TF Animated General Discussion

[griffin]

Posted by Kup:
I have just finished watching Animated. Its okay but that is all, don't expect anything epic or truly exciting about it because it doesn't offer it, at least in this first 'movie length' episode.

The biggest flaw is the animation, particularly when it comes to the Humans and Earth in General. There is no doubt about it, the reason for this animation style is because its cheap. There is nothing artistic about it, just cheap. The human character designs are exceptionally bad and have a 'Grim Adventures of Billy & Mandy' feel to them. Overall the episode was okay but fails to produce any sort of geek fan boy reaction.


XXX SPOILERS XXX




The plot starts off reasonably well but moving too fast for you to get a sense of the Universe this series takes place in. However after they reach Earth things begin to get boring real quick with their first confrontation with this nanotech monster thing which frankly lasted way too long. Although the Humans were not initially annoying, its very difficult to 'accept' the poor character and animation style, If you can't stomach the Transformer designs you will definitely not stomach the Human's. Only at the end with Starscream's involvement do thing pick up again but its nothing too fulfilling. Sari, the girl looks to be the new Kicker with her Allspark channeling power and although she has not reached Kicker's level of annoyance yet she looks to have the bad potential to do so.

This first episode very clearly sets what the tone of the series will be which is not so much about Autobots and Decepticons on Earth but mainly about a Super hero team saving the City of Detroit with the odd Decepticon showing up every now and then. It is made clear that they will be fulfilling a similar role to a robotic Justice League or something of the sort. Also the whole concept of 'Robots in Disguise' was ditched within the first 4 minutes of them acquiring Earth Alt modes as They were made Public Heroes with ceremonies and all very early on.

This premiere was a bit Mediocre and don't expect much from it based on the limitations that they have already imposed on themselves and since 2 Seasons have already been produced, it is very doubtful that the tone of the series will change since they never allowed for them to study fan reaction to the initial few episodes before working on the next.

Overall, I am neither disappointed nor excited. It is very unlikely that I will be collecting any toys from this series.

Rest of topic discussion can be found here:
http://otca.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=3448

[Robzy]

Well, I don't mind it! I'm definitely hooked - and I'll be getting the figures too! :)

[Thanatos]

I definately want to get myself a lumberjack prime!

[Paulbot]

I have just seen it so need some more time to consider my opinion before doing a mini-review. It's not better than Beast Wars but is better than the Unicron Trilogy shows.

It's certainly done it's job as a toy commerical - I want the toys of the characters right now too! :D

[kup]

I am sorry but I find G1/typical 80s & 90s animation much more pleasing to the eye and detailed than Animated despite the regular animation errors.
________
Pissing fetish (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/822/fetish/videos/1)

[iceburn]

where can i get a copy of the animated ep1 and 2???

[Gutsman Heavy]

I watched it on youtube (don't laugh, bittorrent never works for me:()

I thought it was pretty good, much better than A/E/C or RID, got nothing on Beast Wars but over time who knows, ALL HAIL THE TRETCHEROUS CHIN OF STARSCREAM!

[Robzy]

I really enjoyed it. Prime was excellent! Starscream was the show-stealer! I thought Bumblebee and Ratchet were great too, but Prowl kinda annoyed me a bit! I actually also enjoyed the new take on Blitzwing as well!

Anyone know when it's coming on TV in Oz? Or when it's coming out on DVD?

[roller]

"The looks all wrong but at least you got the name right, you treat her like a lady and she'll always bring you home"


it sucks

the animation

but

from the perspective of someone born in the 21st century or late 20th, this was probably the best thing ever, anyone born after'89 was sadly infected.

i liked the spike, carly, daniel cameo

The designs are way too stupid, the faces are hideous chuds. Saris dad looks like a skunk.

i find it a bit hard to believe their ship was right next to a wharf and never found

i hope this means that from now on most series wont have the whole allspark theme, like armada stole and overused Unicron


i luv Nazi Blitzwing shouda called him blietzkrieg

[griffin]

Finally got to watch the whole thing from Youtube and save it for future reference.

Missed the Spike Carly Daniel cameo. I'll have to go back and find it.

The humour was well placed (it wasn't forced or imature), and as much as I'd like to see more included, it would probably ruin the more serious nature of the dark threat faced by the Autobots.

Speaking of which, I think the Autobots are probably a little too weak. A time will come when more Decepticons arrive, and these five Autobots aren't able to defeat a single Decepticon with their lack of effective weaponry. I think it is strange to have Bumblebee, the weakest, having the only laser weaponry (that I can recall).

Sari, is a necessary evil for the cartoon to relate to their target audience - 5 to 10 year olds. The Classics will be produced to keep us happy, so that Hasbro can focus a lot younger than usual with their core TF line.

I'm hoping that the key Sari has isn't a gimmick for the toys or some of them, in that it unlock or awakens them in some way. It might be an old gimmick, but it works with kiddies who want some power/control over their toys.

The Decepticons were a tease, with their short appearance, but unfortunately is necessary for the purpose of not overwhelming the much weaker Autobots, by having them all arrive at once and fight as a team.
Blitzwing looks to be the most interesting to look out for, with his multiple personality and revolving heads (like Man-E-Faces from MOTU). Blackarachnia's very calm and her beast mode is hinted at. Lockdown looks to rival Starscream and Megatron in terms of pure evil, and is apparently being voiced by Lance Henricson. Lugnutz is so far the least known, being a quiet, dumb brute.

Starscream and Megatron seem to act according to previous existing traits, so is a little boring. Megatron's head appears to be drawn to match the Movie Head, perhaps for familiarity with the current generation.

I noticed that Ultra Magnus is the supreme commander of the Autobots, while Optimus Prime is a lowly Autobot who appears to have been kicked out of the Autobot army.

Ratchet is a bit like Rhinox, old and wise, and picking up on Optimus when he makes the wrong decision.
Prowl starts off as an insubordinate Autobot, a bit like Rattrap, but looks to see the value of teamwork and working in the chain of command.
Bulkhead is a basic army grunt. Point him in the right direction and tell him what to do.
Bumblebee, maybe young and impulsive, or just a bit carefree, as one who has not been exposed to conflict before.

The Humans. Well, there's Sari, the 8ish year old girl who will be the Autobot's companion, and link to the audience. Her father, (mr) Sumdac is a rich (but surprisingly doesn't exert his wealth or power over others) manufacturer of robotics in Detroit, probably around 2050. It's explained that the massive advance in robotics and their distribution into all parts of society within only 50 years is due to Sumdac reverse engineering the salvaged parts of Megatron (who crashed to earth 50 years earlier).
Okay, similar idea to the movie, but I guess it's another familiarity concept for the current generation.
The other main human so far introduced is Captain Fanzone. Okay, I thought at first when I heard a character had that name, that he was some sort of superhero, but it is just the name of the police Captain of the Detroit Police.

Then there's the Allspark. It's basically the Matrix in its description by the characters and by what it does, however, the writers have decided to confuse the kiddies by calling it by the same name as the object in the movie, which was something totally different and had a different purpose.

And now, a quick rundown of the plot:
Optimus's team of Autobots are team of repairers of the Spacebridge network, and it is while they are clearing one access point of debris, that they find the lost ancient device known as the Allspark. It's power atracks the attention of the Decepticons, who are also considered lost and ancient, because they were chased off so long ago, they are almost considered a myth.
In the process of attacking the Autobots, Megatron is severly damaged by Starscream's treachery, and the Allspark uses the Spacebridge to transport the Autobots vessel to Earth's orbit. The Spacebridge explodes, causing the Decepticons to scatter, leaving Starscream alone on the Deceopticon ship.
The Autobot ship crashes to Earth, destroying Megatron in the process, who was kicked out of the ship while it was entering the atmosphere. The Autobots enter their stasis pods just moments before they splash into Lake Erie (off Detroit), and a boy on a farm goes out to investigate. He finds Megatron's Head in a crater.
Fifty years later, that boy has built up a business manufacturing robots for all of mankind, and one day in the labs, one of the robotic experiments gets out of control and threatens the city.
The Autobots are awakend, and defeat the threat, and in the process are labelled superheroes by the Humans.
Meanwhile, Starscream on the Decepticon ship, picks up an energy signal (probably from the Allspark), and goes to Earth.
He attacks the Autobots, demanding the Allspark, but they manage to eventually defeat him with the help of the Allspark. Half the city is destroyed, and Optimus is killed. Sari, who has a special key that absorbed some of the Allspark power (which no one seems to have figured out yet, because they think it is just something she already owned), brings Optimus back to life, and the Autobots go to repairing the city.
The 3-part episode ends revealing that Sumdac has the wrecked peices of Megatron in his tower, and feels guilt about having them (maybe he thinks he is responsible for the arrival of the others and the resulting chaos).

Overall, I wasn't overly impressed, but didn't think it sucked either. I got a few good laughs from it, so it rates better than Armada or Energon (which isn't difficult), but not as good as Beast Wars or Gen1.
I'm hoping that other characters are introduced regularly, even if it is just for an episode at a time. As interesting as this first story was, it will get boring real fast if we have just five weakling Autobots fighting crime and the occasional Decepticon for too long.
I recommend people at least watch this opening story.

[GoktimusPrime]

Watched it on YouTube - overall I liked it.

***This post contains spoilers***

I didn't think the animation was bad, but the art style is very cartoonish and parts of the animation is goofy (such as making their vehicle modes physically emote...(--;)) so I can understand why some people wouldn't be huge fans of the art/animation style. The transformation animation was mostly cheap... didn't like the whole "woosh woosh!" whirlwind transformation style. Then there's the over-the-top song and dance transformations that the Autobots had when they first appeared to fight that monster. Gah - had enough of that after seven years of Car Robot/RiD and Armadaverse... considering that this was an American-scripted show, was it really necessary? Thankfully it didn't happen every time someone transformed (which is more typical of what happens in the Japanese series). Some of the transformations were done well, like Starscream transforming in mid-air - that looked nice.

The story premise was interesting - like a futuristic version of the premise behind the live action movie where their recent technology is reverse-engineered by studying Megatron... and I liked the ending where the scientist (why do they always wear lab coats even when they're not working in a lab?!) expresses dread about his life's work from studying Megatron.

And although the story is overall aimed at kids, there were elements that were aimed at adults too. Not just G1 references, but lines which are definitely not aimed at kids, like Sari explaining sex to Optimus Prime. ;D

And I like the culture shock between the Autobots and humans as it reminds audiences that these robots are extra terrestrial aliens. It sounds agiven but a lot of writers (even Simon Furman and BW writers) often portray Transformers as being too earthly. It reminds me of the way Bob Budiansky used to portray Transformers as being other-worldly.

The G1 transformation noise was grossly overused. I don't mind them using it for actual transforming, but I didn't like how they were using it for everything... Bumblebee changes his hand to a tool/weapon - *krrk krrk krrk krrk krrk* - Optimus Prime puts on his face plate - *krrk krrk krrk krrk krrk* - Prowl scratches his butt - *krrk krrk krrk krrk krrk* SHUT UP!


The only real gripe I had was with the key that Sari has. It's too powerful and was used too much. And I don't like the message it's reinforcing to the kids that the current generation of teenagers -> early 20's has come to expect, that being that no matter how bad things go, or not your way, you'll always have a way to get off clean and scott-free. Consequences should be learnt, not get out of trouble for nothing.
I agree - although the G1 cartoon was even worse in portraying war as inconsequential. At least in Animated you see Transformers being hurt and killed (the instant wanton revival sucks) - there are no casualties. G1 was inconsistent - sometimes you'd have a Transformer brutally smashed only to be quickly revived, other times they would have to go to great lengths to repair them.

Omega Supreme nearly dies from a return flight from Cybertron. Optimus Prime nearly dies from a computer explosion and dies from sustaining multiple wounds in battle. Ultra Magnus is blown to pieces (in the G1 comic adaptation he is physically drawn and quartered by Sweeps) and the Junkions reassemble him like Lego(TM)! W T F ?!

Behold! Here's what's inside Sari's key!!

http://cache.gifts.com/photos/B/3/R/S/B3RSFTVANQHLG2VKADUU_L.jpg

[Robzy]

Ratchet is a bit like Rhinox, old and wise, and picking up on Optimus when he makes the wrong decision.
I also thought it was very similar to the relationship between Kup and Hotrod in the movie...


Prowl starts off as an insubordinate Autobot, a bit like Rattrap, but looks to see the value of teamwork and working in the chain of command.
I actually thought they should've made this character Mirage instead of Prowl! ;)

[roller]

i hate it how they dance around when transforming

[GoktimusPrime]

G1 Mirage doubts the Autobot cause (although this was never exploited in the G1 cartoon - there was one ep where Cliffjumper questions Mirage's loyalty for no apparent reason, but his doubts were utterly unproven) but Animated Prowl doesn't - he was just more of a loner in the beginning, more like G1 Snarl. But the difference is that Prowl learnt the value of teamwork by the end - and hopefully we'll see this character (and others) continuing to develop as the series progresses.

Character development was something that was sorely lacking in the G1 cartoon - for the most part, they remained static throughout, or they'll have random personality changes for one story to serve as a plot device e.g.: Cliffjumper's random aggressively hostile doubts against Mirage's loyalty... it disappeared by the end of that episode as mysteriously as it had appeared!

It's still early to tell how much character development will be in this series. Prowl's character development was similar to that of Slingshot's in "The Key To Vector Sigma" where his character evolved for that episode's story, but in Slingshot's case his character remained static after that.

I do hope that we'll see continuing character development as we saw in the G1 comics and Beast Wars/Beast Machines. Time will tell. ;)

Animated Ratchet is a combination of at least three G1 Autobots...
Crotchety old fart http://image.comicvine.com/uploads/item/42000/41962/113133-kup_150.jpg
+
Ambulance medic http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/b/b0/Ratchetg1cartoon.jpg/180px-Ratchetg1cartoon.jpg
+
Magnetic beams http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/c/c5/Windcharger_flash.jpg/250px-Windcharger_flash.jpg
= http://seibertron.com/images/news/cartoon_tfanimated_ratchet1.jpg
Ratchkupcharger!!

[Tober]

To me it was like watching a dumbed down version of Justice League. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing in itself.

The more organic flow of the animation was refreshing and worked well imo.

I don't think it's too much to hope for a developed story line. Afterall Black Arachnia is in there as a spider so maybe...

As for some comparisons to Justice League:

Optimus Prime - Superman moralistic heavy-hitter
Prowl - Batman stealth mystery man
Bumblebee - Flash annoying youngster
Ratchet - J'onn J'onzz ancient vetran
Bulkhead - Green Lantern he's green (ok, now I'm stretching...)
Wonderwoman - Arcee ?
Hawkgirl - Black Arachnia ?

Who are currently heroes serving the city.

I liked the triple change head for Blitzwing, but not the choice of accent. Then again with a name like Blitzwing :rolleyes:

[GoktimusPrime]

Personality(-ies)-wise Blitzwing reminds me of (Devil) Gigatron on Car Robot who had a different voice and personality in each of his 10 modes.

[springah]

You're all filthy pirates.

