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jaydisc
10th August 2009, 03:44 PM
We don't seem to have one of these yet. Seems appropriate.

So, last week I got my Encore Cassettes v2, which is Ratbat, Slugfest, Ramhorn and Steeljaw.

Now, I had these when I was 9 or 10 years old, and have also recently acquired a G1 slugfest, but based on that, it seems the new plastics are a bit different. They seem more matte, and have less gloss than the originals, or my memory of them. That's not to say the originals were glossy, per se, but just comparatively so. There are also subtle color differences, although I'm not sure what adjective to use to describe them.

With Steeljaw, I don't remember such a vast difference in the matching of color between thighs and feet and the rest of the body. Was the G1 one like that too?

Today, I also got Bruticus. Encore Bruticus, as many of you have probably heard, uses the more recent RID version of the mold and its weapons, which includes a mechanism on Onslaught's flat bed to shoot another down his ramp and also more slots and pegs so that when in combined mode, you can merge the remaining weapons and Onslaught's chest piece to form two larger guns, leaving no kibble when combined. I had Bruticus, again when I was 9, so these are new to me, and are most welcomed.

The plastic, again, seems to have a more matte and softer feel than my memory would serve, or compared to other vintage G1 combiners I have. The absence of metal is disappointing, but I think its extra weight would mess with combined mode, as I recall it doing when I had the metal versions as a kid.

The mold issues also discussed are present, most noticeable when looking at the merging of the front facia of the alt mode, specifically with Onslaught, Blast Off and Vortex. However, I'm not sure if I would have noticed them as much had they not been discussed. Although that being said, the tip of my Blast Off nosecone is quite a bit off. I have to sort of rotate the wrists a bit sideways to get the rest of the cockpit to line up. I'll try to take pics tomorrow.

Additionally, many pegs are either quite tight or a bit loose in their respective holes and some joints are very tight and some not so tight. Unfortunately, Onslaught's shoulders aren't the tightest. They are tight enough to hold in place while pointed backwards in combined mode, but must be held while turning the arms to avoid the shoulders turning with them, and thus popping off the chest plate.

I think Gutsman said his plate fell off by looking at it. I feared that when I opened mine, and while it's not tight, it's tight enough and clip at the bottom holds it in place well.

There are also some colors of a different hue than the original. I do welcome the new colors, but it makes little to no difference to me.

So, compared to G1, we have some nice new weapon and ramp features, some updated color, but we've lost a bit of quality, sheen and tightness. However, it would be very difficult to acquire a vintage piece that still does have all of those benefits.

He always looked pretty menacing when combined, but the added guns really adds to his bad ass look. I'm really glad I got him.

kup
10th August 2009, 03:52 PM
Thanks for your description. It sounds as decent as any other Encore reissue - The lack of metal is disappointing but not killer.

It's there a pic of what the added guns look like?

jaydisc
10th August 2009, 04:32 PM
I'll try to take pics of all the things I've described once the sun returns, tomorrow.

blackie
10th August 2009, 04:35 PM
I'll try to take pics of all the things I've described once the sun returns, tomorrow.

iz called a flash....
or a lamp.

GoktimusPrime
10th August 2009, 05:39 PM
I haven't picked up my new encores yet, but I'll post some comparative pics when I do. Any other photo comparison requests can be made here (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=2482). :) There should already be some other comparative pics between G1s and reissues there - I'm sure I've posted comparison pics between G1 and Encore Soundwave, Sky Lynx and Omega Supreme.

lcz128
10th August 2009, 06:46 PM
iz called a flash....
or a lamp.
boooo!!! HISSS!!!!

Natural Light > Flash any day my friend!!! XD

GoktimusPrime
10th August 2009, 07:53 PM
Natural Light > Flash any day my friend!!! XD
I agree, but most of us have commitments during the day (like ya know, work ;)) and have more spare time after sundown. :(

kup
10th August 2009, 08:35 PM
I don't recall ever taking a toy pic during daylight :D

jaydisc
13th August 2009, 03:47 PM
Flash photography is near useless for closeups. As a matter of fact, many cameras will not even allow you use macro mode and flash simultaneously. Regardless, I did take some (albeit crappy) photos.

