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i_amtrunks
12th April 2008, 09:44 AM
So the preview issue: "Focus on the Decepticons" was released this week, giving us some interviews from Writer Shane McCarthy and artist Guido Guidi, some profiles for the Decepticons that will be appearing in "All Hail" and an 8 page preview.

The interviews are pretty good, the new Decepticons are great, and Guido's art is outstanding as always.

Spoilers are below:

The story is set 1 year after the end of the "tion" stories, and "All Hail" will be in complete continuity, even though the seekers have changed their Alt modes.

The newly introduced Decepticons are: The Insecticons, and the Constructicons. Soundwave, Rumble (RED), Frenzy (BLUE), Ravage and Laserbeak all will appear as well. The Battlechargers stay dead.

The art is fantastic, the 8 page preview gives us something we have never ever seen before in a comic... human casualties. It isnt anything overly explicit, not mangled bodies lying around, but there is blood, bodies face down on the dirt, and so much destruction that unseen casualties must have occured.
Starscream seems to be more talk, less action in All Hail, while Megatron is all action and destruction.

This story looks to be good, continuing on from the -tion series quite nicely.

STL
12th April 2008, 11:52 PM
Sounds interesting. I won't be picking mine up for a few weeks. Been a bit lazy lately plus I really don't have time to read much lately either w/ job hunting and all. :(

One thing that gets me is they're maintaining it's in continuity. I don't think that can withstand the test of time in the long run. It just reads way more like a what if than part of the Furman verse. So a lot is going to happen in the FUrman verse but nothing on Earth? Hard to believe imo

bassbot
20th July 2008, 02:32 PM
Well. Found the thread so i'll continue it -

as it stands it doesn't directly continue from the "ation" series, but for me, I still like it as a #1 issue.

i'm very visual with my comic reading (and life) and so it worked really well, without a heap of story, dialogue, or answers, really it sets up the new cast and some of the context.

The Cons are smacking down Earth, whilst the Bots are licking their wounds on Cybertron.
Obviously, this has questions - how are the bots living on Cybertron? (Although we do know that Hound and his crew set themselves up safely on there, in Spotlight: Galvatron i believe).

I'm very interested to see where this goes in #2 and #3.

Lord_Zed
20th July 2008, 09:07 PM
Well. Found the thread so i'll continue it -

as it stands it doesn't directly continue from the "ation" series, but for me, I still like it as a #1 issue.

Obviously, this has questions - how are the bots living on Cybertron? (Although we do know that Hound and his crew set themselves up safely on there, in Spotlight: Galvatron i believe).

I'm very interested to see where this goes in #2 and #3.

Yeah I'm trying to figure out is this part of the main story or a what if or prallel universe like Hearts of Steel? I totaly agree with STL on this, it doesn't feel like the IDWverse at all.

All hail Megatron #1 seems very G1 or Dreamwave-esque with a dash of live action movie homages (the jet scenes). Megatron and Starscream have returned to thier cartoon style inane banter. If this is indeed a continuation of the main comic series then I'm unimpressed, as it seems to have thrown out a lot of the clever ideas from the previous stories and just gone for a simple G1 re-hash. But I guess I'll wait and see.

Paulbot
20th July 2008, 09:26 PM
Potential spoilers... This week's Spotlight Hardhead suggests how Optimus Prime ends up in All Hail Megatron.

Lord_Zed
20th July 2008, 10:11 PM
Potential spoilers... This week's Spotlight Hardhead suggests how Optimus Prime ends up in All Hail Megatron.

Right you are Paulbot. And thats part of what bugs me.

More possible spoilers: Seeing Prime in his current state and Sunstreaker back etc means we know which characters live and which die so some of the suspense of future stories is removed. :mad: Seeing Sunstreaker means we can assume that Hot Rod is successfull rescuing Sunstreaker and most probably defeating the Machination (No doubt with Grimlocks help).

But still this is only the first issue. And it's really all flash and bang. I'll wait till next issue when perhaps we start to learn what the story is.

On another note Spotlight Hardhead was awesome! I like they way they gave him some personality. I also enjoyed the broard spectrum of chracters that showed up. I do hope there not going to rush the story to gel with All hail Megs though, cause that would suck. When Devils Due reformated thier G.I Joe comic from G.I Joe to America's Elite they took a fairly epic storyline and finished it all up in one rather rushed feeling unsatisfying issue. In which the Joe's defeated Cobra Comanders most grand scheme just by doing a Rambo, and busting in and shooting, yawn.

GoktimusPrime
20th July 2008, 10:14 PM
This story felt like a separate continuity to me *shrug*

kup
20th July 2008, 10:24 PM
I was totally under the impression that it was a different continuity, a 'What if' story.

I have not read it but all previews, advertisement, Furman comments, etc have pointed that it was i a continuity of its own and frankly from the bare concept of it (Decepticons win total control) it can't fit anywhere.

Kyle
20th July 2008, 10:41 PM
Very nice artwork. Will be interesting to see what happens next. :)

(Still have not picked up Spotlight: Hardhead yet.)

liegeprime
20th July 2008, 11:10 PM
human casualties.... and they call themselves decepticons
hmph pffft yeah right :rolleyes: not enough... thats all the damage these "giant robots" can do pffft.Someone loses a ketchup smeared pair of shoes ( dirge?) Not even a few dead bodies lying around, ha! Are their targeting systems so dysfunctional they cant hit a teensy weensy human with those big laser pistol, actually making a dent or mebbe loose a limb in the process? Its not much to ask after all there are a lot of humans scurrying around in the city a few dead in the process wont matter so much. Then Megsy blasts a building down, whoop big deal, not a single dangling body or a burning husk even falling from the window ( which I might add are still intact after taking such a forceful blast, nah.... not enough i say. This like so tamed, Im waiting for Bambi to show up......

TheDirtyDigger
21st July 2008, 06:11 AM
human casualties.... and they call themselves decepticons
hmph pffft yeah right :rolleyes: not enough... thats all the damage these "giant robots" can do pffft.Someone loses a ketchup smeared pair of shoes ( dirge?) Not even a few dead bodies lying around, ha! Are their targeting systems so dysfunctional they cant hit a teensy weensy human with those big laser pistol, actually making a dent or mebbe loose a limb in the process? Its not much to ask after all there are a lot of humans scurrying around in the city a few dead in the process wont matter so much. Then Megsy blasts a building down, whoop big deal, not a single dangling body or a burning husk even falling from the window ( which I might add are still intact after taking such a forceful blast, nah.... not enough i say. This like so tamed, Im waiting for Bambi to show up......

Good point liege. I'm gunna draw some dead bodies in myself. If we can customize toys then why not comics?

How many issues is this series going to be or is/was it a one-shot?

Paulbot
21st July 2008, 09:26 AM
...means we know which characters live and which die so some of the suspense of future stories is removed...

I had the same complaints about spoilers from the Sunstreaker Mosaic by Simon Furman that gave away many of the same plot points. :mad:

How many issues is this series going to be or is/was it a one-shot?

12 issues, and the writer has confirmed on the IDW boards that it is in IDW continuity.

Lord_Zed
21st July 2008, 12:21 PM
With regard to liegeprime's comment about the lack of bodies and what not. As far as taking this destruction serious goes. I actualy found that the artwork as nice as it is, detracts from the overall feel of the comic. the artwork is very G1 the Deceps are all smiley and grinning all the time much like they did in the old cartoon. And for that reason I find it hard to reconcile with the dark tone the story is suposed to set. While i think the art is good, considering the nature of the story I wish they'd used one of thier other artists. So we could have abit more shadows and darkness. If they really want to make the Decepticons scary they should make it more like Rythms of Darkness from the old marvel comic, now that was dark.

i_amtrunks
21st July 2008, 12:38 PM
This is not a good comic to re-read.

I was totally under the impression that it was a different continuity, a 'What if' story.

Nope, Ryall, McCarthy et all have been trying really hard for months to convince everyone that it is indeed in continuity.
However I think there will be retcons were AHM is concerned. :o

The art and seeing how McCarthy will try so very hard to tie this into the very close knitted Furmanverse is all that has me wanting to see the next few issues.

And good news for you Paulbot, the Mosaic that Furman penned that you hated so much is now considered non cannon.

Paulbot
21st July 2008, 12:40 PM
And good news for you Paulbot, the Mosaic that Furman penned that you hated so much is now considered non cannon.

Really? I'm torn. On hand one I'm happy the future's not set in stone, on the other hand I'm disappointed that the original storyplan has been thrown out.

As for this series I want it in continuity because the last thing we need is more alternate universes! :)

i_amtrunks
21st July 2008, 03:00 PM
Really? I'm torn. On hand one I'm happy the future's not set in stone, on the other hand I'm disappointed that the original storyplan has been thrown out.

I don't know if I would call it thrown out, more like altered. From what we saw in AHM, and the announcement of Maximum Dinobots may have given Furman a reason to alter his storyline (that's my line of thinking anyways)

As for this series I want it in continuity because the last thing we need is more alternate universes! :)

No, the thing Transformers needs most is dozens upon dozens of intersecting and confusing alternate Universes! :p

GoktimusPrime
22nd July 2008, 11:19 AM
If we can customize toys then why not comics?
jaAm? (http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/JaAm)

lcz128
22nd July 2008, 06:09 PM
I only read the series' following up to All Hail Megs only just recently (am planning to pick up the trades) but I have to say I'm enjoying this :) I've never enjoyed transformers comics as much as now. I felt that a lot of the DW stuff was too flashy and hard to follow whereas these have been refreshing. While sometimes I feel the colouring isn't up to scratch in every issue, they've been fairly consistent.

I picked up AHM last week and was happy with it. While yes, I am sad that they're not properly continuing the story that has come before, I am looking forward to where this takes us. :D

And bloody oath - the spotlight issues really add to the main storyline. I've only just read some of these and how they've tied in has me happy! :D

AHM #1 as an intro issue has a lot of questions posed by the time it's all over (feels like it's over too quick though) but it does leave me hanging for the next few issues :D

kup
29th July 2008, 11:54 AM
http://www.geocities.com/wow_frostwolf/misc/grimlock.jpg

lcz128
22nd August 2008, 11:16 PM
So, issue #2 is out! What did people think?

Personally, I was a bit underwhelmed. I was hoping that it would go further faster. I guess it does make sense that there will be build up before getting to the real meat - I guess my beef was that there was a fair amount of human-ness in this issue - which I'm not that big a fan of :b

roller
23rd August 2008, 12:37 AM
i shall ask McCarthy himself whether its a continuation etc etc

Lord_Zed
23rd August 2008, 01:18 AM
So, issue #2 is out! What did people think?

Personally, I was a bit underwhelmed. I was hoping that it would go further faster. I guess it does make sense that there will be build up before getting to the real meat - I guess my beef was that there was a fair amount of human-ness in this issue - which I'm not that big a fan of :b

I actualy prefered this issue to #1, becuase they started to deviate a bit more from the standard g1 archetype. The humans focus also made the Decepticons more menacing. Cause seriously all those bright colours and smilling do not credible scary enemies make.

The humans seem to be running thier campaign against the Decepticons in a reasonable manner, Am I the only one reminded of Colverfield by this issue? Which begs the question, what is Megs plan? he better have one cause if the story develops in a believable fashion it's heading toward tactical nuke time.

I do however agree that it's a little slow, what aggrevates me is Revalation #3 feels rushed to fit in with All hail Megs, which in turn feels stretched.

And All Hails still doesn't feel like the standard IDW universe, although it does feel more unique than issue #1

FFN
23rd August 2008, 10:52 AM
This is not a good comic to re-read.

Nope, Ryall, McCarthy et all have been trying really hard for months to convince everyone that it is indeed in continuity.
However I think there will be retcons were AHM is concerned. :o

The art and seeing how McCarthy will try so very hard to tie this into the very close knitted Furmanverse is all that has me wanting to see the next few issues. At the risk of Shane McCarthy appearing here (since he's aussie and all) and attempting to shut me up again, I don't think he's trying very hard at all to tie this into Furman's storyline, given he's ditched the facsimiles and Megatron's long-term goals, humans have some how forgotten about those rampaging robots that the military attacked in Devastation and the giant robot dinosaur wandering around in Spotlight Grimlock, he said he would not use Ore-13 (the reason why Earth became a pivitol flashpoint in the war), and issue 2 seemingly abandons the established rule set in Spotlight: Optimus Prime that combiner/gestalt technology was dangerous and had devastating consequences for both the participants and anybody who attempted to use it as a weapon (the combiners go insane).

And good news for you Paulbot, the Mosaic that Furman penned that you hated so much is now considered non cannon.Really? I'm torn. On hand one I'm happy the future's not set in stone, on the other hand I'm disappointed that the original storyplan has been thrown out.

As for this series I want it in continuity because the last thing we need is more alternate universes! :) The Sunstreaker Mosiac, created awhile before AHM was announced, was *originally* part of Furman's continuity. But Ryall and McCarthy ditched it. Its possible McCarthy will have Sunstreaker or somebody reference Hunter, but I doubt it.

Go on, do it, McCarthy! I BLOODY DARE YOU.

i shall ask McCarthy himself whether its a continuation etc etc What do you think he's going to say? Of course he'll say AHM is a continuation. If he admitted it was not in-continuity they might lose sales. His job depends on it.

roller
23rd August 2008, 11:04 AM
What do you think he's going to say? Of course he'll say AHM is a continuation. If he admitted it was not in-continuity they might lose sales. His job depends on it.

I think he will say "Roller you are the greatest ever, please contribute your own storyline that i can take back to IDW, i shall call it "All Hail Roller"

at least, i think he'd say something along those lines.

i_amtrunks
23rd August 2008, 11:08 AM
Issue 2 was a letdown.

Megatron has sealed off New York City and will now terrorise it. It starts to stink like a G1 episode crossed with the average summer blockbuster film. There is no grand over-arching goals anywhere to be seen, it's taken two issues to setup this lacklustre scene and I feel it will take many more to play out.

We have now been introduced to 2 human soldiers that we know will be big players in helping the Autobots defeat the Decepticons later down the line.

Someone else said it was kinda like a rehash of the first DW arc, replacing San Fran with NYC, and it really does feel like that, fanboyish, and slow to boot. The fact that it is meant to be "in continuity" with the very well established IDW Furmanverse yet looks to contradict it and pretend it never occurred is just an insult.

Wait for a few more issues to be released, and about the time that Maximum Dinobots is at issue #2 or #3 for IDW to issue a statement announcing that AHM is just a 12 issue "evolution" style story that lives in a "what if" sub branch of the IDW Furmanverse.

Paulbot
23rd August 2008, 11:12 AM
Spoilers!

IDW Frenzy is awesome! :D

Like many on other boards the GIANT Devastator reminded me of Dreamwave's first G1 series.

Choosing Daniel Witwicky as the hero is an interesting choice.

As for the continuity, yes it's loose but it kind of works (but I want it to so I'm forgiving). Maybe the events of Devastation/Spotlight Grimlock were covered up? There's nods to that in this issue with them asking if it's the Machination again and the CIA classified stuff. The combiner tech had to be perfected eventually too and it does make some sense that Devastator would be the first working combiner from a traditionalist viewpoint.

i_amtrunks
23rd August 2008, 01:56 PM
Spoilers!
The combiner tech had to be perfected eventually too and it does make some sense that Devastator would be the first working combiner from a traditionalist viewpoint.

Agreed, there is still time for any refined combiner tech to make it's way into Decepticon hands, and for said Decepticons to arrive on Earth.

However it seems that this is about the only part of the AHM series that will be able to be squeezed into continuity without major ret-conning of Furmans work.

FFN
23rd August 2008, 03:40 PM
I think IDW is just hoping people have forgotten the gestalt = insanity thing from Spotlight: Optimus Prime.

Why? Jhiaxus, a genius by Cybertronian standards, was never able to perfect his experimental process. Banzaitron's Decepticons (the ones who took the Pretender Monsters from the Autobots) were wiped out in Spotlight: Hardhead, so I doubt the Decepticons had much of a chance to do much in the way of research.

Who knows? Maybe Furman will save AHM's retcons and continuity errors by reviving Shockwave and having him (very quickly) come up with a solution. Hell, while's he's at it, he will figure out a way to make Ore-13 a non-issue.



BTW, July sales data for IDW came in (http://tfarchive.com/community/showthread.php?t=34535&page=22):
TRANSFORMERS ALL HAIL MEGATRON #1 15,703 copies
Yep, the heavily hyped and publicised new-reader-friendly series for new readers only managed to sell one less copy than Devastation #1.

Lord_Zed
23rd August 2008, 10:15 PM
Spoilers!

IDW Frenzy is awesome! :D

Like many on other boards the GIANT Devastator reminded me of Dreamwave's first G1 series.

Choosing Daniel Witwicky as the hero is an interesting choice.
.

Yeah but did you notice The first page he appears Devestator is normalish size, then next panel he grows to gigantic proportions throught the power of magic.

I to am hoping there's some kind of attempt to pull this all together and recombine the story with the more clever machinations of Megatron that cam before. But I can't help but feel that All hail Megs is the grinning idiot from the cartoon who will be undone by making an obvious ameture mistake, like trusting Starscream. the sombre Megatron from the old IDW continuity was so much cooler to my mind.

This all reminds me of when Devils Due restarted GI Joe as America Elite, although the two where in the same continuity for me they never gelled. It did give them a chance to come up with some new ideas though. Unfortunately the final comic of that series was the biggest letdown I've read in 20 years, UGHHH!:mad:

GoktimusPrime
24th August 2008, 10:38 PM
Mmm... I'm still kinda confused about this story's place in the IDW-verse. Some things (that others have mentioned) makes it feel out of continuity, yet other things like talking about the Machination suggests that it's in continuity. So I'd really like McCarthy to answer the question of whether this story is meant to be in continuity or not!