Also I have the DVD, haha

[1orion2many]

:eek:OMG it gets worse everytime I see this animated pile of Elephant DOO DOO! :(

[kup]

I watched it again. Since I knew what to expect I wasn't as dissapointed the second time and I think that I enjoyed it a bit more particularly at the very start and the Battle with Starscream. However all the bad points are still there such as the horrendous human animation and the 'City Super heroes' crap right after they awaken from stasis. The Nanotech bug monster thing battle didn't seem as long this time around but it was still dull.

The Human character's animation and style are awful, particularly at the robot factory tour and the park, the backgrounds are MASSIVELY cheap. After watching the first part in space and then Earth, there is a huge contrast where you notice the really cheap animation as if the first part (finding the Allspark/Megatron attack) was made by a different animation studio and a budget one took over when they reached Earth.

The Battle with Starscream is the saving grace of this first episode although it ends in a very cliche sort of way. If it wasn't for the Starscream battle this episode would have sucked royally as the battle had good pacing and Tom Kenny does an excellent Starscream (although I can still hear Sponge Bob in there :P ).

I don't see anything at the level that the US fans are raving about and its not better than G1 and certainly well below Beast Wars. Beast Wars showed thaty it had maturity and quality right off the bat in the first episode. First time I saw Beast Wars I was very skeptical and came out feeling good, I am not getting the same vibe here.

The comics would have been an opportunity to make it better but unfortunately they follow the TV show line by line.

I still think its alright, possibly better than the Unicron trilogy (although I enjoyed the Unicron Battles part of Armada better than this) but not much better. I still like G1, Beast Wars a lot more and as much as I dislike Beast Machines, I have to say that BM is of a superior quality than Animated.

I see nothing here that would motivate me to collect the toys just as I don't collect from RID and the Unicron Trilogy.
________
Yamaha V8 Engine (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Ford_Yamaha_V8_engine)

[The_Damned]

hmm i first saw it i hated it but as it proved with the movie when i actually watched it i enjoyed it and will now have to waste my money on the toys:(
ohwell hopefully it will be a little while b4 the toys come out.

does anyone know when the next episodes are out?

[GoktimusPrime]

A lot of people enjoyed collecting CR/RiD in spite of not necessarily being fans of the show (the show isn't bad for its intended audience mind you) - it did give us some awesome figures which inspired Binaltech. ;)


The comics would have been an opportunity to make it better but unfortunately they follow the TV show line by line.
Really? That's really disappointing... I've come to rely on the comics giving me a better alternative over the cartoon since the beginning of G1.

Time Wars (G1)http://www.tfarchive.com/comics/marvel/covers/uk199.jpghttp://www.tfarchive.com/comics/dreamwave/guide/covers/armada14.jpgWorlds Collide saga (Armada)

[kup]

I am a fiction driven collector. Although I apreciate quality and design in toys, it is not what drives me to buy them and collect them. Good fiction and characterisation is what drives me to buy toylines.
________
FREE XXXMOVIES (http://www.fucktube.com/)

[omega3]

i enjoyed it up until the humans came in liked the unicron saga a lot better though

[GoktimusPrime]

I love Roller's description of the professor as a skunk. *rofflez*

[Saintly]

hmm i first saw it i hated it but as it proved with the movie when i actually watched it i enjoyed it and will now have to waste my money on the toys:(
ohwell hopefully it will be a little while b4 the toys come out.

does anyone know when the next episodes are out?

The cartoon network has a schedule on their website... http://schedule.cartoonnetwork.com/xmlServices/ScheduleServices?methodName=mainSchedule&showId=326755&title=Transformers%20Animated&name=Transformers%20Animated&timezone=EST

And so does TV.com -> http://www.tv.com/transformers-animated/show/74991/episode_listings.html?om_act=convert&om_clk=episodessh&tag=episodes;more

[Fizzer]

I saw this hour special this morning and im already growing fond of a few
characters i love Megatron so dark and powerfull and bulk head well he is
awesome love him heaps, starscream so dumb as usual but with a different
sense of style i like, it is a change from the 1st g1 series but hey new era
now means new era of Transformers i say bring on the new line of shows
and toys cant wait.

[G1Optimal]

Missed the Spike Carly Daniel cameo. I'll have to go back and find it.



Hope you found it....

if not it was on the 3rd part at time index 2:46-2:48. :)

[GoktimusPrime]

So is this going to show in Australia on Cartoon Network only?? I hope not... they made the mistake of showing Transformers exclusively on pay TV with Beast Machines (with a crap time slot) and that just didn't go down well. :/

[kup]

There is a good chance that it will show on Toasted TV but even if it does it will be on at stupid times such as 6am on a Saturday morning and on top of that they would likely treat it like all previous cartoons in the way that they spontaneously change the timeslot without warning or get rid of the cartoon midway through a season only to resume it over a year later.

For Free to Air, Toasted TV is unfortunately the only choice for non ABC type cartoons. When I first arrived in Australia at the age of ten, Cartoons in Australia were already lackluster when it comes to Broadcast but you had saving graces such as Agro's cartoon connection and the Original Cheez TV. Unfortunately these days the only choice is the crapstacular Toasted TV for free to air cartoons.
________
Bmw M40 (http://www.bmw-tech.org/wiki/BMW_M40)

[Saintly]

you don't have to rely on Free-to-air TV anymore when you have the internet.

a semi-related news -> http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=341508

[i_amtrunks]

loved it, the animation style is not the best, and I certainly would not have picked it myself, but it has grown on me.

Not too fond of the human characters (The Police Captain Fanzone really gives me "chief" from Inspector Gadget vibes).

Bumblebee and Bulkhead did not grate me as much as I thought that they would, and Prowl was...different.

Ratchet was pure Awesomesauce though, so much character crammed into his few appearances, the Movie people need to learn from the Animated people on how to get secondary characters characterization.

Voice Acting work is fantastic, even BA was decent, even though her VA sounds the same every single time.

Cant wait for the 5th for episode 2!

[Bartrim]

The cartoon network has a schedule on their website... http://schedule.cartoonnetwork.com/xmlServices/ScheduleServices?methodName=mainSchedule&showId=326755&title=Transformers%20Animated&name=Transformers%20Animated&timezone=EST

And so does TV.com -> http://www.tv.com/transformers-animated/show/74991/episode_listings.html?om_act=convert&om_clk=episodessh&tag=episodes;more

Thats not for cartoon network australia is it?

[Saintly]

Thats not for cartoon network australia is it?

nope.. it's for the US...

Animated isn't screening here yet -> http://www.cartoonnetwork.com.au/jsp/allshows/index.jsp

[roller]

I cant wait for an animated movie, where they knock off all the old characters to make way for another years toys-a winning formula that cant fail, right Hasbro?!

Wheres Saris mum? Why is sari named after clothing?

[GoktimusPrime]

Hehehe... they should have a scene where she's wearing a sari. ;)

Maybe she's related to Bulma's family (the ones that own Capsule Corp in Dragonball Zed) where everyone is named after some item of clothing (and the Saiyajin are named after vegetables :p)

http://www.edu.aytolacoruna.es/design/plain/images/avatares/Bulma.jpg Bulma http://www.weplay.com/cheerleading/bloomers/bloomer.jpg

http://www.forumsextreme.com/imgs1/Avatars_DragonBall_Trunks.jpg Trunks http://www.spongebob-squarepants.co.uk/wp-content/imgu/SpongeBobSwimTrunks.jpg

http://www.absoluteanime.com/dragon_ball/bra.jpg Bra http://expertscorner.lussori.com/wp-content/images/victoria-secret.jpg

http://www.projectbag.com/dbz/namek/pics/drbriefsmini.gif Brief http://www.savingadvice.com/images/blog/hello-kitty-briefs.jpg

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/2/2f/Sari_Animated.JPG/150px-Sari_Animated.JPG Sari http://anvil.unl.edu/keep/images/complete6.JPG

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/0/08/IsaacSumdacModel.jpg/150px-IsaacSumdacModel.jpg Isaac http://www.daniweb.com/forums/techtalk-images/avatars/Looney%20Tunes/Pepe%20Le%20Pew.gif

[i_amtrunks]

Someone somewhere had a brainwave about Sumdac=Cadmus...

I figured since Sumdac and Sari look Indian, that they were given Indian sounding names on purpose.

[GoktimusPrime]

Even though Isaac is a Hebrew name and 'sari' isn't even really a name (it makes as much sense as calling someone Trunks or Bra :p)

[Bartrim]

Overall I enjoyed it and even though there were aspects I didn't like, I will watch the whole series. I'm sure if I'll buy any of the toys yet. I can see alot of potential in Blitzwing. Even though he only had a couple of lines I thought he was pretty cool.

I did have a laugh when Sari explained to Optimus Prime how they make the little organics. Although I thought it was a bit wrong that an 8 year old knows about the birds and the bees.

[1orion2many]

:(Well I took the plunge and managed to watch the whole thing on youtube, that's 1 1/2 hours of my life I'll never get back:eek:. It went from bad to worse as far as I'm concerned, we went from cheap animation to even cheaper crappier characters as soon as the humans started appearing, I don't suppose Bulkhead wants to sit on Sari by any chance as this would put both her and me out of our misery:p:D.

[Saintly]

I haven't watched it yet :/ Though I'll get around to it!

Next episode should show up at your favourite non-TF internet site on the 6th of Jan... usually takes a few hours for the rippers to upload.

[Hereticpoo]

Its not as bad as I thought it would be. Remember its aimed at 10 yr olds, and its a toy commercial. I like how all the characters contribute to the story with their own 'personalities'. Unlike G1, where it was all 'What now prime' and "What is your command Megatron'. I love G1 and at the time it was great, but for a whole bunch of kids this is the transformers that in 20 years will spawn Masterpiece Animated Bumblebee and KO Animated Primes and repaints, repaints and repaints. I think its good for todays kids, but I'm still happy with G1, primes disappearing trailer and all! :)

[1orion2many]

:eek:The thought of this cartoon spawning a Masterpiece really scares me:eek:. I am stupid enough to buy the toys from this line but mainly because they are Transformers and not because I think they are anything brilliant. I may change my mind about the toys once I get my hands on them but as for the cartoon, I have a white porcelain thing I sit on which is where it should be flushed:p:D.

[kup]

Its not as bad as I thought it would be. Remember its aimed at 10 yr olds, and its a toy commercial. I like how all the characters contribute to the story with their own 'personalities'. Unlike G1, where it was all 'What now prime' and "What is your command Megatron'. I love G1 and at the time it was great, but for a whole bunch of kids this is the transformers that in 20 years will spawn Masterpiece Animated Bumblebee and KO Animated Primes and repaints, repaints and repaints. I think its good for todays kids, but I'm still happy with G1, primes disappearing trailer and all! :)

At this point in time, I seriously doubt that this cartoon will have any more impact than Armada, Energon or Cybertron in 20 years time.

Its pointless to say that something is good because it is better than a 20 year old cartoon. The point here is to move forwards not backwards. The Animation of this show is atrocious to say the least and although it has good story aspects to it, it is yet to balance out with the bad aspects in my opinion.

It is still considerably inferior to previous much older cartoons and that is a disappointment to me. Just because it seems better than the post 2001 TF cartoons doesn't immediately mean that its good.

That's how I see it.
________
Amc amx (http://www.dodge-wiki.com/wiki/AMC_AMX)

[liegeprime]

saw it on you tube... im waiting for the toys.. especially the Jay Leno Starscream - hope the toys have the gimmicks of their weapons like in bulkheads case that wrecker ball. Wonder what scale will the toys be? - Bumblebee - scout no doubt. One thing Ive noticed though Hasbro seemed to be enjoying using the Gorilla model lately for its characters -e.g. Cyb. Crumplezone - well it works anyway no argument from me there, I like it. Hope they make a decent Arcee - if there will be one. Anyways Im buying the toys hehehe. Sigh I'll need another set of shelves :( elae id be cropping the TFs again on the existing ones hmmmmm

[GoktimusPrime]

especially the Jay Leno Starscream
Wahahahahaha! :D

[Borgeman]

just looked at screamers face again - his expression is similar to those of the units in Team Fortress 2 :D

George

[Hereticpoo]

At this point in time, I seriously doubt that this cartoon will have any more impact than Armada, Energon or Cybertron in 20 years time.

Its pointless to say that something is good because it is better than a 20 year old cartoon. The point here is to move forwards not backwards. The Animation of this show is atrocious to say the least and although it has good story aspects to it, it is yet to balance out with the bad aspects in my opinion.

It is still considerably inferior to previous much older cartoons and that is a disappointment to me. Just because it seems better than the post 2001 TF cartoons doesn't immediately mean that its good.

That's how I see it.


Pointless? I think waiting for Hasbro to move G1 forward is pointless. What cartoons are you thinking of? Robotech/Macross, The Incredible Hulk? I like that Megatron, the most powerfull weapon in the Universe, doesn't shrink into a pea shooter. I like the lack of anime 'magic'. In the 1986 TF movie Devastator is standing full height in the back of Astrotrain. In the G1 cartoons Omega Supreme's arm flies to Cybertron in Rocket mode, and his body is magically waiting for him. In the 86 movie Megatron rides in to kill Starscream sitting in Cyclonus, then in bot mode they are the same size.

I agree with Marty Isenberg, the current story editor;

"So let the old timers wail, drape themselves in ash and sackcloth. This Transformers, as Isenberg noted, is not for them. And I get the feeling it will do quite well with its own generation of fans. "

(Article link: http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=140125 )

[Robzy]

"So let the old timers wail, drape themselves in ash and sackcloth. This Transformers, as Isenberg noted, is not for them. And I get the feeling it will do quite well with its own generation of fans. "

What I find particularly funny is how similar Transformers Animated is to the "Challenge of the GoBots" series!

For example, the show is essentially about a small core unit of friendly "guardians" protecting earth (with humans fully aware of that) from danger/evil. They have very cartoonish faces (including eyeballs of sorts) and cartoony designs. They also 'emote' in their vehicular modes like the GoBots did - Bumblebee's arms for example.

Also, they all transform in to vehicles (like GoBots) with nary an objectformer (or "Real Gear" :rolleyes:) in sight!

Leader-1 was a young leader who had big aspirations. He felt he had more to offer, and made rash (and not always good) decisions. Animated Optimus seems very similar... he doesn't have the "authority" of G1 Prime! Bumblebee is the cute human sidekick (Scooter), Bulkhead is the big loveable oaf (Turbo), and Ratchet and Prowl remind me of several characters... Zeemon and Heatseeker/Royal-T respectively. Also, Prime is not in charge (neither was Leader-1) - they both answer to superiors!

And the baddies are similar too... Starscream displayed characteristics of a blend of Cy-Kill and Fitor... lots of grandstanding and treachery, but then Starscream has always been like that, so I guess it's okay! Blackarchnia was sassy like Crasher (sans the laughing), and Lugnut was the big dumb brute (Cop-Tur). At least Blitzwing and Megatron were unique!

For many years a lot of Transformers fans absolutely panned GoBots - and now, particularly in the US, they are lapping up a similar concept! And worse... they're calling it "new"!

[dirge]

Maybe no impact to you, but this has the makings of g1 for this generation, and I think you seriously have forgotten that.