First noticeable problem was with Blast Off. As you can see, his nosecone and cockpit were quite poorly aligned:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus03.jpg

I could rotate the nosecone a bit which brings the cockpit a bit more aligned, but it isn't without its side effects:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus04.jpg

Vortex was better, but still subtly imperfect:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus01.jpg

The problem with Vortex was the way the legs click into place. You see this peg here:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus09.jpg

Depending on whether you want Vortex's robot mode, or Vortex's combined/arm mode you put it into either of these slots:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus10.jpg

The problem is that to get it to the hole closer to the torso you're putting quite a bit of strain on the leg/foot piece because it's sliding up the thigh which only allows straight movement.

It was extremely stiff getting it into place, but worse, it was petrifying to try to slide it back out. The pressure required really made me fear I was going to break either the thigh connect or leg piece.

Luckily, for combine mode, I prefer slightly longer arms, so I'll never have to put it in that second slot again. To match Bruticu's other arm, I extend Blast Off's waist.

Next up is Onslaught who suffers from slight erectile dysfunction, specifically he can't keep his gun up:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus05.jpg

However, from what I understand, even the originals suffered from that.

However, what's really noticeable is that he, uhh, how do you say, hangs to the left:

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus06.jpg

It really looks quite silly, especially in robot and combined mode.

Lastly, I tried to grab a pic trying to capture the different type of plastic used in some areas. It almost seemed a bit resin-y. I'm not sure if that's the right term, but those who have the Natobot kit can understand what I mean. It's just really matte, and a bit more rough. I'm referring to the brown piece here.

http://itfdb.com/temporary/tf/encorebruticus07.jpg

I'll take some pictures of the combined guns in the next day or two.

snaketales
13th August 2009, 04:06 PM
Flash photography is near useless for closeups. As a matter of fact, many cameras will not even allow you use macro mode and flash simultaneously. Regardless, I did take some (albeit crappy) photos.

Well I think those photos are good and made the review a good read.
Thumbs up!

TF76
13th August 2009, 05:23 PM
Nice job Jay.

If I ever get any time I'll try to take some pics of mine. I think I got lucky but it has a few problems (different to yours)

I think it isn't perfect but it is not garbage either. l see more issues with my encore autobot tapes and minibots and the club seacons.

I expected it not to be perfect and was just happy to get it as a whole package.

I think I get annoyed about it because a lot of people were shi$$ng all over the toy befor they even got one. A lot more attention has been made towards it's flaws than any other encore I have noticed.

All my encores alt modes are 'wonky' all have different (usually more transparent) plastic, differences to the original. The list could go on, i just don't get why people hate this set so much.

MV75
13th August 2009, 09:59 PM
All of these, (well most), "problems" I also have with my g2 bruticus. As in onslaught being "wonky" and the chest piece falling off, and onslaughts arms loose, etc. Definitly not new.

But I have mine in vehicle mode anyway, as I really love them as individuals. I must be the only member here that prefers to display in vehicle mode.

Stompy
13th August 2009, 10:28 PM
The nosecone for Blast Off looks pretty nasty and the crooked gun too. I think those would bother me a lot. Thanks for the insights so far jay.

dirge
14th August 2009, 08:52 AM
Next up is Onslaught who suffers from slight erectile dysfunction, specifically he can't keep his gun up:

However, from what I understand, even the originals suffered from that.


My original Onslaught will stay up fairly well. It _does_ tip if you tap it relatively gently, but an "anti-aircraft" aim is easy enough.

My G1 Vortex lines up perfectly, I'm dismayed to hear about your encore being so far off :(

MV75, my G2 Bruticus doesn't have any mould issues. Are yours really that bad? Sorry to hear that.