Frenzy was freakin' awesome. Frenzy is always awesome in the comics (never understood why the cartoon just relegated him as a Rumble clone. Blecch)! :D
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/a/ae/Frenzyhahaha.jpg/200px-Frenzyhahaha.jpg

The Devastator combination thing was done well - I like how they took the focus away from Devastator, showing you the combining through shadows but focused on the reaction from the other Decepticons. Pretty cool because gestalt combination is something which has always been really difficult to do well in the English-language comics.

i_amtrunks
25th August 2008, 11:24 AM
Calling Hook a rookie was an interesting development. At first I took it as him being a rookie on Earth, but then I got to thinking (never a good thing), and I started to wonder if perhaps McCarthy is pretending (or is potentially even unaware) of the events that occurred in Megatron: origins and will have the Constructicons (and perhaps Frenzy) as "new" bots made in the recent past, rather than bots that have been around for millennia.

I'm still not sure that Mc Carthy himself is sure if AHM is to be in continuity with the Furman-verse or not, there are a number of small things that contradict or pull into question what has already been established. Hopefully things like combiner tech working so quickly after being such a problematic tech, Ore 13 missing (not existing), the origins of certain characters and whatnot can be dealt with sooner rather than later.

Paulbot
25th August 2008, 11:33 AM
Calling Hook a rookie was an interesting development.

Heehee. Just had a thought about Issue 3. I would love it (in a mad way as nod to continuity-muck ups) if Megatron looks out at the destruction Devastator is doing and says "They were worth the time we spent building them" :D

STL
26th August 2008, 12:00 AM
I think from the start the story wasn't intended to be part of the universe. Fact of the matter is that sales on the TF titles had been in a steep decline down to the lowest levels in years. And AHM is intended to be a fresh direction but IDW didn't want to alienate the fans already following the monthly. I'm in entire agreement with FFN here. The whole debacle is only so bad b/c IDW maintain its part of the grand scheme of things. The design, the story just does not resonate that. Of course, I don't personally care b/c all I want is a good TF story and I've yet to even read the first issue yet but the art is definitely compensation for mediocre story if the vibe I'm getting from this thread is correct.

FFN
26th August 2008, 11:11 AM
I like the colouring by Josh, but I'm not a real fan of Guido's penciling in AHM. I much preferred his work in Spotlight: Galvatron.

Mmm... I'm still kinda confused about this story's place in the IDW-verse. Some things (that others have mentioned) makes it feel out of continuity, yet other things like talking about the Machination suggests that it's in continuity. So I'd really like McCarthy to answer the question of whether this story is meant to be in continuity or not! I'm still not sure that Mc Carthy himself is sure if AHM is to be in continuity with the Furman-verse or not, there are a number of small things that contradict or pull into question what has already been established. Hopefully things like combiner tech working so quickly after being such a problematic tech, Ore 13 missing (not existing), the origins of certain characters and whatnot can be dealt with sooner rather than later. McCarthy himself has confirmed repeatedly (as part of damage control) that AHM is part of the continuity Furman established. I remain highly skeptical.

I think the line referring to the Machination is something of an afterthought.


What concerns me about AHM or whatever upcoming is the new 'Drift' character. The description they gave of him seems like somebody vomited Japanese stereotypes and pop culture into Transformer form, and he sounds like McCarthy's self-insertion fanfic "BADASS" type of character.

Anybody remember the Wreckers/Universe BotCon/OTFCC comic version of Devcon? The fan writer wrote him as a BADASS loner jerk character, despite his only previous fictional appearance making him out to be a pretty nice guy.

STL
26th August 2008, 02:30 PM
Anybody remember the Wreckers/Universe BotCon/OTFCC comic version of Devcon? The fan writer wrote him as a BADASS loner jerk character, despite his only previous fictional appearance making him out to be a pretty nice guy.

Devcon was a cool character. Even though he only appeared once, I loved the sci-fi vibe he resonated. I think he was a jerk but I think he definitely was a loner. Why else would he be out there as a bounty hunter on his lonesome. He was conversational with Smokescreen w/out being a jerk so the OTFCC bums got that wrong.

GoktimusPrime
26th August 2008, 06:30 PM
Remember that it's been 300+ years between Devcon in G1 and Beast-era... a lot could've happened to change him into a brooding loner.

STL
26th August 2008, 10:37 PM
Remember that it's been 300+ years between Devcon in G1 and Beast-era... a lot could've happened to change him into a brooding loner.

Like lazy lame@$$ writing? ;)

FFN
26th August 2008, 11:56 PM
Devcon was a nice guy in the G1 cartoon ep he appeared in. There were far more assholes back on Earth.

Walky explained to me that the writer was a big fan of Devcon, but for some reason remembered him being meaner than he actually was. Nobody has been able to answer my question HOW can you misremember a character's ONLY previous official ficional appearance to such a degree that you get their entire personality wrong?

Methinks the Botcon/OTFCC writer just made Devcon his self-insertion character.

STL
27th August 2008, 12:08 AM
HOW can you misremember a character's ONLY previous official ficional appearance to such a degree that you get their entire personality wrong?


See my previous answer:

Like lazy lame@$$ writing? ;)

:p

GoktimusPrime
27th August 2008, 01:09 PM
...although it fits in with the whole Beast Machines thing where many characters suddenly became entirely different for no apparent reason! e.g.: Megatron, Rhinox, Rattrap et al.!

But yeah... I think STL's appraisal is correct. :D

STL
27th August 2008, 11:41 PM
I just read the Wheelie Spotlight and the more it all seems out of place w/ AHM being in continuity. In the AHM Preview book back in April, it was indicated that Reflector and his three component robots would form part of the line up. In Wheelie's Spotlight they just bought the dust.

With that in mind, I'm more convinced that IDW are just pursuing a new independent story and trying not to alienate the existing fanbase. I mean, the Wheelie Spotlight was just one month prior to AHM. It'd be a major oversight to tell us they'll be appearing in AHM and killing them off in the Spotlight. And the more u look at IDW's AHM Decepticon line up, it screams first two seasons of G1 which is exactly what I believe they're going for.

TheDirtyDigger
28th August 2008, 06:59 AM
they just bought the dust.


Bit the dust my friend...bit the dust.

i_amtrunks
28th August 2008, 11:16 AM
I just read the Wheelie Spotlight and the more it all seems out of place w/ AHM being in continuity. In the AHM Preview book back in April, it was indicated that Reflector and his three component robots would form part of the line up. In Wheelie's Spotlight they just bought the dust.

Good point there, I'm certain that McCarthy pitched AHM as a stand alone, Evolutions style story, but IDW have shoe-horned it to partially fit in with Furmans existing universe.

That being said, if Reflector is to appear in AHM, we could assume that they will eventually end up on Wheelie's planet (meaning Wheelie has been stuck there for a very long time), or the more likely option that McCarthy has no desire to fit his story in continuity.

Paulbot
28th August 2008, 11:48 AM
I think Wheelie was there a very long time. Optimus Prime received his distress call in Spotlight:Optimus Prime, and then Wheelie spotlight started with that message going out and then a significant time passed on that planet.

STL
28th August 2008, 10:48 PM
Bit the dust my friend...bit the dust.

I need lessons. I'm too fobby. Could u help? :p

And i have to look back at the Prime Spotlight, I don't remember seeign Wheelie. Great eye, Paulbot.

GoktimusPrime
29th August 2008, 05:38 PM
You have confused the idioms "bit the dust" and "bought the farm." Both refer to someone being deceased although to "bite the dust" implies a more violent death, particularly in combat. Reference (http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idioms/b.html)

TheDirtyDigger
29th August 2008, 10:05 PM
I think he actually attempted to put 'bit/bite the dust' into past tense.

Bit, bought.
You can see how this could be done, albeit mistakenly?

I like it though.
'Bought the dust'.
I'm going to use it elsewhere and see if anyone picks up on it.
And then use it so much and subvert others to its common use as to have it added it to the vernacular.:)




So anyway is it stone cold fact now that AHM is in the Furman-verse but with massive continuity errors?

FFN
29th August 2008, 10:49 PM
Ryall, McCarthy say so. That's the official position.

But I say you should question that position very carefully in light with the continuity errors.

griffin
29th August 2008, 11:52 PM
Try not to be too harsh on the guy people. He's living a fanboy dream in contributing to the official Transformers universe in some way, like Dan Khanna or Don Figueroa, or that aussie guy working for Takara.
Unless we know for sure, give him the benefit of the doubt, in that it could have been a what-if story idea pitched to IDW (Megatron ruling earth unchallanged), and the comic company wanted to work it into their main universe.
I think it would be a great opportunity for a real fan to have a creative input to Transformers officially, and we shouldn't take away from him that feeling of pride he must have.
Try to keep criticism reasoned and constructive, with evidence, not mere opinions. Most of you have been doing that, and I'm not here to make a fuss. I just want to make sure it is kept civilised enough so that non-members don't see this place as a fanboy whinge-fest forum, and avoid it or complain about it to others.
Thankyou. :)

GoktimusPrime
30th August 2008, 10:03 AM
As you've said, the criticisms here have been reasoned and constructive and backed with evidence. tbh if McCarthy is going to write a story then go on public record as saying that it's meant to be in continuity with what Furman's writing, yet create continuity conflicts, then he's going to attract criticism from readers.

I'm currently undecided as to whether I think this story is in-continuity or not. If McCarthy says it is, then I'm willing to believe him and give him the benefit of the doubt until at least Furman's current work with IDW G1 is completed - because there may be future events that Furman introduces that could make McCarthy's stuff make more sense.

Time will tell. :)

STL
30th August 2008, 10:14 AM
I don't think with comics its really fair to give the creative team a benefit of the doubt, bossbot. Across the entire comic community these days there's a fair amount of misrepresentation and deception that is intended to lure fans into buying certain comics thinking one thing but giving them totally another. There are instances when writers and editors flat out lie to the fans via news reports and whatnot that one thing is the case and then as you read you realise that's not the case at all. For instance, Marvel's X-Men First Class was touted originally as fitting into original X-Men continuity. They were supposed to be stories between the original stories of the X-Men. That's turned out to not be the case. And Marvel have never come out and admitted that. Yet in all their pre-advertising that's how they marketed at. There are countless more examples across the bolard.

So I don't blame some of the others for being harsh on the writer and editor. He might be an Aussie but I don't like the practice of most comic companies today. There's a high level of misrepresentation that goes on to lure and compel readers to buy stuff even when the editors know the cold hard fact that they're not telling the truth. In fact when they are confronted by an interviewer they give a very frustrating "We knew it all from the start but b/c the story was..." line.

So a lot of the time you have to draw inferences and can't rely on the words of even the writers and editors and I hold firmly to the view that this isn't meant to be in continuty but IDW are trying to maintain that it is to keep hold of the existing readers following their line while attracting new readers as IDWs TF stuff has been on a heavy decline for over two years now.

I think you'll notice too that AHM is much more DW styled. And I think they're trying to stick to that nostalgic G1 feel unlike Furman who was creating his own universe. Furman's story which wasn't very G1-esque though it used G1 characters.

TheDirtyDigger
30th August 2008, 01:24 PM
I just hope IDW doesn't buy the dust the way DW bought the dust.
I am absolutely loving this interpretation of TF fiction. Definitely my favourite by a long shot.

Pulse
30th August 2008, 02:17 PM
I just hope IDW doesn't bite the dust the way DW bought the dust.


Don't cha know an explosion of that magnatude only occurs once in a stella cycle... :D

http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/f/fd/Dreamwave.jpg (hopefully ;))

GoktimusPrime
30th August 2008, 04:51 PM
If IDW goes belly up I say that Hasbro should give Marvel back the rights to publish Transformers and Marvel should include TF with their Ultimate universe! ;)

FFN
30th August 2008, 05:25 PM
I think Hasbro prefers working with smaller independant publishers because they would be able to have a greater say and be able to nix and demand things without the publisher getting their little feelings all butthurt.

GoktimusPrime
30th August 2008, 07:08 PM
It never seemed to bother Hasbro or Marvel back in the old days. :p Furman has commented about the surprising about of freedom they got from Hasbro. Everything was meant to be approved by Hasbro but Furman never had anything knocked back so he started wondering if they were even bothering to read his scripts, so he wrote this utterly ridiculous story which he thought should never be approved as it would utterly trash Transformers continuity... and sure enough, it was flagged by Hasbro. Heh. :)

Sky Shadow
31st August 2008, 11:12 AM
The amazing Trevor Hutchison propaganda covers are the redeeming feature of this series. From the solicitations and those images it seemed like this was going to be a comic about an Earth ruled by the Decepticons with Megatron as a dictator. That would have been a great comic. Unfortunately this comic starts too early and it's not about a world or even a city run by Megatron. It's about the Decepticons fighting humans on a small scale. Sigh.

McCarthy himself said "While this isn't a complete reset it's certainly a new direction for the universe IDW has established and we're taking giant steps forward in establishing a new tone, new outlook and new approach to the license." Unfortunately by "new tone", he seems to have meant "Dreamwave Year One". This is far too bright, sunlit and human with puffy-robot art. It doesn't focus on the character of any of the Decepticons - they're generic 1984-85 toyline robots who smash things. And the comic seems to believe that an unoriginal line about a toothpick is a positive development for Daniel Witwicky, almost the most universally loathed character in Transformers fiction. It's not. The only intriguing two pages in the first two issues were the silent pages with the Autobots at the end of issue one. That isn't yet followed up in issue two and by contrast the 'cliffhanger' at the end of issue two is more like... I don't know... a coathanger? Something that's not a cliffhanger, anyway.

This series has not been worth my money so far. Hopefully it will improve. And if IDW ever do produce that series about Megatron ruling the world (with Trevor Hutchison propaganda art) then I'll be there.

roller
31st August 2008, 02:11 PM
i just read #2 a bit odd that the demise of the machination is quickly mentioned, do you think we will ever see how the machination collapsed?

Is this the main problem you all have with the series? The year long jump into the future with minimal explanations to certain changes? EG: seekers new bodies, humans forgetting about the tfs-like the shuttle crash etc

GoktimusPrime
31st August 2008, 03:30 PM
From the solicitations and those images it seemed like this was going to be a comic about an Earth ruled by the Decepticons with Megatron as a dictator. That would have been a great comic. Unfortunately this comic starts too early and it's not about a world or even a city run by Megatron. It's about the Decepticons fighting humans on a small scale. Sigh.
Yeah... I found G1's "Rhythms of Darkness" where the Decepticons ruled the United States with remainder of humans and Autobots forming a struggling band of resistance fighters to be a far more interesting story. Ditto the destructive awe of the 2nd Generation Decepticons... phwoar!

http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/a/a4/Franciscog2.jpg
San Francisco is pwn'd by Jhiaxus in one strike

Sky Shadow
31st August 2008, 04:35 PM
Yeah... I found G1's "Rhythms of Darkness" where the Decepticons ruled the United States with remainder of humans and Autobots forming a struggling band of resistance fighters to be a far more interesting story. Ditto the destructive awe of the 2nd Generation Decepticons... phwoar!

Exactly. G2 actually did establish "a new tone, new outlook and new approach to the license." And Transformers #67 contained a real sense of drama because it was a handful of underdogs against the Doomsday Clock and Galvatron's empire (and it had a Jim Lee cover.) There was actual characterisation of the Pretender Monsters as Decepticons who fear and resent Galvatron's regime but aren't strong enough to challenge him, and an Autobot resistance that consisted of Chainclaw, Getaway, Inferno, Crossblades, Jazz, Guzzle, Prowl and two humans. That's an interesting cross-section of characters and it came out in 1990, with only seven years of Transformers history. Eighteen years (which reminds me: I'm clearly getting old) later, the most interesting Decepticon army IDW can conceive is Megatron, the Seekers, the Constructicons, the Insecticons, two triple-changers, Soundwave and the cassettes. I was bored to death with that line-up two-and-a-half decades ago. I don't want to see them again, not as a group. Just once I'd like to see a Mainframe-equivalent Transformers comics revamp with actual "giant steps forward". A Transformers Generation 3, so to speak.

Paulbot
31st August 2008, 07:31 PM
Yes the AHM cast is 1984 revisted, and it is a shame since IDW had been doing good though with the assortments of characters. I liked that Hot Rod, Hardhead, Nightbeat were hanging on Earth with Prowl, Ratchet and Bumblebee (and that the former all had new Earth modes). I liked that the Decepticons on Nebulous included Thrust as well as Powermaster characters. I liked Hound's team of assorted Autobots etc.

I too thought the series was going to start with the conquering of Earth already taken care of.

Roller, the Dinobots limited series should show us the demise of the Machination, I think...

Firecracker
31st August 2008, 09:15 PM
Thought I should mention when I spoke to Shane and commented how I enjoyed the 'reimaging' of Frenzy in issue 2, he replied about Perceptor showing up in issue 5 and that, 'He's a completey new take and design on the character'... to which I replied, 'Wow sounds cool, but I bet that'll be popular'... His reaction was not one of amusement.:p

All in all, I'm enjoying AHM... I don't know where the story is going and that is a good thing, imo. Plus, I'll support it so it doesn't end abruptly after 12 issues. Shane mentioned he's signed on for 3 series... but only if there is interest.

TheDirtyDigger
31st August 2008, 09:22 PM
So (sorry for the lack of finding out myself here but...) what is going on with the Furman titles/story of Infiltration, Stormbringer, Spotlights etc??

STL
31st August 2008, 11:52 PM
So (sorry for the lack of finding out myself here but...) what is going on with the Furman titles/story of Infiltration, Stormbringer, Spotlights etc??

The current storyline across the four spotlights cyclonus, hardhead, doubledealer and sideswipe will wrap up the Revelations story arc of the Dead Universe. After that, Furman's next project is Maximum Dinobots which continues the story on Earth from the end of Devastation.

FFN
31st August 2008, 11:55 PM
So (sorry for the lack of finding out myself here but...) what is going on with the Furman titles/story of Infiltration, Stormbringer, Spotlights etc?? His current storyline arc, Revelations, finishes with Spotlight Sideswipe, apparently. Kind of rushed since IDW switched gears to AHM.

To be released is Maximum Dinobots, which happens concurrently with Revelations.


After this Furman will move onto The Thirteen, which isn't connected to any particular continuity, yet is connected with all ofn them due to Primus and Unicron.

As noted above, Shane McCarthy takes over IDW's main G1 comics (spotlights and such).

