Henkei returns?

[SilverDragon]

Red leader (http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-news-rumors/325497-henkei-returns-transformers-united.html) over at TFW2005 reports that he got a notification for a new line of Henkei except now it's called Transformers United. It will comprise the Generations toys.

He runs the Kapow! Toys site, so we can take this info as legit unless something official contradicts it. But really, it was inevitable that Generations would get a Henkei-esque release over in Japan.

[SharkyMcShark]

I wouldn't be surprised if the first few releases were unchanged, or just had chrome added.

Drift looks like Drift does in the comics, so really all that could be done in pursuit of greater accuracy is chroming the swords (and I'm not even sure you can chrome that kind of plastic). Thrust won't get a release. WFC OP and Bee are already accurate to source, so maybe they'll just get some chrome. Same for Megs and Soundwave, and Red Alert won't get a release over there.

It'll be intersting to see what they do with Darkmount, and later releases like Blurr, Skulgrin and the like.

[FFN]

I don't know why that one guy hopes they'll do a "more accurate" colour scheme for Straxus considering he had two different colour schemes and Japan never got the Marvel comic anyway (much less of an expectation by your fanbase for fiction accuracy when most of them don't know who that is). What we got on the Generations toy is an amalgamation of Straxus' two colour schemes.

I suppose they can either make the blue darker, or make it black, but that would be depending upon one's interpretation on if Straxus was supposed to be blue or was just a victim of the olden day "blue to represent black" comic colouring limitations. Hasbro's colour scheme followed the cover of a fan book coloured by Straxus' biggest fan, David Willis.

[kup]

The Generations toys have been pretty good overall, specially by Hasbro standards. I am satisfied with the ones I have just as I was satisfied with the original Classics run (except Starscream and Megatron).

However like always, I will go with whichever provides me with the better toy if I am yet to get said release.

[gdmetro]

Oooo.. if this is true I'm excited!!

Red Leader mentions:

Transformers United set for release in December 2010 brings us the following figures

1) UN01 - Optimus Prime Cybertron Mode
2) UN02 - Bumblebee Cybertron Mode
3) UN03 - Cliffjumper Cybertron Mode
4) UN04 - Megatron Cybertron Mode
5) UN05 - Soundwave Cybertron Mode
6) UN06 - Optimus Prime
7) UN07 - Bumblebee
8) UN08 - Autobot Drift
9) UN09 - Megatron
10) UN10 - United Straxus

Im loving and hating this news at the same time.

I have yet to get any of the generations (WFC) except thrust and Drift- whom ill pick up again via henkei 2. So these will be all buys for me if and when they come out.

However, it seems from this info generic "bumblebee and optimus" are being released- it seems logical to assume these are classics/henkei molds?

If this is true, I'm slightly peeved- only slightly- as I got henkei prime and bee at aftermakret prices- but only like 10 bucks max difference so still ok.

Henkei megs I have yet to get, so if that is re-released - *Fist pump!!

Under this assumption, the further question is whether they will release the other previous henkei figs- that are not gentei or rare during initial run, but now pricey. i.e. mirage, red alert, smokescreen. I would be slightly bummed again.

But it works both ways- I cant even imagine if they re-release henkei rodimus or even a henkei take on ultra magnus?? wow... people would be pissed.

Although Id still love it- damn I need to save up now and get dupes of each- one for misb, one for display.

:D

[kup]

The Japanese unusually don't do repaints or re-releases in such short amounts of time after the last. I am guessing that it's possible that they are referring to new molds, perhaps those Legends (scouts?) toys they had on display at Botcon and Comic Con.

[gdmetro]

The Japanese unusually don't do repaints or re-releases in such short amounts of time after the last. I am guessing that it's possible that they are referring to new molds, perhaps those Legends (scouts?) toys they had on display at Botcon and Comic Con.

Hmm I guess that is also a very likely possibility, and the more I think about it the more it makes sense. Although we can only speculate now, I guess the 2 factors that I am holding out hope for (wishful thinking):

-Bumblebee- would be equivalent to that goldbug? repaint by hasbro- which was already released in Henkei as cliffjumper.

-They would be releasing individual legends figures- (I don't know if this is even a point) but in Henkei they released them in packs of 3- i.e. the minibot spy and attack teams.


Still happy of this news regardless!

[FFN]

I'm wondering what's with the names.

Since the movies, only the G1-based toylines have used the Japanese names (Henkei, Alternity) while the others have more or less followed Hasbro's names where possible.