Autocon
15th August 2009, 12:15 AM
mine seem better than that though my vortex was hard to transform with the nose piece aswell

my brawl doesnt quite clip together in alt mode

everything else seems fine and sturdy

GoktimusPrime
15th August 2009, 10:48 PM
Comparison pics between my original G1 and Encore Combaticons. Apologies for my crappy photography and poor focus in some pics. And yes, I know my G1 Combaticons are missing all accessories and I've substituted Bruticus gestalt parts with Ruination parts - as noted in other threads the main reason why I got the Encore Combaticons was really for the accessories. ;)

G1 Onslaught (top) & Encore Onslaught (bottom)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_onslaught.jpg
No erectile problem with mine.

G1 Blast Off (left) & Encore Breast Off
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_blastoff.jpg
The two halves of Encore Breast Off's arms indeed do not clip together as well as the original leaving a noticeable gap that bisects the window. Although it doesn't look so bad IRL as it does in photos.

G1 Brawl (left) & Encore Onslaught (right)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_brawl.jpg

G1 Swindle (left) & Encore Swindle (right)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_swindle.jpg
Most noticeable difference is the colour; Encore Swindle has a much lighter shade of tan, which I don't like as much as the original colours on the G1 toy. The legs on my Encore are also really loose when sliding in and out; the legs on my G1 toy which I purchased back in 1986 are still _much_ stiffer than on the Encore version which I only got today! The little tab underneath Encore Swindle's window is also a bit too big which makes it difficult for the window to swing across it.

G1 Vortex (left & left inset) & Encore Volter (right & right inset)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_vortex.jpg
The most substantial difference is the little blue parts on the nose of the chopper; on the Encore version it doesn't sit flush as with the G1 toy. This effects the transformation to robot mode making it more cumbersome - you need to nudge the leg over to one side to compensate. (-_-)

Combaticon limb robots (G1s on left, Encores on right)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_limbformers.jpg
One noteworthy difference is the eyes on Blast Off - the G1 version has one visor-eye whereas the Encore is painted so he has two eyes, like the cartoon/comic model.

Onslaught (Left: G1 metal chest, Middle: Encore, Right: G1 plastic chest)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_onslaughts.jpg
One interesting thing to note is the cannon on G1 Onslaught has plastic grooves on the "inside" whereas they're filled out on the Encore version. As far as I can tell it seems that this mould variation occured in 2001 with Mega-Octane as can be seen when comparing with Dolrailer:
Dolrailer (2000): http://www.tfu.info/2001/Decepticon/Mega-Octane/jrobotmode.jpg
Mega-Octane (2001): http://www.tfu.info/2001/Decepticon/Mega-Octane/robotmode.jpg

G1 Bruticus (left w/ Ruination gestalt parts) & Encore Bruticus (right)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_bruticus.jpg

Except for Onslaught none of the Encore Combaticons rub sign indents. Overall the flaws are pretty minor and not surprising considering how overused this mould has been.

liegeprime
16th August 2009, 06:53 AM
So far the diecast reissues are the ones with minimal nuances as far as ive seen . Ive only bought the seekers, ratchet, ironhide, Omega Supreme encores. All of them uses a different composition with regards now to the plastic - as jay has mentioned is more resin type. There was a discussion re: plastic "feeling thin mixed", less gloss, lighter feel back when its the seeker 2 pack was the latest , just couldnt find it. although the lighter weight was disproved by some here as they actually weighed the figures VS the G1s. Though it does still feel lighter for me. NO problem with encore ratchet/ironhide, as good as the original with a slight thinner feel to the plastic bits. Encore Omega has thinner plastics than the original. Color matching wise - they seem to use brighter colors. Not really much of a difference. Encore bruticus from all these pics is as mentioned is a downgrade in quality. hmmm Mold degradation has indeed taken its toll on this reissue.:( As far as i can see the sharpness of the edges aint there, kinda KOey looking for me.:(