There's no way this is the "G1 for this generation". It's just another Transformers cartoon. The G1 of today - if anything - is the live action movie. Animated does not highlight the whole "robots in disguise" that defines Transformers - and ultimately, is reason why the concept has thrived. The live action film - and G1 - gave us alternate modes which allowed the Transformers to hide on Earth. Yes, G1 did that within the boundaries of cartoons at the time, which wasn't perfect, but there were numerous examples of the Transformers fooling humans with their alt modes - and examples of Transformers mistaking cars for Autobots.



Animation atrocious? Give me a break. Your precious beast wars had worse cgi than the last starfighter, and looked like candy land.


Keep in mind that - for the time - Beast Wars used state of the art cartoon animation techniques, and Reboot was the only previous cartoon which had tried full CGI. Beast Wars was pushing boundaries in animation for 1996. Of course, CGI animation has improved with computing power. Is Animated using cutting edge animation techniques? That's the comparison you should be making.


I like the lack of anime 'magic'.

But then, this is a cartoon which doesn't even try to ground itself in reality. Everything is stylised. The alternate modes are expressive. What you're referring to is the concept of cartoon physics, which has been a common theme of almost every Transformers series from G1 through to Armada (and that teleport thing the Autobots would use), although Beast Wars & Beast Machines made an effort to avoid it. The emotive alternate modes take this cartoon away from the concept of Robots In Disguise far more than mass shifting in G1 or the teleporting which was so prevalent in Armada.

The thing that really strikes me about Animated is how drastic a change of direction this represents, from Classics, Cybertron and _especially_ the live action movie. The Movie has done tremendously well, and the toys have flown off the shelves. Hasbro has basically taken this success and thrown it away by following up with a Transformers concept that is entirely different and is _not_ incorporating the strengths of the film - and associated toyline - at all. Whether or not it's a good cartoon (or good toys), it's not a the ideal followup to the film.

[GoktimusPrime]

I agree. I was really hoping that the follow-up cartoon would take cues from the movie, much like the Batman and Spiderman animated series which came after those respective movies.

Hereticpoo: Hasbro doesn't particularly care about advancing the G1 story line or not - they just want the toys to sell. It's up to the writers as to whether or not they want to advance the story. That's kinda what happened with Beast Wars - Hasbro initially just released those toys with a lame background story about how the Transformers became animals. Mainframe were like, "yeah okay, let's try something new" and the rest is history. The problem with Beast Machines is that it boxed itself into a corner with its ending It is possible to continue from Beast Machines, but it sure wouldn't be easy.

Another possibility would be to insert the new series into some other existing time era... like post-G2/pre-BW. I would love for a new series to detail the final stages of the Great Autobot-Decepticon War, leading to the decisive defeat of the Decepticons - and you could even have a second season detailing the early years after Pax Cybertronia... the whole cultural shift and clean up ... the rise of the Maximals and Predacons, with the Maximals establishing political dominance on Cybertron leaving the Predacons feeling politically under-represented and somewhat 'oppressed'... and uncomfortable era of 'peace' like the former Soviet Union with feelings of dissent that would one day lead to the Beast Wars.

A story reboot isn't necessarily bad, but it needs to be done right. Armada rebooted continuity and I didn't think it was done that well. Animated is another reboot and I thought the first ep was okay... but still early days. :/

[1orion2many]

Maybe no impact to you, but this has the makings of g1 for this generation, and I think you seriously have forgotten that.

Animation atrocious? Give me a break. Your precious beast wars had worse cgi than the last starfighter, and looked like candy land.

And your "point" seems hypocritical when you're the one living in the past. :p

:confused: I actually liked BW and didn't think the CGI was bad, you must remember it is now about 12 years old, what other full CGI cartoon series was around at the same time which made it look lame:confused: also the last Star Fighter would of had a larger budget to make thier CGI if you are comparing both inflation and the amount of time that it was actually showing and yes I know the LSF is a lot older than BW's. I personally liked the CGI in BW better than Cybertron. You believe this has the makings of G1 for this generation, I'm not going to dispute you because we will not know for sure for another 20 years. My one real question about the TF animated cartoon is why couldn't they make it in the same quality as the Japanese Anime instead of the cheap style they have chosen, I accept that you like this style of cartoon or at least that is what it sounds like where as I completely detest this cartoon style, the storyline wasn't what I would have liked to see either as I do not believe you need such lame human characters unless of course they are trying to make the TF characters look stronger than what they actually are and yes I know they seem to have a lot of lame human characters in the previous series as well but they are getting worse with each series released. :eek:OMG I'm turning into a grumpy old man:eek::p:D

[kup]

Like I said earlier MV75, The point is to move forwards not backwards. As mentioned by a couple of people already, Beast Wars was state of the art when it was released and even won an Emmy Award for it. Beast Wars still has arguably better Animation than this when it comes to quality and considering the limitations of the past as you so bluntly put it; they still did an awesome job of it. This new cartoon smacks of cheapness despite the style and looks like everything else on cartoon network, nothing really makes it stand out and feels of a much lesser quality than Beast Wars despite the differen styles of animation. Beast Wars may have aged somewhat in the last decade, but f**k! it looked freaking awesome back in its day. Animated does not when I can look at a 20 year old cartoon (such as Masterforce) and see that it has a distinctly higher quality of Animation and character design than this new cartoon. Animated simply has no excuse.

Now, in that context lets look at G1. What did we have at the time G1 was released? We had Gobots, Scooby Doo, Smurfs, Masters of the Universe, etc.

Heck Yeah! G1 had fantastic and innovative animation compared to most of the cartoons of its time and I remember being blown away as a kid by the more realistic style and animation despite the numerous errors.

Let's see what's so inovative about this new cartoon: Nothing. It looks just like everything else that's on cartoon network.

Your argument is seriously flawed MV75. I respect that you like Animated and that in your view its the "G1 of this generation" but its not enough for you to say you like it, you have to back that up with some critical argument if you are willing to put forth such a statement.
________
1958 DODGE (http://www.dodge-wiki.com/wiki/1958_Dodge)

[GoktimusPrime]

The Last Starfighter (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-IH4v25yOs) wasn't completely CGI rendered - it also include actual photography of things actors, location backgrounds, painted matte backgrounds, miniature models etc. Beast Wars on the other hand was entirely CGI animated. And yeah, TLS had a movie budget whereas Beast Wars had a cartoon series budget - a budget which was cut for seasons 2 and 3 and yet the CG got better in spite of having less money (although admittedly seasons 2 and 3 had less episodes).

While I don't think the animation in Animated is necessarily bad, I would agree that it's not terribly innovative either. And there are elements of it which are just too cartoony for comfort and seem to dumb the show down - like how the Autobots can emote in vehicle mode... that works really well in a movie like Disney/Pixar's Cars, but doesn't suit Transformers IMO.

A Transformer should not be emoting in vehicle mode like this http://www.speedwayphoto.net/junkyard/images/tow_mater.jpg

PS: Beast Wars did indeed win an Emmy Award for "best special effects in an animated television series."

[dirge]

And how far will the live action movie go against animated? 1 movie compared to several seasons, and then two years later one more movie, etc.


It's a much stronger continuity reboot, and for me is more likely to stand the test of time as a landmark in the history of Transformers. Okay, it had a much bigger budget, but it still presents a more memorable Transformers story.



But that'll probably only be an american problem as we'll probably get the series shown here in 4-6 months time, which is the perfect timing.


...but the momentum generated by the movie still falls flat, because this series has almost nothing to do with it, aside from obviously being Transformers.



To say it's atrocous now is kidding yourself. Give it another 12 years then call it bad. :P


I never said that, you were the one calling Beast Wars a badly animated series. I have not expressed an opinion on the quality of the animation, merely the style. Don't falsely accuse others of things they haven't done when you've already done the same thing yourself.



Alternative modes expressive?


I am referring to the fact that these vehicles smile and such. Not much of a disguise. I'm generally not a fan of Transformers that don't transform into something that doesn't pass as an actual disguise. That's not to say I don't like some of them - I loved Transmetal Cheetor - but entire series is filled with Herbie The Love Bug analogues. Not something I want to see.

[GoktimusPrime]

Another thing that limits the appeal of these Transformers is that they're transforming from stylised robots into stylised vehicles which is less creative than transforming from a pre-defined alt mode like a licensed vehicle or existing animal - something realistic looking.

That's not to say that stylised unrealistic alt modes are bad, as dirge pointed out the Transmetals are considered cool by a lot of fans (although they weren't popular in Japan - hence the reversion to more realistic beast modes in Beast Wars Neo), but it is more challenging to engineer a cool stylised robot out of a pre-defined alt mode like a Dodge Viper, Peterbilt, F-22 et al.

The first 2-3 years of G1 were the most popular because that was when the line was still dominated by realistic alt modes like the Datsun Fairlady ZX, Porsche 935 Turbo, F-15 Eagle, Volkswagen Beetle, Lamborghini Countach, Walther P-38 (whose realism has been a continual legal dilemma!) et al. Some fans are only interested in this era - e.g. heroic decepticon. 1986/7 onward saw a significant increase in non-realistic "futuristic" or "Cybertronian" alt modes - e.g.: Headmasters, Targetmasters, Technobots et al.

After that era, interest in G1 dwindled - evidenced by the fact that the G1 cartoon was cancelled after only 3 eps of Season 4 in 1987.

Beast Wars of course breathed new life into Transformers starting off with reasonably realistic beast modes (a theme expanded on in Beast Wars II and Neo).

Car Robot (RiD) was immensely popular amongst collectors despite the fact that the TV show was targeted at a very young audience - and many collectors were getting CR figures long before Hasbro brought out RiD so it was already popular amongst non Japanese speaking fans who didn't necessarily have access to the show.

Armadaverse went back to not so realistic "futuristic" vehicles but then Car Robot's influence went and gave birth to Binaltech (and in turn Alternators) which was incredibly popular with collectors despite not having a TV show - and in the case of Alternators, no supportive fiction at all!

Part of the appeal of the movie Transformers is that (with the exceptions of Scorponok who isn't really a proper Transformer in the movie but a remote drone deployed by Blackout, and Megatron whose circumstances didn't see him acquiring an Earth mode) they have realistic looking vehicle modes.

Movie Bumblebee is a sexy 2008/9 Concept Camaro muscle car which helped Sam get some boo-tay. Animated Bumblebee is some non-descript hatchback who plays seatbelt wrestling with a little girl who probably soiled her seat.

[kup]

Your precious beast wars had worse cgi than the last starfighter, and looked like candy land.



I am sorry but this post did drive the discussion into personal territory as it felt more hostile than anything else discussed, positive or negative.

Also keep in mind that I may have expressed my views on animated a few times on this board but I have always backed it up with descriptions on why I thought something didn't work for me and also happened to mentioned the positive things that did.

Now lets put this behind us and continue a proper discussion on what we think of animated.
________
Vapor (http://vaporizer.org/)

[Borgeman]

bloody hell, waaaay too many angry/serious/omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad people here :p

seriously though, i think i need to hand out some chill pills/weed to you guys.... ;)

George

[dirge]

bloody hell, waaaay too many angry/serious/omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad people here :p


Hey, I'm not angry. I dislike Animated, but I'm fine with that - it gives me time to focus on G1 again. Maybe even Masterforce (which has some ridiculously rare toys like Minerva) :)

I don't appreciate people throwing accusations around without checking their facts, but ultimately that only hurts their own case :eek:

[Borgeman]

no you're not, you're omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad

see, im not being personal cause everyone here fits into that statement of mine - HA!

:p

George

[dirge]

no you're not, you're omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad


Hey at least I don't buy them, sell everything off, buy again, sell it all off.. ad nauseum :p

[llamatron]

did indeed win an Emmy Award for "best special effects in an animated television series."

Here comes super correction nerd to the rescue...


The achievement in animation Emmy award was presented to Clyde Klotz, production designer for "Beast Wars,"

Super correction nerd, away! Off to fight another day...

[Tiby]

Hey everyone, I think we need to be thankful that the TF universe is so varied and widespread, with a common theme (being able to transform!). There is something here for everyone.

From realistic licensed vehicles to a zoo of animals to household appliances, from super civil wars to interstellar exploration to the meaning of life, from life to love to death to rebirth, from sacrifice to betrayal to cowardice, Transformers has it all!

The fact that we have 7 pages already dedicated to a new chapter of TFs is wonderful! So many people from different parts of Australia (and NZ!) and from different backgrounds have come together through this.

Not eveyone likes the same food, but it doesn't stop you going to dinner with friends does it?

[The_Damned]

i always thought the beast wars cartoon was absurd!!!:p:D.....

[dirge]

I don't mind that others appreciate Animated. Personally, I don't like the style & direction, but I don't expect others to have to dislike it because I do
(:

[GoktimusPrime]

Overall I do like what I've seen of the Animated show and pics of the toys online - I might change my mind later when I see more of the series and actually see the toys for myself, but so far I'm pretty happy with what I'm seeing.

Having said that, I can understand how the show and toyline's may not appeal to other people. I personally don't mind the idea of stylised fantasy alt modes, so long as they're done right. Personally I like my realistic and fantasy alt moded Transformers, but we can see how more realistic alt modes have historically had a broader appeal.

And although I did enjoy what I've seen of the show, to me the animation style isn't overwhelming me with awe (unlike say Macross Plus or Ghost In The Shell Stand Alone Complex) and I personally really dislike how the Autobots physically emote in vehicle mode.


i always thought the beast wars cartoon was absurd!!!
...any particular reason why?

[TheDirtyDigger]

My personally opinionated review:


-Has decent moments of TF action.

-Humans and their animation suck.

-Wish it was targeted at an older audience. Too kiddy for me to take seriously and not as good as Teen Titans and nowhere near close to the brilliance that was the Justice League cartoon.

-80% chance of me getting the toys at this stage. Like Gok I don't mind stylized alt modes but personally do prefer realistic ones.

-Overall 2 and a half stars (out of 5)

[kup]

Since we are giving Stars, I will also give it 2/5 stars:

Positives:
+ Attempts at character development
+ Attempts at providing an initial story arc with good action thrown in at the end.

Negatives:
- Cheap animation and character design
- Too kiddy and the style may suit Fairly Odd parents or Power Puff girls but it doesn't suit Transformers.
- Uninspired and at times dull overall plot. A Generic 'Super Hero' plot that doesn't totally suit Transformers and feels more like capitalizing on the Super hero craze.
________
Dc medical marijuana dispensaries (http://dc.dispensaries.org/)

[GoktimusPrime]

I like how Animated expanded on the idea from the movie about human technology being reverse engineered from Megatron - but it feels a bit more sinister here with all these people living in this Asimov society surrounded by robots all spawned from Megatron (at least technologically). That final line with the professor praying for forgiveness was really cool as it does lend a dark underpinning tone to the series. I'm hoping that this will have repurcussions in upcoming eps...

http://archives.umc.org/uploads/images/myspirit_movie_irobot_2.jpg "I just hate it when these things turn evil and attack all humans!"

[kup]

It would not be so bad if they actually emphasised on that story arc more than the Super hero plot. My favorite parts of Animated plot wise were the very start and the end with the Starscream battle and the Professor with the Megatron head.