STL
1st September 2008, 12:35 AM
I'd hate to break it to IDW but it looks like its too late for them. The September Sales figures came in and AHM came in at spot #139

139 15.68 $3.99 IDW Transformers All Hail Megatron 1 15,699

That's a bare increase on the 11,000 odd units that were selling for Escalation. A great decline for the franchise since the DW days and its even more so appalling given the success of the movie.

Source:
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=17852

griffin
1st September 2008, 12:52 AM
As noted above, Shane McCarthy takes over IDW's main G1 comics (spotlights and such).

Really? Isn't he like a noob to TFs comics, with just 2 published issues under his belt? Are IDW that impressed with this relative unknown, or is Furman just running out of ideas (pitched one too many Unicron stories to the editor perhaps)?

This was the only bio I could find (other than on his website), suggesting that he has been writing for comics for 4 years, but there isn't a huge list of his works that made it to print. Maybe he just does it in his spare time, or the list is incomplete.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shane_McCarthy
Maybe IDW thought it was enough experiance to take point on their biggest (I think) selling title.

griffin
1st September 2008, 12:59 AM
Maybe IDW thought it was enough experiance to take point on their biggest (I think) selling title.

Okay, I take that back. I looked it up and as big as TFs started out, they are now being beaten easily by IDWs Angel series (wraps up the loose ends of the axed TV show), Star Trek and even their Doctor Who comics.

STL
1st September 2008, 01:08 AM
Okay, I take that back. I looked it up and as big as TFs started out, they are now being beaten easily by IDWs Angel series (wraps up the loose ends of the axed TV show), Star Trek and even their Doctor Who comics.

I don't blame you though. IDW's most notable books are TF. However, I think they've dropped the ball in terms of sales. I haven't liked certain parts of Furmans work but overall I've liked it. However, I don't think the mass market agrees and even the hardcore faithful aren't backing it up anymore.

STL
1st September 2008, 01:10 AM
I'd hate to break it to IDW but it looks like its too late for them. The September Sales figures came in and AHM came in at spot #139

139 15.68 $3.99 IDW Transformers All Hail Megatron 1 15,699

That's a bare increase on the 11,000 odd units that were selling for Escalation. A great decline for the franchise since the DW days and its even more so appalling given the success of the movie.

Source:
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=17852

I should also add that this is not even factoring in the four alternate covers that comic industry experts suggest can add up to 10% of a books sales for a month. With that in mind, the book sold closer to 14,000 units. Yup, I think the damages been done.

roller
1st September 2008, 10:06 AM
Yeah but you fellows must keep in mind, people today 'need' a popular character to 'look up to' role model i think its called

"And giant robots dont look like me, so i shall buy the comic with the human or human looking characters,hey! Lets go surf the internet!" says little 21st century timmy :)

i_amtrunks
1st September 2008, 10:20 AM
Comics still ahve the "nerd" stigma attached to it, so no matter how popular the movie/s are I dont think the sales would have improved all that much because of them.

Plus the Furmanverse title was a very hard one to get into if you missed Infiltration, not to mention that during the Movie/s release when there may have been some impulse buys that the Furmanverse titles were on their "break". AHM looks to be a title that you can drop in and out of without much problem in terms of losing the basic plot.

Thanks for the info on Perceptor Firecracker, As long as Perceptor is still a know-it-all, I'm sure McCarthy won't be torn into too many pieces! :)

roller
1st September 2008, 11:01 AM
SPOILER WARNING!








Hoist will be appearing in the series, from the horses mouth

GoktimusPrime
1st September 2008, 01:11 PM
Few writers have ever really played on the fact that Perceptor's meant to be absent-minded... the cartoon portrays him as a bumbling professor, but not necessarily forgetful (but a geek). And Perceptor was pretty darn cool - even charismatic in the comics! But he's seldomly ever portrayed as being absent-minded!

FFN
1st September 2008, 06:00 PM
Perceptor is awesome. He's heavily armed, is evidently a sharpshooter and rallies the troops during Decepticon attack.

Really? Isn't he like a noob to TFs comics, with just 2 published issues under his belt? Are IDW that impressed with this relative unknown, or is Furman just running out of ideas (pitched one too many Unicron stories to the editor perhaps)? IDW obviously hopes a new writer with a new storyline would give them the sort of sales Dreamwave achieved in its heyday. Hell, even Guido Guidi is drawing AHM like his Dreamwave days, rather than say, his fantastic, different-looking work in Spotlight: Galvatron and the Hearts of Steel series.

Furman has kept Unicron out of IDW since he began in 2005. Unicron will likely show up in the The Thirteen, though, given that's a Hasbro canon project.

Shane McCarthy
2nd September 2008, 03:17 AM
Hi guys,

I'm dropping in to say thanks to Roller and the Perth crew for attending the Perth signing and for their generous gift. I also thought, since I was invited here by the guys (and since I'm an Aussie), I'd stick around long enough to at least try and clear up some of the conjecture I've seen on the board.

Firstly, even though we've stated this many times before, yes AHM is in continuity and no it was never pitched as an Elseworlds or What If story. I was brought in by IDW because they were looking for a new take on the franchise/continuity as sales on the book were dropping to an all time low. This doesn't mean that what was out there was bad, it just meant that for whatever reason it wasn't catching people's interest and IDW wanted something that would.

AHM was always in continuity, right from the start; our comments in interviews and on forums explaining that fact weren't 'damage control' or any such thing, we were simply trying to clear it up as, obviously, it's been somewhat confusing for many fans.

Now, regarding the continuity, Chris Ryall and I worked hard in the early planning stages to try and make a good blend of what the existing readers would want, and what new readers would be interested in. Some things we've changed (some of which you've seen, others you've yet to see), some things we've gotten rid of and other things we've kept. Regardless of whether or not people think it is, AHM is definitely tied in with previous continuity. I've read all of the previous IDW books and have brought much of that through into AHM; again, some of this you just haven't seen yet.

Ok, some quick replies to some points (sorry I couldn't reply to all of these personally, Guys, I hope you understand):

Body count - As much as I would have loved to have shown extreme death and carnage Hasbro, understandably, won't allow it. At the end of the day kids are reading this and Hasbro need to be careful about how their property is portrayed to all audiences.

Megatron's goals - Yes Megatron has planned all of this out; he's not just attacking New York city for no reason. The previous protocols he had in place for attacking planets were all well and good but now, according to him, he's won the war; the Autobots have been defeated. As far as I'm concerned he's a military genius and an incredible leader; there's more to this than blowing things up.

Devastator - I've read Spotlight: Optimus Prime. AHM is a full year ahead of the end to Revelation so there's plenty of room for advancements in tech.

AHM Sales - As stated elsewhere the 15, 000 or so listed in the sales figures were far from the final amount. We sold over 20, 000 copies of AHM #1 and are just (agonizingly) short of selling out of the entire print run.

Spotlight: Wheelie - Wheelie takes place well into the future which allows for Reflector to be in AHM with no continuity problems.

Hoist - I'm not sure what 'horse' you got that from, Roller, but it's not me. Hoist isn't in AHM.

I hope this has helped to clear some things up. Obviously there's nothing wrong with anyone disliking this series but I'd like to make sure you're fully informed about what's going on before anyone leaps to conclusions.

At the end of the day myself and IDW are big fans of the property and are working our arses off to bring you something that you'll hopefully enjoy and that will sell copies. Obviously change can be startling, especially to those of you that have been supporting the books, but sales weren't up and IDW needed to do something to reignite the line. Maybe it'll work, maybe it won't (so far it's exceeded expectation) but IDW is simply trying to do something so all of you can keep reading Transformers (and, as has happened, we gain a few new TFs fans along the way).

Cheers.

TheDirtyDigger
2nd September 2008, 09:52 AM
Great to hear direct from the writer on these points Shane. Much appreciated.
I haven't picked up AHM yet as am waiting for the TPB to come out but I definitely will.
Just one thing you said there that if we could get clarification on would be excellent.

some things we've gotten rid of

Have we gotten rid of these things by just not writing them into the continuity or are they deemed that unnecessary to the story that we wont miss them at all?
Also, what are these things that we've gotten rid off?

Cheers.:)

STL
2nd September 2008, 10:11 AM
Hey there! Isn't this a wonderful surprise? Do you still collect the toys much? Which lines? I've always wondered how many writers still collect the toys. Artists always seem to but i'm never sure about the writers



AHM Sales - As stated elsewhere the 15, 000 or so listed in the sales figures were far from the final amount. We sold over 20, 000 copies of AHM #1 and are just (agonizingly) short of selling out of the entire print run.


I agree. Thuugh IDW never made mention of it, I suspected all along that was the reboot and looking at the vibe of AHM from the marketing, it seemed IDW were making a change of direction.

And I agree the 20K figure is probably higher b/c of re-order amounts which aren't always included in those figures. The only distortion I'm really worried about is all the variant covers and how much that could've given it a healthy boost b/c as is chronic in the comic industry, there's always a massive drop in decline after the numero uno issue.

I'm hoping the implied re-order volume though means we see a slightly higher second issue. It's a pity that at such a time when the brand is doing so well our comics can't do well.


Spotlight: Wheelie - Wheelie takes place well into the future which allows for Reflector to be in AHM with no continuity problems.


And that's one of the frustrations, I think, for existing readers. I didn't know that until now. But I guess to the new reader you guys are trying to attract that won't really matter all that much.

I personally don't mind the change (even though I haven't read AHM yet to see how jarring it actually is) b/c I've always been of the school of thought IDW should have two main Transformer titles. One for the aged reader who wants to see a more complex Transformers brand that we never got in G1, and one that's more of the nostalgic, big bang ilk like the DW books were


At the end of the day myself and IDW are big fans of the property and are working our arses off to bring you something that you'll hopefully enjoy and that will sell copies. Obviously change can be startling, especially to those of you that have been supporting the books, but sales weren't up and IDW needed to do something to reignite the line. Maybe it'll work, maybe it won't (so far it's exceeded expectation) but IDW is simply trying to do something so all of you can keep reading Transformers (and, as has happened, we gain a few new TFs fans along the way).



I support the books regardless. Now, I do have the 1st AHM issue in my mountain of comics that have yet to be read and I think i better get around to it.

Firecracker
2nd September 2008, 10:48 AM
Thanks for stopping by Shane!

Pulse
2nd September 2008, 11:01 AM
Hey Shane! :)

Woah! An actual TF celebrity stopping by our little ol' place in the universe... :D

GoktimusPrime
2nd September 2008, 11:23 AM
I think Shane needs one of those "I'm famous on the internet" T-shirts. :p (as opposed to Cataphract who's the reverse).

Body count - As much as I would have loved to have shown extreme death and carnage Hasbro, understandably, won't allow it. At the end of the day kids are reading this and Hasbro need to be careful about how their property is portrayed to all audiences.
It never bothered Hasbro back in G1!! The Underbase Saga, the Time Wars etc etc. - we saw characters slaughtered en masse! :p

Hoist - I'm not sure what 'horse' you got that from, Roller, but it's not me. Hoist isn't in AHM.
lol. That's not the last time roller's been pwned and I'm sure it won't be the last. :)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/Transfan%20Meets/Sydney%20Meet%20February%202008/sydmeet0209_08.jpg
But we loves him anyways. :D

Paulbot
2nd September 2008, 11:27 AM
Good to hear straight from the source! :)

And that's one of the frustrations, I think, for existing readers. I didn't know that until now. But I guess to the new reader you guys are trying to attract that won't really matter all that much.

Hey I said about the Wheelie spotlight taking place over a long time. He spent "Meta-cycles" (which I assume is something like decades) on the planet between sending the distress call from Spotlight Optimus and Reflector showing up. :p


It never bothered Hasbro back in G1!! The Underbase Saga, the Time Wars etc etc. - we saw characters slaughtered en masse! :p
Robot characters slaughtered. I think Shane is saying that he can't have anything too graphic when it comes to human characters (hence the removal of the blood soaked shoes between the preview and issue one)

i_amtrunks
2nd September 2008, 12:17 PM
So when do we see Ore 13?

Or will it be wiped out in Spotlight Sideswipe/Maximum Dinobots, and thats why we wont see it in AHM?

I'm going to keep on getting the series, now that McCarthy has said that Megatron is building up to something, (floating island of Manhanttan fortress anyone? :p) not that I wasn't going to collect it, IDW needs every sale possible so that they keep putting out Transformers Sales! :D

GoktimusPrime
2nd September 2008, 12:53 PM
Hey I said about the Wheelie spotlight taking place over a long time. He spent "Meta-cycles" (which I assume is something like decades) on the planet between sending the distress call from Spotlight Optimus and Reflector showing up.
Yeah, I got that when I read Spotlight Wheelie for the first time. Hence the pronounced visible aging on Wheelie etc. and remember when I said that Spotlight Wheelie reminded me of the movie "Enemy Mine" where two enemy starfighter pilots are stranded on an alien world for nearly a lifetime (even raised a child who was born on that world)!

http://www.hotmoviesale.com/dvds/11648/1/Enemy-Mine.jpg

Robot characters slaughtered. I think Shane is saying that he can't have anything too graphic when it comes to human characters (hence the removal of the blood soaked shoes between the preview and issue one)

We never saw anything that graphic in G1 or G2 either (thank you CCA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comics_Code_Authority)) but there were ways around that (e.g.: annihilation of San Francisco in Generation 2).
http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/a/a4/Franciscog2.jpg
Somewhere in that big ball of light millions of people are being slain - but we can't see that so it's okay! :D
(perhaps the entire population managed to pull a Nakazawa Keiji (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keiji_Nakazawa) and live through that!)

Shane McCarthy
2nd September 2008, 07:09 PM
Also, what are these things that we've gotten rid off?
Cheers.:)

I'm not at liberty to say. You'll find out as you read.

Shane McCarthy
2nd September 2008, 07:14 PM
Hey there! Isn't this a wonderful surprise? Do you still collect the toys much? Which lines? I've always wondered how many writers still collect the toys.

I wouldn't say I collect them but if one comes out that takes my fancy I'll pick it up. I liked a lot of the Beast Wars toys (clearly old news now) and I like the Masterpiece figures but have yet to buy any actually. I tried to get one of those anniversary Primes with the Matrix etc in the box but I missed out...and come to think of it I meant to get Unicron and didn't.

It seems I'm bad at this.

there's always a massive drop in decline after the numero uno issue.

I'm hoping the implied re-order volume though means we see a slightly higher second issue.

There usually is but the sales figures for #2 were very impressive.

Shane McCarthy
2nd September 2008, 07:15 PM
So when do we see Ore 13?

It won't be seen in AHM.

GoktimusPrime
2nd September 2008, 08:17 PM
I wouldn't say I collect them but if one comes out that takes my fancy I'll pick it up.
Not all Transfans collect the toys. Jhiaxus - the Australian Transfan who co-administers the Obscure Transformers Web Site (http://s90690880.onlinehome.us/jhiaxus/) isn't an active toy collector - he's more like you; just occasionally gets toys that he likes. But he's a rabid collector of TF comics though. He has the complete collection of G1 and G2 comics from Marvel (trust me, I've read his collection - at least, issues that I don't have... took me a couple of days :p). Charl, another Australian Transfan who runs The Lexicon (http://www.transformersfanfic.com/) also doesn't collect toys. A couple of years ago she sold off her entire TF toy collection (except for one toy (http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/Vice_Grip)).

So yeah... don't let anyone tell you that you're less of a fan just because you're not really a toy collector (not that anyone here has suggested that, but you know what I mean ;)). There's more to being a Transfan than the toys (although admittedly the toys are at the core and heart of the franchise/hobby - without the toys there would be no Transformers).

I liked a lot of the Beast Wars toys (clearly old news now)
Jhiaxus and I first realised that Beast Wars was old at OzFormers 2003 where some people walked by pointing at the Beast Wars toy diorama going, "Aw Beast Wars, I remember that!" - we knew at that moment that when people started talking about Beast Wars with fond nostalgia that it had become old - we'd become old! Gah!

and I like the Masterpiece figures but have yet to buy any actually.
That's rather ironic considering how a lot of the Decepticons in AHM appear to be Masterpieces (especially the Decepticon jets). :) Did you specifically request that or was that the artist's decision? Also, who decided to give Thundercracker a red nosecone? That looks awful IMO.

I tried to get one of those anniversary Primes with the Matrix etc in the box but I missed out...
Here are my recommendations when it comes to MPs:
+ Optimus Prime = Takara
+ Ultra Magnus = Hasbro or Takara (no difference)
+ Starscream = Hasbro
+ Megatron = Takara (check WA laws regarding replica weapons - in NSW this toy is prohibited and consequently NSW collectors need to register our toys with the NSW Firearms Registry (http://www.megatron.net.au/))
+ Skywarp = Takara
+ Thundercracker = Takara (coming soon)

and come to think of it I meant to get Unicron and didn't.
Dude... those things were everywhere! Did you just kept passing them up each time you went shopping until one day they were sold out? :p
http://www.geocities.com/transfandomcomic/toypic_unicrons.jpg

It seems I'm bad at this.
I usually just buy the toy as soon as I see it. Works for me most of the time. :p ;)

liegeprime
2nd September 2008, 08:49 PM
:(:(:(:(:( on the wittle destruction. guess someone in Hasbro's stood up and said
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb313/liegeprime/Thinkkids.png

just my luck... but couldnt there be like in G2 an implied en masse Akira effect type explosions, yah know from afar shots, there wont be flying bodies seen then to traumatize the kid readers ( not that Halo and all that RPG games havent desensitized them anyhow) that way :p just buildings and bridges dissolving like coffee in water. Anyway I guess that's up to the artist's interpretation. :D

GoktimusPrime
2nd September 2008, 09:14 PM
"TETSUOOOOO!"
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/kanedakicker.jpg

FFN
2nd September 2008, 10:00 PM
It won't be seen in AHM. But wasn't Ore-13 the only reason Earth became a pivitol flashpoint in the war? At the start of Furman's stories Earth was a backwater planet where Starscream's team was stationed. They prematurely went into Siege Mode because of the discovery of Ore-13, causing Megatron to arrive to put his house in order, and to defend their cache of the valuable resource which both sides predicted could tip the balance of their war in favour of whomever could secure the greatest amount of the resource.