All the names here, assuming they're anywhere near final, use presumably Japanese trademarkable versions of the American names, even Straxus, which Hasbro was unable to trademark.

I wonder if this means Takara is following Hasbro's lead in not considering WFC to be a version of G1 (hence "Optimus Prime Cybertron Mode" instead of "Convoy Cybertron Mode"), or it's the beginning of Takara naming everything based on the American names.

[Tallestblue]

Oooh, I hope that Megs is the 2006 Megs and he's unchromed so he fits in with Classics better. Probably not, but. I can dream!

[kup]

I'm wondering what's with the names.

Since the movies, only the G1-based toylines have used the Japanese names (Henkei, Alternity) while the others have more or less followed Hasbro's names where possible.

All the names here, assuming they're anywhere near final, use presumably Japanese trademarkable versions of the American names, even Straxus, which Hasbro was unable to trademark.

I wonder if this means Takara is following Hasbro's lead in not considering WFC to be a version of G1 (hence "Optimus Prime Cybertron Mode" instead of "Convoy Cybertron Mode"), or it's the beginning of Takara naming everything based on the American names.

I have a feeling that they are moving towards westernizing all the names in all contemporary franchises. Animated was also called Optimus Prime and he isn't exactly movie.

In regards to Starxus, I think that the Japanese just tried a little harder in naming him. Hasbro equivalent would have been 'Decepticon Straxus' or even 'Darkmound Straxus'.

[jaydisc]

Couldn't be happier. Guess we will also get Jazz, Tracks, Windcharger, Grapple and the others seen at botcon. I'd be super happy for Magnus and Nemesis too. But I wasn't expecting WfC. I hope they do some nicer paint jobs for those.

[SharkyMcShark]

Couldn't be happier. Guess we will also get Jazz, Tracks, Windcharger, Grapple and the others seen at botcon. I'd be super happy for Magnus and Nemesis too. But I wasn't expecting WfC. I hope they do some nicer paint jobs for those.

Grapple and Windcharger are part of the Autobot Alliance line though, aren't they?

[5FDP]

I'm satisfied with the Hasbro releases. Afterall, we can now get both Thrust and Dirge in the Generations line :D

[FFN]

I have a feeling that they are moving towards westernizing all the names in all contemporary franchises. Animated was also called Optimus Prime and he isn't exactly movie. They are still keeping Convoy around for G1-based franchises like Alternity, though.

As for Animated, apparently at one time TakaraTomy were going to rework the series to be part of the movies. Before the series debut, previews in in Figure Ō magazine, and one in TV Magazine, Animated was to be heavily altered in order to make it take place within the continuity of the 2007 live-action mode. According to TakaraTomy marketing director Masahiko Yamazaki, it takes place chronologically before the movie. Of course, the dub features none of this, so who knows that the hell they were talking about.

http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-news-rumors/285256-figure-king-issue-143-image-scans.html

http://www.tfw2005.com/transformers-news/animated-8/latest-edition-of-tv-magazine-reveals-new-transformers-animated-japan-details-169265/


In regards to Starxus, I think that the Japanese just tried a little harder in naming him. Hasbro equivalent would have been 'Decepticon Straxus' or even 'Darkmound Straxus'. I would think there would have been something that falls under the International Class 28, "Toys and Sporting Goods" in one of the markets that Hasbro operates in that was named too similarly for Hasbro to trademark the toy as variations of Straxus.

In that case, they cannot just slap "Decepticon" or something onto the name and call it a day.

[kup]

I would think there would have been something that falls under the International Class 28, "Toys and Sporting Goods" in one of the markets that Hasbro operates in that was named too similarly for Hasbro to trademark the toy as variations of Straxus.

In that case, they cannot just slap "Decepticon" or something onto the name and call it a day.

Maybe but given Hasbro's track record on random name slaps, I reckon that they just didn't bother to try to work the name in. However Darkmount is still a much better compromise than Tankor.

[FFN]

I don't see any evidence of this being part of their random name-slapping or them simply not trying hard enough.

Hasbro may have been unable to trademark Straxus and Octane, and/or were unwilling to expend the time, effort and money to attempt to fight in court against whomever happened to have the very similar trademark, especially as, in these cases, Hasbro doesn't look like it had much of a legal leg to stand upon.

[jaydisc]

Grapple and Windcharger are part of the Autobot Alliance line though, aren't they?