If they had gotten rid of the middle part with the nanotech bug monster and the Super hero parts (fire rescue, park, ceremony) I would have a much higher opinion of the plot despite my issues with the animation. I found that middle part so dull (and it was a huge portion of the story) that it ruined it for me.

It has been repeatedly said that the regular episodes will focus more on the Super Hero aspects than the Decepticons or progressing story arcs and that is my main issue when it comes to the plot pacing of the show. I honestly hope that this is inaccurate but the plot of this premiere episode clearly points that they are heading in that direction.

Although the dark aspects of the show do have a lot of potential it is very hard to take them seriously when the following scene will likely involve a smiling car or a kid that looks like Timmy from Fairly Odd Parents:http://gba-video.majescoentertainment.com/images/catalog/ncv3/FairlyOddParents.jpg
________
Xr200 (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Honda_XR200)

[GoktimusPrime]

It certainly is very different from the G1 comics where humans largely feared the Transformers and the US government and military even formed special divisions to hunt them down (I.I.I. and R.A.A.T.) - most humans were unaware of the the distinction between Autobots and Decepticons... even Spiderman and G.I. Joe were initially wary of all Transformers and attacked Autobots when they first encountered them (although I think that G.I.Joe were damn lucky that Superion got recalled by Blaster... he would've seriously kicked the crap out of them if that fight had been allowed to continue! ;D) - although it was neat how the humans eventually became allies of the Autobots, it was an arduous process and they were never publicly decorated heroes. It was more like the movie where they formed an alliance of convenience against a common foe (Decepticons) but we never saw parades or ceremonies for them. If they did, you'd know that there would be anti-Transformer terrorists like Circuit Breaker going after them.

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/6/60/Triple-iboardroom.jpg
I.I.I. ("Triple-I"; Intelligence and Information Institute), the original Sector Seven, but with way more power since they have their own top secret division of the U.S. military known as the R.A.A.T. (Rapid Anti-Robot Assault Team). That scene where Agent Simmons was staring down the barrel of Captain Lennox's gun - that would never have happened with Colonel Walter Barnett!!

[kup]

I have just watched the next episode of Animated. I have to say that I enjoyed it much more than the first although the very start of it was stupid with the Archer character. Thankfully that only lasted for a couple of minutes.

Although it still had very kiddy elements and the TFs are continually regarded as celebrity heroes by the overall human community (robot paparatzis chasing them), the plot was overall better handled.

*Spoilers*



It focused on Megatron becoming concious and using the limited resources that were avaliable to him (due to his lack of body) to seek out the Allspark and destroy the Autobots. The focus was mainly on this and that's why the show felt more enjoyable despite the secondary plot of Sari's slumber party with the autobots and teaching them how to play Twister (yes, you heard right).

Prowl's character development was nicely done and well executed. From being a generic ninja with attitude, he is becoming a bit of a Beachcomber with his admiration and respect of nature. He has developed depth of character which also help to give the show also more depth and quality in its storytelling.

The show became more enjoyable when I went into a mindset that I was watching more of a Super Hero Team show than Transformers. In fact, several scenes reminded me more of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles in the way that the 'Bots interacted with one another.

Looks like this show has the potential for me to enjoy if I go into a similar mindset that I did with Beast Machines, as in treat it as its own show rather than part of the Transformers franchise. Its more Super Hero team than Transformers anyway and that is how I will watch it.

This show its definetly falling into the Beast Machines category of 'good show, but doesn't feel like Transformers' but it is definitely reaching a higher quality than the recent Japanese cartoons.

I am so glad that the Angry Archer crap only lasted less than 5 mins :D
________
Chevrolet Van Specifications (http://www.chevy-wiki.com/wiki/Chevrolet_Van)

[liegeprime]

I just watched it ( 2nd episode) on youtube.... angry archer indeeed, a ripoff of DC's green arrow (do I hear lawsuit ringing, hehehehe), good thing its less than 5 min as you said kup. Having watched this 2nd episode makes me want the toys even more... can't wait! I'm more interested in the toys than the show anyway.

[Gutsman Heavy]

I think it was great that they dedicated most of the episode to fleshing out Prowl, in the "movie" he got neglected and I found him boring as hell, but now he's really sprung up as a character, I had no interest in getting his figure but now I do, so I guess it succeeded as a toy ad :)

[kup]

Yeah, there is a definite higher level of quality in the script of this new episode than the 'movie' one. Its less generic and its good to see that they are fleshing out a character that originally had the potential to be the most boring and annoying if not developed.

Some things still annoy me like how Prowl's room looks like a Samurai dojo when he is supposed to be an Alien with little knowledge of Earth culture but this is very minor. The Sari slumber party thing was also unsettling but it didn't dominate the core of the overall plot although it served to provided the setting and circumstances which is why I could deal with it.

A nice episode overall and a head above the first 'movie' one. Still not enough to change my mind about the series or collecting toys but definitly a step in the right direction. I hope that they continue to concentrate more on Transformers aspects than Super hero ones for future episodes.
________
Masturbation Shower (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/759/shower/videos/1)

[GoktimusPrime]

I just watched ep2 and yeah, it's a lot better than ep1!

The Angry Archer character sh**s me to no end. With the sole exception of Circuit Breaker (I'm not counting Cobra Commander because he's not really a Transformers character), human villains in Transformers have always been terrible... The Robot Master (although he wasn't a true villain, but still extremely lame), The Mechanic, Lord Chumley, the Roadjammers... gah... we can lump the Angry Archer in that basket of atrocious human villains whom we'd all rather soon forget. But thankfully he only lasted for a few minutes, if only Wheelie lasted that long in G1S3 :p And his attempt at speaking in Shakespearean prose was kinda cute (not enough to redeem the character though).

But aside from that, I really enjoyed the episode. When I first heard that Prowl was going to be a martial artist, I shuddered because "martial arts" is almost always screwed up in shows, movies etc. - in short, I thought he'd be an Autobot ninja turtle. But I like how they focused on the philosophical aspects of martial arts, and it was done well too. In the Martial Arts discussion thread (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=129) we recently discussed the notion of binary logic in fighting, which is often expressed in through Yin Yang and Ba Gua in Chinese martial arts (and other Asian martial arts influenced by China), so from that perspective I really liked how in this episode Prowl demonstrated the application of binary logic based combat. In this case, Yin (0) = stillness and Yang (1) = motion; and it was only through a sequential cyclical combination of both extremes was he and Bumblebee able to allow the Autobots to win.

We've never seen this level of practical martial arts philosophy in Transformers before. Not in Bugly, Bludgeon, Banzaitron or Dinobot! And best of all, it really makes Prowl actually earn his namesake! Let's face it, G1 Prowl never really did much prowling...

So yeah, right now Prowl is my favourite Animated character. :)

I didn't mind the idea of Sari's slumber party. It's part of her trying to initiate the Autobots into human culture, which they obviously find baffling - and this is cool. As I mentioned before, even Bob Forward, Larry DiTillio and Simon Furman often made the mistake of portraying the Transformers as being too earthly. I like how Isenberg is portraying the Transformers as being otherworldly - something I haven't seen done so well since the days of Bob Budiansky. The Twister game served as a simple demonstration of the episode's Yin/Yang theme - which is needed to engage a younger audience. Remember that Beast Machines totally ran off philosophies similar to Yin/Yang and Aristotle's Phronesis and essentially was just too adult, flying right over the heads of kids and making it distasteful to some older audiences who disliked seeing it get way too hippie - at least here Prowl shows an immediate practical application behind his theory instead of growing a garden. ;)

As for the "super heroes" aspect... I don't think it's too bad. From most of the Autobot's POV they're just there to help - much like the Autobots in Car Robot (RiD). They're not looking for glory or publicity per se - with the exception of Bumblebee, but his attitude might change after being educated by Prowl.

And that's another thing that I'm enjoying about this series - character development! In the first ep Prowl developed from being an aloof brooding loner into becoming more of a team member. In this episode Bumblebee developed from being impulsive into learning that patience is a virtue. :)

I also really like what they did with Megatron. I found it both original and, as Prowl would say, "fascinating." :)

Also, there was a lot less emoting with the Autobots in vehicle mode, which was great to see.

[Paulbot]

If the Angry Archer had been the focus of the episode he would have been a bit annoying but as a couple of minute threat I just feel apathy. If this is what they meant by the Autobots fighting supervillains than I like the direction. I think he'll come back though, I don't think they'd create such complicated weapons for a one shot character.

What I imagine is that we'll get a few more random human supervillains (all quickly handled like this) and then eventually they will team up for revenge (maybe with a Decepticon sponsor and/or Decepticon technology) which will make them more of a threat (for one episode at least).

[GoktimusPrime]

They're such stupid weapons though. Punching arrows?! PUNCHING ARROWS?!?

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/c/c1/AngryArcher01.jpg/250px-AngryArcher01.jpg = http://digitalotaku.net/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/omfg7794259yx.jpg

But yes... thank Primus he only appeared for one scene. Would anyone care if he never appeared again? During G1 I really wanted to see Charlene and Astoria Carlton-Ritz again - it'd be cool to follow up on Skids and Powerglide's human girlfriends (yeah okay, Skids did technically break up with Charlene, but they can still be friends, right?) - but I wouldn't lose any sleep if I never saw Angry Archer again.

That's one happy Autobot http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/a/a1/Charleneskids.jpg

[iceburn]

just watched it today!!! hmmm prime died and revived...that's fast!
well...definitely a chance now to get the toys when it comes in June/July...
*curses in a good way*

[iceburn]

just watched it today
surprisingly...prowl has the battle mask

[Saintly]

mods, I'm wondering if we could merge this thread with that "ranking" thread... was confused by it and posted in the wrong thread :/

I'll fix it up if necessary

[kup]

I have just watched the latest 'Blast from the Past' Episode.

This episode featured my favorite Autobot subgroup, the Dinobots but I am underwhelmed and dissapointed at the handleling of them in animated.

*Spoilers*


The Super Hero aspect and Transformers carrying on seamlessly among the humans without any sort of proper reaction from them is still unsetling. No one asks or cares that these robots happen to be Alien life forms, nor the Government or the general population and I find that idiotic.

This time they tried to developed the character of Bulkhead but they have gone for the traditional 'dumb big Oaf' approach than anything more original. With Rhinox in Beast Wars, he was the largest and strongest (at least in the 1st & 2nd Season) but was also very wise and intelligent with reserved mannerisms. Bulkhead is just a generic 'Dumb big guy' which we have seen countless times in cartoons before and frankly that's borring.

My biggest gripe with this episode however is the handleling of the Dinobots. They have gone for carbon copies of the G1 cartoon Dinobots and to me, that sucks! I was hoping for something like the comics or at least a midway point but the Dinobots here are just primitive retards just like in the G1 cartoon. Their creation was not as bad as I was expecting but was also disappointing. They have basically been constructed from Dinosaur Park animatronics with a little design help from Megatron. They were also given life by the key and I hate it how the key has now become the series' plot device, an obstacle for innovation. Dr Sumdac's naivety is also disturbing, its beyond absurd how he is completely oblivious to Megatron's 'agenda' even though he was the one who constructed the Dinobots with the guidance of Megatron and how despite all that has happened by the end he still trusts in Megatron's good will.

Overall, very underwhelming and a dissapointment that they decided to go with a carbon copy of the G1 cartoon dinobots which many fans will agree, it was one of the biggest flaws of the G1 cartoon to have them so dumb, specially when compared to the absolute kick ass characters we got (and still get) in the comics.

The only thing that I would commend them on is that the Dinobots, particularly Grimlock are spit images of their G1 toy counterparts. When Grimlock transforms at the end, the Transformation sequence looks identical to that of the G1 toys which I thought was cool.
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CUMSHOT COMPILATION (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/485/compilation/videos/1)

[Gutsman Heavy]

I'll take those primitive retards anyday of the week, I loved the episode, mostly because I love the G1 toon Dinobots

[kup]

I like the G1 Dinobots too but after reading the Marvel and IDW comics, its very hard to go back to dumb Dinobots.

The Animated episode wasn't bad, but it seemed more like a rehash than anything new. It was better than the first episode but not as good as the last.
________
LIST OF CEOS OF FORD MOTOR COMPANY PICTURE (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/List_of_CEOs_of_Ford_Motor_Company)

[i_amtrunks]

I quite liked the ep, Megatron using his abilities to manipulate a very daft genius into doing his dirty work for him.

Grimlock seemed to grow intelligence as the episode went on, hopefully this trend continues, and Slag and Swoop also get to speak in their next outing.

Bumblebee is an a**wipe, he is just a jerk, Bulkhead should put him through a wall or 10.

Prime has the least "character" of all the bots now, so I expect some big backstory in the coming weeks for him, possibly when Sentinel comes to Earth.

[Robzy]

I concur! I think "Blast from the Past" was the best episode so far! I really liked the portrayal of the Dinobots (including the voice), and I thought Megatron's story was great too - certainly hinting at things to come.

It's very similar to the 'new' (by that I mean '2003') TMNT cartoon... ie, Shredder starts off slowly, and becomes a threat as the seasons goes on. I think the same will apply here - eventually Megatron will arise again, but in the meantime he's using his 'brain' to manipulate the situation.

[kup]

I would not have minded this origin so much if it was actually Megatron who who had planned to give them life all along but the randomness in which the key was used to give them life was what wrecked it for me. If Megatron had orchestrated the creation of the Dinobots down to them gaining a spark, fine my review on this would have been much more positive.

Gaining a Spark in such a random and stupid manner through Sari and her key is what killed any enjoyment of this new take on the Dinobots creation.

Things like this makes Sari seems more of a plot device than an actual character which is uninspired writing in my opinion.

Its not a bad show, this episode may not be as good as the last but its certainly better than the first 'movie' one in my view. However the tone of it is very 'Super Hero team to the rescue' and frankly if I wanted to watch that sort of thing I would watch Teen Titans or Justice League. I like Transformers because they are unique, they are aliens trying to survive on Earth by trying to assimilate into the Earth environment while fighting a Civil war that has grown off their home world. This show puts that side of Transformers as secondary and 'Super Hero team' as first. Its evident even in the way that they interact with one another.
________
Vapir No2 Review (http://vaporizer.org/portable)

[GoktimusPrime]

Okay, just saw the ep and here are my thoughts...

+ I really don't like how they're continuing to portray Bulkhead as a big lumbering oaf. I don't ever expect him to achieve Prowl's level of grace, but when Prowl started training him I was hoping that they would at least meet midway... he doesn't need to be a ninja, but he could stand to be not so freaking UNCO! Prowl's training method sucked - not because it was inherently bad but because it doesn't cater well for a student with Bulkhead's...er... special needs. Bulkhead seems to demonstrate the coordinative abilities of an under-12 year old and would be more suited learning some really super-simple basic martial arts as demonstrated inthis kata (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KprSXB25BDA&feature=related). IMO that kata is way too simple to be used to teach most folks over the age of 12. With someone as ridiculously unco as Bulkhead, who can't seem to be able to turn around without falling, you'd probably start him at that "baby steps" level. :/ I can appreciate that they were trying to use the whole scene as a plot device for Prowl explaining how big and destructive things can still be appreciated - but it wasn't enough to justify why they couldn't have improved on Bulkhead's coordination. The Dinobots are big and destructive... and yeah, stupid - but they're not unco! None of them ever accidentally destroyed anything, if anything, their destructive power was quite precise.

