Government finally asking if gamers want an R rating

[Dkaris]

Just saw a story on this on news.com.au but iPod is about to die. About time we got an R classification.

Update:aliens be predator 2 has been cleared for. MS classification. Ore ordered my hunter edition today

[Linthart]

I'll second that motion. I read a statement from Eb games saying that basically left 4 dead 2 sales were abysmal due to the censoring and it's really cut them deep. In our economic state I should think that the government should be doing all that it can to keep gamers money (which is a $1b industry in Australia) within our economy instead of forcing us to importing, piracy and the general need for sending our money elsewhere

[1AZRAEL1]

We better get an R rating for games, they need to realise not all games are played by people under the age of 18.

And I agree with Linthart, I read what EB had to say about it and agree. More people would resort to importing/pirating the game because they don't want the censored abortion that is the version we have been given. If I want a game, I want to play it the way that the creators intended, and not a watered down version of it.

[Starscream212]

Sounds like the government is gunna let us have a R18 rating on games but then try to censor our internet! Ahhh cant win!

[Sam]

One of the crazy things is all this is the double-standards going on; films have an R rating but games don't.

The logic that by not introducing an R rating for games in order to "protect" children is also flawed.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

One of the crazy things is all this is the double-standards going on; films have an R rating but games don't.

The logic that by not introducing an R rating for games in order to "protect" children is also flawed.

Most parents don't even realise that there is no R rating for video games. Ridiculous innit.

Have your say everyone, the more we say we want one, they will have to take it seriously.


R18+ Classification for Computer Games - Public Consultation (http://www.ag.gov.au/\gamesclassification)
Source:ag.gov.au (http://www.ag.gov.au/)

[Dkaris]

most parents dont realize there are child lock features on ps3 and 360

[Tober]

Yeah it sucks... It's taking forever for my import of Left4Dead2 to arrive... :mad:

Apparently it's pretty simple to unlock the restriction on the Australian PC censored version anyway.

[Dkaris]

In regard to the banned title Alien Vs predator 2, its now been given an MA banned and not censored or any less gory than the rest of the world.

[5FDP]

This is great news for all of us adult gamers - if they actually take it seriously.

From memory, an R classification has been considered many times before however a senator in SA opposed it blocking the move. I think he may be retiring from politics which is perhaps the reason this is being revisited.

It really doesn't make sense to not have one considering most people are importing their games and the local distributors are missing out on making money. This would also help protect Australian jobs.

At the end of the day, it's up to the parents to filter what their kids watch and play, and it shouldn't be up to any government to make such decisions.

[1AZRAEL1]

At the end of the day, it's up to the parents to filter what their kids watch and play, and it shouldn't be up to any government to make such decisions.

Spot on. The parents need to take responsibility rather than the government.

[Dkaris]

The lack of parenting in todays kids is shocking. I'll give you an example.

I work in a target store in NSW at least a few times a week i have parents coming in looking to get items such as nintendo DSi's/Lites, ipod touches, expensive digital cameras etc. When i ask how old the child is that they are buying these items for, about 80% of them tell me the kid is under 8 years old. Out of all the items above mentioned, the only one id get for an 8 year old is a DS. this generation of parenting is pathetic. no offense to any members on here who are parents, but i think a lot of parents use technology and the new gadgets to raise their kids for them. Sorry parents. technological devices aren't surrogates.

[kup]

The problem with modern culture and family dynamics is that nowadays it is necesary to have two incomes in order to sustain the average household. Both parents need to work full time from 9am to 6-7pm and when they come back they are exhaused and don't have time to properly mind the kids. They become what is essentially weekend parents and since they also need the weekend to rest, they don't do that weekend parenting that well either.

In the past there was always a parent who maintained the household and raised the kids - That parent may work part time but is otherwise present when the kid was back from school. Yeah the role used to belong to women but without the PC bullcrap the problem with modern society is that modern full time working parents prefer to delegate the raising of their children to either Institutions (child care, etc) the Government or the corporate industry because they don't have time to do so themselves - This reliance has been allowed to gradually increase and increase by many parents to the modern phenomenon of family members living their own lives and often not even bothering to dine together, almost as if they are all strangers to one another.

Modern generations of children are not raised by their parents but institutions, several women at my workplace for example come back only after a couple of months of maternity leave and Babies are raised by employed strangers working under a company policy when they are not even a year old. Their parents essentially become little more than babysitters in the after hours or holidays where the Government or corporate institutions don't function.

[SGB]

From memory, an R classification has been considered many times before however a senator in SA opposed it blocking the move. I think he may be retiring from politics which is perhaps the reason this is being revisited.
You're thinking of Michael Atkinson, the SA Attorney General.

Sadly, he's not retiring from politics.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

I had a read through the Discussion paper and interestingly it list one more "for" and R-rating than against. The majority of reasons listed on the "against" side are (Not suprisingly) somewhat laughable and reactionary cmments from most likely mis-informed people.

I am in the process of challenging the against arguments and might list them here if the writing still makes sense after my rage has been contained:D

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Bump.

Submissions close on the 28th of Feb.

http://www.ag.gov.au/gamesclassification

I printed out some foms and took them to work and got people there to fill them out. Many people aren't aware and they were appreacitive that I did this. (hint hint)

[Dkaris]

Just a quick update, If any of you guys out there have a thing for women in porn with small breasts, start saving it now, its yet another item being added to the ban list. The governments reason? Women in porn with small breasts look too much like children. I'm so over this country and the restrictions we have to deal with. We're really in a catch 22 right now. I thought the rudd government was only letting this slide a bit to keep the christians in the senate on side to get some bills through. I didnt actually think the government would let this thing go through, and support it. Now, if the liberals get in next election it will be even worse than it is now. =[

im sorry if im ranting but this particular subject really gets to me

[5FDP]

Just a quick update, If any of you guys out there have a thing for women in porn with small breasts, start saving it now, its yet another item being added to the ban list. The governments reason? Women in porn with small breasts look too much like children. I'm so over this country and the restrictions we have to deal with. We're really in a catch 22 right now. I thought the rudd government was only letting this slide a bit to keep the christians in the senate on side to get some bills through. I didnt actually think the government would let this thing go through, and support it. Now, if the liberals get in next election it will be even worse than it is now. =[

im sorry if im ranting but this particular subject really gets to me

I actually heard this bit of news on Foxtel's Attack of the Show (airing on Fuel TV) last week and thought it was just a piece of American humour and not to be taken seriously e.g. similar to the type of news they have on SNL.