GoktimusPrime
16th August 2009, 08:57 AM
Encore Sky Lynx was really well done and I'm happy with Encore Soundwave too. Encore Ratchet and Ironhide did have a problem with holding the long gun underneath the vehicle mode though, they don't clip in as well as on the original G1 figures. I agree that the plastic on the Encore Combaticons and latest cassettes do feel 'inferior' to the original G1s. They also "look" thinner too; this is most noticeable with Encore Omega Supreme whose entire head illuminates instead of just the window, although Encore Omega Supreme is using an LED whereas G1 Omega Supreme just has a lamp.

Now here's a comparison between G1 and Encore Ramhorn and Steeljaw:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_ramhorn.jpg
The differences is noticeable, but overall Encore Ramhorn is a pretty good reproduction. I have no major issues with it.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_steeljaw.jpg
Aaahh... Steeljaw. The decos on the cassette mode are in improvement over TFC Steeljaw. They've added in decos on the feet and overall you can see it's a much better looking cassette mode in terms of the decos (the words "metal position" are actually readable!) For some reason the metal parts are _really_ shiny. Not chrome, just shiny metal. It doesn't do anything for me personally. However the main criticism I have on this toy would have to be the mismatching yellow!! Wow... usually Hasbro's the one who routinely screws up their yellows (e.g.: Animated Bumblebee, Universe Sunstreaker etc.), but here TakaraTOMY's done the same thing. Arguably worse because unlike ANI Bumblebee and UNI Sunstreaker, the mismatching yellow bits are _not_ painted over transparent plastic. They're actually yellow plastic parts, but for no particular reason, are a much brighter shade of plastic than the rest of the body! You can see clearly the hips, feet and tail are a lot brighter than the rest of the toy! It's noticeable in cassette mode too. It's noticeable from an altitude of 300m! So yeah, Encore Steeljaw wins in terms of his awesome cassette decos, but fails in terms of the mismatched yellows. :/

kup
16th August 2009, 09:17 AM
Wow, that color mismatch in Steeljaw is a real killer.

Wheel-J
16th August 2009, 10:41 AM
Wow, that color mismatch in Steeljaw is a real killer.

+1! :( Wish our custom experts had anything to say about this.

On the happy side, Ramhorn looks snappy based on Gok's pics! Glad they did a good job on that one - my first and only cassette I owned and lost decades ago. :rolleyes::)

griffin
16th August 2009, 12:04 PM
I can't believe that they've reissued Steeljaw twice and still haven't fixed up the lion's mane (being on his ass instead of on his head).

Because of the miss-matched colours, Steeljaw was the only one of that set that I didn't swap over with my old one in my collection.

loophole
16th August 2009, 04:01 PM
G1 Swindle (left) & Encore Swindle (right)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_combaticons_swindle.jpg
Most noticeable difference is the colour; Encore Swindle has a much lighter shade of tan, which I don't like as much as the original colours on the G1 toy.

i noticed the same colour differences between G1 Swindle and the "classics" reissue of him so maybe thats where they got the colour from for the encore release

bruticus
16th August 2009, 04:38 PM
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/comparisons/comparison_steeljaw.jpg
However the main criticism I have on this toy would have to be the mismatching yellow!! ...They're actually ...a much brighter shade of plastic than the rest of the body! You can see clearly the hips, feet and tail are a lot brighter than the rest of the toy! It's noticeable in cassette mode too.

Hey mate, i just checked this out for myself and was hoping you can explain whats going on.
-Top is G1 (Hasbro 1986, Takara 1986, Macau)
-Bottom is Encore
1049
I always thought that the G1 had bright yellow legs and the encore version was pretty much spot on up until i saw your comparison pics. Do you know whats the difference between my G1 steeljaw and your G1 steeljaw?


I can't believe that they've reissued Steeljaw twice and still haven't fixed up the lion's mane (being on his ass instead of on his head).