If you are referring to Hasbro's AA line: Yes. For Hasbro, Windcharger and Grapple will be (what I call) HFTD, as Generations is "deluxe only". Hasbro has stated that it doesn't really see any difference between HFTD and Generations and the reason for the two was a strategy to get retailers to give more shelf space to TFs. They've mentioned that homaged characters might appear in either line.

I don't expect there to be a 1 to 1 pairing of Hasbro Generations releases against TT United releases, and that would seem to be reinforced by this preliminary list.

[KaRNiV8L PRiME]

Does this mean we will get a TT united thundercracker?? :)

[jaydisc]

Doubt it. TT released Thundercracker under Henkei.

It looks like Hasbro has their own deluxe Prime and Bumblebee coming:

http://www.allspark.com/content/view/7833/20/

The plot thickens...

[1AZRAEL1]

One that stands out on that list for me is Wreckgar. Hmmmm.

[Tallestblue]

WRECK-GAR!? I was stoked about Jazz and Tracks in Generations, but Wreck-Gar? I'll be on cloud nine all week now.

[jaydisc]

Wreck-Gar should pose an interesting situation for FansProject as that should put the two companies in direct competition for the first time.

[1AZRAEL1]

You raise a good point there. Will FansProject be asked to stop making him by Hasbro? Or will they stop on their own? I don't think Hasbro will allow them to continue making him.

[Lord_Zed]

Judging by Preceptor Hasbro's Wreck Gar might be a garbage Truck ala Animated again. So they might end up totaly different beasts.

[1AZRAEL1]

Hmmm, I will wait and see what he looks like when we se pictures. I would ideally prefer him as a bike. I won't make a judgement until I know what he looks like.

[SharkyMcShark]

Fallback?

Interesting.

[SharkyMcShark]

If you are referring to Hasbro's AA line: Yes. For Hasbro, Windcharger and Grapple will be (what I call) HFTD, as Generations is "deluxe only". Hasbro has stated that it doesn't really see any difference between HFTD and Generations and the reason for the two was a strategy to get retailers to give more shelf space to TFs. They've mentioned that homaged characters might appear in either line.

I don't expect there to be a 1 to 1 pairing of Hasbro Generations releases against TT United releases, and that would seem to be reinforced by this preliminary list.

Well I raise the issue as there could be some kind of rights clash between the two - remember that Henkei thus far hasn't used homage figures from other lines apart from Classics and Universe.

[jaydisc]

Well I raise the issue as there could be some kind of rights clash between the two - remember that Henkei thus far hasn't used homage figures from other lines apart from Classics and Universe.

This is true. One can only hope :)

[jaydisc]

Just got pricing from my supplier. UN09 Megatron is a voyager.

[kaiden]

Just got pricing from my supplier. UN09 Megatron is a voyager.

so its something new then? more money to burn then :D

[jaydisc]

Not necessarily. Could just be a re-release of Henkei Megatron.

[kurdt_the_goat]

Don't know why it'd end up in this new United line, but the "Unite for the Universe" movie redeco's of Voyager Megatron and Optimus (with jetfire parts) have been in limbo for a while, perhaps it's them showing up again?

[Paulbot]

Don't know why it'd end up in this new United line, but the "Unite for the Universe" movie redeco's of Voyager Megatron and Optimus (with jetfire parts) have been in limbo for a while, perhaps it's them showing up again?

This makes sense or it is a mighty big coincidence that there's a Voyager United Megatron and a Voyager Unite for the Universe Megatron. Makes me think maybe the extra Bumblebee will be whichever MovieBee toy hasn't come out yet.

[gdmetro]

Wreck-Gar should pose an interesting situation for FansProject as that should put the two companies in direct competition for the first time.


You raise a good point there. Will FansProject be asked to stop making him by Hasbro? Or will they stop on their own? I don't think Hasbro will allow them to continue making him.

This is a very interesting issue, however I don't think there will be direct competition- since FP's product is not "wreckgar" just "collector". :rolleyes:

3rd parties skirting the grey area has been talked about elsewhere in abundance- I think it is hard pressed for Hasbro to do anything?
Or if not, it is not worth their effort/time? And why would they even care that much about FP's product?
It is highly unlikely for a collector who can afford FP's products to not shell out for Hasbro's if that is some what decent anyway- if anything this hurts FP the most, as if Hasbro's one is decent, at that much lower price point, FP's would look less appetizing.


It will also be interesting to see what FansProject does. I would not be surprised if FP does not release anytime soon or even aborts the project. FP have made efforts to not reference names, alter facial designs to avoid any real sensible possibility of conflict with their releases. This can be contrasted to other 3rd party companies such as Igear whom have blatantly infringed- flying in the face of Hasbro.