On the flip side of this, isn't it discrimination against women with small breasts that want to be viewed on the internet??

They went on to say (on the show) that this has already resulted in an increase in the amount of women requested breast implants.

What has this world come to....

[Gutsman Heavy]

and I thought SA's new R18 laws were bad!

[Dkaris]

im so worked up over this i posted it in the wrong therad >_>

[1AZRAEL1]

Michael Atkinson says "Gamers scarier than bikers (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/gamers-scarier-than-bikers-says-minister-20100217-obqz.html)"

Unfortunately, the gamers that do send him threatening letters, or stalking him, only harms our cause to get an R18 rating for games.

Still, the guys a tosser.

And I just read the above posts as well, the whole "small breasted woman porn" because they look too much like children is a complete bollocks.

[kup]

Michael Atkinson says "Gamers scarier than bikers (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/gamers-scarier-than-bikers-says-minister-20100217-obqz.html)"

Unfortunately, the gamers that do send him threatening letters, or stalking him, only harms our cause to get an R18 rating for games.

Still, the guys a tosser.

And I just read the above posts as well, the whole "small breasted woman porn" because they look too much like children is a complete bollocks.

Politicans Scarier Than Gamers (http://smarthouse.com.au/Comment/A3N5J2H7)

[Autocon]

saw this on good game

hex lex whatever her name is :D hearticon

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Michael Atkinson says "Gamers scarier than bikers (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/gamers-scarier-than-bikers-says-minister-20100217-obqz.html)"

Unfortunately, the gamers that do send him threatening letters, or stalking him, only harms our cause to get an R18 rating for games.

Still, the guys a tosser.

And I just read the above posts as well, the whole "small breasted woman porn" because they look too much like children is a complete bollocks.

I fear this will go nowhere, even with the discussion paper. Needing a 100% consesnsus to change is probably not going to happen, mainly due to Atkinson's resolute refusal to accept the many logical arguments of the opposing side. Its disconcerting that he is even a politician with such a blinkered closed view of any subject.

One cant have a discussion to sort out an issue if the other side completely refuses to acknowledge ones view...

Found an anti- R18 site. Thanks to gamespot. They bust out the same rubbish as Atkinson. Dont these people realise that sexual content would eb refused anyway? Yet again they whip out Rapelay as an example. *sigh* Morons, complete morons. No idea at all....

[DarkHyren]

Women in porn with small breasts look too much like children.And next thing you know guys will be arrested for dating women with small breasts -_-
The government is trying to get a foothold so they can eventually ban all porn, I'm certain of that.

On the subject, I would welcome a R18+ rating, maybe then we can get full versions of games rather then cut ones.
Game developers will be able to make games without trying to sneak a R rated game in under a MA rating or worrying if it will upset some prude/moral psycho/priest somewhere.

Also it would keep the really violent games away from some children and then we maybe won't have so many of the little criminals running around because their idiot of a parent let them have bad games because "it's only rated M/MA".
No matter how bad a parent they are at least a few of them won't buy their little troublemakers really violent games if the game is rated R.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

SO true. Many parents dont understand the MA rating or take it seriously, but most understand the seriousness of an R rating.

IMO the current ratings set up is pretty weak, the "M" rating is sooooooo broad that a vast majority of games from "mild" to "kind of strong" content fits in.

The MA with the whole "Parent or legal guardian" clause is just a joke. Yay or nay. Know what I mean? Set some definate guidelines on age. They can either buy/see or not. How many shops actually check if a kid's elder is their legal guardian or not? Ridiculous


Only 7 days to get those submissions in now.

ends on the 28th February

[Dkaris]

SO true. Many parents dont understand the MA rating or take it seriously, but most understand the seriousness of an R rating.

IMO the current ratings set up is pretty weak, the "M" rating is sooooooo broad that a vast majority of games from "mild" to "kind of strong" content fits in.

The MA with the whole "Parent or legal guardian" clause is just a joke. Yay or nay. Know what I mean? Set some definate guidelines on age. They can either buy/see or not. How many shops actually check if a kid's elder is their legal guardian or not? Ridiculous


Only 7 days to get those submissions in now.

ends on the 28th February

I think another thing with ratings like MA though, is how often to retailers enforce them? I dont know about you guys but there have been numerous times ive been in a que and the sales person has sold MA games like modern warfare 2 to a kid who is no where near 15. I dont see retailers asking these kids for their ID or see any signs up saying that MA games will not be sold to kids under 15 years. =/

[SGB]

16,000 signatures collected for R18+ rating petition (http://www.arnnet.com.au/article/337155/16_000_signatures_collected_r18_rating_petition/)

[1AZRAEL1]

Yea I saw that in the MX yesterday, but will it be enough? It did say the average gamer's age was 30 and that adults should have the right to decide what games they want to play. But critics argue the move would see an increase in the video-game violence and expose children to harsh content.

It should be enforced that you would have to show ID if they suspect you look underage, much like buying alcohol or porn :p

I can't see that children will see more violence than what they already see. The parents should be governing what they watch or play.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Exactly. Although the discussion paper is just that, discussing the prospect of an R rating. So its still a way off, but at least momentum is gathering.

I think the amount of violent media that is allowed in will be negligible, as most of the time, the games that are refused classification just change something minor and re-apply and make it in the MA rating. Except for left for dead 2. Even then, I suspect the makers may have been making a point with the amount they cut. From the admittedly limited footage I have seen of the Aus verison, it looks like an M game now...

[Gutsman Heavy]

the only reason L4D2 is so heavily cut is because they just gave us the German edit, instead of editing specifically for Aus. All shooters, and violent games in general are heavily edited for Germany.