If Ore-13 doesn't exist in your story, does that mean there was another previously unmentioned reason that you have/will introduce specifically for All Hail as to why the Decepticons are on Earth and why they are so heavily invested in this planet when all previous indications suggested that the only remarkable thing about Earth was that it was the only source of Ore-13/Ultra Energon in the galaxy?

Phew, run-on sentence.

Shane McCarthy
2nd September 2008, 10:37 PM
But wasn't Ore-13 the only reason Earth became a pivitol flashpoint in the war?

Yes. Does that mean it's the only reason they may want to stay there? No.

griffin
2nd September 2008, 10:41 PM
He could just mean that ore-13 just won't be used in the plot of AHM, not that it doesn't exist anymore. This may well be a double sized mini-series, going 12 issues/months, but the story itself could be just focussing on something other than a plot element before (and maybe after) AHM. It'd be like in the movie universe, the Decepticons taking over a city or acquiring other resources to consolidate their position on earth, before hunting for the Allspark in Mission City (the climax). Sure it would have added another hour or so to the movie, but could have worked as part of the total story, without dealing with the primary concept of the movie (hunting for the Allspark).
It's also possible that something Megatron is working to in this story, makes sense within the context of the ore, or its absense in the story. Only one sixth of the story has been told so far, so it's still only early.

STL
2nd September 2008, 11:32 PM
"TETSUOOOOO!"
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Transformers/kanedakicker.jpg

Now there's one bio-card I never want.

roller
3rd September 2008, 12:18 AM
took me 10yrs to see Akira the whole way through!

What i dislike about the IDW universe, is that there are so many stories running at the same time, and little snipets of juicy stories being thrown out in certain Spotlights.

I seem to recall that HOund and his crew were scheduled to head for Earth in Devastation or Escalation, was this cancelled when Optimus and others left Earth at the end of devastation?

FFN
3rd September 2008, 01:03 AM
In Devastation 6, Optimus Prime told Hound to rendezvous at the Garrus-9 penal facility. Hound noted that Sideswipe would not be happy (as he had been bitching about Sunstreaker's dissapearance since Spotlight: Galvatron).

I'm waiting to see how the Hunter-Sunstreaker headmaster storyline plays out in Maximum Dinobots. I find it a strangely fulfilling plot, particularly the fact Sunstreaker was so desperate to escape that he appeared to shunt most of his conciousness into Hunter.

i_amtrunks
3rd September 2008, 09:17 AM
I'm waiting to see how the Hunter-Sunstreaker headmaster storyline plays out in Maximum Dinobots. I find it a strangely fulfilling plot, particularly the fact Sunstreaker was so desperate to escape that he appeared to shunt most of his conciousness into Hunter.

And he only did that when Hunter refused to kill him. Pretty desperate!

Okay so Ore 13 is what brought Megatron to Earth, but now there is something else that is keeping him there...

I'm going to stick to my theory about Megatron trying to turn Manhattan into some kind of flying fortress! :p

roller
3rd September 2008, 02:53 PM
In Devastation 6, Optimus Prime told Hound to rendezvous at the Garrus-9 penal facility. Hound noted that Sideswipe would not be happy (as he had been bitching about Sunstreaker's dissapearance since Spotlight: Galvatron).

I'm waiting to see how the Hunter-Sunstreaker headmaster storyline plays out in Maximum Dinobots. I find it a strangely fulfilling plot, particularly the fact Sunstreaker was so desperate to escape that he appeared to shunt most of his conciousness into Hunter.

ta for the info, so does this mean hound etc already turned up on earth before AHM? Or did they get diverted away from Earth?

Paulbot
3rd September 2008, 02:57 PM
No they got diverted before they got to Earth, and then they got attacked and ended up elsewhere again.

FFN
3rd September 2008, 08:15 PM
I think they show up on Earth in Spotlight Sideswipe (or maybe a story set between Revelations and AHM), as Hound and Mirage have their Earth bodies in Spotlight Mirage (we don't know if that fits in anywhere) and AHM.

Lord_Zed
3rd September 2008, 08:37 PM
Okay so Ore 13 is what brought Megatron to Earth, but now there is something else that is keeping him there...

I'm going to stick to my theory about Megatron trying to turn Manhattan into some kind of flying fortress! :p

Yeah and then he'll turn it into a resort ala Club Con

http://images.wikia.com/transformers/images/c/ca/Clubconresort.jpg

While I will lament the passing of the previous IDW style, I'm still more than willing to give AHM a whirl, I have a feeling wether it gets the yay or nay from me will depend on just what Megs is up to. Capturing New York seems to be more symbolic than strategic, so unless he's going to try to goad some sort of massive attack (like Galvatron in Rythms of Darkness), I have no idea what he's up to, better not be mindless destruction though, I thought IDW Megs was above that, if not ShockWave better come kick his tail pipe.

Paulbot
3rd September 2008, 09:00 PM
Hmm fortress, holiday resort... I tend to think of Optimus's body being turned into an alligator and Decepticon taxis ala City of Steel.... :D

Hereticpoo
4th September 2008, 11:33 AM
I've never bought a TF comic before AHM #1. Why? Because I coundn't just drop in on the story arc without having to read 20 years worth of comics and countless contradictions. It seemed like too much effort.

So I bought AHM #1, thinking that we'll finally see the ruthless and powerfull leader I always wanted to see in G1. The bonus of being able to read a story from the start is good. I hated when Megatron would say "Decepticons Retreat!!" in G1.

Mr Macarthy has stated that this is a continuation, but, who cares if it isn't?
I'm happy to see Megatron unleashed! He's won the war, there's no need to hide. All he has to do is reap the rewards after he beats humanity (I hope we put up a good fight). I can understand how long time readers and avid fans may not like it, but Hasbro and IDW haven't aimed it at you. They want new readers/demographic/sales, like any profit making company. Hell, they got me.

I like it so far but its still early days. Sure some of the characters have rendered differently from Inf, Esc, and Dev (which I had to buy after reading AHM #1), but never let the truth (or someone else's) get in the way of a good story!

P.S. As I press 'submit' I mentally prepare for the tongue lashings....:D

Pulse
4th September 2008, 11:41 AM
It's getting mighty warm in here... :D

http://pointriderrepublican.typepad.com/flame.gif

GoktimusPrime
4th September 2008, 12:51 PM
Hereticpoo: Actually TF comics very, very rarely have continuity contradictions. There are a lot of comic lines which occur in different continuities - and this has especially happened since 2003, but they're mostly pretty good in terms of not contradicting their own respective continuity. The G1 and G2 comics were all (mostly) within a single continuity with very few contradictions.

It's absolutely nothing compared to the mountains of contradictions that appear in the G1 cartoon continuity!! PHWOAR! And not just lots, but really openly flagrant and obvious contradictions too! Comic contradictions, when they do seldomly happen, are far more subtle in nature (e.g.: I honestly didn't notice the continuity flubs in the Earthforce Saga when I read it as a kid, whereas a lot of contradictions in the cartoon were immediately obvious to me at the same age).

I can understand that the comics do have a lot of different continuities/universe/realities (and so do the cartoons really - RiD, Armadaverse, Animated etc - all separate canons), but it's not like you have to read every one of them to enjoy the others. For example, I don't read most of the Transformers Vs G.I. Joe comics but that doesn't impact on my reading of other TF comics in the slightest. They're all separately contained continuities that don't effect on each other.

Hereticpoo
4th September 2008, 01:02 PM
Hereticpoo: Actually TF comics very, very rarely have continuity contradictions. There are a lot of comic lines which occur in different continuities - and this has especially happened since 2003, but they're mostly pretty good in terms of not contradicting their own respective continuity. The G1 and G2 comics were all (mostly) within a single continuity with very few contradictions.

It's absolutely nothing compared to the mountains of contradictions that appear in the G1 cartoon continuity!! PHWOAR! And not just lots, but really openly flagrant and obvious contradictions too! Comic contradictions, when they do seldomly happen, are far more subtle in nature (e.g.: I honestly didn't notice the continuity flubs in the Earthforce Saga when I read it as a kid, whereas a lot of contradictions in the cartoon were immediately obvious to me at the same age).

I can understand that the comics do have a lot of different continuities/universe/realities (and so do the cartoons really - RiD, Armadaverse, Animated etc - all separate canons), but it's not like you have to read every one of them to enjoy the others. For example, I don't read most of the Transformers Vs G.I. Joe comics but that doesn't impact on my reading of other TF comics in the slightest. They're all separately contained continuities that don't effect on each other.

Touche! Yes, I must admit I don't know anything when it comes to what has come before in comicverse. And the fear of dropping into the comic verse stems from the TV horrors and a small dabbling in the X-Men, Spiderman verse. That whole Marvel verse was so confusing! So I guess my bias attitude towards comics comes from that. (Uncanny X-men. Xcited Xmen, Xmen Macross Frontier, The Amazing Spiderboy, The Apocalypse X adventures of Ratchet and Spider boy) :D

Lord_Zed
4th September 2008, 01:12 PM
Mr Macarthy has stated that this is a continuation, but, who cares if it isn't?
I'm happy to see Megatron unleashed! He's won the war, there's no need to hide. All he has to do is reap the rewards after he beats humanity (I hope we put up a good fight). D

I like the idea of the Decepticons stomping into town to, but it does contradict the previous continuity where the Decepticons would hide from the planets inhabitants not just the Autobots, and the Autobots already knew they were there so there was no point hiding from them. Ofcourse maybe Megs has a good plan or a new weapon to keep humanity in line.

And I hate the way cartoon Megs would always holler "Decepticons retreat!" at the end of every ep to, that's why I'm a TF comic fan. :D

Paulbot
4th September 2008, 01:22 PM
The X-Men comics are my beloved second fandom and yes I admit it's very confusing to come in late, but Marvel do make an effort.

The recent relaunches of Transformers comics have all been pretty much clear slates. Dreamwave ignore everything that came before it. IDW did the same.

But IDW did quickly become a very complicated TF storyline which I enjoyed [continuity nerd alert :) ] but pity anyone coming in who hasn't read every spotlight and every issue.

If this series appeals to you (and it does to me) and gets other new readers out of people hesistant to read TF comics I'm all for it. :D

GoktimusPrime
4th September 2008, 04:19 PM
Hereticpoo: fwiw Transformers is a pretty tightly-contained story even within the Marvel Universe. Transformers exist on Marvel's Earth-120185 (http://en.marveldatabase.com/Earth-120185) whereas the mainstream Marvel universe occurs on Earth-616 (http://en.marveldatabase.com/Earth-616). Characters like Death's Head have travelled from Earth-120185 to Earth-616 (courtesy of the Doctor who travels through Time And Relative Dimensions In Space (T.A.R.D.I.S.)). Other characters have never travelled between Earth-120185 to other universes but you can see alternate versions of themselves between the different universes. e.g.: Both Spider-Man and Circuit Breaker participated in the Secret Wars and Secret Wars II on Earth-616 and they have alternate versions of themselves living on Earth-120185, but they are not the same Circuit Breaker and Spider-Man (i.e.: they haven't travelled between Earth-120185 and Earth-616). Although presumably the Secret Wars might've occured on Earth-120185 because Spider-Man is wearing his alien symbiote suit when he appears in Transformers!

The Transformers' encounters with G.I. Joe in G1 and G2 also don't bear any relevance to G.I. Joe. Larry Hama was notorious for refusing to expose himself to any G.I. Joe canon that he didn't write (some have accused him of being a prima donna)... it's possible that G.I. Joe may exist on an Earth that is neither Earth-120185 nor Earth-616, but I personally can't verify that because I just don't know enough about G.I. Joe. Lord Zed? :)

But IDW did quickly become a very complicated TF storyline which I enjoyed [continuity nerd alert :)] but pity anyone coming in who hasn't read every spotlight and every issue.
That's what trade paperback reprints are for! :D

Paulbot
4th September 2008, 04:53 PM
The Transformers' encounters with G.I. Joe in G1 and G2 also don't bear any relevance to G.I. Joe. Larry Hama was notorious for refusing to expose himself to any G.I. Joe canon that he didn't write (some have accused him of being a prima donna)... it's possible that G.I. Joe may exist on an Earth that is neither Earth-120185 nor Earth-616, but I personally can't verify that because I just don't know enough about G.I. Joe. Lord Zed? :)
Hmm. The Transformers comic explicity tied into the original Marvel US Joe crossover series (although the crossover itself contradicted Transformers), but I never noticed that the Joe comics didn't before.

Hereticpoo
4th September 2008, 05:26 PM
Wow, GoktimusPrime you know your comics! As Ali G would say....

"RESTECPA" :)

STL
4th September 2008, 11:13 PM
I think continuity can be a source of wonder and pleasure but it can also be a hindrance. If you have at DC or Marvel, there are certain titles that really struggle. Marvel struggled for a long period with it and then downright abandoned it before returning to it where it was convenient. DC is just lost in continuity now.

I don't care if AHM is incontinuity or not. I'm happy to read it as a book in its own universe. What's really important is if its a good story or not. Furman's storyline will no doubt continue (in fact its been solicited as such) so I think in the final analysis to hell w/ continuity.

It's not like TF writers are crazy enough to have Rodimus Prime the eternal leader of the Autobots and Optimus Prime as the up and coming turbo revving young punk. Those are stupid things DC or Marvel would try. I think TF mythos has some certain pillars but around that its all really flexible b/c they've never had that depth and texture that made them hard properties to play with.

GoktimusPrime
5th September 2008, 09:26 AM
I think continuity can be a source of wonder and pleasure but it can also be a hindrance. If you have at DC or Marvel, there are certain titles that really struggle. Marvel struggled for a long period with it and then downright abandoned it before returning to it where it was convenient. DC is just lost in continuity now.
Infinite Crisis'd! :p

It's not like TF writers are crazy enough to have Rodimus Prime the eternal leader of the Autobots and Optimus Prime as the up and coming turbo revving young punk. Those are stupid things DC or Marvel would try.
I have to disagree with you there. I don't recall Marvel ever portraying Rodimus Prime as a "up and coming turbo revving young punk" - Rodimus Prime was actually a reasonably decent character in the G1 comics. He wasn't a flawless character, but flawless characters are boring! I don't believe he ever acted with reckless abandon as Rodimus Prime.
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/b/b9/MarvelUK-133.jpg/250px-MarvelUK-133.jpg
He did act recklessly when he lost the Matrix to the Quintessons and reverted back to being Hot Rod - but again, he was no longer Rodimus Prime at that stage - and to Hot Rod's credit, he did remember his responsibility though (thanks to prompting from Arcee).

Paulbot
5th September 2008, 09:31 AM
It's not like TF writers are crazy enough to have Rodimus Prime the eternal leader of the Autobots and Optimus Prime as the up and coming turbo revving young punk. Those are stupid things DC or Marvel would try. I think TF mythos has some certain pillars but around that its all really flexible b/c they've never had that depth and texture that made them hard properties to play with.

Although in Animated Optimus is the new inexpeirenced commander and Ultra Magnus is the wise and mighty eternal leader of the Autobots... But I guess you mean if they did a DC style reboot of G1 right?

That's why I like Marvel, 40 years and one universe (plus a self contained Ultimate-verse). :)

Sky Shadow
5th September 2008, 10:37 AM
My biggest problem with Dreamwave and IDW has been the limited series(eses) and the reboots. I can understand that people buy issue #1's and see them as a 'jumping on point', hence the constant rebooting. But Marvel US made sense – You start at issue #1, end at #80 (and you can read Headmasters, Vs. G.I.Joe and Universe in the middle if you like.) UK was even easier: pick up issue #1 and don’t stop until you get to #332. Now that I'm going through my comics, Dreamwave is ridiculously difficult to work out what goes where, with multiple covers for each issue and tripling up of issues #1-6 from the two limited series and then the ongoing. The IDW Spotlights should never have stopped being numbered like normal issues – from looking at the front covers of the issues themselves it's completely impossible to work out a reading order. Aaargh!

And I've worked out what the main problem is with All Hail Megatron. The way it's been outlined as a concept, any of the drama hinges on us caring what happens to the humans. Unless they're really 'fleshed' out (like Sam Witwicky in the recent movie) Transfans really don't care what happens to humans, particularly Daniel Witwicky (one of the first characters against the wall as soon as the fandom got any sort of official revolution over the Transformers universe [see the appalling, yet canonical Transformers: The Wreckers #1.]) And we're never going to care more about humans who were introduced to us two issues ago than we do about robots we've known and grown attached to for over two decades, even if they're not really getting characterisation this time around. Maybe this comic was never going to be about a dystopia ruled by the Decepticons, but All Hail Megatron could have worked if it was a 'Marvels' style comic of a sci-fi invasion actually drawn from the perspective of humans, looking up at the giant robots who've appeared in their world. Or an underdog story from Megatron's point of view where he and a handful of Decepticons are desperately struggling against the military to take the Earth - that would work too. The whole thing could just do with a bit of perspective and focus.

Sky Shadow
5th September 2008, 03:29 PM
UK was even easier: pick up issue #1 and don’t stop until you get to #332.

Although now that I think about it there were also the the Annuals and G.I.Joe crossover. Which were a @!%$# to get at the time.

Paulbot
5th September 2008, 03:37 PM
Although now that I think about it there were also the the Annuals and G.I.Joe crossover. Which were a @!%$# to get at the time.

Yep. I still don't have any of the UK annuals. :(

GoktimusPrime
5th September 2008, 04:47 PM
I only have the 1987 Annual. :/

The way it's been outlined as a concept, any of the drama hinges on us caring what happens to the humans. Unless they're really 'fleshed' out (like Sam Witwicky in the recent movie) Transfans really don't care what happens to humans,
This is also important when Decepticons are distributing whole sale destruction and carnage to what would otherwise be faceless numbers. As Joseph Stalin once said, "The death of one man is a tragedy. The death of millions is a statistic." - we care more about mass tragedies when we start learning about the suffering of individuals (and are thus able to more easily empathise with individuals). There are plenty of examples of this from TF lore. :)

FFN
5th September 2008, 11:39 PM
The IDW Spotlights should never have stopped being numbered like normal issues – from looking at the front covers of the issues themselves it's completely impossible to work out a reading order. Aaargh! I worked out the order of the currently-released books awhile back.