Are you referring to how the lion's mane has always been on the ass since g1 and they havent corrected this mistake with this second reissue or are you saying that G1's had it correct back then and the encore stuffed it up?
I'm guessing you mean the former? cos my G1 has the decals for the lions mane on the ass parts.
-Top is G1 (Hasbro 1986, Takara 1986, Macau)
-Bottom is Encore
1050

GoktimusPrime
16th August 2009, 04:58 PM
I always thought that was just some funky design pattern and never really thought of it as the lion's mane... usually cassette's have one side that's their robot side and the other is the cassette side (esp. with quadrapeds) so I don't really interpret any of that side as being part of the robot. <shrug>


I always thought that the G1 had bright yellow legs and the encore version was pretty much spot on up until i saw your comparison pics. Do you know whats the difference between my G1 steeljaw and your G1 steeljaw?
That's news to me! I just had a quick look at the Transformers Variants site (http://www.geocities.com/futuristgroup/vquanda.html) and I couldn't see anything about Steeljaw with bright yellow thighs/legs. I only had a skim read so maybe someone could have a proper check and see if I missed something (I'm about to step out now so I don't have time to do it atm).

kup
16th August 2009, 05:44 PM
It's very possible that the brighter yellow legs Steeljaw is an undocumented G1 variant which this Encore is reproducing.

Interesting as that legitimizes the color difference.

TF76
16th August 2009, 05:45 PM
http://www.geocities.com/futuristgroup/vsteeljaw.html

bruticus
16th August 2009, 08:37 PM
After some modding to make everything click into place properly without overstressing any plastic parts....My encore bruticus has moved up a few notches from the previous low rating i initially gave him.
10521053

Like the RID and Armada reincarnations, every single piece of weapons and accessories in this set can be attached to bruticus himself in one form or another.
10541055

So finally, he is now worthy of joining the ranks with my other bruticii.
1051

TF76
16th August 2009, 11:05 PM
Nice collection Bruticus! They all look awsome! :D

griffin
16th August 2009, 11:13 PM
Are you referring to how the lion's mane has always been on the ass since g1 and they havent corrected this mistake with this second reissue or are you saying that G1's had it correct back then and the encore stuffed it up?
I'm guessing you mean the former? cos my G1 has the decals for the lions mane on the ass parts.

Yes, it has always been on its ass, and I made a whinge with the first reissue didn't fix it. Now that the Encore has done the same, I'm just as disappointed/annoyed that it has copied the same error as the original Gen1 figure.

MV75
17th August 2009, 07:46 AM
So reprolabel it and put the sticker on the other side, or ask them to do a "mirror" print of the label.

griffin
17th August 2009, 10:50 AM
Mirror print will screw up the lettering. And the other side has moulded lion details, so covering them up with a sticker is not an option. Besides, you'd have to get the sticker cut differently to match the shapes on the other side.

MV75
17th August 2009, 10:57 AM
Of course they'd then be able to arrange the text properly on their computers before sending it to print. I thought I could get out of having to type that.

GoktimusPrime
17th August 2009, 12:11 PM
Though arguably if they had fixed it it would be less G1-accurate which might get up the nose of some G1 purists. <shrug> Either that or Steeljaw is supposed to be one hairy-bummed lion. ;)

jaydisc
17th August 2009, 12:21 PM
Thanks for taking pics of the combined guns Bruticus.

primatives
21st August 2009, 07:20 PM
hey is that giant bruticus in the background the g2 version or a KO, its so much bigger than the other ones????

Sky Shadow
21st August 2009, 07:58 PM
hey is that giant bruticus in the background the g2 version or a KO, its so much bigger than the other ones????

It's a knockoff:

http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/6769/48nq5.jpg

Original.......................... bigger bootleg.......................... biggest bootleg.

See this thread for more details: http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?p=72616#post72616

kup
21st August 2009, 09:17 PM
I have to admit - The size is pretty cool.