[SGB]

46,000 sign EB Games R18+ rating petition (http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/technology/sign-eb-games-r18-rating-petition/story-e6freaal-1225834375420)

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

the only reason L4D2 is so heavily cut is because they just gave us the German edit, instead of editing specifically for Aus. All shooters, and violent games in general are heavily edited for Germany.

Aaah ok. Poor Germans.
I also understand that applying to have something viewed for classification is fairly pricey, so i thought maybe the didn't want have to apply a third time.

[Sam]

Just wondering if anyone has tried to submit their views on the R18+ rating for games?

I tried the given email address from the government website (classificationreview@ag.gov.au), but it bounced back!

I just sent it again, hope it goes through.

[OrionPax]

Just wondering if anyone has tried to submit their views on the R18+ rating for games?

I tried the given email address from the government website (classificationreview@ag.gov.au), but it bounced back!

I just sent it again, hope it goes through.

They're probably flooded with emails and also extremely cautious after the hacking incident

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Just wondering if anyone has tried to submit their views on the R18+ rating for games?

I tried the given email address from the government website (classificationreview@ag.gov.au), but it bounced back!

I just sent it again, hope it goes through.

I did mint through the old fashioned fax machine.

[kup]

Everytime I have to deal with anything to do with the Government I need to fax things.

It really shows how on top of the technological game they are.

[Sam]

Everytime I have to deal with anything to do with the Government I need to fax things.

It really shows how on top of the technological game they are.

You have no idea how true that is. I have firsthand experience! :)

[SGB]

Games rating call gets 55,000 submissions (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/australian-it/games-classification-call-gets-55000-submissions/story-e6frgakx-1225837084356)

[SGB]

Video game 'cancer' group funded by Atkinson (http://www.news.com.au/technology/video-game-cancer-group-funded-by-atkinson/story-e6frfro0-1225837330811)

[5FDP]

Bloody hell... talk about much ado about nothing. This Atkinson guy seems to have nothing better to do or any other priorities for that matter. Surely there are other more pressing matters for him to focus his attention on... It kind of embarrasses me that he is a fellow South Australian.

Question - I don't know much about politics, but if the below is true, how can an R classification ever come into effect while this guy is still in office? Was there any point of the petition?


As a state attorney-general, his approval is required for any changes to the classification system.

[Gutsman Heavy]

I'm surprised Atkinson has time to rag on video games when he's trolling news forums and claiming anyone who disagrees with him a liberal plant.

[DarkHyren]

Atkinson is a complete nutter, but unfortunatly he is like alot of older people, stuck in the past.
Most generations have to suffer this type of nonsense from people like him if they have / develop something the older generation didn't have.
It happened with rock and roll, cars, indoor plumbing, everyday people owning land, so on and so forth backwards through time.
All of those things were considered "evil" by the past generations that didn't understand them, but look at the way things are now.
Would you consider indoor plumbing evil?
You probally wouldn't, because it has been around since you were born.

Unfortunately in this case, the guy has some power to affect others so we need to deal with his type of thinking on a more regular basis rather then ignoring them.

[5FDP]

Would you consider indoor plumbing evil?


:confused:

[SGB]

Gamers attack Christian lobby over R18+ 'lies' (http://www.itwire.com/it-policy-news/regulation/37387-gamers-attack-christian-lobby-over-r18-lies)

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Bloody hell... talk about much ado about nothing. This Atkinson guy seems to have nothing better to do or any other priorities for that matter. Surely there are other more pressing matters for him to focus his attention on... It kind of embarrasses me that he is a fellow South Australian.

Question - I don't know much about politics, but if the below is true, how can an R classification ever come into effect while this guy is still in office? Was there any point of the petition?
Well, I believe he was behind the R18 poster thing that is going on in SA now. Why he is in power? Sadly people vote for him.



indoor plumbing
ROFL!


Video game 'cancer' group funded by Atkinson (http://www.news.com.au/technology/video-game-cancer-group-funded-by-atkinson/story-e6frfro0-1225837330811)
This guy is not even trying to pretend to have an open mind. The only way to get an R rating is if he goes, or the process changes.

The discussion paper was never likely to have pushed an R rating in, but it is there to advise GA's on what the people are after. Akinson needs to heed the information in the paper and accept the findings. Politicans are there to act on behalf of those they represent, not themselves.

[kup]

Politicans are there to act on behalf of those they represent, not themselves.

That is a philosophy which is almost completely absent in Australian politics.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

That is a philosophy which is almost completely absent in Australian politics.

Yes, its a sad state of affairs...

[SGB]

Well, I believe he was behind the R18 poster thing that is going on in SA now.
While he agreed with the idea, he didn't come up with it. It was a Family First member who came up with the idea. SA Libs and Labor stupidly agreed with it.

[SGB]

A fascinating read:

Ex-Classification Board Member Issues Pro R18+ Response (http://gamepolitics.com/2010/02/26/ex-classification-board-member-issues-pro-r18-response)

[1AZRAEL1]

Well this certainly puts a dent in our campaign to get an R18+ rating.

A special investigation by SMH (http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/declare-game-over-on-video-violence-degrading-our-kids-20100313-q539.html)

Now I can see parents against the R18+ rating will ahve a field day with this. But when you look at it, because it is R18, if the person buying the game looks underage, all the store has to do is ask for ID. Simple solution much like the selling of alcohol. The problem is with MA15+ games, you can't really ask for ID because there is none for that.

This article is going to blow everything out of propotion for the campaigners against the new rating.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Well this certainly puts a dent in our campaign to get an R18+ rating.

A special investigation by SMH (http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/declare-game-over-on-video-violence-degrading-our-kids-20100313-q539.html)

Now I can see parents against the R18+ rating will ahve a field day with this. But when you look at it, because it is R18, if the person buying the game looks underage, all the store has to do is ask for ID. Simple solution much like the selling of alcohol. The problem is with MA15+ games, you can't really ask for ID because there is none for that.

This article is going to blow everything out of propotion for the campaigners against the new rating.

I think this sould support the rating really, any semi-intelligent person knows about the R-rating for movies, its just that the MA15 rating is ridiculous. An R rating would take out the ambiguity out of the age thing.

It comes down eseentially to this: People repect the R rating for things and dont respect the MA15 rating for things.