+ For all his apparent brilliance, Professor Sundac sure is an absolute IDIOT. Falling for Megatron's dupe once I could forgive, but still believing in him after he admitted that he'd intentionally armed the Dinobots with destructive capabilities? "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

+ The Dinobots - oh god... these guys are even stupider than the G1 cartoon Dinobots. I mean, in the G1 cartoon, the Dinobots were always dopey, but they weren't retards in Seasons 1 and 2... they only became retarded in "Transformers The Move" and episodes which followed that - and by retarded I mean their minds were reduced to the level of a small child (like the way they all gathered round Kup for story time). These Dinobots are operating below that level... almost like animals. (-_-) As someone who's never liked retarded Dinobots, I find this really, really stupid. I agree with kup - they should've tried to meet midway and make the Dinobots maybe not as smart as they were in the G1 comics but not as stupid as they were in the G1 cartoon... but instead, they went below the retard level of the G1 toon Dinobots.

+ Sari's key - I liked how it changed the Dinobots and instilled them with Sparks and the ability to transform. That was cool. Megatron was trying to build an army of drone warriors, not necessarily Transformers - and without the AllSpark he wouldn't have had the ability to imbue them with life anyway. Also, it also served to allow Megatron to learn of the key's existence, which I'm sure will be quite useful for him later. ;)

+ Megatron - I like how he's still operating as an incapacitated villain. That keeps things interesting... and also how the plot is progressing with him working towards restoring more power for himself. His relationship with Dr. Sundac is like watching some evil mastermind playing a mindless puppet for a fool and as his front... kinda like Dick Cheney and George Bush! ;D

...overall... I was disappointed with this episode. Unlike Eps 1 and 2, there was no substantial character development. In Ep1, Prowl started off as a loner who learnt the value of being part of a team. In Ep2, Bumblebee started off as reckless and impulsive and learnt that patience is a virtue, learning to couple the art of stillness with his already honed abilities of speed. In Ep3, Bulkhead started off as a clumsy brute and... well... nothing changed! He should have learnt to combine some of Prowl's agility and coupled it with his already well developed raw power, but it never happened.

No character development = teh suck

...having said all that, the ending with Prowl and Bulkhead placing the Dinobots on a remote island for them to live peacefully was really nice. Thus Prowl remains as my favourite character in this series. :)

---------------

P.S.: This is one of my favourite dialogues from G1 demonstrating the Grimlock I know and love...

Background: this is from US#77 - Powermaster Optimus Prime has sacrificed himself to destroy Unicron, and in his dying breath named Grimlock as his successor, who is now co-leader of the Autobot-Decepticon Alliance with Bludgeon. Prowl has been trying to convince Grimlock to make a public address to boost morale amongst the Transformers.

PROWL: "All you've done so far is give orders and get on everyone's nerves."
GRIMLOCK: "If you think speech help, you make it. You better at it."
PROWL: "Me? It's not my job! Prime named you Autobot Leader, not me! You have a responsibility to your troops, a duty--"
GRIMLOCK: That it, isn't it? That what really stick in your craw! That Prime name me Autobot Leader and not you! Always saw yourself as next leader, didn't you? With your clever plans and fancy speeches!
(Grimlock sticks his face into Prowl's, pointing at him)
GRIMLOCK: "Well, you not leader, I AM!
(Grimlock walks away from Prowl)
GRIMLOCK: "Suggest you remember that next time you think to question me!"
(With Grimlock gone, Prowl's cool logical facade collapses as he surrenders to his anger with eyes narrowed and teeth gritted, haunched over with both fists clenched... Prowl realises that Grimlock has seen right through him and that he had just been royally PWN3D like a n00b!)

[kup]

PROWL: "All you've done so far is give orders and get on everyone's nerves."
GRIMLOCK: "If you think speech help, you make it. You better at it."
PROWL: "Me? It's not my job! Prime named you Autobot Leader, not me! You have a responsibility to your troops, a duty--"
GRIMLOCK: That it, isn't it? That what really stick in your craw! That Prime name me Autobot Leader and not you! Always saw yourself as next leader, didn't you? With your clever plans and fancy speeches!
(Grimlock sticks his face into Prowl's, pointing at him)
GRIMLOCK: "Well, you not leader, I AM!
(Grimlock walks away from Prowl)
GRIMLOCK: "Suggest you remember that next time you think to question me!"
(With Grimlock gone, Prowl's cool logical facade collapses as he surrenders to his anger with eyes narrowed and teeth gritted, haunched over with both fists clenched... Prowl realises that Grimlock has seen right through him and that he had just been royally PWN3D like a n00b!)

I remember that part clearly, its one of my favorite Grimlock moments.

After Dinobots like the Marvel comics and IDW, its very hard to go back to Season 3 type Dinobots. Unfortunately that is the only type of Dinobots that the Executives seem to know due to the cartoon.

I am sure if you show the kick ass characters we got in the comics next to the Animated/cartoon versions, you will see kids much prefering the butt kicking comic Dinobots than a gang of retards.
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[GoktimusPrime]

I also didn't like how the Dinobots were all basically the same as each other and didn't get much individual exposition other than Grimlock being their spokesperson (Swoop and Slag never even had their names mentioned!). What particularly bugged me was that they were all identical in battle (with the exception of Swoop's flight, which he didn't use that well to his advantage). Even in the G1 cartoon, the Dinobots all had unique attacking styles: Grimlock loved to munch metal (who didn't love the way he caught Thundercracker in mid flight with his teeth?!), Sludge loved stomping and even outclassed Rumble at making Earthquakes ("No faaaaiiiir!"), Swoop was the bombardier (and in the comics, an aerial ace), Snarl had powerful tail whips and Slag was the flamethrower and battering-ram. In Animated, they're all flamethrowers! Granted that in the cartoon the Dinobots did all shoot flames and lasers from their mouthes, eyes and horns - but at least they displayed individual attacking abilities on top of that. I found that the Animated Dinobots were sorely lacking in such individuality.

This scene from G1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14s4i4Endt8) showing the Dinobots vs Devastator shows the Dinobots using their various individual attacks (in dino modes).

And even the G1 cartoon gave them individual personality traits. As Megatron once said, "Grimlock is arrogant, Slag hostile and Sludge stupid." Snarl and Swoop also had some characterisation too (Snarl was gruff and aloof whilst Swoop was more affable).

Seriously - aside from the way that they look, can anyone tell me any real difference between these Dinobots? (o_O)

P.S.: Dr.Smoov's "SOS Wheeljack" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-aTbHsZJ9g) - a great parody on how silly the G1 portrayal of the Dinobots were. ;) (contains strong language)

[kup]

I enjoyed that 5 min part of Heavy Metal War A LOT more than the whole of this last TF: Animated episode.
________
Think mill (http://thinkmill.com/)

[liegeprime]

I just hope the toys are as good ... bring on the rest of them dinos!! not just the 3, c'mooooon... not another of those split a known group then make them an exclusive botcon figure selling plots again....absolutely no respect for fanboys!!!! :mad::mad::mad::mad:

[1orion2many]

:eek:what can I say:eek::eek::eek: I might enjoy the toys but so far this series cuts the cheese in a big way(Stinky):p:D.

[iceburn]

ohhh...me iceburn, lliiikkkeeee
wonder if the dinobots will become toy figures too.
i also want the full form of Optimus Prime as a fire truck

[Paulbot]

Iceburn, the Dinobots are all ready scheduled to be made as toys! :)

[kup]

If I buy any Animated toy, it would be Grimlock. He appears to be a modern execution of the original G1 Grimlock down to the Transformation sequence and look. He also looks to be less 'stylized'.
________
MAGIC FLIGHT LAUNCH BOX (http://vaporizers.net/portable-vaporizers)

[iceburn]

Iceburn, the Dinobots are all ready scheduled to be made as toys! :)

ohh any links to that?

[Tiby]

I've just been watching the premiere on YouTube. I am sold. While the flexible vehicles is a bit strange, it suits the style. The Unicron trilogy had the flashing cockpits or lights when the vehicles talked, but they were CG after all.

So far there has been more characterisation in the first 10 minutes than some characters got in the whole G1 series, and far more than the generic clones in Headmasters etc.

I'm not out to bag the other shows, but I am extremely relieved that this show is about a core group of well-characterised bots and cons, rather than every possible new toy we they can cram in with cameos. Having said that, there is still the rest of the show to go...

[GoktimusPrime]

Flashing cockpits I can deal with... physically emoting is teh suckage. Thankfully we haven't seen much of it in eps 2 and 3 and I hope it stays that way.

[Robzy]

ohh any links to that?

Grimlock and Slag prototypes are near the bottom of the page...

http://tformers.com/transformers-database/animated/

:)

[Paulbot]

I liked the Dinobot episode more than the Prowl episode. It had a very familar plot to the original Dinobot cartoons which I enjoyed. Grimlock's voice was excellent. While I prefer the (Furman) comic Dinobots to the cartoon Dinobots, there's something nice about seeing a new version of the dim-witted dinosaurs.

[GoktimusPrime]

It had references to both the G1 cartoon and comics - the cartoon reference obviously being Sari taking the Autobots to a museum about dinosaurs and the Dinobots being created on Earth, and the comic reference being how the Dinobots got trapped in a tar pit (although they didn't have to wait 4 million years before being rescued, eheheheh).

[Paulbot]

I recall tar in the cartoon as well (wasn't that a cliffhanger during Dinobot Island?) but it does work as a comic reference too.

Most of the plot points though seem to reference the cartoon: Megatron convincing the Dinobots to attack Autobots, the secluded refuge, even the fire breath coming from all the Dinobots not just Slag.

[kup]

I was reading future episode synopsis and thre is a possibility that the Dinobots may get smarter in the future which will hopefully meet that 'half way mark' between the comics and cartoon intelligence. I dont think that they will get much smarter but any additional IQ points would be welcomed.

Cars bad...Car Robots WORSE!
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FISTING VIDS (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/20/fisting/videos/1)

[GoktimusPrime]

indeed... these Dinobots would be cooler if they took more cues from the G1 comics...

[Paulbot]

I would like if they get smart enough that Slag and Swoop can actually speak.

[Gutsman Heavy]

I have no doubt they'll get smarter, remember they were just given life in the show, consider them as infants, fire breathing infants, but infants none the less.

[kup]

I have just seen the lost Episode 'Meltdown' which was skipped by cartoon Network. Time Warner released it as an 'on demand' episode (downloads into a set top box upon request). It is supposed to take place before the 'Blast from the Past' Dinobot episode. It has found its way into torrents, downloads and Youtube.

*Spoilers*

This is the most 'Super Hero' type episode so far and it starts with the Autobots watching television and suddenly seeing Bumblebee participating in a televised wrestling match against a hyper Steroid enhanced 'super' human. This Echo's Bob Budiansky's last comic issue with the wrestling Micromasters but this is much worse. Then it escalated into a very boring Super Hero fight with the Mutated wrestler where the other Autobots joined in and defeated it. The Wrestleing match was aranged by the CEO of a Bioengineering company to proof to Captain Fanzone, that his Bio enhanced humans were superior to any Machine or robot. The defeat and mess created by the bioenhanced human makes him loose face with the Police and City, loosing the contract, this sets the plot of the episode into motion.

As mentioned this is the most 'Super Hero' type episode so far as the bad guy is pretty much your typical 'accident altered' human super villain. When he was turned down by the Police Force and abandoned by investors, he basically tried to show his capabilities by conducting an experiment which mixes Bumblebee's inner fluids (leaked from the mutant fight) with his enhanced bio matter. The result was that in a fit of rage, he spilled it and was 'mutated' into an Acidic humanoid with the ability to melt everything he touches. He became Meltdown the Super Villain. Meltdown then goes to Professor Sumdac's building to 'avenge' himself (Sumdac had acquired the Police contract to enhance the Police force with robotic drones instead of bio enhanced humans). Meltdown and his mutated henchman are eventually defeated by the Autobots in another boring fight and locked away in an electromagnetic bubble. That's it.

I can see why this episode was skipped, not so much due to its poor story but its controversial nature of the beginning. The villain of this story has made a industry from biologically enhancing humans using steroids and hormone like substances. Aparently in near future Detroit, they do not have any moral issues with artificially enhancing humans in such a manner. The CEO of the company (the villain) was trying to sell the technology to Chief Fanzone to enhance his Police Force. No one cared about the ethical or moral issues about this, only that it wasn't efficient enough.

They also had a very stupid subplot happening with Bumblebee trying to proof that he is tough despite being the shortest of the team (reason for joining the wrestling match). There were far too many 'short jokes' and Bumblebee just behaved in a very annoying childish form with in a generic 'short guy trying to be tough' manner. He was so annoying that it made Wheelie seem like the most awesome Bot in the world. It was badly handled.

What can I say? This episode was the worse episode by far. I am honestly trying to find good points to this episodes as I did with the previous others but I can't think of any, there is nothing here that merits praise; It was just a mess. It was a Super hero plot doesn't necessarily make it a bad episode, but it was so generic, predictable and cliche that it just didn't work at all. To put it simply, this episode SUCKED!

I thought of something Positive! The good thing about this episode is that it was stand alone. It didn't contribute anything to the main story arc and does not affect continuity in any way. You don't loose anything by skipping it. Not much of a good point but at least it doesn't affect the rest of the series (hopefully:p)
________
Easy vape vaporizer (http://www.vaporshop.com/easy-vape-vaporizer.html)

[kup]

I have just finished watching this week's 'properly' broadcast Animated episode.

The Episode Title 'Thrill of the Hunt'.

*Spoilers*

I was very impressed by this episode and it certainly is infinitly superior to the super crap episode that was 'Meltdown'. This episode for the first time had proper quality to its story telling with good pacing and world building. It also had no Super hero aspects despite some people getting saved. The Autobots for the first time acted as such, Autobots facing the greater threat of the Decepticons.

This episode starts off in a lighter note with the Autobots exploring the city at night and commenting about the 'otherworldly' things they encounter. Ratchet was particularly amusing at the begining with his culture shock of looking through the window of a autoparts store (which was a smart prelude on what is to come). Then it went into a car chase which gradually developed in the introduction of the Decepticon Bounty Hunter named Lockdown.

Lockdown and Ratchet had a history going back to the Great War. This story was told through intermediate flashbacks which were nicely done in showing us a desolate but ravaged city on Cybertron where Ratchet was given the task to find and rescue an Autobot who contained critical data on the War effort. This Autobot was non other than Arcee!

The flashback sub story clearly had a dark atmosphere which was a huge contrast from the typical 'bright and happy' episodes that we have gotten from animated so far. It showed us a ravaged city and the consequences of the Great War. It also showed fantastic character development for Ratchet who had to not only guard and escort Arcee to Autobot command but heal her as well since she was badly injured/damaged. Without going too far into it, things quickly grow more dire as both are captured by Lockdown. Lockdown is a Decepticon bounty Hunter who deals in not only Head hunting Autobots but also the stealing and gathering of Intelligence data to sell for the right price to Megatron in exchange for self upgrades. This is what what makes Lockdown a terrifying foe, he captures Autobots and steals parts from them to upgrade himself, hence his Frankensten like limbs and varied color scheme. Long story short, this sub plot does not end with a happy ending which again adds a more maturity and quality to this episode. The story is also logical in defining what shapes Ratchet into the bot he is in the 'present' as we get to understand his 'war trauma' and why he is so grumpy. This is handled logically and with finesse. This episode legitimizes Animated as a series capable of providing a worthy story, character development and plot without patronizing the audience with too many kiddy elements.