Some have speculated that the two wreckgars won't be sold at the same time- but who are we to know at this stage. We also don't know how far FP are into the project? If they are only at design stage, then perhaps they will try to avoid any direct conflict, by releasing it later? I'm assuming the cost of design isn't that detrimental if they decide to abort- compared to actually creating the final prototypes and moulds for mass production or even begin production (highly unlikely at this stage).


Just got pricing from my supplier. UN09 Megatron is a voyager.

Awesome news! It could be re-do of the classics/henkei mould or an entirely new mould? Great news either way.

Some have speculated elsewhere that perhaps the prime, bbee and megs figs are actually Transformers:Prime figs that Hasbro have shoehorned into the line. It might tie into the release of the cartoon? but I'm not sure on the timing as I haven't read up much on that, so someone more informed should correct me if I'm wrong.

Also makes some sense that bbee prime and megs are released first- being the most popular characters in terms of marketability towards the masses.

But this idea has to incorporate the fact that- will japan get the Tf: Prime cartoon at a similar release time? since I'm assuming at this stage these moulds are replicated in both generations and United lines.

[griffin]

This is a very interesting issue, however I don't think there will be direct competition- since FP's product is not "wreckgar" just "collector". :rolleyes:


It's not the name they are competing with, it's the character/toy, which Hasbro also owns. If an unauthorised figure comes out that is recognised as a Transformers character, it doesn't matter what the name is, if it looks like an existing character to make its money, then that's the issue of infringment. After all, Hasbro don't always name toys exactly how they are meant - look at Straxus. We all know it is Straxus, but the toy is called Darkmount... How is that any different for a 'Springer' to be called 'Defender', Wreckgar to be called 'Collector', Swindle to be called 'Munitioner', etc... Just like with Darkmount, fans are buying them because they know who the *Transformers* character is, not because of the name. The mere fact that those people admit to buying them for the TFs character they represent, proves that they aren't buying them for the name. (In other words, the character is being infringed, not the name - both of which Hasbro/TT have some claim over.)

But since Hasbro didn't act against the unauthorised Drift and Arcee toys, I doubt they would start with an older, obscure character like Wreckgar.

[griffin]

So the anagram grows even longer - CHUGU...

[kup]

But since Hasbro didn't act against the unauthorised Drift and Arcee toys, I doubt they would start with an older, obscure character like Wreckgar.

I think Hasbro doesn't act on the 3rd party stuff because it doesn't really cut into their profits. The 3rd parties exploit the collector market and Hasbro's business model sells straight to retailers so there is no 'profit' conflict. If Hasbro decided to be more flexible and allow for collector centric products in a similar way like Mattel does within their business plan or if FanProjects begins to sell retail, then there would be a conflict but I don't see them doing that any time soon.

I agree however that the toys such as Defender and Collector and indeed intended to unofficially represent the Transformers characters but so far FP has been clever about it by making them 'similar but different' so legally they are unique toys from another company.

As it was discussed in the Unofficial thread, most fans would go for the official Takara-Tomy/Hasbro product over the 3rd party equivalent if they were comparable products. I know that if I had to choose between the Protector armor and MP Rodimus, the latter is an easy choice. Third parties exists because they have been successful at providing something that Hasbro has not by focusing on the neglected collector market. However I am sure that if Hasbro begins to officially release comparable products, the 3rd party would probably dwindle down to just simple accessory kits.

As an exaple, I am pretty sure that the new Wreckgar (assuming it actually looks like the Club Magazine photo) would be preferred to FansProject collector for the reasons stated above.

[jaydisc]

I bought Botcon 2007 Springer because it seemed to be the only way to buy Springer.

When the Universe Springer and Ratbat 2-pack came out, I thought that made a better springer, and was generally a cooler mold, so I bought that.

Finally, Defender came out, and I bought that.

Had they been released in the reverse order, that would have been 2 Hasbro toys I would never have bought.

[kup]

I bought Botcon 2007 Springer because it seemed to be the only way to buy Springer.

When the Universe Springer and Ratbat 2-pack came out, I thought that made a better springer, and was generally a cooler mold, so I bought that.

Finally, Defender came out, and I bought that.

Had they been released in the reverse order, that would have been 2 Hasbro toys I would never have bought.

I had similar reasons for getting those toys and if Defender had been released first, I wouldn't have gotten the others. On the other hand, if Hasbro had released a proper triple changing Springer that does justice to the character, I wouldn't have gotten Defender.