I think that is essentially a pro-R rating articel IMO, after all it is talking about parental judgement for games and ssaying that children are lightly effected by violent games. Therefore R rating takes the children thing out of the picture.

[SGB]

Holy. Crap.

Attorney-General Michael Atkinson to quit front bench (http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/in-depth/attorney-general-michael-atkinson-to-quit-front-bench/story-fn2sdwup-1225843341005)

While this is great news, don't pop the champers yet regarding R-rating for video games as the new A-G could wind up sharing the same views as Atkinson.

[1AZRAEL1]

Well, that is unexpected, but welcomed. Lets hope it will lead to a victory for gamers.

[SGB]

Gamers 4 Croydon hails ‘fantastic’ Atkinson resignation (http://delimiter.com.au/2010/03/21/gamers-4-croydon-hails-fantastic-atkinson-resignation/)

[5FDP]

Atkinson resigned :eek:

This is certainly good news for the R classification for video games as he was the main opposition. Sure, the person filling his shoes might share the same views, but this can only be a good thing and a step in the right direction.

[Tober]

Wii could be worse than Xbox, says politician (http://www.news.com.au/technology/wii-could-be-worse-than-xbox-says-politician/story-e6frfro0-1225843683915)

So much for my plans for a new Wii motion-device that simulates turkey-slapping Labor politicians. :(

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Regulate, regulate, regulate. No-one think for themselves anymore, its illegal.


He also said it was up to those campaigning for an R18+ classification to prove why one should be introduced.
eeer, wasnt that what the submissions on the debate about the R18 all about??

[1AZRAEL1]

A good point was raised in the comments I read. Running around with cap guns and playing cowboys and indians, is that any different? Yet they still allow sales of toy guns for kids to play with. I used to have alot of them, did I turn out bad? No. Am I going to go out and kill people because I grew up playing cowboys and indians? No. Games are just that, games. A break from reality. Really it is up to the parents to not buy violent games for their kids, but to also explain to them the difference between games and reality and that it is wrong to emulate what you play in real life. For me, it all comes down to the parents.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Yep, Thats what it is. Parents.

Thats is where the buck stops, but in todays society I see a lot of parents that just dont have time/care for their children. That makes me sad.

[SGB]

New S.A. A-G has been named, and it appears he's in support of an R-rating for games:

John Rau open to R18+ rating, says campaigner (http://www.news.com.au/technology/john-rau-open-to-r18-games-says-campaigner/story-e6frfro0-1225845233727)

[Saintly]

Yep, Thats what it is. Parents.

Thats is where the buck stops, but in todays society I see a lot of parents that just dont have time/care for their children. That makes me sad.

Not all parents don't care for their kids, TC :)

I limit my 10yr old (Saintly legend) to about 30min sessions a day and we (parents) take turns watching what he does, whether he is playing games or simply using the internet.

And in term of games, I have a limited range of MA rated games which I would only play after 9pm (the kids go to bed at 8.30pm).

Heck I don't even have MP Megatron, that's how far I've gone, protecting their minds.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Thats er, very saintly (?) Pun intended.

I didn't mean to say all parents dont look after their kids, but some dont. That was all, I meant no offence;)

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

According to gamespot the GA's will have a get together and the results of the discussion paper will be tabled for them to peruse on May 7th

http://au.gamespot.com/news/6258745.html?tag=latestheadlines%3Btitle%3B1
And now the fun begins

[SGB]

Strong gamer response caused Aussie R18+ setback (http://au.gamespot.com/pages/news/story.php?sid=6262044&skipmc=1)

I say horsecrap. The AGs' spin reeks of them having decided against an R-rating and looking for a way to say so in a manner that minimises political damage.

[1AZRAEL1]

And what's not legitimate about who submitted? We are passionate about our games, and we damn we should be. If parents cared that much that they see that games are going to cause their kids to turn bad, they need to look in there own backyard. How many of us played, or saw, Doom when it came out, and who were young? I know I was, and I turned out ok. By today's standards, Doom would be R18, if we had that rating.

This is complete horsecrap, because they full well know that there is more support for it than against it. They and all the other idiots, don't realise it would make more sense to have it, as alot more games would be released as R18 and parents would then know they shouldn't buy it for their kids.

Ugh rant over for now.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Of course its going to have a strong gamer turn out. Gamers are the ones directly effected by it.

Its like having a consoltation on whether or not to ban religion and then ignoring because all the religious people submitted their views.

Smells dodgy to me.

[Sam]

Looks like they just don't want to accept that many people have made well-reasoned arguments for an 18+ game rating.

It's wrong for them to argue that the fact that people who submit their opinions are gamers necessarily invalidates their views, I think that's some kinda association fallacy.

[SGB]

Now here's a surprise: former Queensland Premier Peter Beattie supports the introduction of an R-rating for video games.

Gamers need long pants, not ill-fitting SquarePants (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/gamers-need-long-pants-not-ill-fitting-squarepants/story-e6frg6zo-1225887105651)

[SGB]

R18+ Are You Ready? (http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/11/r18-are-you-ready/)

[5FDP]

About bloody time I say! Hopefully this time there will be a decision made instead of putting it off any further.

[Hursticon]

I agree 5FDP, I'm tired of Politicians who grew up in the years immediately after the WWII telling me that Video Games are for children and they're not a real art form! :mad:

Australia needs to have an 18+ Rating in games as well as further financial Government Assistance and Incentives for local gaming companies to grow and compete in an area of the Entertainment Industry that makes x3 times the amount of money in a year than all of Hollywood, both TV and Cinema, combined! ;)

[SGB]

READY: Grow Up Australia (http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/11/ready-grow-up-australia/)

[SGB]

Video game violence link inconclusive, finds Govt (http://delimiter.com.au/2010/12/01/video-game-violence-link-inconclusive-finds-govt/)

Attorney-General overwhelmed by support for R18+ games classification (http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/369850/attorney-general_overwhelmed_by_support_r18_games_classific ation/)

New research clears way for new R18+ ratings on violent games (http://www.news.com.au/technology/gaming/new-research-clears-way-for-new-r18-ratings-on-violent-games/story-e6frfrt9-1225964194494)