Pre-War
Megatron Origin 1-4

War
Spotlight: Shockwave

1984
Spotlight: Soundwave
1988
Spotlight: Ultra Magnus

No obvious date
Spotlight: Sixshot
Spotlight: Hot Rod

The present
Infiltration
Infiltration 0-4
Stormbringer 1-4
Spotlight: Nightbeat
Infiltration 5-6
Spotlight: Kup

Escalation
Escalation 1-6
Spotlight: Ramjet (sort of takes place during the events in Brasnya, but Megatron has to recover from his fight with Prime before he can punish Ramjet)

Spotlight: Optimus Prime
Spotlight: Galvatron

Devastation
Spotlight: Blaster
Spotlight: Arcee
Devastation 1-6
Spotlight: Grimlock

Maximum Dinobots 1-6 (apparently this runs concurrently with Revelations)

Revelations
Spotlight: Cyclonus
Spotlight: Hardhead
Spotlight: Double Dealer
Spotlight: Sideswipe

Spotlight: Mirage (Hound and Mirage are in their Earth bodies, even in the 'real' world, but the comic is confusing enough...)

All Hail Megatron - 1 year later
All Hail Megatron 1-12

???
Spotlight: Blurr (I don't know where this goes)
Spotlight: Wheelie (Wheelie's distress signal is ignored by Prime in Spotlight: Optimus Prime, but the issue itself concludes meta-cycles later, if I recall correctly [1 meta-cycle = 13 Earth months].)

Paulbot
5th September 2008, 11:57 PM
Looks good but you missed out New Avengers / TFs (which I admit is questionable to include) but would happen between Escalation and Ramjet (as Ramjet is new on Earth during the crossover).

Looking again at Spotlight Wheelie it is possible that the message Optimus saw wasn't the one Wheelie sent while crashing, but the one he sent with his makeshift transmitter? However Wheelie sent that messages for Deca-cycles, Mega-Cycles, Stellar-Cycles, and finally Meta-Cycles. Since Stellar-Cycles are a year (although a year of the particular planet) I thought Meta-Cycles would be a larger grouping of Stellar-Cycles? (Decades?) The last two pages are noted as being a "year" later from the main events.... but either way the story happens where you've noted it as far as I'm concerned too.

FFN
6th September 2008, 01:17 AM
Looks good but you missed out New Avengers / TFs (which I admit is questionable to include) but would happen between Escalation and Ramjet (as Ramjet is new on Earth during the crossover).

Looking again at Spotlight Wheelie it is possible that the message Optimus saw wasn't the one Wheelie sent while crashing, but the one he sent with his makeshift transmitter? However Wheelie sent that messages for Deca-cycles, Mega-Cycles, Stellar-Cycles, and finally Meta-Cycles. Since Stellar-Cycles are a year (although a year of the particular planet) I thought Meta-Cycles would be a larger grouping of Stellar-Cycles? (Decades?) The last two pages are noted as being a "year" later from the main events.... but either way the story happens where you've noted it as far as I'm concerned too.The wiki is currently down, so I can't double check, but I believe Simon said on the IDW forums that meta-cycles were 13 months, but maybe he changed it since then.

TF/Avengers is not part of my personal canon :P In any case, its exclusion barely even registers a blip on the overall storyline.

GoktimusPrime
6th September 2008, 11:00 AM
I thought the New Avengers/TF crossover was a separate continuity. In the Marvel Universe the New Avengers occur on Earth-616 (http://en.marveldatabase.com/New_Avengers_%28Earth-616%29) which is the "mainstream" Marvel universe.

Now I doubt that Marvel would allow the New Avengers, Dr. Doom etc. to enter IDW continuity... so I think that Avengers/TFs must be either a contained continuity or perhaps Transformers entered Earth-616. The former seems more likely to be the case... considering that Marvel didn't allow Transformers to exist on Earth-616 during G1 and G2 when they publishing Transformers, I am skeptical that they would allow it now that TFs is no longer in their court.

Sky Shadow
6th September 2008, 02:55 PM
Yep. I still don't have any of the UK annuals. :(

The 1989 one was the only one I managed to get hold of in the 80's themselves, the rest I accumulated in the late 90's. The worst bit was that some of the stories in the '87 and '88 Annuals in particular were fairly 'important' reading for the weekly book, which frustrated me as a child. (What... Ultra Magnus and Galvatron are buried in a volcano now? Galvatron and Megatron are working together? Highbrow has Scorponok's head? Where are my shoes? Etc.)

liegeprime
6th September 2008, 03:35 PM
I only have the 1987 Annual. :/
we care more about mass tragedies when we start learning about the suffering of individuals (and are thus able to more easily empathise with individuals). There are plenty of examples of this from TF lore. :)

Meh, I just wanted to see the carnage:D in this TF lore version :p:p but the catsup shoes got edited :(:(

Kyle
6th September 2008, 06:36 PM
I worked out the order of the currently-released books awhile back.

Pre-War
Megatron Origin 1-4

War
Spotlight: Shockwave

1984
Spotlight: Soundwave
1988
Spotlight: Ultra Magnus

No obvious date
Spotlight: Sixshot
Spotlight: Hot Rod

The present
Infiltration
Infiltration 0-4
Stormbringer 1-4
Spotlight: Nightbeat
Infiltration 5-6
Spotlight: Kup

Escalation
Escalation 1-6
Spotlight: Ramjet (sort of takes place during the events in Brasnya, but Megatron has to recover from his fight with Prime before he can punish Ramjet)

Spotlight: Optimus Prime
Spotlight: Galvatron

Devastation
Spotlight: Blaster
Spotlight: Arcee
Devastation 1-6
Spotlight: Grimlock

Maximum Dinobots 1-6 (apparently this runs concurrently with Revelations)

Revelations
Spotlight: Cyclonus
Spotlight: Hardhead
Spotlight: Double Dealer
Spotlight: Sideswipe

Spotlight: Mirage (Hound and Mirage are in their Earth bodies, even in the 'real' world, but the comic is confusing enough...)

All Hail Megatron - 1 year later
All Hail Megatron 1-12

???
Spotlight: Blurr (I don't know where this goes)
Spotlight: Wheelie (Wheelie's distress signal is ignored by Prime in Spotlight: Optimus Prime, but the issue itself concludes meta-cycles later, if I recall correctly [1 meta-cycle = 13 Earth months].)

Thanks for the list! Now I can store my comics in order~ :p

Paulbot
6th September 2008, 07:30 PM
Now I doubt that Marvel would allow the New Avengers, Dr. Doom etc. to enter IDW continuity... so I think that Avengers/TFs must be either a contained continuity or perhaps Transformers entered Earth-616. The former seems more likely to be the case... considering that Marvel didn't allow Transformers to exist on Earth-616 during G1 and G2 when they publishing Transformers, I am skeptical that they would allow it now that TFs is no longer in their court.

Yes it's it's own little universe -- the crossover didn't occur in Earth-616 because it is out of continuity with the events in the New Avengers comic -- but this universe had the same history as the IDW one as far as the Transformers are concerned.

hotaru_oz
11th September 2008, 03:01 PM
I've read the first AHM and I found it to be an interesting read, I was little disapointed with the lack of human death showed but that's to be expected since kids do read the comics.
I'm hoping to grab the second issue today.

roller
11th September 2008, 05:26 PM
I've read the first AHM and I found it to be an interesting read, I was little disapointed with the lack of human death showed but that's to be expected since kids do read the comics.
I'm hoping to grab the second issue today.

The preview comic "Focus on Decepticons" had a pair of blood soaked sneakers, they were edited out in #1.

I like it how in #1 only 1 person in the constructicons scene, was worried, the rest were all "ooooh its a movie" I love that bit

GoktimusPrime
11th September 2008, 07:59 PM
We do see blood flying when Frenzy leaps on those soldiers mind you. And again, G1/G2 showed us mass carnage of humans without visually showing us anything too graphic (e.g.: San Francisco).

FFN
11th September 2008, 08:41 PM
I think the way they are handling human deaths in TF fiction is fine. Showing graphic human deaths in Transformers fiction is childish and puerile.

roller
12th September 2008, 11:56 PM
Is AHM an allegory about the struggle of the working class man over the corporate machine?

hotaru_oz
12th September 2008, 11:59 PM
The preview comic "Focus on Decepticons" had a pair of blood soaked sneakers, they were edited out in #1.

I like it how in #1 only 1 person in the constructicons scene, was worried, the rest were all "ooooh its a movie" I love that bit

yeah I noticed that, I know I wasn't expecting full on gore but a little blood would've been nice, considering all the violence that was happening.
I just read the 2nd issue and it seemed a little short to me, I think it's because I'm used to reading thick manga volumes :)
I'm also wondering how someone could mistake Ravage for a giant robot dog :confused:
any way I loved it and waiting for the next issue ^^

FFN
13th September 2008, 12:32 AM
Is AHM an allegory about the struggle of the working class man over the corporate machine? Didn't they do that in Megatron Origin? Working class Megatron leads a bolshie revolution against the fatcats of the Senate or something that was lost in the orgy of REALLY CHEESY "robo blood" and artist Alex Milne giving all of the Transformers anime catgirl fangs.

GoktimusPrime
13th September 2008, 12:35 AM
I'm also wondering how someone could mistake Ravage for a giant robot dog
The guy was being chased by a giant robotic quadraped... it's meant to be a... well, do you know exactly what kind of animal Ravage is meant to be? (noone else tell her please)

http://planetcybertron.com/ravage-1.jpg

A/ Panther
B/ Leopard
C/ Cheetah
D/ Lion
E/ Jaguar
F/ Cougar
G/ Lynx
H/ Tiger
I/ Puma

...and considering that he's never seen Ravage before (probably never seen a Transformer before) and he's being chased and running for his life - under that kind of pressure I think it's understandable that he could make an assumption that it could be a dog. :p So place yourself in some highly-stressful situation and then think about what kind of animal Ravage is meant to be. ;)

Also goes to show what crap beast modes the G1 Transformers had - as far as robots in disguise goes, Ravage's quadrapedic robot mode is utterly unconvincing compared to say Cheetor or Tigatron (although his true alt mode is his microcassette tape mode).

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/4/46/Airazortigatrontrigger.jpg/180px-Airazortigatrontrigger.jpghttp://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/7/76/Cheetorbeast1.jpg/170px-Cheetorbeast1.jpg

Didn't they do that in Megatron Origin? Working class Megatron leads a bolshie revolution against the fatcats of the Senate or something that was lost in the orgy of REALLY CHEESY "robo blood" and artist Alex Milne giving all of the Transformers anime catgirl fangs.
...and mispelling of Sentinel Prime as Sentinal Prime. (-_-)
Still, I really liked the underlying premise for that story though. :)

hotaru_oz
13th September 2008, 08:59 PM
The guy was being chased by a giant robotic quadraped... it's meant to be a... well, do you know exactly what kind of animal Ravage is meant to be? (noone else tell her please)

http://planetcybertron.com/ravage-1.jpg

A/ Panther
B/ Leopard
C/ Cheetah
D/ Lion
E/ Jaguar
F/ Cougar
G/ Lynx
H/ Tiger
I/ Puma

...and considering that he's never seen Ravage before (probably never seen a Transformer before) and he's being chased and running for his life - under that kind of pressure I think it's understandable that he could make an assumption that it could be a dog. :p So place yourself in some highly-stressful situation and then think about what kind of animal Ravage is meant to be. ;)

Also goes to show what crap beast modes the G1 Transformers had - as far as robots in disguise goes, Ravage's quadrapedic robot mode is utterly unconvincing compared to say Cheetor or Tigatron (although his true alt mode is his microcassette tape mode).

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/4/46/Airazortigatrontrigger.jpg/180px-Airazortigatrontrigger.jpghttp://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/7/76/Cheetorbeast1.jpg/170px-Cheetorbeast1.jpg




Lol gee I'm guessing Ravage is one hell of a giant mechanical Panther with a stubby tail :p
True the guy was more concerned from said giant killer kitty than trying figure out what it is.

Paulbot
14th September 2008, 08:17 PM
Note a couple of posts about the TF novels (and Animporhs!) have been moved here (http://www.otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=2133)

GoktimusPrime
15th September 2008, 01:13 PM
Lol gee I'm guessing Ravage is one hell of a giant mechanical Panther with a stubby tail
Sorry, not a panther. Ravage is meant to be a Jaguar. :)

roller
15th September 2008, 03:50 PM
Didn't they do that in Megatron Origin? Working class Megatron leads a bolshie revolution against the fatcats of the Senate or something that was lost in the orgy of REALLY CHEESY "robo blood" and artist Alex Milne giving all of the Transformers anime catgirl fangs.

hahaha yeah, i just felt like saying something 'deep'

bassbot
29th September 2008, 06:17 PM
I've finally come back here (the board) after a busy hiatus! good to see conversation still going. some speculation has seemed weird to me, but i'm constantly on the idw forums and knew the clarity of AHM being set 1 year later. Revelations and Max Dinos fitting in that gap and providing initially a rushed and then more fleshed out completion to Furman's work.

Anyhow. I think the main test for AHM is to see whether a lengthy Transformers tale will work in modern comics publishing. It is essentially an ongoing test, but not really. It also will push IDW to market well as their won't be another #1 for a while on the main line (ecxluding MAx dinos).

I've enjoyed the slow burn SLASH blockbuster feel of AHM so far, loved the cons and the interactions especially in #3 between Megs and Starscream.
Don't mind either the return to main line characters at all.

STL
3rd October 2008, 12:02 AM
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=18289

Issue #2's

141 (Rank); IDW Transformers All Hail Megatron #2; 13,355 (sales); #1 (previous issue) 15,699; (previous issue's sales); -2,344 (decline in units); -14.93% (percentage decline)

__________________________________________________ ________________________

:( Nothing to write home about exactly.

i_amtrunks
3rd October 2008, 12:41 PM
Covers #5 and #6 (http://ryalltime.blogspot.com/)

Art by Casey Coller (Spotlight Blurr) colours by Joana LaFuente.

I wonder how accurate these covers are, as in do they showcase characters in the comic itself or are they the "not at all related" style covers that are there just to look pretty (which they do quite well).

Really hope the central figure of cover #5 appears, the IDW Universe needs more of him.

Paulbot
3rd October 2008, 01:13 PM
Issue five's cover is a very nice image.

FFN
15th October 2008, 12:13 PM
Drift scares the hell out of me, as Guido Guidi said (in reply to comments that Drift's design suggests Drift is a try-hard for Japan pop culture) that the character is what many would consider to be a japanophile. Now, some people said that it's just similar to Jazz emulating African-American culture... but Jazz is *cool*.

Shane McCarthy
22nd October 2008, 07:38 PM
Drift scares the hell out of me, as Guido Guidi said (in reply to comments that Drift's design suggests Drift is a try-hard for Japan pop culture) that the character is what many would consider to be a japanophile. Now, some people said that it's just similar to Jazz emulating African-American culture... but Jazz is *cool*.

In much the same way that I'm not writing Jazz as emulating African-American culture, I'm not writing Drift as emulating Japanese culture either.

In some respects Drift has a 'samurai' quality about him but that's something that's also shared with Western Gunslingers. Wolverine has 'samurai' qualities about him but I wouldn't regard him as a Japanophile (and no, Drift has no similarities with Wolverine...sideburns on TFs?? Nah).

There's clearly a Japanese influence in Drift's design; that was deliberate. But since Drift has yet to appear heavily in my scripts no-one but myself has any idea of how his personality will play out.

You might find plenty of reasons to dislike the guy when he appears, and hey, each to their own, but he's not going to be a walking Japanese stereotype.

roller
26th October 2008, 03:25 PM
just read issue 4


Spoilers ahead if you havent read it


Spoiler for Spotlight Mirage as well




whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaa


whats goin on?!!!?????????????????????!!!!????????????????



this mysterys getting deeper

Id like to think that the chosen one, Hotrod, has gone mad! :D Course, im waiting on the edge of my seat to find out which planet there really on.

Just wondering, how long have the humans been hiding out? weeks? days? hours?

I also enjoyed bumblewasp complaining about earth tyres, i made that kind of conclusion ages ago too, in the cartoon it would have been cool to see someone slide over one of the 10000ft expressways.

My one complaint about IDW so far, too short a read.

As for spotlight Mirage, he was on Earth at the end right? Did he ever make contact with the other Autobots?

Is there a Jazz toy that is like his AHM appearance?

GoktimusPrime
26th October 2008, 06:31 PM
My one complaint about IDW so far, too short a read.
+1 QFT. I don't mind an issue with plenty of dialogue and back-story building... but I found that there was a distinct lack of action in this issue. :/

The issue kinda read like so:
Decepticons: "MUAHAHAHAHA!"
Humans: "Hhnnn..."
Autobots: "WhY mY SHoULd3Rs hUR7?"
THE END!

In much the same way that I'm not writing Jazz as emulating African-American culture, I'm not writing Drift as emulating Japanese culture either.
Actually... I thought you kinda were with the way Jazz was using words like "dude" in the latest ish. Unless he's emulating Californian surfer culture. ;)

Btw could we please never have a Transformer refer to other Transformers in the exclusive company of Transformers as men (or gentlement etc.)?? It makes them sound waaaaaay too human. I'd hoped that we would never relive that nightmare from that horrific Armada dub where both Optimus Prime and Megatron frequently referred to their troops as "men." That... that brought back some bad memories for me. *sniff*

In some respects Drift has a 'samurai' quality about him but that's something that's also shared with Western Gunslingers. Wolverine has 'samurai' qualities about him but I wouldn't regard him as a Japanophile (and no, Drift has no similarities with Wolverine...sideburns on TFs?? Nah).
"Hoodja talkin' 'bout 'Carthy?!" http://www.ridforever.info/gallery/albums/Official-Character-Images/Super_Sideburn.thumb.jpg :p ;) j/ks

But I agree - you can have certain cultural influences in a character without making that character a complete stereotype or caricature of/from that culture. e.g.: Bludgeon and Dinobot also have strong samurai (Bushido) influences in their character make-ups but I don't think most people would see them as "Japanophiles." BW Fuzor Silvebolt likewise has a strong Chivalry influence too. Various Transformers have different cultural influences.