Eventually after a creepy encounter with Meltdown which has Prime captured and Ratchet's battle for vengeance and redemption to rescue him, we have a straight forward battle but well fought with a good resolution to the story which was thoughtful, not flashy but an appropriate conclusion which made the story believable instead of forced like the ending of the 'movie' first episode.

This brings us to another thing that made this episode good. There was no Sari, no imposing humans characters and certainly no magic key to save the day. This episode relied on good writing to tell a story instead of some ridiculous plot device or a generic Super hero team against Super villain plot. It was good and refreshing to see a Transformers episode that relied on telling a well thought out Transformers story instead of some cheap rehashed plot that we have seen before in several series. We haven't gotten this level of quality in story telling since Beast Wars.

Another thing to mention is that the Autobots don't seem to emote in car mode for this episode so it maintains the seriousness of the story throughout without breaking its pacing or dark mood with excessively stupid jokes and kiddy animations like they have been doing in previous episodes.

Looks like this episode is the exact oposite of the 'Meltdown' episode. I am having difficulty finding bad elements in it because it was that good. Well, the only bad thing is really a matter of preference, I am not that fond of Blitzwing's 'demon' face. It seems too goofy for me but aside from that, this episode was superb.

I probably liked this episode so much because for the first time in this series, we have gotten a proper Transformers story without the super hero crap or annoying humans. This episode partially tabbed in what makes me a Transformers fan and I appreciate that.

If Animated continuously provides this level of story telling consistently in future episodes instead of the Super hero crap with much less Sari and her stupid key saving the day plot resolutions, then I could grow to like this series enough to collect the toys. This episode for the first time in Animated felt like a proper Transformers story.

Keep it up and you will win my money! Less Super heroes, more Transformers! :)
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PORNSTARS PORN (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/32/pornstars/videos/1)

[liegeprime]

How do you get these episodes Kup? I went to youtube and typed TF animated and go from there but they usually want a more specific title search to do a search to include the upcoming/next episode. Like when I wanted the dinobot episode. I had to add "Blast form the Past" coz if I didn't it always just shows the very first episodes...

So my only recourse for now is wait for you guys here to post what the next title is so I can add it to my search in you tube, really annoying....

OH nice episode as well - hope the make an Arcee figure even though she's just a cameo character.... now.

[Robzy]

I tend to agree with you Kup! I thought 'Meltdown' was a 'letdown' to be honest! I'm getting tired of 'Sari and her magical key' all the time.

On the other hand, 'Thrill of the hunt' was excellent! It was a great character episode - giving us more insight towards Ratchet's past. I'm also really starting to like Prowl's character a lot... he's fast becoming my favourite character in the whole show!

2 extra bonuses for me were...
1) Susan Blu reprising her role as Arcee
2) Lance Henriksen as Lockdown (I recognised his voice during the episode)

[Gutsman Heavy]

I had zero interest in lockdown untill now, Bounty Hunter Lance Henriksen!? EPIC!

I thought Meltdown was ok...

[Saintly]

How do you get these episodes Kup? I went to youtube and typed TF animated and go from there but they usually want a more specific title search to do a search to include the upcoming/next episode. Like when I wanted the dinobot episode. I had to add "Blast form the Past" coz if I didn't it always just shows the very first episodes...


Liege, check this post -> http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?p=3545#post3545

Griffin posted (#23) a set of links from youtube to all the episodes so far...

[i_amtrunks]

Thrill of the Hunt was far superior to Total Meltdown, but Meltdown wasn't too bad a stand alone episode, Meltdown will be interesting throughout the rest of the show, as they didn't show any way of reducing his threat level once he escapes from the force field.

Thrill of the hunt was excellent, ratchet was already my favourite animated character, and is even more so now, I want a "Great War Ratchet" figure too. Prowl is showing himself off to be quite the fighter, and Blitzwing's cameo was great, I doubt there are many people who don't want him to appear soon.

Hopefully many of the naysayers who reckon the show caters exclusively to kiddies caught Thrill of the Hunt. Might start to change their opinion.

[kup]

Hopefully many of the naysayers who reckon the show caters exclusively to kiddies caught Thrill of the Hunt. Might start to change their opinion

Despite my good review of this particular episode, I happen to be one of those "naysayers". One or a a couple of good episodes does not make a good show.

It seems that the bulk of TF Animated will be the super hero stuff like the Meltdown episode which I personally hate. The next episode in fact appears to be of this sort with the Autobots going against a roller skating villain. I hope that its not as bad as the Meltdown episode as it was on par or worse than Armada's worse offerings.
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Volcano Vaporizer Reviews (http://vaporizer.org/reviews/volcano)

[griffin]

Topic is closed temporarly while the Admin reviews the content. It's best to be starting up seperate review topics for each episode anyway, otherwise we have just one over-long topic that is hard to follow or jump into.

[GoktimusPrime]

(from the Ep6 review thread)


Am I the only one who finds it quite funny people get so hot under the collar about a kids TV show based on a toyline for kids? Just enjoy it for what it is, a childs cartoon, I love cartoons so I have no issue with the kiddy nature of this series!
And therein lies in part of the problem with this series. Making it totally kiddie-oriented isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it does make its appeal far more limited as it tends to exclude older audiences.

IMO the Japanese Beast Wars and Armadaverse series were pretty ordinary, even for a kid-targetted series. Car Robot (RiD) was quite good as a kid-oriented series, but again, you'll find that most older CR/RiD fans are fans of the toys, rather than the series because it has limited appeal to older fans.

The appeal of G1 (esp. the comics) and Beast Wars was that it had different layers of appeal - to both kids and older audiences. G1 and BW had elements which appealed to both younger and older audiences - like The Simpsons they worked in layers.

Animated fails to do this. And even as a kid-oriented show, it still feels kinda mediocre at best.

As Michael McConnohie (the voice actor for Cosmos and Tracks) once said, you don't need to dumb stories down when writing for children. He attributes the success of G1 as being that they didn't dumb it down for kids. Sure, parts of it were campy/corny and there are glaring continuity issues - but overall the G1 premise wasn't dumbed down extensively for children.

And part of why Season 3 is less popular with many fans is because although in many ways G1 writers did try to smarten up the show (e.g.: putting TFs in a more scifi setting) in other ways the show dumbed itself down (e.g.: Daniel and Wheelie).

As McConnohie argued, kids really find it offensive when people talk down to them. He argued that G1 didn't talk down to kids and cites "The God Gambit" as a good example of a G1 episode which contained heavy adult themes presented in a kids' cartoon story that didn't dumb itself down for its audience. The G1 comics are full of other and better examples of this.

And Beast Wars - wow... I was a uni student when that show came out and I was totally able to relate to it as an adult audience member and G1 fan (as STL is currently discovering :D).

When I look at Animated I find that the show is lacklustre in its appeal to me as an older audience member. Other than some glaringly obvious G1 references, there's just nothing about it that appeals to me as an adult.

And kids these days are being more and more exposed to cartoons which engage dual audiences - I've never seen Avatar: The Last Airbender but I've heard from friends that it engages audiences on two levels like Beast Wars. I've heard the same about Digimon too, but again, have never seen the show for myself. A lot of animé series works on dual engagement (sadly none of the JP-exclusive TF animé :().

The live action movie also had layers of appeal too, which helped to make it very successful. The movie had aspects of appeal for:
+ Transformer fans
+ Non-Transformer fans
+ Kids
+ Adults

Yes, I understand that Transformers is primarily targetted at kids - but one traditional strength of Transformers is that it's also targetted older audiences too - which is why Transformers has remained so endearing for such a long time for so many people.

We can't have the series appealing too much toward adults - that's what Beast Machines did to some degree and part of the reason why it failed. But at the same time, G1, G2 (comics), BW and the live action movie have already demonstrated to us that Transformers can be written to simultaneously appeal to multiple target groups.

Writing TFs solely at kids to me reeks of being slack. This attitude of "meh it's just a kids' show" to me feels like they don't really care all that much about Transformers. Despite the fact that Beast Wars was primarily targetted at kids, the producers and writers went to extensive lengths to ensure that the show could still appeal to old school fans. They communicated with the fandom online and directly enlisted the assistance of certain fans like Ben Yee. They did extensive research into G1 and G2... they read comics, watched cartoons. As a result they not only included a multitude of G1 and G2 elements into Beast Wars (in turn allowing Beast Wars to actually enrich and enhance G1/G2) but also threw in a tonne of fandom 'easter egg' references (like incorporating fans' online handles and fan site names into the script, e.g.: Wonko The Sane (also a reference to Douglas Adams), M-Sipher, Hooks, Starbase Rugby et al)! They even got widely beloved G1 writer Simon Furman to write the conclusion of Beast Wars! To me, that is dedication.

And the movie writers had plenty of dedication - on a different level from Beast Wars as the movie wasn't attempting to be in pre-establishing continuity, but there is ample evidence which showed that the writers did do some homework. And Michael Bay himself admitted being "schooled" in Transformers, a process which made him a fan of TFs.

...am I seeing this dedication in Animated? To some degree, yes. As I said, there are plenty of G1 references in the series. But where it falters is in actually making the story endear itself to an adult audience... so far the show has yet to do that for me.

Animated has the potential to do so, particularly with characters like Prowl and Lockdown - I so wish that they would develop other characters in the same vein, especially Bulkhead who still seems nothing more than a goofy cartoon caricature rather than an actual character.

Being really strong doesn't mean you have to be really stupid. Alright, you don't have to be a genius like Rhinox - but look at Brawn - his motto was "might over microchips" and was portrayed as a 'brawn over brains' kind of character - as was Grimlock - but neither was portrayed as being bumbling idiots (except for Season 3 where Grimlock was a clown, which really sucked).

One of my favourite moments in G1 with Brawn was in "The Ultimate Doom" where Brawn went, "I'll get the door," and just walked through a wall! :D

[kup]

*shrug*

I had a high degree of frustration with this episode. There were nice little moments with nods to G1 and BW but overall too many story elements felt incredibly dumbed down to make it interesting. That infamous villain at the start doesn't need me commenting much more than others here already have.

I was particularly fond of the Soundwave upgrades but what irked at me immeasurably was the key. Like Robzy, I've just about had it with the stupid thing. What they key did achieve in this episode was make me shrug at Soundwave's return. Sure I did like it was happening but it felt so cringeworthy.

I also agree with the sentiment that this is far more Shockwave than Soundwave but ultimately it didn't matter b/c a lot of enthusiasm I had for the good parts were rained on by all those annoying elements someone thought it was wise to throw in.

I agree and that is the primary issue that I have with this episode but for me its also the overall series. The 'cringeworthy' moments are way too common and last way too long hampering my enjoyment of any promising elements that the plot may have.

The core plot of a disembodied Megatron scheming to regain a new body and hamper the Autobots is brilliant storytelling in concept and an excellent twist since Megatron in the past has always been depicted as ever powerful, never vulnerable. However the ever intrusive and time consuming overly 'silly' elements and settings (slumberparty, trickortreating, birthday party, pony princess, absurdly dumb professor, etc, etc) ruin what otherwise would be an excellent plot premise and before long the cringe moments begin to outweigh the good moments making an episode frustrating to watch.

After 10 episodes the tone and mood of the series has been set and it is very unlikely to come away from it and sadly this is not to my taste. This is the first Transformers series that I have found so frustratingly annoying to watch that I am quiting watching it altogether, not even Armada and its dumb Pokamon plot managed that, so this is a first.
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[STL]

After 10 episodes the tone and mood of the series has been set and it is very unlikely to come away from it and sadly this is not to my taste. This is the first Transformers series that I have found so frustratingly annoying to watch that I am quiting watching it altogether, not even Armada and its dumb Pokamon plot managed that, so this is a first.

Come on, Kup, there are disappointments to the stories but they're still pretty decent. I've seen bits of Cybertron and Armada and I think those are far more cringeworthy and I can't be bothered following those. The dialogue is also second rate but here I think it's far better controlled.

Yes the cringeworthiness factor can be high but I think the caricatures are good here b/c I feel each character has a voice. Bulkhead may be dumb but he serves his purpose to the young audience. Bumblebee is annoying and immature but that's cool too. I think you need that rather than everyone's favourite little bot. Making him a little snot actually makes the team dynamics work better. I could keep going but what I think is that between the 5, I think they synch together far better. They're bigger than the sum of their parts. They are strongest when they bounce off each other imo.

I think more of the "Earth" elements birthdays, Halloween in themselves are fine. I think it's good to connect with kids even though they gnarl at me.

Overall, you don't have a perfect cartoon but I think for there is still a charm to it with a small core cast allowing us to warm to the characters. It's just that key that keeps making everything trivial that holds it down for me.

[kup]

That's my point, I am not criticizing the core of the story or the main characters, I am criticizing its overall execution.

The silly moments ruin the atmosphere for me and on top of that several episodes dont even feel like Transformers to me and more like a Super Hero series. Sometimes it even reminds me of Beast Machines in the sense that sometimes it doesn't even feel as if I am watching a Transformers series at all. Thankfully, unlike BM some episodes do go back to form (Thrill of the Hunt) but in most other episodes, even when the plot premise is good, it ends up being ruined by some stupid overhanging silly theme and the solution is almost always that damned key.

I did give this show a good worthy try but overall after watching 10 episodes, I have found it to be a poor attempt at Transformers and overall substandard despite the promising bits.

I am happy that you guys are enjoying it but to me it has become pretty crappy.

In regards to the 'kiddy' themes: I used to hate them when they were used back in the 80s and 90s when I was a kid for basically the same reasons that I am hating them now. They felt out of place and hurt the overall 'inmersiveness' of the fantasy world created. Fortunately back in the 80s it was the odd episode in a series that had this overly kiddy 'birthday!' or 'Halloween!' theme unlike animated which seems to have it every second episode at least.
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[GoktimusPrime]

STL: I find it amusing that you're far more forgiving toward Animated compared to your far less forgiving appraisal of Furman's work at IDW. ;)

[STL]

STL: I find it amusing that you're far more forgiving toward Animated compared to your far less forgiving appraisal of Furman's work at IDW. ;)

I hope I'm not going OT. If I am, feel free to move it mods.

The reason I'm less forgiving of the Animated concept is because I can understand the audience it's generated at and hence the limitations that I expect to impair it. It's like when you walk into McDonalds you don't expect the same service as you'd be when dining on Collins Street. I'm a harsh critic of today's cartoons for kids but when I measure TF Animated by those standards, I can accept the corny elements with Halloween, birthday parties etc b/c there's another audience they're evidently catering too. I'm not thrilled but I know that coming in. If I had it my way, the brat would be gone. Megatron would've exterminated her and her daddy. We'd be in the middle of an all out war between the Autobots and Decepticons with the hordes of both alliances converging on Earth. There wouldn't be thanksgiving or halloween or a birthday party. It'd be war. But of course, that's not animated. It's probably closer to IDW's G1.