Findings on video game violence ’too hasty’ (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/findings-on-video-game-violence-too-hasty-20101202-18gux.html)

Home Affairs minister voices support for R18+ (http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/369989/home_affairs_minister_voices_support_r18_/)

[Hursticon]

So they finally found out what the industry had been saying all along?:rolleyes:
This debate is getting old now, they should just instate the 18+ Rating and be done with it. :cool:
Those friggin' christian lobby groups need to keep their noses out of which doesn't concern them, as they don't understand the situation anyway, as they're whole argument is completely hypocritical and dismisses the 75% of people who actually play games - Those who are over 15! :mad:

[SGB]

Labor to back adults-only games classification (http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/12/05/3084954.htm)

[Sam]

Those friggin' christian lobby groups need to keep their noses out of which doesn't concern them, as they don't understand the situation anyway, as they're whole argument is completely hypocritical and dismisses the 75% of people who actually play games - Those who are over 15! :mad:

I hope you realise not all Christians are against the 18+ rating....

As a Christian myself, I wrote a submission to have an 18+ rating for video games. From what I understand, a lot of people supported this, but the government still hasn't acted (*frustrated sigh*).

I also spoke with my other Christian friends who are also gamers. To them, an 18+ rating for games is a logical choice. Unfortunately, they're all Americans and they have an 18+ rating over there already. :(

I agree that the ACL is not always in touch with the actual situation though!

[Hursticon]

I hope you realise not all Christians are against the 18+ rating....

As a Christian myself, I wrote a submission to have an 18+ rating for video games. From what I understand, a lot of people supported this, but the government still hasn't acted (*frustrated sigh*).

I also spoke with my other Christian friends who are also gamers. To them, an 18+ rating for games is a logical choice. Unfortunately, they're all Americans and they have an 18+ rating over there already. :(

I agree that the ACL is not always in touch with the actual situation though!

I most certainly do realise Sam, I'm not an idiot as I've got a very devout Tafe mate who is absolutely nuts about Unreal Tournament. :cool:
I was merely pointing out that a lot of 'Christian Lobby Groups', not Christians in general, tend to stuff up a lot of things for people that have absolutely no affect on them whatsoever. :mad:
I hope I didn't offend you or any other Christian members as that was certainly not my intention. :)

[Sam]

I most certainly do realise Sam, I'm not an idiot as I've got a very devout Tafe mate who is absolutely nuts about Unreal Tournament. :cool:
I was merely pointing out that a lot of 'Christian Lobby Groups', not Christians in general, tend to stuff up a lot of things for people that have absolutely no affect on them whatsoever. :mad:

That's right, many of those Christian Lobby groups are out of touch with reality and common sense and ruin the fun for everyone else.



I hope I didn't offend you or any other Christian members as that was certainly not my intention. :)

No offense taken mate, and none intended. Cheers. :)

[SGB]

WA government under pressure from MPs on R18+ video games (http://www.news.com.au/technology/wa-government-under-pressure-from-mps-on-r18-video-games/story-e6frfro0-1225965950660)

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Tomorrow is ab big day! Fingers crossed for an R18 rating. Hopefully those chumps in the WA govt won't ruin it for the rest of Australia.

Go Mr O'Connor!!!!

[Hursticon]

Tomorrow is ab big day! Fingers crossed for an R18 rating. Hopefully those chumps in the WA govt won't ruin it for the rest of Australia.

Go Mr O'Connor!!!!

Indeed! - Fingers and Toes are Crossed! :D:cool:

[SGB]

No decision today:

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/12/ready-democracy-inaction/

[Hursticon]

No decision today:

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/12/ready-democracy-inaction/

Just read...

FFS, is it really so hard? - why is it that 8 people are required to unanimously agree in order to get the R18+? when did it stop becoming a 'Majority Rules' system and become an 'All or Nothing' system? :confused:
The rest of the world sits back and laughs at us because it has taken over 3 years to decide... not to decide!?! :mad:

God F@#$ing Damn!

[SGB]

Gamers fume as states delay lifting ban on R 18+ video games (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/gamers-fume-as-states-delay-lifting-ban-on-r-18-video-games-20101210-18sih.html)

AG’s sidestep R18+ Classification for video games decision (http://www.itwire.com/your-it-news/entertainment/43850-ags-sidestep-r18-classification-for-video-games-decision)

O’Connor: Could Have Gone Better, On The Right Track, WA Not To Blame (http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/12/o-o-connor-could-have-gone-better-but-on-the-right-track-wa-ag-not-to-blame/)

[5FDP]

The consultation process found 98.4 per cent of the more than 58,000 respondents backed the move.

A national telephone survey also showed that 80 per cent of respondents supported an adults-only rating for video games.

Another case of the minority making decisions for the majority. Politicians never seem to learn that they are elected by the people to be a voice for the people. They make all the promises come election time, but everyone should know by now they have their own 'secret' agendas.

[SGB]

The R18+ Aftermath: Where To Now? (http://www.kotaku.com.au/2010/12/the-r18-aftermath-where-to-now/)

Attorney-General John Rau proposes scrapping of MA15 rating for video games (http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/make-games-adults-only/story-e6frea6u-1225969832993)

WA State Council calls for R18+ support (http://au.gamespot.com/pages/news/story.php?sid=6285276)

R18+ games – down but not out (http://www.efa.org.au/2010/12/13/r18-down-not-out/)

[SGB]

Conroy supports R18+ game classification (http://www.arnnet.com.au/article/375420/conroy_supports_r18_game_classification/)

[Hursticon]

Conroy supports R18+ game classification (http://www.arnnet.com.au/article/375420/conroy_supports_r18_game_classification/)

This guy is... Well, this guy! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3ieGbZji_4) :rolleyes:

[Golden Phoenix]

This guy is... Well, this guy! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3ieGbZji_4) :rolleyes:

I tend to think of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1dvSlvZLG8) when Conroy opens his mouth

[Hursticon]

I tend to think of this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1dvSlvZLG8) when Conroy opens his mouth

Ha! :eek::p:D
LOL - That's F'n Awesome man!, that is exactly what he is like! :p:D
(Nice find man, I laughed hard at that! :D:cool:)

[SGB]

Aussie R18+ decision impossible in March (http://au.gamespot.com/pages/news/story.php?sid=6299099)

[SGB]

O'Connor pushes for July R18+ deadline (http://au.gamespot.com/news/6299917.html)

[SGB]

Government threatens R-rating games showdown (http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/03/16/3165063.htm)

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

I think the shake up that is needed here is to lose the need for 100% consensus.