There's clearly a Japanese influence in Drift's design; that was deliberate. But since Drift has yet to appear heavily in my scripts no-one but myself has any idea of how his personality will play out.

Make him a Pachinko-addict! :D Seriously though, if the battle on Earth ever spreads beyond the U.S. and goes to Japan, could you arrange for some fan reference to be written in the background art? e.g.: In The War Within there's a building with "Transformers" written in Japanese in the background and in the movie there's a sushi restaurant in Mission City called "Takara Sushi." It'd be nice to have some kind of Easter Egg like that... so if you're going to have Japanese text on buildings etc. in say downtown Tokyo, make them TF related. I dunno if you have that much influence over the background art, but it'd be nice if you could. :D

It's interesting to see how the Decepticons appear to have absolute power whereas the Autobots are at the depths of desperation (and despair). I look forward to seeing how events play out from here. :)

genechan
26th October 2008, 09:13 PM
I got the 4th issue the other day myself~

Quite enjoyed it too~! It is interesting to see the Autobots really on edge like there are.

I am really looking forward to the next issue~! One downer though....the comics are not long enough~! >.<

roller
26th October 2008, 11:26 PM
One downer though....the comics are long enough~! >.<

i found the exact opposite, there not long enough in my opinion, but then, that could just be the edge of your seat mystery of the story.

and im a fast reader:)

i_amtrunks
28th October 2008, 09:00 AM
AHM #4 improves upon the first 3 issues, but there is nothing overly spectacular in it. Bar the art, which like the writing improves each issue.

For a series that is meant to be about the Decepticons it strikes my funny bone that the best issue has such a heavy focus on the Autobots. Having minimal pages allocated to humans helps a great deal as well.

I did like Megatron praising his troops, its something we have never really seen before, Soundwave being absent, yet Insecticon clones being there seemed odd, but meh it's not a biggy. It would have been better if we had have seen other infiltration units listening to an interstellar broadcast of Megatron's victory speech rather than only the earth based characters, but I understand the desire to keep AHM tightly knit and focused for now. It also served the point of keeping references to the "-tion" series at a minimum.

Not overly intersted in the Autobot traitor, Ironhide believes it to be Mirage, Prowl is uncertain, while Jazz is hiding something. What Jazz is hiding is what interests me most, although the revival of Kup (who got a mention in the issue, I'm sure just to remind everyone of him before he returns) should be something interesting to explain, if the Autobots are so low on energy and cannot repair Sideswipe and Trailbreaker's major injuries, then how did they manage to repair Kup? (For now I'll assume that he was healed before the Decepticons rampaged through the Autobots.)

Season 1 Autobots are very nicely banged up, as mentioned Sideswipe and Trailbreaker seem to be hit the hardest (other than Prime), but even Tracks has been soundly beaten.

Strongest issue thus far, but still not spectacular, these first 4 issues could have been placed in 2 issues and not affected the story, plot, characters or anything.

Firecracker
28th October 2008, 11:14 AM
I really enjoyed issue 4! I can see this ramping up nicely.
CBR have a interview up here (http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=18585#). Check out Perceptor! Mr. McCarthy was not joking when he said 'reinventing'. Wikid! Hasbro. Toy. Now!

genechan
28th October 2008, 11:25 AM
I really enjoyed issue 4! I can see this ramping up nicely.
CBR have a interview up here (http://comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=18585#). Check out Perceptor! Mr. McCarthy was not joking when he said 'reinventing'. Wikid! Hasbro. Toy. Now!

That looks awesome, love Percy's and Blurr's new design :D

Lord_Zed
28th October 2008, 12:13 PM
How come Blur and Perceptor get new designs, and Hot Rod goes back to his old cartoon look? not to mention personality.

Paulbot
28th October 2008, 12:43 PM
Kup sure beefed up when he got rebuilt huh? Although that's nothing compared to Roadbuster! Talk about a "Deluxe Autobot" :)

Perceptor's going back to the tank mode is cool. (Did Perceptor ever turn into a tank in the cartoon? I don't recall it outside the UK comic). I do prefer it when Blaster (Spotlight), Soundwave (War Within) and Perceptor (here) are given Cybertronian combat modes.

TheDirtyDigger
28th October 2008, 01:54 PM
Perceptor's going back to the tank mode is cool. (Did Perceptor ever turn into a tank in the cartoon?

I do remember him rolling along like a tank but really he looked like a giant microscope.

griffin
28th October 2008, 02:42 PM
I posted the CBR interview as a news topic, not knowing it had been mentioned here. Ah well, it is news after all, and you can post in either topic now if you want. I'm not going to shuffle the posts between the two topics.
As you were... :p

roller
11th December 2008, 11:30 PM
I was just wondering

in regards to issue 5

does one have to read Stormbringer to understand why the home world is abandoned?

i_amtrunks
12th December 2008, 08:40 AM
does one have to read Stormbringer to understand why the home world is abandoned?

Not really. The destitution and general post-apocalyptic look of the place is probably explanation enough.

It cant hurt to read it though.

FFN
13th December 2008, 10:36 PM
Nah, you don't really need to read Stormbringer, because All Hail Megatron's portrayal of Cybertron is inconsistent to previous appearances anyway. Sure, it's messy, but the Autobots shouldn't be able to live for an extended period of time on that world without some extensive shielding.

According to Furman's stories, Cybertron was almost destroyed by millions of years of unending war what depleted its resources and stripped away its atmosphere. Thunderwing (http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Thunderwing_(G1)) attempted to warn his fellow scientists on both sides of the impending cataclysm, and that the only hope of surviving (short of abandoning the planet) was to use his dangerous carapace technology (Pretenders). The other scientists ignored his warnings, Megatron refused to fund his "unnatural" research, so he continued on his own.

However, the carapace technology drove him insane, becoming the very scion of destruction he foresaw. The Autobots and Decepticons failed to stop his rampage across the planet, until Cybertron itself chose to save its offspring by swallowing Thunderwing into its depths. From then on, Cybertron slowly died, becoming a dead, radiation-soaked world, which is part of the reason why the Autobots and Decepticons in Furman's storyline operate across the galaxy.

bassbot
15th December 2008, 08:49 AM
I've been enjoying AHM, but now i'm really missing some of the little things that could have connected it too previous continuity. It wouldn't have been hard to include a little reference (whether visual or in dialogue) to the Autobots needing shielding and all their energy going into that, and not being able to fix Prime...
anyhow, still want #6.

roller
15th December 2008, 08:51 AM
i just hope that the in the end, the story isn't a dream

or

That the humans all start chanting "UsA , USA, USA" and start smashing the Decepticons, while American flags appear everywhere-like at the end of that horrid Spiderman movie

i_amtrunks
15th December 2008, 10:05 AM
i just hope that the in the end, the story isn't a dream

or

That the humans all start chanting "UsA , USA, USA" and start smashing the Decepticons, while American flags appear everywhere-like at the end of that horrid Spiderman movie

That would be horrible.

Especially considering that the writer is Australian, and yet in his comic, North America (and in particular New York) is still "the heart of Earth". I'd love to see more Worldwide focus in Transformers comics every now and again.

GoktimusPrime
15th December 2008, 10:10 AM
The writing of AHM is very American-centric. If I didn't know better I would never have guessed that McCarthy is a non-American. Seriously.

Then there was that alternate future in G1 where Spike and the human-Autobot resistance won their victory by using an American flag! Har! :D

i_amtrunks
15th December 2008, 10:41 AM
Then there was that alternate future in G1 where Spike and the human-Autobot resistance won their victory by using an American flag! Har! :D

I don't know if I would call it a victory... they just didnt get nuked by the EU... :p

GoktimusPrime
15th December 2008, 11:17 AM
Well considering that was the primary objective of their suicidal mission, I'd say it was a victory. ;) And hey, the convenient timing of Hook, Line and Sinker's arrival probably enabled Spike and the other surviving members of that raid to escape. :D

Sky Shadow
15th December 2008, 12:12 PM
The writing of AHM is very American-centric. If I didn't know better I would never have guessed that McCarthy is a non-American. Seriously.

Then there was that alternate future in G1 where Spike and the human-Autobot resistance won their victory by using an American flag! Har! :D

And that was written by a Pom. I'd love a more global look at Transformers. Again, Masterforce did that sort of thing relatively well. It would be interesting if different Transformers were stationed at different locations on Earth and if their personas developed based on their conditions (guess where Outback would be based...)

http://www.theyareamongus.com/community/competitions/outback/outbacks-holiday.jpg

STL
15th December 2008, 09:55 PM
http://www.theyareamongus.com/community/competitions/outback/outbacks-holiday.jpg

:D

Lord_Zed
15th December 2008, 10:19 PM
If there going to make it Ameri-centric then I hope they a t least make the consequences appropriate. Given the carnage the Decepticons have caused in America in AHM the world can never go back to the way it was can it? at least not without some corny fix I think. Will China become the new world leader? America has got to be hurting with no President and there greatest city captured and in ruins, the stock market must be in even worse shape than in the real world.

I wonder if anti-US terrorists in AHM praise the Decepticons?

FFN
15th December 2008, 11:33 PM
To be fair, Transformers has and in all likelihood always will be an American franchise. The majority of it's fans are there, and the US continues to be TF's biggest market. So it's reasonable for most western TF stories to be written with an American audience in mind.

I wouldn't worry about the US military being able to defeat the Decepticons (not without external help, anyway), as McCarthy didn't like the 2007 live-action movie.

roller
16th December 2008, 08:53 AM
USA!!! USA!!! USA !!!

Convoyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy yyyyyyyyyy!!!

STL
16th December 2008, 11:47 PM
I just read issues #2 and #3 and I can't speak highly enough of this series. #1 felt generic crash and bang but I've really warmed to the different style to TFs. It's very refreshing. This is a much more cinematic approach to the stories compared to Furman's weaving together of multiple plots. Its been very possible to enjoy and I don't think the continuity issues are as glaring as people have made them out to be. I think those fans are being rather precious. A year has elapsed, a lot has changed. Accept it for what it is.

(Not to mention the fact that IDW had to try something new b/c Furman's run was sinking into unchartered depths at a time when Transformers is a hot property. Like it or not, the sales numbers for Furman's run are pathetic and change was needed.)

The conversation between Starscream and Megatron in #2 was extremely well executed and intelligent. The Constructicons and Astrotrain's snipe at one another was welcomed too and gave some texture to the rivalry among the ranks. Ravage's silence was great too. It gave the book real atmosphere and spoke volumes about the nature of the character.

The human characters are not being forced down our throats. They're there to tell the story of the Transformers and how humanity responds to the Decepticons' assault on Earth. They're not the new age kid genius/punk who wants to tell the Autobots what to do. They've got problems but there within the context of the story. I actually find myself caring for them more for that reason as opposed to Verity, Hunter and the other one (Jimmy?). They have a job to do and they struggle through the crisis. This is a world without heroes, a world without hope. And it's a wonderful world that McCarthy has constructed.

I wonder how much of this is related to Spotlight Mirage too.

My only quibble was what the heck happened to Devastator's breast plate? that really irked me as they combined. At first I thought it was a colouring mistake but on closer inspection, I realised it wasn't there and that jarred me a bit.

Love Guido's art. He's a talent though I think the inks aren't doing him justice here. He seems a bit too scratchy at times as opposed to the clean lines we know he's capable of.

But yes, overall, I haven't been this excited about TF fiction for a while now (since Stormbringer/Escalation). It's simpler but it reduces TFs down to some of the core aspects of the war between Autobot and Decepticon. The characters and the pages have life. It isn't trying too hard and it doesn't make you wait and wait for the plot to develop. I love how everything is slowly unfolding too, it's like we're being exposed to an all new mindset. I look forward to picking up #4 and #5 from the comic shop next week or the week after.

i_amtrunks
17th December 2008, 08:27 AM
(Not to mention the fact that IDW had to try something new b/c Furman's run was sinking into unchartered depths at a time when Transformers is a hot property. Like it or not, the sales numbers for Furman's run are pathetic and change was needed.)

AHM #1 sold a solitary issue less than Devastation #6.

Hereticpoo
17th December 2008, 10:13 AM
I'm glad you like it STL I'm loving it too. After AHM #1 I went and bought all the TPB's i could that related to the IDW and tion comics.

I like the way Mr Macarthy has made the characters as gritty as possible considering its a children's franchise. And I met the guy for like 1 min and he seems cool, hell we're practically BF's.....except I don't understand the restraining order Shane, whats that about! JK! :D



I just read issues #2 and #3 and I can't speak highly enough of this series. #1 felt generic crash and bang but I've really warmed to the different style to TFs. It's very refreshing. This is a much more cinematic approach to the stories compared to Furman's weaving together of multiple plots. Its been very possible to enjoy and I don't think the continuity issues are as glaring as people have made them out to be. I think those fans are being rather precious. A year has elapsed, a lot has changed. Accept it for what it is.

(Not to mention the fact that IDW had to try something new b/c Furman's run was sinking into unchartered depths at a time when Transformers is a hot property. Like it or not, the sales numbers for Furman's run are pathetic and change was needed.)

The conversation between Starscream and Megatron in #2 was extremely well executed and intelligent. The Constructicons and Astrotrain's snipe at one another was welcomed too and gave some texture to the rivalry among the ranks. Ravage's silence was great too. It gave the book real atmosphere and spoke volumes about the nature of the character.

The human characters are not being forced down our throats. They're there to tell the story of the Transformers and how humanity responds to the Decepticons' assault on Earth. They're not the new age kid genius/punk who wants to tell the Autobots what to do. They've got problems but there within the context of the story. I actually find myself caring for them more for that reason as opposed to Verity, Hunter and the other one (Jimmy?). They have a job to do and they struggle through the crisis. This is a world without heroes, a world without hope. And it's a wonderful world that McCarthy has constructed.

I wonder how much of this is related to Spotlight Mirage too.

My only quibble was what the heck happened to Devastator's breast plate? that really irked me as they combined. At first I thought it was a colouring mistake but on closer inspection, I realised it wasn't there and that jarred me a bit.

Love Guido's art. He's a talent though I think the inks aren't doing him justice here. He seems a bit too scratchy at times as opposed to the clean lines we know he's capable of.

But yes, overall, I haven't been this excited about TF fiction for a while now (since Stormbringer/Escalation). It's simpler but it reduces TFs down to some of the core aspects of the war between Autobot and Decepticon. The characters and the pages have life. It isn't trying too hard and it doesn't make you wait and wait for the plot to develop. I love how everything is slowly unfolding too, it's like we're being exposed to an all new mindset. I look forward to picking up #4 and #5 from the comic shop next week or the week after.

Golden Phoenix
17th December 2008, 07:15 PM
My only quibble was what the heck happened to Devastator's breast plate? that really irked me as they combined. At first I thought it was a colouring mistake but on closer inspection, I realised it wasn't there and that jarred me a bit.


I actually like this. I liked that there didn't appear to be any parts coming from anywhere else.

Lord_Zed
17th December 2008, 11:11 PM
(Not to mention the fact that IDW had to try something new b/c Furman's run was sinking into unchartered depths at a time when Transformers is a hot property. Like it or not, the sales numbers for Furman's run are pathetic and change was needed.)


The human characters are not being forced down our throats. They're there to tell the story of the Transformers and how humanity responds to the Decepticons' assault on Earth. They're not the new age kid genius/punk who wants to tell the Autobots what to do. They've got problems but there within the context of the story. I actually find myself caring for them more for that reason as opposed to Verity, Hunter and the other one (Jimmy?). They have a job to do and they struggle through the crisis. This is a world without heroes, a world without hope. And it's a wonderful world that McCarthy has constructed.

I wonder how much of this is related to Spotlight Mirage too.


While I am warming to the series, I can't say the human characters in AHM are any better than Jimmy Verity and co, there just as sterotypical and dull, I'd almost agree with the not being forced down our throats part, till Spike turned up.

Continuity problems aside and despite what you say there are some problems thus far, my only real complaints about AHM are that I still find it very slow, Revelations was to damn fast but this is the oppisite end of the scale there must be a happy medium somewhere. I also miss the more diverse cast of previous comics, while I was getting bored of the -ation series it seemed like it was finally getting intersting with humanity learning about the TF's and what not.

I miss the linked Spotlights though, well except Spotlight Mirage, I hope that's not linked to AHM becuase it was terrible.

FFN
18th December 2008, 06:36 PM
I totally disagree with everything STL has said about AHM.

AHM #1 sold a solitary issue less than Devastation #6. Yeah. IDW claims they totally sold out, but to my knowledge, they've yet to actually tell us what those sales figures were.

Hereticpoo
18th December 2008, 07:20 PM
Are you trolling FFN? I respect that you disagree with STL and some other opinions but why do you not like it so much?

All you've done is make statements of fact in this thread regarding continuation and you haven't really given your express opinion. So what is your opinion? Why don't you like it?

Your statement to STL makes me feel like I'm stupid for liking it...so whats your problem?

And we're due for issue #6 in a few weeks, if you hate it so much why are you still reading? Sorry Man I'm not trying to get agro or piss you off so please don't be offended. I just wanna understand what all the negativity is about. :confused:


I totally disagree with everything STL has said about AHM.

Yeah. IDW claims they totally sold out, but to my knowledge, they've yet to actually tell us what those sales figures were.

Sky Shadow
18th December 2008, 07:57 PM
Are you trolling FFN? I respect that you disagree with STL and some other opinions but why do you not like it so much?