Furman's IDW work on the other hand is directed to mature, devoted fans of G1. He is supposed to be a master of his craft. I think he's underperforming and hasn't adopted well to the serialised format. To him its still one ongoing series between his minis and his spotlights. However the retail reality isn't the same. They are minis. They need to be written like they are. I, hence, expect better.

That said, I've constantly said I'm a big fan of the IDW universe. It's the execution that has frustrated me. And there have been issues that I've liked and been glowing about like the Stormbringer mini, Escalation, Optimus/Blaster/Magnus/Nightbeat/Shockwave spotlights.

Anyway, if you saw Furman's run incorporating half of the Halloween, birthday, dumb professor, righteous brat (wait, didn't he do that with Verity) stuff, then if you think I'm harsh now, you'd be in for one heck of a surprise. :)

[GoktimusPrime]

The thing that continues to irk me with Animated is how it fails to adequately engage me as an adult audience member. While I appreciate that the show's target demographic audience is children, I don't see why it cannot be written at multiple levels where it can also simultaneously appeal to adults like Beast Wars.

[i_amtrunks]

The thing that continues to irk me with Animated is how it fails to adequately engage me as an adult audience member. While I appreciate that the show's target demographic audience is children, I don't see why it cannot be written at multiple levels where it can also simultaneously appeal to adults like Beast Wars.

That would require more effort though. :p

I seriously believe that the writers believe themselves to be doing enough for the older viewers with all the G1 nods and Easter eggs...

[kup]

G1 nods are not enough I reckon. To me having random nods like that with no purpose to the world and story feel forced and annoy me more than it pleases me, specially when its done as often as in animated.

Beast Machines tried throwing in random but pointless G1 tributes in places but it didn't do them any good because they were useless when it came to the context of the story and felt rather forced and random, particularly when the overall story was trying very hard to 'revolutionize' transformers into something radically different.
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[GoktimusPrime]

I disagree - Beast Machines did try to blend itself into G1 and enhance G1 just as Beast Wars did. Arguably it wasn't executed as well, but they did make a similar attempt. For example:

+ Sparks, the AllSpark Matrix - again, continues on from canon established in Beast Wars which itself harks back to G1/G2. In Beast Machines we see Sparks making a journey back to the Matrix, which we also saw in G1 when Transformers ventured into the Matrix. Beast Machines establishes that all Sparks are destined to return to the Matrix, which harks back to Optimus Prime's famous words, "Till All Are One."
+ Technorganism: In the G1 episode "Dweller in the Depths" Cybertron is shown as having a technorganic core and the ancient inhabitants of Cybertron (creations of the Quintessons) being technorganic in nature. The G1 comics also showed an ancient race of "technorganic" looking creatures who also dwelled in the depths of Cybertron who surfaced when Cybertron was being "reborn" - they killed Battletrap and Runabout and got trounced by the Dinobots (the fight was Grimlock's first as a true Action Master).
+ The Oracle - who was later revealed to be a remanifestation of Vector Sigma - who in turn has been retconned as an "embodiment of Primus."

[kup]

I disagree - Beast Machines did try to blend itself into G1 and enhance G1 just as Beast Wars did. Arguably it wasn't executed as well, but they did make a similar attempt. For example:

+ Sparks, the AllSpark Matrix - again, continues on from canon established in Beast Wars which itself harks back to G1/G2. In Beast Machines we see Sparks making a journey back to the Matrix, which we also saw in G1 when Transformers ventured into the Matrix. Beast Machines establishes that all Sparks are destined to return to the Matrix, which harks back to Optimus Prime's famous words, "Till All Are One."
+ Technorganism: In the G1 episode "Dweller in the Depths" Cybertron is shown as having a technorganic core and the ancient inhabitants of Cybertron (creations of the Quintessons) being technorganic in nature. The G1 comics also showed an ancient race of "technorganic" looking creatures who also dwelled in the depths of Cybertron who surfaced when Cybertron was being "reborn" - they killed Battletrap and Runabout and got trounced by the Dinobots (the fight was Grimlock's first as a true Action Master).
+ The Oracle - who was later revealed to be a remanifestation of Vector Sigma - who in turn has been retconned as an "embodiment of Primus."

I understand what you are saying but I disagree. These 'tributes' were indeed present in Beast Machines as part of the plot but they were so freaking different in concept and execution (with the exception of the Allpark) that they may as well have called them anything they wanted and no one would have been able to tell the difference.

However when I made my comment before, what I had primarily in mind were the seemingly random tributes such as the numerous sparkless bodies of what looked like Soundwave, the Optimus Prime statues inexplicably holding the Golden discs and so on.
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[GoktimusPrime]

...that was kinda Hasbro's fault. Mainframe were instructed to make a "fresh start" with Beast Machines and not make it a 'direct' continuation from any pre-existing TF canon, which I think was a really stupid decision, and given that I think Mainframe did admirably to try and heavily link it with G1, G2 and BW anyway. Then after that they we had over half a decade of badly dubbed TF shows from Japan with the entirely rebooted continuities which seemed to be more in line with what Hasbro wanted.

...I just don't get that. Part of the winning formula with Beast Wars was its strong ties with pre-existing TF canon and at the same time bringing something fresh and new to Transformers. Why drop it?? When the G1 cartoon, comics and toy line were cancelled, although I wasn't happy, I wasn't surprised either because I could see that the franchise was beginning to falter and popularity dwindling... but with Beast Wars, to me it looked like Hasbro pulled the plug on it during its prime - for why!?

...just another reason why I'd like to kick Archer in the janglies. :p

[kup]

...just another reason why I'd like to kick Archer in the janglies.

I am not sure if this is coincidental but things begun to change for the worse almost inmediately after Archer took over with strange things such as more organic monsters than robots in TM2 designs with notably inferior engineering even when compared to the first year of BW (Cheetor, Dinobot II). After that things only became worse with Beast Machines and their over simplified toy designs and reliance on sound and light gimmick on larger toys rather than engineering. Of course, the real killer were the confirmation that these creatures were no longer robots but morphing "technorganic" creatures which Archer as said many times that he is very proud of, so this sort of thing is more to his preference than Transforming robots.

Fortunately the Movie Autobots were an exception to this (even if some Decepticons did fall prey to mediocrity such as Voyager Starscream) same with the Classics but these toys were either designed by Takara or were under strict supervision from third party sponsors.

Animated is the latest toy line which is 100% Hasbro. I may have issues with the stylized designs but that can't be helped because its the style of the show. However I will keep an eye out on how well these toys are designed and engineering when it comes to playability and transformations.

If the Animated toys end up being substandard with over reliance on simplified engineering and gimmicks then it will really say a lot about the Archer regime when it comes to Transformers.
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[TheDirtyDigger]

Be nice if they did a serious cartoon with a decent level of animation for older fans while keeping the excrement that is Animated for the two years and younger audience it is so obviously designed for.
I bring my own children up with a healthy diet of mentally nutritious animation but even they blanch at having to swallow this tripe.

Not a fan.

Gok you can kick A.Archer in the janglies all you like....
Me.....I'm aiming for the face.

[GoktimusPrime]

I would never recommend kicking anyone to the head if you value your own janglies...

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/Tae%20Kwon%20Leap%20Photocomic/taekwonleap16.jpg

[TheDirtyDigger]

Well I plan on you being there to protect my janglies while you mangle his.

Double team him man!!!




To keep things on-topic...is there anything we could do as a collective to voice our utter disdain for this cartoon and start some action on getting a decent one going.
DC have just released a new cartoon movie taken straight from one their comics. New Frontier...awesome story. One of the most refreshing stories I've read in years.
I would kill to see the IDW stuff on the screen.

[Paulbot]

Um, there is not a collective disdain for the cartoon. Quite a few of us enjoy it for what it is, a children's cartoon for a children's toyline. I like the uniqueness of this animation for a TF series, the small but interesting cast, the Decepticons appearing as unique threats and the fact that it is fun.

[GoktimusPrime]

Agreed... I wouldn't say that I hate this cartoon either, there are some things that I do like about it. But at the same time I'm not overwhelmingly impressed by it either - it's not wowing my pants off like G1 and Beast Wars.

[TheDirtyDigger]

Well I Hate it and......





my Hate makes me strong!:mad:
http://www.command-post.org/desk/archives/emperor.bmp

Yeah I do appreciate it's a kids cartoon and all but I'm not a kid. As for TF's being a kid's toyline I think alot of us here are proof positive that TF's have evolved far beyond children and the powers that be lose alot of potential dollars by not considering us in their marketing strategies and execution.

[GoktimusPrime]

um.. not really. Adult collectors still constitute a minority niche market. Beast Machines showed us the folly of a too mature/adult oriented marketing approach toward Transformers (there were other problems w/ BM too, but the overtly adult theme of the show wouldn't have helped engage the majority child audience).

That's why adult-oriented TF lines like G1 reissues, Binaltech, Masterpiece etc are produced in limited production runs. Hasbro produced their reissues at a larger standard mass production run and tried marketing it toward children, which was a mistake... the adult collector market simply wasn't big enough to support it at that scale and as a result was an overall failure compared to Takara's efforts (can't wait to open my Sky Lynx!).

Having said that, there's no reason why the story cannot be written at dual levels to appeal to both kids and adults simultaneously - just as G1 (particularly the Marvel comics) and Beast Wars did. Why aren't they doing this with Animated? I think i_amtrunks nailed the reason - they can't be donkeyed. (-_-)

[TheDirtyDigger]

That's why adult-oriented TF lines like G1 reissues, Binaltech, Masterpiece etc are produced in limited production runs.

And yet as a general rule, all these lines sell out completely and sell for more (and sometimes alot more) in the secondary market which indicates there is more adult collectors than Hasbro thinks there is.
Also a more mature cartoon would conceivably bring older anime fans and some adults in general into the TF fold.

[roller]

when i was in primary school and BW came out

we kids did not see the season long arcs or subtle comments

we liked it because of the 3d animation and explosions and transformers

But

animated is not BW

and Animated is made in the 21st century

children born after 1989 have the "poison water" in their system, plus the tv and toy people are too lazy to have this show appeal to the entire fandom, the 07 movie was for adults now in 08 we [hasbro] let the kiddies have their turn to play with toys-its science guy

[GoktimusPrime]

And yet as a general rule, all these lines sell out completely and sell for more (and sometimes alot more) in the secondary market which indicates there is more adult collectors than Hasbro thinks there is.
Also a more mature cartoon would conceivably bring older anime fans and some adults in general into the TF fold.
Well that all depends on how you define "more mature." Are you talking about something that is entirely focused toward older fans, like Beast Machines, or are you talking about something that is dual focused, like Beast Wars?

I think it would be a mistake to ignore the kid market - they are still the majority market share and the staple bread and butter for Transformers toy sales. But I agree that a show that also has another layer that can appeal toward older collectors would assist in drawing in that niche market.

This formula was already well proven with Beast Wars.


when i was in primary school and BW came out

we kids did not see the season long arcs or subtle comments

we liked it because of the 3d animation and explosions and transformers
Exactly - Beast Wars succeeded on two levels and was able to appeal to both age groups. Kiddies loved it for the animation and transforming robot action, whilst older fans loved it for the G1/G2 references, subtle adult humour (including sexual innuendo) and complex story arcs.


plus the tv and toy people are too lazy to have this show appeal to the entire fandom,
And there we have it. They just can't be effed to put in the effort. Writing Beast Wars was a lot of effort for Larry DiTillio and Bob Forward, who admit that they knew nothing about Transformers when they were first hired to write Beast Wars - but they went and thoroughly educated themselves about Transformers history and lore... they read comics, watched cartoons and communicated with fans online. They did their homework - and it really showed well! They have my undying admiration for having done all that... I doubt Mainframe/Hasbro would've paid them any extra for doing it - it was done purely as an act of dedication and love for their fans.


the 07 movie was for adults now in 08 we [hasbro] let the kiddies have their turn to play with toys-its science guy
The 2007 movie didn't ignore kids either. Aside from the moment where the soldier gets impaled by Scorponok and occasional swearing, the movie is reasonably kid-friendly. Kids can watch this movie and marvel at the amazing special effects and see giant transforming robots beating the crap out of each other in photorealistic live action - let's face it, that stuff appeals to the kid in all of us. :D

There's no real reason why Animated couldn't have been written to also appeal to older audiences too other than the sheer "meh" laziness factor from the writers.

[TheDirtyDigger]

Well that all depends on how you define "more mature." Are you talking about something that is entirely focused toward older fans

While I realise that that there's almost zero chance of that happening...yes...that is my preferred preference.

I know it's a toy line but the story behind it is one of war and serious issues with characters that have defined adult persona.
Saying that also, I would be immensely satisfied if they just animated the IDW stuff.

[kup]

Why is it so bad to have a mature series?

Anyone remember the X-Men 90s cartoon? It was filled with serious themes such as discrimination, genocide, right for life, social inequality, in your face racism, etc, etc. It hardly had any stupid ass kiddy moments, even their Christmas special had an underlaying theme on social poverty.

Guess what? It was a massive hit with kids and these kids still love it as adults!!

Why can't Animated or 21st Century American Animation in general be the same and go forwards instead of backwards ?

[MV75]

I think some people are just looking in the wrong place for their expectations.

As Roller said:


animated is not BW

Now those of you who know who you are, need to say that until your mouths dry out and your vocal cords fail to realise it and move on to something else.

Whinge whinge whinge beast wars, whinge whinge is getting FAR too old. Yet I expect to see more posts brewed with this exact formula tomorrow.
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[dirge]

Whinge whinge whinge beast wars, whinge whinge is getting FAR too old. Yet I expect to see more posts brewed with this exact formula tomorrow.

Everyone is entitled to express their (measured) opinions on this topic - regardless of their stance. Please respect that.

[SofaMan]

Um, there is not a collective disdain for the cartoon. Quite a few of us enjoy it for what it is, a children's cartoon for a children's toyline. I like the uniqueness of this animation for a TF series, the small but interesting cast, the Decepticons appearing as unique threats and the fact that it is fun.

I'd like to throw y voice behind Paulbot's assessment - I'm quite happy to watch it for what it is, and have been enjoying it immensely, whereas I haven't even bothered with the last 4 TF cartoon post-BM (RiD - Cybertron)

[kup]

I'd like to throw y voice behind Paulbot's assessment - I'm quite happy to watch it for what it is, and have been enjoying it immensely, whereas I haven't even bothered with the last 4 TF cartoon post-BM (RiD - Cybertron)

I really wish I was tolerant enough of this new series to watch it all.

I didn't particularly like the Unicron Trilogy series but I was able to watch them from beginning to end even if they weren't exactly satisfying. This is something that I am unable to do with Animated, I just come out annoyed and pissed off at the end of an episode.

I guess that my main issue here is that I see potential story wise in Animated but within the same episode I see this potential trashed, spat and overall ruined by ridiculous concepts and themes that end up dominating much of the episode.

With the Unicron series, at least they were consistent and allowed you to watch them for what they were..Animated shows you something awesome one second and something appallingly bad the next, usually leaving a bad taste in the mouth for the remainder of the episode. I just can't enjoy a series that way.