Blasted christian lobby, if they pulled their finger out and had a logical look at the evidence, then they would see the flaws in the current set up. Just think, how would and 'R' make easier access when R games are being shoehorned into an MA? It makes no sense. Phew, glad to have that off my chest for now.

[SharkyMcShark]

Blasted christian lobby, if they pulled their finger out and had a logical look at the evidence, then they would see the flaws in the current set up. Just think, how would and 'R' make easier access when R games are being shoehorned into an MA? It makes no sense.

This exactly encapsulates my thoughts on the matter. I couldn't care less about libertarian theory arguments about how the government is impinging on our freedom of speech and telling adults what they can and can't watch - not only do we have no guaruntee of freedom of speech in this country (well unless you live in Victoria or the ACT - two states that have actual blls of rights), but governments all over the world do that to their citizens to varying degrees.

However what annoys me about the current system is that games considered the world over to be for adult audiences (For example Saints Row 2, or GTA4) are classified as being alright for 15 year olds here - entirely defeating the basis of the stand being taken by the OFLC, that the minds of young people need to be protected from corrupting influences (or however it is they're wording it).

[5FDP]

R18+ games one step closer, says Brendan O'Connor (http://www.news.com.au/technology/gaming/r18-games-a-step-closer-says-brendan-oconnor/story-e6frfrt9-1226099826269)

So... Greg Smith is the new Michael Atkinson :rolleyes:

[Accel]

well they can over turn NSW apparently. so lets hope they can! XD

[Hursticon]

R18+ games one step closer, says Brendan O'Connor (http://www.news.com.au/technology/gaming/r18-games-a-step-closer-says-brendan-oconnor/story-e6frfrt9-1226099826269)

So... Greg Smith is the new Michael Atkinson :rolleyes:

This is excellent news :D, but seriously, after more than a decade's worth of consultation this A**-Clown wants to seek more opinions from Community Groups?... :confused::mad:
I'm going to hold my tongue on what I really think of that ridiculousness - there is always one isn't there? :rolleyes:

[bowspearer]

Blasted christian lobby, if they pulled their finger out and had a logical look at the evidence, then they would see the flaws in the current set up. Just think, how would and 'R' make easier access when R games are being shoehorned into an MA? It makes no sense. Phew, glad to have that off my chest for now.

You're surprised- this it the very lobby that were die-hard supporters of mandatory internet filtering, even though the first casualty of it in terms of political websites were anti-abortion pages. Seriously, if you could bottle that kind of irony, you'd have to ban it as the worlds worst chemical weapon- ever!

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

You're surprised- this it the very lobby that were die-hard supporters of mandatory internet filtering, even though the first casualty of it in terms of political websites were anti-abortion pages. Seriously, if you could bottle that kind of irony, you'd have to ban it as the worlds worst chemical weapon- ever!

Sadly not in the slightest. Its just a shame they don't think about the situation more thoroughly instead of over-reacting.

[Gutsman Heavy]

R18+ passed. Woo.

I do expect it to just be MA cut in half though.

[bowspearer]

Sadly not in the slightest. Its just a shame they don't think about the situation more thoroughly instead of over-reacting.

It is when you consider what a joke the current M+15/MA rating and enforcement has been in terms of child welfare.



R18+ passed. Woo.

I do expect it to just be MA cut in half though.

The MA/M+15 ratings need a massive overhaul. My concern with them now is that while games publishers were forced to shoehorn games innappropriate for kids into the ratings previously; how many will now still opt for shoehorning when they see their sales dropping because of all the ignorant/deadbeat parents who are no longer able to buy the likes of GTA for their 10 year old children.

[1AZRAEL1]

Watch the R18+ battle crumble now that some moron went on a killing spree and named Modern Warfare 2 as his training program.

This will be a setback with the kneejerk reaction that I know is coming.

[Accel]

it has already started. the minister for R18 tried to calm the christian groups down by saying the Norway guy was just an insane bastard.


to be fair he was an insane Christian fundamentalist too ;P maybe we should ban crazy Christian fundamentalists instead of R18 :3

[1AZRAEL1]

to be fair he was an insane Christian fundamentalist too ;P maybe we should ban crazy Christian fundamentalists instead of R18 :3

I like this idea better :p

[Hursticon]

I like this idea better :p

I agree, but I'm going to leave it there as I don't want to offend anyone. :o

[1AZRAEL1]

NSW backs R18+ video game rating (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/nsw-backs-r18-video-game-rating-20110810-1imr4.html)

[Hursticon]

NSW backs R18+ video game rating (http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/games/nsw-backs-r18-video-game-rating-20110810-1imr4.html)

It's good, but I'm not holding my breath yet - Chances are they'll just re-brand MA15+ as R18+ and we'll have only moved backwards. :(

[loophole]

yeah i heard on the radio today that they were going to add the R18+ but still ban games that they deem too violent, so what the bloody point then :mad:

[SkyWarp91]

yeah i heard on the radio today that they were going to add the R18+ but still ban games that they deem too violent, so what the bloody point then :mad:

WHAT. THE. FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

[Gutsman Heavy]

That's not surprising. I basically expect them to cut MA in half, AvP, Gta, COD and other "extreme" MA games would be R, and the less violent games stay in the MA rating.

[bowspearer]

That's not surprising. I basically expect them to cut MA in half, AvP, Gta, COD and other "extreme" MA games would be R, and the less violent games stay in the MA rating.

The other thing is that some games, especially if they involved, say sexual violence, don't even make an X rating in this country. So even with an R rating and things matching R ratings for movies, you'll still find some violent games will fit into the RC category.

[Gutsman Heavy]

And so it should, no game needs sexual violence. Rapelay can git the eff out of mah country!