Actually, I think FFN has a point - basically take everything that STL likes about All Hail Megatron, and that's what I dislike about it. (But, STL and I have inverse, bipolar tastes in everything to do with Transformers comics, as we discovered in the 'What Is The Greatness Of Transformers UK' thread. If we ever agree about a comic, the universe will cease to exist. :p)

I've already made my points earlier in this thread and in the "All Hail Megatron #5 Preview" and "Covers for Spotlight Drift" ones. I hate everything in this comic that's set on Earth (most of the first three issues), but I'm really enjoying the stuff on Cybertron (except the fact that Drift is there). I was sick to death of the first two years of Decepticons in the first place and McCarthy's Decepticons are plastic cut outs and I wish they'd get on with wiping out all the humans on the planet so I don't have to put up with them anymore*. Guido Guidi can't draw humans well either, so that would be another plus for the series. On the other hand, McCarthy's Autobots are really keeping me interested. It's been a long time since I used issue #2 to line the kitty litter tray, so I can't check, but I doubt Ravage's silence is characterisation, McCarthy probably just doesn't know Ravage can talk.

Nevertheless, I think it probably was a good thing for IDW to provide readers with a get-in-on-the-ground-floor-type reboot - the Furman storylines were getting convoluted, mainly because of the nonsensical restarting of Spotlights at #1 every issue so I could never work out what order they were supposed to be read in. Oh and I hated Furman's use of Sunstreaker as a Headmaster - he should have used Chromedome or Siren or hell - Nightbeat for that role - it's not like the man's averse to overusing him.

End rant. For now.

*Spoilers...
...
...
...
Alternatively, I'll be ecstatic if Spike wipes out Megatron and all the 1984-85 Decepticons so we can replace them with less boring ones who have personalities. Preferably from 1988-90.

Hereticpoo
18th December 2008, 08:06 PM
Hey thats cool Sky Shadow, at least you say why. Thx :)

Actually, I think FFN has a point - basically take everything that STL likes about All Hail Megatron, and that's what I dislike about it. (But, STL and I have inverse, bipolar tastes in everything to do with Transformers comics, as we discovered in the 'What Is The Greatness Of Transformers UK' thread. If we ever agree about a comic, the universe will cease to exist. :p)

I've already made my points earlier in this thread and in the "All Hail Megatron #5 Preview" and "Covers for Spotlight Drift" ones. I hate everything in this comic that's set on Earth (most of the first three issues), but I'm really enjoying the stuff on Cybertron (except the fact that Drift is there). I was sick to death of the first two years of Decepticons in the first place and McCarthy's Decepticons are plastic cut outs and I wish they'd get on with wiping out all the humans on the planet so I don't have to put up with them anymore*. Guido Guidi can't draw humans well either, so that would be another plus for the series. On the other hand, McCarthy's Autobots are really keeping me interested. It's been a long time since I used issue #2 to line the kitty litter tray, so I can't check, but I doubt Ravage's silence is characterisation, McCarthy probably just doesn't know Ravage can talk.

Nevertheless, I think it probably was a good thing for IDW to provide readers with a get-in-on-the-ground-floor-type reboot - the Furman storylines were getting convoluted, mainly because of the nonsensical restarting of Spotlights at #1 every issue so I could never work out what order they were supposed to be read in. Oh and I hated Furman's use of Sunstreaker as a Headmaster - he should have used Chromedome or Siren or hell - Nightbeat for that role - it's not like the man's averse to overusing him.

End rant. For now.

*Spoilers...
...
...
...
Alternatively, I'll be ecstatic if Spike wipes out Megatron and all the 1984-85 Decepticons so we can replace them with less boring ones who have personalities. Preferably from 1988-90.

Lord_Zed
18th December 2008, 09:13 PM
I've already made my points earlier in this thread and in the "All Hail Megatron #5 Preview" and "Covers for Spotlight Drift" ones. I hate everything in this comic that's set on Earth (most of the first three issues), but I'm really enjoying the stuff on Cybertron (except the fact that Drift is there). I was sick to death of the first two years of Decepticons in the first place and McCarthy's Decepticons are plastic cut outs and I wish they'd get on with wiping out all the humans on the planet so I don't have to put up with them anymore*. Guido Guidi can't draw humans well either, so that would be another plus for the series. On the other hand, McCarthy's Autobots are really keeping me interested. It's been a long time since I used issue #2 to line the kitty litter tray, so I can't check, but I doubt Ravage's silence is characterisation, McCarthy probably just doesn't know Ravage can talk.


I agree with the above, except I have no opinon on Drift, and am more annoyed at the year 3 movie Autobots who seem a bit stereotypical to me, they were more interesting in the previous IDW stories (so far). the Jazz-Prowl-Ironhide traitor thing is cool though.

Spoilerage.........


.
Alternatively, I'll be ecstatic if Spike wipes out Megatron and all the 1984-85 Decepticons so we can replace them with less boring ones who have personalities. Preferably from 1988-90

I kind of agree, if were going to pigeonhole TF's by years then the most of the Deceps and Bots should get wiped out in a cataclysmic battle, leaving room to introduce the next 1988-90 chracters who will get wiped out 12 issues later. :D

Although I must agree I find the Autobots story more interesting than the Deceps this time around, I think that's a first for me.

FFN
18th December 2008, 11:06 PM
Are you trolling FFN? I respect that you disagree with STL and some other opinions but why do you not like it so much?

All you've done is make statements of fact in this thread regarding continuation and you haven't really given your express opinion. So what is your opinion? Why don't you like it?

Your statement to STL makes me feel like I'm stupid for liking it...so whats your problem?

And we're due for issue #6 in a few weeks, if you hate it so much why are you still reading? Sorry Man I'm not trying to get agro or piss you off so please don't be offended. I just wanna understand what all the negativity is about. :confused: I'm fighting the good fight, so to speak. I enjoyed Furman's run on IDW, particularly his use of characters who are rarely seen, or new takes on familiar characters. I was getting into the story. I enjoyed the off-the-wall idea of Sunstreaker as a Headmaster, for instance. I believe this is one of the few stories to give Sunstreaker a significant role. Man, for a guy who barely appeared in G1 comics or the cartoon, he sure is popular :D

I do not enjoy my story being ganked away from me so I can (essentially) read the G1 cartoon, but with blood and humans dying. I question some of the plot holes, such as the claimed "1 year later" (Devastation showed the Decepticons under immediate attack... so what have they been doing?), and how come in issue 4 Megatron claimed that the Earth had been conquered. Was the conquest of the rest of the world not important enough to show on page? In any case by issue 5 it is implied that the rest of the world was still unconquered. Oh yeah, how come various Decepticon dudes have reformatted into body forms that transform into outdated Earth vehicles and technology compared to their previous body forms?

I'm also not enjoying Guido's pencils in AHM. I much preferred his work in Spotlight: Galvatron.

So, along with continuity issues and and comments made by the powers that be that have irked me, I do not like AHM and do not support it.

I also get the feeling on this forum that I should support it because the author is Australian. I enjoy going against the grain ;)

Hereticpoo
18th December 2008, 11:22 PM
Fair enough! :) Restecpa :cool:

I'm fighting the good fight, so to speak. I enjoyed Furman's run on IDW, particularly his use of characters who are rarely seen, or new takes on familiar characters. I was getting into the story. I enjoyed the off-the-wall idea of Sunstreaker as a Headmaster, for instance. I believe this is one of the few stories to give Sunstreaker a significant role. Man, for a guy who barely appeared in G1 comics or the cartoon, he sure is popular :D

I do not enjoy my story being ganked away from me so I can (essentially) read the G1 cartoon, but with blood and humans dying. I question some of the plot holes, such as the claimed "1 year later" (Devastation showed the Decepticons under immediate attack... so what have they been doing?), and how come in issue 4 Megatron claimed that the Earth had been conquered. Was the conquest of the rest of the world not important enough to show on page? In any case by issue 5 it is implied that the rest of the world was still unconquered. Oh yeah, how come various Decepticon dudes have reformatted into body forms that transform into outdated Earth vehicles and technology compared to their previous body forms?

I'm also not enjoying Guido's pencils in AHM. I much preferred his work in Spotlight: Galvatron.

So, along with continuity issues and and comments made by the powers that be that have irked me, I do not like AHM and do not support it.

I also get the feeling on this forum that I should support it because the author is Australian. I enjoy going against the grain ;)

roller
19th December 2008, 05:54 PM
I wonder if the Dead universe is still kicking around in AHM at all

kup
23rd December 2008, 03:02 PM
Last weekend I bought almost all the issues of AHM and borrowed Issue 1 from Zed (couldn't find that one). I have read them all in one go and I have just finished reading this whole thread which I have been avoiding since the first issue was released due to spoilers.

I will begin with the positives and then I will get on with my general comments.

The series overall reads fast, is enjoyable and does enthuse me to continue reading. This is primarily due to the Autobot's situation and dilemma with an unknown traitor among them as their situation is indeed dire and I want to see where it all leads.

The brief dynamic with Megatron praising Starscream was a bit unusual and cought me off guard but I welcomed it as it was a rare moment to see something like that in TF stories and realistically speaking, Starscream would not have such a high rank among the Decepticons if Megatron did not respect him as a soldier to some degree.

There is also nothing more awesome than Kup smoking a cigar! :D

Before I begin with the rest of my views, with all due respect to Mr McCarthy, this series reads as something that was conceived to be in a continuity of its own and I don't see how this was meant to be within the 'tion' continuity all along. It reads more like there was a conscious decision not take into account the Furman stories and only after much of the AHM story outline was finalized was the decision made to shoe horn it into the rest of the IDW continuity.

There is also something else that caught me by surprise. Up to this point the marketing push (covers, posters, etc) gave the impression that this new series was about Megatron having absolute rule of Earth with the Autobots completely defeated (Prime's head on a spike). I was surprised when the book was mostly about Megatron just getting started in his conquest of Earth with the Autobots exiled on Cybertron. I know that 'reader deception' is all too common in modern day comics as STL pointed out earlier in the thread, but this kind of annoyed me. Regardless it was a minor annoyance and not something too deterring but I thought that I should mention it.

My following comments are not necessarily bad but it is a bit of a let down for me as I am one who likes more variety in my Transformers. It feels that AHM was either written to appeal to G1 cartoon only fans that are only familiar with the first 3 years of Transformers or that the writer is a cartoon only fan himself. This is particularly noticeable coming after Furman's portion of the IDW continuity which makes a considerable effort to show us a wide variety of characters stretching from G1 to G2 while AHM only concentrates on '84-'86 characters and makes no references to later ones (that I have noticed).

The issues so far also read as a more refined and violent G1 cartoon episode as the Decepticon characterizations are much less complex than the ones we saw in Furman's stories and more of your stereotypical cartoon bad guys all smiling and laughing at the destruction they cause. Naturally they have an evil plan to conquer the world and that appears to be the whole scope of their endeavors which is unlike Furman's side of the continuity in which Earth becomes a pivotal front in the overall galaxy expanding war effort.

Yeah, the Furman stories were indeed becoming too convoluted and the last few issues have felt very rushed and unfocused but AHM is the extreme opposite with a much more simplified story and G1 cartoon like villains with stereotypical villain type goals and methods. I personally preferred Furman's overall approach as it made the Transformers a mysterious alien force on Earth and part of a much greater war. The Decepticons were also more focused in the larger picture of achieving victory than enjoying mindless destruction and some of them like Sixshot, showed different sides to them reminding us that there were different sides to the Decepticons than just purely evil villains; this helped to add more depth to them and the overall story.

The Irony given that this series was marketed as being focused on the Decepticons is that what keeps AHM interesting is actually the Autobots as their situation and characterizations are much more refined and believable than that of the Decepticons. The Autobots are in a dire situation and despite them being good guys, they are on the edge, specially when they are sure that they have a traitor among them; this gives them a lot of story possibilities and depth which is a huge contrast to the Decepticons which are all 'HaHa, we are evil!'.

While reading this thread I found myself mostly agreeing with FFN (has the world exploded yet? :p) and Lord_Zed in their assessments of All Hail Megatron.

In conclusion, AHM is a simpler, more visual and faster to read than Furman's stories but they also feel 'lesser' and a bit of a step down in its story telling from what we have gotten before from IDW primarily due to the much more simplified form of cartoon like story telling and characterization. Even though it is still enjoyable to some degree and I look forward to more issues (I want to see what happens to the Autobots) but I also have a feeling that I already know where the overall story is heading and how it will conclude because of the heavily cartoon inspired Decepticons,. Hopefully I am wrong in that and there is room for surprises.

FFN
23rd December 2008, 09:15 PM
I wonder if the Dead universe is still kicking around in AHM at all Nah, I'd expect that to be OVER -- FINISHED!

IDW evidently NEVER DID WANT Furman's story TO LIVE FOREVER and decided that it was SURPLUS TO REQUIREMENTS. If they have so little faith in their writers that they hover over the stories like LIKE SOME PREDATORY BIRD, yanking it halfway through when sales start to dip, then WHAT CHANCE DO WE HAVE?

GoktimusPrime
23rd December 2008, 09:20 PM
There is also nothing more awesome than Kup smoking a cigar!
..other than romanticising smoking to impressionable youthes who might be reading the book. (-_-) But then again, it's not lit. Maybe he just likes to hold it there like Popeye - I remember seeing one episode of Popeye where he tells his nephews that he doesn't really smoke pipe and just holds it there (it was one of those community service messages at the end of the ep - and knowing's half the battle! :p).

http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/6594/spinachguy2mf.gif
...heh, I had a lecturer at uni who looked a lot like Popeye. ;D

Golden Phoenix
23rd December 2008, 09:45 PM
..other than romanticising smoking to impressionable youthes who might be reading the book. (-_-) But then again, it's not lit.

Maybe he has the same reason as Bender.
"They make me look cool"
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:9BGM7cW6Awq_TM:http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/punchurclockin/bender-smoking.jpg

kup
23rd December 2008, 09:52 PM
Maybe he he has the same reason as Bender.
"They make me look cool"
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:9BGM7cW6Awq_TM:http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/punchurclockin/bender-smoking.jpg

I say you are right and it works!

..other than romanticising smoking to impressionable youthes who might be reading the book. (-_-)

I feel like smoking a cigar now!

Lord_Zed
23rd December 2008, 10:25 PM
The things Kup will do to impress the "in crowd", sure is a sucker for peer presure.

But how do we know it's a Cigar if he never lights it? Maybe it's a Decepticons finger.

Golden Phoenix
23rd December 2008, 10:36 PM
But how do we know it's a Cigar if he never lights it? Maybe it's a Decepticons finger.

Well the crazies have to manifest somewhere

kup
23rd December 2008, 11:41 PM
The things Kup will do to impress the "in crowd", sure is a sucker for peer presure.

But how do we know it's a Cigar if he never lights it? Maybe it's a Decepticons finger.

lol for a moment I thought you meant me :)

Golden Phoenix
23rd December 2008, 11:48 PM
lol for a moment I thought you meant me :)

Wait, we're not talking out you?:p

STL
24th December 2008, 12:26 AM
Nah, I'd expect that to be OVER -- FINISHED!

IDW evidently NEVER DID WANT Furman's story TO LIVE FOREVER and decided that it was SURPLUS TO REQUIREMENTS. If they have so little faith in their writers that they hover over the stories like LIKE SOME PREDATORY BIRD, yanking it halfway through when sales start to dip, then WHAT CHANCE DO WE HAVE?

AHM #1 sold a solitary issue less than Devastation #6.

While I respect that there was appreciation for the -ion run and I myself loved parts of it, I think we're forgetting the larger picture here. Furman started with 100K + readers.


Infiltration
N/A - OCT05 #0 - over 100,000
030 - JAN06/#1 - 45,468


Let's look at the end of his run.


Devastation #6: 149 - FEB08/#6 - 12,666



Revelations sales
Revelation
163 - JUN08/#16 - 10,806
181 - JUL08/#17 - 10,516


Compared to AHM's first issue:


ALL HAIL MEGATRON: 139 - JUL08/#1 15,703


Source: http://tfarchive.com/comics/idw/sales.php: based on IcV2 estimates which are very respected in the comic industry.

By no means am I saying that AHM has improved sales but what I'm saying is that Furman failed miserably from a sales point of view. At a time when the franchise should be at dizzy heights, he's managed to reduce the comic fanbase from the 100K to such lowly heights. Dreamwave, like them or not, did not have such poor sales numbers till the very end when they were struggling to even get product on the shelves.

The only person who has responsibility for this is Furman. He writes the books and constructs the arcs. He has to take responsiblity. It wasn't as if IDW editorial all of a sudden saw bad sales and reacted without thought, they'd seen a steady decline that they had been unable to arrest. In the end, they had to try something new and my belief is that good or bad, they had to do something new. AHM was it. I'm not saying AHM's a success but it was entirely necessary and I don't think we can deny that.

Furman left IDW with no choice but to find a way to revitalise the franchise. As respected and venerated by the old school brigade, he has failed to command the respect of the reading public. The -tion series is a series for the faithful and there aren't many of us and the fact is that even more of us are abandoning the book if you look at the numbers. I for one loved his Beast Wars: the Gathering but I'm under no illusions about its failure and Furman's failures at IDW b/c at the end of the day, a comic's success is also about its sales. Creatively I'm inspired by the Gathering but I acknowledge its failure on a sales level. And I think that fans have to accept that the "-tion" series failed on that front and is itself responsible for falling on its own sword. No one else.

You do not get exposure of 100K and go down to 10K in 3 years.


I also get the feeling on this forum that I should support it because the author is Australian. I enjoy going against the grain ;)

Definitely not. I for one didn't warm to it just b/c it was an Australian writer. Just have a look at my posts earlier in this thread and elsewhere. Even Nicola Scott who drew Birds of Prey is Australian but I don't follow her religiously to ever cover/comic she does. I think the reading TF public is especially harsh and will vote with its wallet. Combined with the comic reading public who dabbles in TFs, its not easy to get away with "support me because I'm home grown". Also, more TF collectors these days are in it far more for the toys than the comics so the moment a comic is disinteresting, its very easy to turn your back on. Even more so when you're shelling out close to $8 for a comic which could be spent on TFs.


My following comments are not necessarily bad but it is a bit of a let down for me as I am one who likes more variety in my Transformers. It feels that AHM was either written to appeal to G1 cartoon only fans that are only familiar with the first 3 years of Transformers or that the writer is a cartoon only fan himself. This is particularly noticeable coming after Furman's portion of the IDW continuity which makes a considerable effort to show us a wide variety of characters stretching from G1 to G2 while AHM only concentrates on '84-'86 characters and makes no references to later ones (that I have noticed).