[Robzy]

The only thing I really don't like about Animated is that damn 'magic' Allspark Key of Sari's!!!! :mad: :p Aside from that, I'm actually quite enjoying it too!

And I agree - the show is really aimed at kids first, and adult fans second. But that's okay! There's one definitive way to get around this... An animation studio needs to make a "re-make" of the original G1 series (with as many of the original voice actors as possible), direct to DVD and aimed at adult fans! And there should be no toys - that way the writers can base a story around any character they want, instead of what toy needs to be promoted!

[Gutsman Heavy]

There's one definitive way to get around this... An animation studio needs to make a "re-make" of the original G1 series (with as many of the original voice actors as possible), direct to DVD! And there should be no toys - that way the writers can base a story around any character they want, instead of what toy needs to be promoted!

good idea, about as likely as finding Sarah Michelle Gellar in my bed tonight though :(

[GoktimusPrime]

heheh yeah. There's no way HasTak would ever fund a television series based on a non-existent toyline that they're not trying to sell. Remember that Transformer TV series are essentially advertisements for the toys. No toys, no show.

But it is possible to do this in comic books, and Dreamwave and IDW etc have provided us with numerous comic book series not bound by any TF toy lines.


And I agree - the show is really aimed at kids first, and adult fans second. But that's okay!
I don't mind the fact that adult fans are a secondary concern for the writers... what irks me more is that they're not really trying that hard to engage the adult audience at a serious level.

Beast Wars was primarily aimed at kids yet even at a secondary level it did effectively engage older audiences.

[TheDirtyDigger]

But it is possible to do this in comic books, and Dreamwave and IDW etc have provided us with numerous comic book series not bound by any TF toy lines.

I thought it was cool how the IDW stories have taken 'toys' from different lines and used them...
Titanium OP, Classics Jetfire and G1 Technobots all in the one story. That's how I like my universe.:)

Ok will try watching Animated again and more than just the first episode from a (much) simpler perspective but I fear my base hatred will lose none of it's maliciousness.

[GoktimusPrime]

Actually Titanium Optimus Prime was based off Dreamwave's War Within Optimus Prime... I don't recall IDW ever using that design as I imagine it would infringe copyright. That's why IDW used Classics Jetfire instead of DW's War Within Jetfire (which is what Titanium Series Jetfire is).

The War Within Jetfire
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/5/5a/Jetfiredarkages.jpg/150px-Jetfiredarkages.jpghttp://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h254/emzo117/titaniumjetfire.jpg

Classics Jetfire
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/1/1e/Jetfireclassics.jpg/180px-Jetfireclassics.jpghttp://members9.tsukaeru.net/ty1_toys/robo/TF_CLASSICS/CL_JETFIRE/CL_JETFIRE_27.jpg

[TheDirtyDigger]

Ok just checked and OP in IDW isn't exactly like the titanium version as his chest isn't so prominent but he does have those bars across his headlights which is why I thought it was.

My very valid point still stands though.....


I thought it was cool how the IDW stories have taken 'toys' from different lines and used them...

[GoktimusPrime]

Furman has been doing stuff like that since G1. :) Most other TF writers like to keep TFs within the same line and same subgroup (e.g.: Constructicons vs Dinobots etc), whereas Furman likes to mix them up, e.g.: the Wreckers = Jumpstarters + Deluxe Autobots + Triple Changers + Impactor + Rack N' Ruin, Decepticon Mayhem Attack Squads = (at different stages) "Small" Pretenders, Pretender Beasts, "Small" Targetmasters, Triggercons, Deluxe Insecticons and Duocons; and of course, there was the Survivors which was comprised of Autobots and Decepticons. It was cool because a lot of kids liked mixing up toys from different factions to form their own special units, which is what these teams looked like. :)

[Bartrim]

hehe. I actually have my toys displayed in random lots for that very reason:D

[Tiby]

The king is dead. Long live the king!

Grimlock falls victim to trademark hassles:

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/animated-8/transformerscom-update-animated-dinobots-and-soundwave-bios-and-more-164358/

[Paulbot]

I don't get why they've gone with "Autobot Grimlock" and not "Dinobot Grimlock"??? And why not "Dinobot Slag" while they are at it? :(

[GoktimusPrime]

Wha-?! But we had a Grimlock in Classics not too long ago! How did Hasbro drop the ball on that?!? (O_o)

Still, I'm glad that they've gone for "Autobot Grimlock" instead of naming him after some other Dinobot like "Sludge" or worse, a non-Dinobot like "Wheelie." I would have preferred "Dinobot Grimlock" but "Autobot Grimlock" works for me.

I'm more disappointed that Slag will be called "Snarl" - I would greatly prefer "Autobot Slag" over "Snarl." (-_-) Still... Snarl works for this character (well, it works for any character who's surly :p)


"Where are DECEPTICONS? Me GRIMLOCK getting hungry!"
I'm glad that they're doing tech specs again but that motto is just sh!t... it absolutely fails in comparison with Grimlock's original motto of "Among winners there is no room for the weak." (also Tankor's motto :))


GRIMLOCK more than lives up to the reputation of his Tyrannosaurus Rex mode. Ill-tempered, powerful, and always ready for a fight, he loves to throw his weight around. He likes the way the ground shakes as he stomps around, and the way people scatter when he roars. He's happiest on DINOBOT Island, where he can stomp and roar to his Spark's content, shattering trees with his tail, and breathing jets of flame into the sky. Every once in a while, though, he prefers to find the biggest, most powerful DECEPTICON he can, and smash its chassis to pieces.
*sigh* They've taken my favourite Dinobot and made him into a really strong and powerful retard. (-_-) I hated it when the G1 cartoon writers did it to the Dinobots in Transformers The Movie and post-movie eps, and I'm hating it just as much now.

Grimlock will obviously be appearing in the next G1 series from IDW and I'm sure that Furman will do him greater justice - after all, it was Simon Furman who showed us how awesome Grimlock could really be (although Budiansky did a decent job with Grimlock to - it was Budiansky who created "King" Grimlock ;)).

http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/7/71/Biggrim_me_king.jpg

Whoever decided that Animated Grimlock needed to be stupid needs a good sharp solid square kick to the janglies with spiked steel capped boots (where the spike tips are laced with hydrochloric acid).


"SNARL SMASH!"

"Bombs away!"
(O_o) See what I mean about failing to engage the older demographic? Hell, this is barely even engaging most kids and is quite frankly insulting their intelligence... (-_-) *sigh*


Bio: One of the first robots brought to life on Earth by the power of the AllSpark, SNARL has a lot in common with the dinosaur whose form he takes in beast mode. He's almost impossible to hurt, first of all, and he really likes smashing stuff with his tail, or ramming it with the horns on his head. He prefers his beast mode to his robot mode, because he has more options for how to smash stuff as a triceratops. He doesn't take delight in random destruction the way some DECEPTICONS do - he just really likes being strong, and breaking stuff seems like the best way to enjoy it.

Like the other DINOBOTS, SWOOP prefers to be left alone on DINOBOT Island, where he can soar and dive without worrying about the DECEPTICONS taking pot shots at his wings. When he does have to return to the mainland to battle the DECEPTICONS, however, he enjoys the way people scatter when they see his shadow. That, and smashing trees with his ball and chain doesn't compare to the satisfying crunch it makes when it bashes into DECEPTICON armor.
Could someone please tell me what's the difference between the Animated Dinobots?? Their characters read to be virtually identical to me - i.e.: they're really strong and like to smash stuff - grrr! Oh wait, Swoop is different - he likes to fly... and smash stuff! OOoOOooOooHhhhHhhhH!!11!!~1 Even the cartoon Dinobots had greater individuality than this (well, in the pre-movie seasons).

The amount of creativity and imagination put into these characters is astoundingly underwhelming and sorely disappointing thus far.


"You ain't heard nothin' yet!"
Bio: SOUNDWAVE has only been around for a little while, but he knows that if there's one thing he loves, it's noise! Sound is like clay that he sculpts to his purpose. The more noise there is around him, the more elaborate he can get in how he uses it. He can imitate voices, make humans fall asleep, and even take control of simple robots with sound. He hopes the AUTOBOTS are ready, because he's about to rock them harder than they've ever been rocked before.
i.e.: "Soundwave likes to be noisy." *ahem* L A M E !

This profile tells us nothing of his personality... but I will give credit to the Animated writers for giving him more personality depth beyond what his tech specs gives us, even if it is actually Shockwave's personality (beats having no characterisation at all which is what the Dinobots seem to be afflicted with).

[STL]

I concur with you, Gok. Very frustrating

With Soundwave I can sort of can understand being noisy and causing a ruckus is this Soundwave's modus operandi. It's based on how he was constructed. But there is a lack of any other motivations. I hope that's because he only appeared in 1 episode and that's all we ever know about him.

I just want the toys though. As a line, Animated is decent on its own terms but hardly as compelling as G1.

And the trademark hassles annoying but as long as Hasbro use the prefix Autobot <character>, I'm cool. It just surpirses me they can get away with on TV-Comics but not with the toys.

[kup]

I just want the toys though. As a line, Animated is decent on its own terms but hardly as compelling as G1

What's that you say? This is "the G1 of today" remember? :p

I am not impressed on all fronts on this line but as strange as it is, it does have an overwhelmingly positive (I would say excessively) reaction in the American community, although I am yet to see someone put forth a decent argument to back up their statements beyond the "ZOMG!!! BEST EVA!!"

If the fan community is an indication of the response from the broader community, it is safe to assume that we will be getting more Animated or Animated inspired Transformers for several years to come. I find this disappointing :(

[STL]

What's that you say? This is "the G1 of today" remember? :p


I still maintain that it could be. Not to me, but to the kids that will grow to be fans like ourselves. My little sister loves BW and G1, BW for Rattrap and Waspinator; and G1 for it's sheer G1 goodness (meaning i don't know why).

I think when she finally watches Animated she'll be in love with it b/c it's more relatable to her and kids of her age.

That said, G1 will always be my G1. Animated (I hope) will usher a new age of collectors. Cybertron and Energon were far more cringeworthy. Armada's dialogue left me wanting to smash my head against a wall.



If the fan community is an indication of the response from the broader community, it is safe to assume that we will be getting more Animated or Animated inspired Transformers for several years to come. I find this disappointing :(

That's a scary thought. I can live with the novelty of Animated but bots in the Cybertron style of toys is what I'd want. I'm sure I'd end up buying those lines but I'll miss the Cybertron styled toys. It was the first time they got modern Transformers working in G1-ish proportions without being cumbersome.

[i_amtrunks]

I'm severely disappointed with the tech specs section, theres no tech specs to be found, just some dot points.:(

[GoktimusPrime]

kup raises a good point, IMO Animated really fails even at marketing towards kids compared to G1. Remember that G1 was marketed toward kids - we were kids when G1 came out! But yet it was written at a much higher level than Animated appears to be!

G1 tech specs portrayed each Transformer as being unique individuals, complete with personality quirks.
Compare the G1 and Animated Dinobots here...

G1/G2 Grimlock
Strong and arrogant but ultimately an Autobot at heart (and this was decently written in the pre-movie cartoon seasons). Being elected as Autobot leader saw the old "absolute power corrupts absolutely," becoming a tyrant king. His leadership of Earthforce and later leadership of the Autobots (as Optimus Prime's named successor) saw him learning the mistakes of the past becoming a smart and savvy Autobot commander - once giving Prowl a good verbal serve and being one of few Autobots to see through the Decepticons' guise during the Autobot-Decepticon Alliance. In Generation 2 Grimlock saved Optimus Prime and was a major contributor in the Autobot-Decepticon alliance against The Swarm.

Animated Grimlock
SMASH!

G1 Slag
"My love for you is like a truck, BERSERKER!" (Clerks)
At first this might seem the same as Animated Sla-- Snarl, but it's more... Slag IS a berserker - as in like from Norse/Viking and Old English literature. Beowulf'd!! He was also the Dinobots' flamethrower (once burnt a hole in Unicron's ass!), whereas in Animated it seems that they can all throw fire!

Animated Snarl
SMASH!

G1 Swoop
Was always one of the somewhat more intelligent and benevolent Dinobots. Both he and Snarl were created to counter the rogue Dinobots (Grimlock, Slag and Sludge) in the G1 cartoon and later in "Desertion of the Dinobots" it was Swoop who managed to escape and later teamed up with Spike and Carly to free the other Dinobots (and save the Autobots on Earth). In the comics he began as a member of the Autobot Elite Flying Corps - originally known as Divebomb until he lost a dogfight with a Decepticon ace who then stole his name, forcing him to rename himself as Swoop... a shame that he carries with him until he can one day best Divebomb in battle and reclaim his name.

Animated Swoop
Fly! ...then SMASH!

...Animated writers could potentially make the Dinobots more interesting in future Animated episodes - raising them above what their pitiful personas alotted to them by their tech specs. They've already done so for Soundwave... but Hasbro certainly doesn't seem to be trying that hard to give these Transformers any real decent characterisation. (-_-)

[roller]

so are IDW gonna do a DW and make the comic better then the cartoon?

[kup]

The comics are already out. They are basically episode Transcripts, they are exactly the same as the cartoon almost as if they just took screenshots from the episode and added speech bubbles.

[roller]

oh are they the only comics we will be getting from the animated series?

that sucks

they are just the same as the eps

[GoktimusPrime]

Which is disappointing... IDW would have had the potential to provide us with a better alternative Animated continuity. Dreamwave provided us with better continuities for Armada and Energon, especially Armada; I really liked how the Armada comics portrayed Cybertronian society as a caste society. ;)

[Paulbot]

There's some sample pics from the Animated Comic in my review (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=393).

[GoktimusPrime]

I just finished watching Peter Jackson's King Kong for the first time and I reckon that Kong got way more character development and was better written as a character than any of the Transformers in Animated - especially the Autobots and most especially Bulkhead and the Dinobots. (-_-)

[Gutsman Heavy]

too bad that film is way too damn long, unlike Animated which doesn't outstay its welcome :)

a good film but horrible pacing, cut 45mins from that beast!

[Paulbot]

I've moved the second series preview and the discussion of characters within it to a separate thread where you can discuss the spoilers in the preview at your pleasure: http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=728

[The_Damned]

I just finished watching Peter Jackson's King Kong for the first time and I reckon that Kong got way more character development and was better written as a character than any of the Transformers in Animated - especially the Autobots and most especially Bulkhead and the Dinobots. (-_-)

KK was bad i kept expecting JB to do something other then be serious and it dragged on way to long, over all i was very disappointed, considering how good the director's last movies were. i dont know how you can compare an animated cartoon with a crappy remake of a movie.

[GoktimusPrime]

...getting back on topic - I'm not trying to say that King Kong was a particularly good or bad movie - just mentioning the irony that a giant gorilla was a better written character than the Animated TFs who seem more like a bunch of caricatures.

[SilverDragon]

...getting back on topic - I'm not trying to say that King Kong was a particularly good or bad movie - just mentioning the irony that a giant gorilla was a better written character than the Animated TFs who seem more like a bunch of caricatures.

I don't think that. They've been developed quite well so far-and at least it isn't Energon-level of character inconsistancy.

[autobreadticon]

:( is Canada going to air a new episode this week?