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

And so it should, no game needs sexual violence. Rapelay can git the eff out of mah country!

What really bugs me about this whole debate is that those opposing the R rating would often use Rapelay as an example of games that would get in under the R18, but it has absolutely no chance due to the sexual content. If it did, RL would be available in countries with an R rating, but it isn't. As well as the fact the game programmers have done their best to keep it in Japan.

The arguments against the R rating have been so immature.

Hopefully the R rating will extend the options of more extreme content so we don't have to put up with butchered efforts such as GTA etc.

I will just be interested to see what limitations they put into the R rating now.

Anybody seen a draft of the plans anywhere?

[Hursticon]

And so it should, no game needs sexual violence. Rapelay can git the eff out of mah country!

I 100% agree that rape has no place in video games, hell I'd go so far as to say it shouldn't even be highlighted in movies, but the term sexual violence needs to be better defined IMO as I'll gladly defend my right to digitally beat the life out of someone with a 4ft Dildo-Sword! :cool:

It's my personal belief though that sex has a very valid and rightful place in video games and should certainly be incorporated tastefully and only in video games that are aimed at 18y/os and over - Barbie does enough for marketing sex to under 10s that games don't need to follow. ;)

[valkyrie_76]

And so it should, no game needs sexual violence. Rapelay can git the eff out of mah country!

Whoops

*deletes folder*

:D

[5FDP]

THE Gillard Government has introduced legislation to establish an R18+ category for computer games (http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/r-rating-for-computer-games-planned/story-e6freuy9-1226271650856).

[1AZRAEL1]

Well, just have to see what kind of effect it has. But this could be the first thing she has done that I actually like.

[Doubledealer]

Heh. I still refuse to believe anything until I walk into a store and see that R18+ sticker on the box.

[Hursticon]

Heh. I still refuse to believe anything until I walk into a store and see that R18+ sticker on the box.

Agreed, it'd better not be on a bloody Spyro game either!

[5FDP]

Heh. I still refuse to believe anything until I walk into a store and see that R18+ sticker on the box.

What about now DD? :D

Gamers get adults-only R18+ classification (http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/technology/gaming/gamers-get-adults-only-r18-classification/story-fn6saqys-1226399236193)

[Accel]

they all seem to forget the dude they did all the hard work and then booted out during Gillards reshuffle.

he worked on it for a looooooooooong time

[Doubledealer]

What about now DD? :D

Gamers get adults-only R18+ classification (http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/technology/gaming/gamers-get-adults-only-r18-classification/story-fn6saqys-1226399236193)

Haha, I'm still skeptical. :p

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Haha, I'm still skeptical. :p

Yeh, Likewise. I have a horrible feeling that everything in the MA rating will get classed as R18 and we will just be in the same spot as before. Because apparently games are the root of all evil.

I am most curious to see how they set the parameters for the rating now. Time will tell.

[5FDP]

That's a good point TC. Quite a few games that have reached our shores as MA15+ have been rated as R or the equivalent of in other countries. Having said that, it also comes down to different cultural beliefs and tolerances.

The ONLY reason why I am excited for this news is that we should get a local release of Mortal Kombat 10 so no more importing. Keep in mind too that games that were previously banned will still be banned as they need to be resubmitted to the Ratings Board but this is unlikely as it costs developers / distributors money for games that have already passed their shelf-life.

[Hursticon]

That's a good point TC. Quite a few games that have reached our shores as MA15+ have been rated as R or the equivalent of in other countries. Having said that, it also comes down to different cultural beliefs and tolerances.

The ONLY reason why I am excited for this news is that we should get a local release of Mortal Kombat 10 so no more importing. Keep in mind too that games that were previously banned will still be banned as they need to be resubmitted to the Ratings Board but this is unlikely as it costs developers / distributors money for games that have already passed their shelf-life.

Ed Boon was tweeting about the announcement, I replied that I look forward to MK's re-submittal; Very much hope that that is what he & Netherrealm decide to do (So we'll get the GOTY Edition right off the bat! :D). ;):cool:

The problem with this legislation is that it lies at the Federal Level (Mind you I'm glad they had the balls to actually address the damn issue & did something about it!), the State's are only required to instate an R18 rating but are free to interpret what exactly constitutes that rating; this doesn't bode particularly well for any one in a state with more 'Conservative' governments or those that pay headed attention to minority religious groups. :(

[5FDP]

Thread necromancy!! :cool:

So... gamers finally got their R rating - thank you common sense :), but now, we have major retailers like Target pulling GTA5 off the shelves because it is not 'suitable' for their store. What lead to this... an online petition authored by former sex workers. Yes, that's right, moral standards are now being dictated to us by a group of prostitutes! WTF???!

A couple of days ago we had a report by the Greens encouraging parents to buy gender neutral toys because apparently buying Transformers for your son and Barbies for your daughter will lay the seeds for domestic violence later on in life. What has this world come to :mad:

[UltraMarginal]

Thread necromancy!! :cool:

So... gamers finally got their R rating - thank you common sense :), but now, we have major retailers like Target pulling GTA5 off the shelves because it is not 'suitable' for their store. What lead to this... an online petition authored by former sex workers. Yes, that's right, moral standards are now being dictated to us by a group of prostitutes! WTF???!

A couple of days ago we had a report by the Greens encouraging parents to buy gender neutral toys because apparently buying Transformers for your son and Barbies for your daughter will lay the seeds for domestic violence later on in life. What has this world come to :mad:

I can't say but I'll be honest and say that I never saw prime bitchslap Barbie but she had a habit of walking into doors.

Actually lately my wife has made a habit of walking into stuff. she corked her arm on a shelf in the art store the other day and hit the back of her hand on the kitchen bench last night just walking past it. I'm thinking of layering protrusions in our house with bubble wrap so I don't cop the blame :D

[CBratron]

Just like tv and movies, department stores have a target audience (or target buyers in this case). And for Target and Big W and Kmart and David Jones and Myer ( sorry for all the 'ands') the target is mothers. I'm not surprised. But I can always buy from better places. Brick and mortar stores are losing the battle with online retail and if they have to institute these kinds of policies, so be it.
And i'm rambling.

