive but horrible at aiming efficiently and lacking the precision of the mouse. Once you go PC you can never go back :p

The PC controls with the mouse feel natural, good and precise, I don't have a problem with that, I actually believe it to be the superior control method for a shooter. Since attempting to play the PC game with a PS3 controller was so horrible, I feared that due to that, I will not be able to enjoy FOC as much since I would be forced to use the PS3 controller due to lack of PC support.

On a separate note, I also tried playing Arkham city with the PS3 controller and it was also horrible after playing with the mouse - It lacks free aiming precision with the camera and rather clunky. Controllers are good for games such as God of War and whatnot, not shooters with free aiming controls.

[Cat]

Yeah, I do know what you mean by the lack of precision.

Targetting using the 360 controller was fine, it just took me awhile to get used to, and just to deal with the fact that I can't be as precise as I'd like.

It depends on the quality of the game as to whether or not that's a dealbreaker for me, and WFC certainly won me over.

[kup]

Yeah, I do know what you mean by the lack of precision.

Targetting using the 360 controller was fine, it just took me awhile to get used to, and just to deal with the fact that I can't be as precise as I'd like.

It depends on the quality of the game as to whether or not that's a dealbreaker for me, and WFC certainly won me over.

Anyways thanks for answering my question. I guess free aiming with the PS3 controller it is. I hope I can naturally get into it with FOC as aiming with the controller almost felt as awkward as trying to use a calculator while wearing boxing gloves.

[Verno]

No, nothing like that at all.

He's simply working for them now. No such plans.

Or...

We've stumbled onto a big conspiracy! :eek:

[Verno]

What do we actually know about Regeneration One story?

[griffin]

Not much, and tfwiki (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Regeneration_One) has a few preliminary details... and is probably the best place to keep checking back on any new plot details as they are known.

[Sworc]

Just picked up IDW US Classics Vols 1 & 2 and just started reading them.

But I had a quick flick through and noticed the date of the later issues in volume 2 are post the '86 movie, yet they don't seem to include any of the characters from the film. Without giving too much away (first time reading these comics), do the comics eventually follow in the footsteps of the film or do they continue to be completely independent story lines?

Cheers

[Cat]

Just picked up IDW US Classics Vols 1 & 2 and just started reading them.

But I had a quick flick through and noticed the date of the later issues in volume 2 are post the '86 movie, yet they don't seem to include any of the characters from the film. Without giving too much away (first time reading these comics), do the comics eventually follow in the footsteps of the film or do they continue to be completely independent story lines?

Cheers

Not really.

There was a miniseries done at the time by Marvel, of the film, but that was it, it wasn't in continuity.

Otherwise, the US comics just continued as was. Hot Rod was basically just another soldier.

The UK series did a lot more with the concepts we see in the movie, and had some great stories.

[Paulbot]

There was also an issue (#43) that was a straight adaptation of a post-movie cartoon episode (The Big Broadcast of 2006). Totally random since the US comic was not based on the cartoon. Titan didn't reprint it in their collections (except for a two page summary in the Space Pirates UK collection) so I'm not sure if IDW has/will.

[Sky Shadow]

JBut I had a quick flick through and noticed the date of the later issues in volume 2 are post the '86 movie, yet they don't seem to include any of the characters from the film. Without giving too much away (first time reading these comics), do the comics eventually follow in the footsteps of the film or do they continue to be completely independent story lines?

The US comic continues in real time, so the 1986 and 1987 characters show up in the eighties rather than 2005-6. Kup, Hot Rod, Blurr, Galvatron and Unicron are still important characters in the US comics, but Cyclonus, Scourge, Wreck-Gar, Arcee and Springer are not. Ratbat is a much bigger character in the US comics than he is in the cartoon.

[GoktimusPrime]

The post-movie characters who do appear in the comics only do so when the story jumps to the future world of 2006-08, and when characters from that future travel back to present day 1986-87. Wibbly wobbly timey wimey. ;)

[KalEl]

The post-movie characters who do appear in the comics only do so when the story jumps to the future world of 2006-08, and when characters from that future travel back to present day 1986-87. Wibbly wobbly timey wimey. ;)

Nice Dr who quote there hehe