[yoshi594]

Thread necromancy!! :cool:

So... gamers finally got their R rating - thank you common sense :), but now, we have major retailers like Target pulling GTA5 off the shelves because it is not 'suitable' for their store. What lead to this... an online petition authored by former sex workers. Yes, that's right, moral standards are now being dictated to us by a group of prostitutes! WTF???!

A couple of days ago we had a report by the Greens encouraging parents to buy gender neutral toys because apparently buying Transformers for your son and Barbies for your daughter will lay the seeds for domestic violence later on in life. What has this world come to :mad:

the world? isn't it just idiotic australia? target and kmart have now removed gta 5...guess that's two stores i won't be buying from! (unless they have exclusive transformers of course!)

[Gutsman Heavy]

Absolutely stupid, and a dangerous slippery slope.

[UltraMarginal]

I don't know if it's that out of character for stores like K-mart and Target, I don't frequent either store for much more than toys but I don't recall ever seeing an R rated movie on their shelves.

unfortunately while an R rating does provide some clarity and potential protection for people considered too young to be exposed to certain material, that same rating does come with a certain stigma.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

Just like tv and movies, department stores have a target audience (or target buyers in this case). And for Target and Big W and Kmart and David Jones and Myer ( sorry for all the 'ands') the target is mothers. I'm not surprised. But I can always buy from better places. Brick and mortar stores are losing the battle with online retail and if they have to institute these kinds of policies, so be it.
And i'm rambling.


I don't know if it's that out of character for stores like K-mart and Target, I don't frequent either store for much more than toys but I don't recall ever seeing an R rated movie on their shelves.

unfortunately while an R rating does provide some clarity and potential protection for people considered too young to be exposed to certain material, that same rating does come with a certain stigma.

R18 games should have a stigma to them. They're not designed for kids. they are for adults. The stigma should be, this game has themes and situations that adults only should have access to.

This just goes to show how Target isn't even following guidelines for the display of games. I saw scan of their catalogue stating great toys for kids or something, with a picture of Peppa Pig and barbie on one side, and GTAV on the same page. Now as far as I am aware, according to the regulations set by the classification board, R18 rated games were only to be displayed out of reach of children, away from other games. Now this may be away from the other games, but whoever put that game in that part of the catalogue should be fired.

Sure Target can choose what they sell, but an online peition (with probably more O/S signiatures than Aus) shouldn't induce this. Now, if it were a petition against violence towards women, that would hold more water, but this affects one game. Just one game. It's pointless.

This also goes to show how stupid retailers and many adults are who assume that games are for kids and it would seem that many ignore the rating.

After the rating was introduced, they should have embarked on an advertising campaign educating the public about WHY we now have an R18 rating for games.

this sirt of thing just really annoys me, as it completely undermines the R18 system as it is. personally I'd like an overhaul of the whole system as the MA15+ rating is complete BS!

Rant over. Gald I'm not in Australia at the moment!

[Defcon]

Thread necromancy!! :cool:

So... gamers finally got their R rating - thank you common sense :), but now, we have major retailers like Target pulling GTA5 off the shelves because it is not 'suitable' for their store. What lead to this... an online petition authored by former sex workers. Yes, that's right, moral standards are now being dictated to us by a group of prostitutes! WTF???!

A couple of days ago we had a report by the Greens encouraging parents to buy gender neutral toys because apparently buying Transformers for your son and Barbies for your daughter will lay the seeds for domestic violence later on in life. What has this world come to :mad:


Unbelievable! GTA 5 taken off the shelves. Seriously that game series is always targeted. (see what I did there) ;) I might have to look into this piece of news. Could happen to other games, but not many. I would see it only as a problem if the game was banned from sale everywhere. I never buy games from department stores, unless its a bargain or impulse buy. But even then I just don't. Because once I had a bad experience, a disc was missing from a game and I had a very hard time getting some sort of resolution from the retailer. So never again!

I did see a news story about how gender neutral toys are better, and the seeds and domestic violence. I think it is massively over-reaching to say that.

But not to disregard the topic entirely. I think the way the toys are divided by gender is seriously in need of an overhaul, they just need to change the marketing and the packaging. They should ban pink! :D, just label everything action figure ;)
easy problem solved! customers may be upset at the political correctness gone mad again, but I think we will adjust and eventually not care. I'm ok with a few simple changes to remove some of the gender specifics. But going beyond that is unreasonable. The problem is once you remove the gender signs, the next step would be the products will change also. As a negative some traditional products for boys and girls may become much more limited and generic.

[MayzaPrime]

As Kmart and Target are massive companies and can sell or not sell whatever they want...

What I find funny is a bunch of misinformed people thinking that they have made a difference when actually GTA V has been out for over a year and Target and Kmart have been selling it for the entire time...

I also find it funny that parents still buy this game for their kids... What kind of moron would buy a R rated game for an 8 year old. Parents need to take some responsibility for what their children watch, ignorance is not an excuse.

[fatbot]

https://www.change.org/p/target-to-change-their-violent-name-and-aggressive-logo?share_id=idYimUiMIG&utm_campaign=share_button_action_box&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=share_petition

C'mon guys, together we can stop department stores from promoting violence through their names & logos!

[Defcon]

I also find it funny that a bunch of people can be celebrating they have successfully got a product banned, as if it made a difference right? it seems silly because maybe they have, because they could do this again to another game quite easily. The image of a murdered woman from a game, is confronting to someone who does not play games, or who especially always considers games to be toys for children. They see that image, they get the worst impression of the game, they don't care about anything else. It is pointless to try and inform them, because they have already made up their minds. Its bias. Its useless to say what about all the murdered men? Nobody cares as much, but they should if they care about the other.

If in the game, women were completely removed or excluded from the violence, it wouldn't make a difference. Because the argument been made that these types of games are grooming men to commit violent acts, commit acts of domestic violence, and murder and mayhem. Because violence doesn't discriminate. What about if a woman plays this game is she not been groomed to be violent as well? or does it only work on men. I am sick of my gender been demonized, demeaned as if we don't have free wills.

[Trent]

Damn hippies and womenists!