I tire of these remarks about '84 and '86 characters getting too much attention. Fact is, they never did. Even in the cartoon, they were never developed and weren't that very distinct. Only a few ever were. I actually really appreciate more stories about the '84-'86 characters b/c I felt I never really got to know them. They had few comic appearances and their cartoon appearances weren't very material. All this talk about concentrating too much on '84 to '86 is really just "I want to see obscure characters" squeal. I'm all for obscure characters and developing them but there's nothing wrong with developing existing characters who never got much of a chance to shine or entrenching them further in the mind of readers. It doesn't bother me either way but there seems to always be a small minority (even in the broader comic reading community) that loves obscure characters. I do too but really, I think a franchise should stick to its guns and focus on building those b/c they're what the franchise is really about.
.
As i_amtrunks has often remarked, which I absolutely agree with, it'd be great to have both types of series available. I'd read both. I see the beauty of both and appreciate the different approaches. There's something wonderful about the simplicity of AHM.

jacksplatt11
24th December 2008, 12:41 AM
Nah, I'd expect that to be OVER -- FINISHED!

IDW evidently NEVER DID WANT Furman's story TO LIVE FOREVER and decided that it was SURPLUS TO REQUIREMENTS. If they have so little faith in their writers that they hover over the stories like LIKE SOME PREDATORY BIRD, yanking it halfway through when sales start to dip, then WHAT CHANCE DO WE HAVE?

Oh... I see what you did there...

FFN
24th December 2008, 03:00 AM
Well, I thought it was funny :p


Let's look at the end of his run.

Compared to AHM's first issue:

Source: http://tfarchive.com/comics/idw/sales.php: based on IcV2 estimates which are very respected in the comic industry.
i_amtrunks got mixed up. AHM #1 sold one copy less than Devastation #1 over the same period of time.

And I think failure is a rather harsh.

Paulbot
24th December 2008, 08:33 AM
I'm a little over sales figures continutally being pulled out :rolleyes:

Thank Primus there aren't similar figures for Hasbro and Takara sales! :p

I tire of these remarks about '84 and '86 characters getting too much attention. Fact is, they never did. Even in the cartoon, they were never developed and weren't that very distinct. Only a few ever were. I actually really appreciate more stories about the '84-'86 characters b/c I felt I never really got to know them. They had few comic appearances and their cartoon appearances weren't very material. All this talk about concentrating too much on '84 to '86 is really just "I want to see obscure characters" squeal. I'm all for obscure characters and developing them but there's nothing wrong with developing existing characters who never got much of a chance to shine or entrenching them further in the mind of readers.

Furman could and did look at the G1 universe as a whole and could use elements from the whole spectrum (including G2). It wasn't forced to only use the characters that had toys on sale that year like the original comics and cartoons. Seeing characters like Hot Rod and Hardhead (in earth modes) fighting alongside Wheeljack and Prowl pleased me greatly.

I don't care about obscure characters being used for the sake of using something obscure (Hasbro is doing enough of that with it's pointless Micromaster homages) but I prefer to see the whole of the G1 universe to be used.

This is why Drift bugs me. There are so many characters in G1 that I can't see how you couldn't find an existing one that had the right sort of character traits (and could have been given a new Japanese race car mode).

As i_amtrunks has often remarked, which I absolutely agree with, it'd be great to have both types of series available. I'd read both. I see the beauty of both and appreciate the different approaches. There's something wonderful about the simplicity of AHM.

I would recommend All Hail Megatron to casual fans, and when complete it will make a nice book (shame the trade paperback is in two parts) but am much happier reading Maximum Dinobots.

kup
24th December 2008, 08:43 AM
I would recommend All Hail Megatron to casual fans, and when complete it will make a nice book (shame the trade paperback is in two parts) but am much happier reading Maximum Dinobots.

I also enjoyed Maximum Dinobots! After reading AHM its not hard for me to conclude that this single issue is much better written than the whole first 3 issues of AHM.

Sky Shadow
24th December 2008, 09:56 AM
I tire of these remarks about '84 and '86 characters getting too much attention. Fact is, they never did.

That's absolutely not true, STL. Again, maybe it's a you-had-to-be-there thing, but if you hadn't been (necessarily) preoccupied with sucking dummies, soiling nappies and learning to walk during those years you'd probably have noticed the overexposure and be as tired of those characters as I am and many others are. (I'm focussing for the following on the '84 and '85 Transformers, since those are the years I've been bemoaning and the main ones in All Hail Megatron [except the Autobot movie cast, who were also overexposed in the eighties, so they're basically the same anyway]. When it comes to 1986 as a whole then that's great - no one would like a series focussing on Pipes and the '86-non-Wheelie-minibots more than me, but let's face it - they're not the 1986 characters McCarthy is using.)

Okay, so it's a bit of a tautology to say it, but the '84-'85 characters were the only Transformers for the first two years of Transformers. The writers didn't have anyone else to use. And so they used them. A lot. They got to be in innumerable cartoons, comics, colouring books, picture books, read-along audiobooks, sticker books, paint-by-number books - they were everywhere. And then - decades later - Dreamwave and All Hail Megatron come along and do it all again. The later G1 characters never got anything like that level of exposure. Heck, Pat Lee actually thought G1 was the 84-85 characters and that G2 was "those introduced in the Transformers
movie and beyond". Then again, he also thought his 'favourite character' - Sideswipe - died in the movie and that the Transformers cartoon was so popular that it was only a matter of time before they made the toys. And this is what $#!*s me. They put the franchise in the hands of people like him and McCarthy - people who know bugger-all about Transformers and don't seem greatly interested in broadening their horizons beyond the little they do know. Transformers is at its best when it's in the hands of people who lovingly investigate everything they can about its history. People like Bob Forward, Larry DiTillio, Marty Isenberg, Derrick Wyatt, Simon Furman - people who clearly care about what they're writing. McCarthy couldn't even be bothered to read the IDW comics that came before his one, let alone explore the rich tapestry of Transformers history beyond the most obvious and easily-accessed material. Furman's sales figures might be bad at the moment, but this is a man who managed to sustain readers of a toy franchise comic book for decades. if you put the comics in the hands of someone who doesn't care about the characters then the figures will only continue to drop and the people who make up the long-term (and not just transient) fanbase won't be there anymore. McCarthy is capable of good work, like Spotlight: Blur and the AHM Autobots on Cybertron. He's also capable of utter bilge, like just about everything that's happened on Earth so far. If the G1 comics had been given to someone who didn't care about the characters in the way Furman still does; if Beast Wars had been given to hacks who didn't care what had gone before; if Transformers Animated hadn't been given to people who lovingly researched and homaged all aspects of the past then the Transformers franchise and fanbase would be a very different place to where it is today. I know I wouldn't be here. And I might not be one of those statistical readers of the IDW comics unless McCarthy or whoever ultimately replaces him learns to love the Transformers universe as a whole.

kup
24th December 2008, 10:57 AM
For some reason there seems to be a corporate inhouse believe that people largely prefer Superstar Funana's art and style.

Most art that you see for promotional merchandising material are Pat Lee's marshmallow bots (jigsaw puzzles, posters and other peripheral merchandise) and I don't think that the 'dull surprise' expressions in the Universe packaging was a coincidence.

However it appears that they are slowly catching on that the style sucks and are making improvements.

Although AHM has a much more cartoony and distinct style than most of the 'previous' IDW books its decent and reasonably good but its not hard to see that it is indeed inspired by Dreamwave's in house style which could have been a corporate push based on the constant use of Dreamwave art in Transformers merchandise.

GoktimusPrime
24th December 2008, 11:07 AM
+1.

I have an incredible amount of respect for Bob Forward and Larry DiTillio considering that they totally went out of their way to educate themselves about Transformers and interacting with the TF fandom. They started off knowing next to nothing about Transformers to writing what is widely considered to be one of the best stories ever written for Transformers (IMO the best TF story ever written for a TV series).

FFN
24th December 2008, 04:26 PM
For some reason there seems to be a corporate inhouse believe that people largely prefer Superstar Funana's art and style.

Most art that you see for promotional merchandising material are Pat Lee's marshmallow bots (jigsaw puzzles, posters and other peripheral merchandise) and I don't think that the 'dull surprise' expressions in the Universe packaging was a coincidence.

However it appears that they are slowly catching on that the style sucks and are making improvements.

Although AHM has a much more cartoony and distinct style than most of the 'previous' IDW books its decent and reasonably good but its not hard to see that it is indeed inspired by Dreamwave's in house style which could have been a corporate push based on the constant use of Dreamwave art in Transformers merchandise. I think it has more to do with the fact Hasbro just owns all of Dreamwave's Transformers art and it happens to be the most well-known modern Transformers art, even if it is bad. The people who deal with merchandise licensees in Hasbro probably don't have an opinion on Transformers art anyway, so long as characters (more or less) look right.

However, they've recently been using new art by Don Figueroa, as seen on that Kinnerton advent calendar and the Hot Topic t-shirts.

Guido Guidi is a talented artist. I enjoyed his work in Spotlight: Galvatron and Hearts of Steel. However, his work in AHM is the most "Dreamwavey" stuff he's done for IDW in my opinion, and is likely the direction IDW wanted to attract the more casual fans and general comic book readers, perhaps the former Dreamwave readers IDW failed to recapture when they started out.

If it was a Hasbro corporate push, then I'd think that we'd be seeing Dreamwavey style art for Universe toys.

GoktimusPrime
24th December 2008, 05:23 PM
I think Guidi's just always drawn to his own style which is relatively independent of other DW and IDW artists (aside from following unique character designs of course). I like Guidi's art although I think he needs a wider range of "screaming mouthes." :p

STL
24th December 2008, 10:04 PM
That's absolutely not true, STL. Again, maybe it's a you-had-to-be-there thing, but if you hadn't been (necessarily) preoccupied with sucking dummies, soiling nappies and learning to walk during those years you'd probably have noticed the overexposure and be as tired of those characters as I am and many others are.

It’s all good to sit on the rocking chair as a so-called favourite tanks to 10K. I think what you’ve missed is that AHM is offering us, hopefully (as I haven’t read beyond issue #3 yet, a different model I think that it was wrong to try and link it to “-tion” series as that meant people, especially the old timers, couldn’t look past that and it was poor choice on IDW’s behalf because they’ve been on the back foot ever since.

The assessment that this is G1 all over is a misrepresentation.

When in G1 did the Autobots become so fragile and without purpose? I don’t think that’s an angle that’s ever been explored. When did the Decepticons ever actually go about methodically dismantling the Earth?

And overexposure of ’84-’86 characters does not ever meant they were developed with much depth. I’ve read or watched very few stories about Prowl or Mirage that were more than generic cartoon characterisations. I think those characters deserve as much as a chance to be developed in a meaningful fashion as Sixshot or Hardhead. I really like Hardhead (the futuristic tank and all) and absolutely agree it was great seeing Nightbeat, him and the Technobots working with the classic characters. But it’s awfully naïve to only want older characters developed. The big names, the ones that have recognition deserve a chance to be developed too. They never were and I long for more stories of Gears, Prowl and co.

And the other thing that’s been lost with the AHM formula is it is trying the “Big Gun” approach. A lot of other comics do it like the Avengers and JLA which bring together the biggest most iconic names in the comic fandom together. AHM was trying this approach in my estimation. Big first and second season characters with high recognition factor. New Avengers, a comic I didn’t like, did it very successfully with the strangest mismatch of characters. They brought Wolverine and Spider-Man, two longtime non-Avenger characters, into the fold and it sold like hotcakes. It had top artists and top writers too. And that worked wonders. So like it or not IDW tried AHM b/c it needed to revitalize a very poor selling comic book. The numbers were pitiful – especially given the brand’s success. AHM doesn’t seem to have worked though and I just wonder where to from here.

Not to mention that just b/c one group was overexposed to something (apparently the '84 to '85 cast), the rest of the fandom has to be deprived that? The ones who want to see that?

Comics have downward momentum and you need to try new things to arrest the inevitable decline. It’s one of the principal reasons why most creative teams stay on a title for 12 or less issues these days. I’m not sure what IDW can do though. Furman is one of the big names in TFs and even he doesn’t have staying power as evidenced by the empirical data. And, like Sky Shadow, I’m not sure how much I’d care even if we got a big name like Mark Millar or Brian Bendis on Transformers. Its about TFs first and foremost for me and I don’t care who but I fear there aren’t many avenues for improvement.

I'm a little over sales figures continutally being pulled out :rolleyes:

Thank Primus there aren't similar figures for Hasbro and Takara sales! :p




I think it would be great if we were privy to Hasbro and Takara’s numbers, it would give us empirical data to base our comments based on rather than a lot of conjecture we work on.

That’s neither here nor there though. As far as sales numbers go, what else would anyone suggest instead?

I’m open to suggestions but I can’t find one.

Sales numbers are the only objective criteria that exist yet there are so often claims, such as was made here, about how “successful” Simon Furman’s series was and that it didn’t deserve the axe or a revamp, claims that are absolutely empirically not possible to support.

Or alternatively, we can believe the spin that IDW puts out there as to their success. It’s just the same as Marvel or DC though, really.

The TF comic reading public I feel is perhaps the least progressive part of the fandom from my experiences in my short 3 years of collecting. It seems to be so absorbed about how right it is, how successful what it loves is that it can’t see failure in front of its eyes. It doesn’t like numbers because they convey the truth. The Transformer faithful, of which I count myself as one, is reduced down to a pathetically paltry 10,000 readers from 100,000.

I’m as loyal and passionate about TFs as the rest of you. I ride the highs of alacrity and disappointment. I fret and grumble at glaring lows but I am under no illusions about where TF comics have gone. I don’t like the fact that its flopping. Its very concerning but at least I’m prepared to accept that. We can hold onto what we like but the reality is the sales number tell another tale, a cold hard truth. There aren’t many of us who are the faithful and there’s got to be a good reason for that.
.
Otherwise, we’re living with a whole of denial and that ain’t the pretty river in Eqypt.

Paulbot
24th December 2008, 10:10 PM
When did the Decepticons ever actually go about methodically dismantling the Earth?

They did in Generation Two! :D

STL
24th December 2008, 10:37 PM
They did in Generation Two! :D

I don't remember much of G2. The art always pulled me out of it. But even then its really different from AHM which has different layers.

Paulbot
24th December 2008, 10:45 PM
I don't remember much of G2. The art always pulled me out of it. But even then its really different from AHM which has different layers.
As summarised by the TFwiki

The Decepticons global onslaught is said to have hit Moscow, Tokyo and London as well as Washington; they currently are hitting Delhi, forcing an evacuation (which they're also hitting), and are fighting in North Africa

New York? Bah every other monster/alien/terrorist hits New York. These Decepticons know there are other cities on the planet! :p

In fact come to think of it SPOILERS the purpose of this attack in Generation Two comics and the reveal at the end of AHM #5 are quite similar... END SPOILERS

Golden Phoenix
24th December 2008, 11:10 PM
These Decepticons know there are other cities on the planet! :p
Haha. Thats a good one. Other cities. Pull the other leg Paulbot

GoktimusPrime
25th December 2008, 03:44 PM
Manny Galan's artwork in G2 was terrible IMO and he's been widely criticised by fans for his poor attempt at mimicking Derek Yaniger's art (which Galan has since admitted was a mistake). It was Derek Yaniger who created the distinctive new art style for G2 (I like this comment from TFwiki - "inconsistent proportions that'd make Pat Lee proud" :D). I did like Geoff Senior's art, but I'm biased. (^_^)

The story's quite good though - and it fits in well with Beast Wars too. :)

Lord_Zed
25th December 2008, 07:45 PM
When in G1 did the Autobots become so fragile and without purpose? I don’t think that’s an angle that’s ever been explored. When did the Decepticons ever actually go about methodically dismantling the Earth?


Pretty much every time Optimus died in the comic I'd say. The Autobots milled around hopelessly for a few issues before getting there act together. I seem to recall in the UK story "Prey" Optimus faked his own death to see if the Autobots could cope with out him. As for the dismantaling earth, as mentioned above they did that in G2, and they had finished dismantaling North America in Rythmns of Darkness, now that was a bleak world of Decepticon rule, AHM still pales in comparison to both as far as dark futures go.

But credit where credit is due Mcarthy has done an excellant job with the Autobots without Prime so far, enough at least to keep me reading.


Otherwise, we’re living with a whole of denial and that ain’t the pretty river in Eqypt.

I'm not quite sure what you mean here, Transformers comics may be flopping, but AHM's sales numbers don't actualy affect my opinon of it one iota. Most of my favourte issues of the past TF comics series come from when they were near the end of thier runs, this is true for me at least for the US Marvel G1 comic, Dreamwaves G1,Gen 2, and the IDW "ation series" The only exception si the end of the run of the Marvel G1 Uk comic, which bugged me for much the same reasons that AHM does.

And overexposure of ’84-’86 characters does not ever meant they were developed with much depth. I’ve read or watched very few stories about Prowl or Mirage that were more than generic cartoon characterisations. I think those characters deserve as much as a chance to be developed in a meaningful fashion as Sixshot or Hardhead. I really like Hardhead (the futuristic tank and all) and absolutely agree it was great seeing Nightbeat, him and the Technobots working with the classic characters. But it’s awfully naïve to only want older characters developed. The big names, the ones that have recognition deserve a chance to be developed too. They never were and I long for more stories of Gears, Prowl and co.

Between the Marvel Comics, Dream Wave and IDW I've read plenty about Prowl, and seen more than few sides of him than just his cartoon role as Optimus advisor so I don't think he's a good example. Gears certainly is and in his case, and I'd agree that yes he desrves a chance to be developed. However even if he were included in the cast of AHM I doubt veey much he would be developed at all. Seems to me whenever they go back to bascis and reboot G1 wether it be for a new series, or a spin of universe or whatever, the same thing happens. The writters grab a bunch of recognisable G1 favourtes and then give all the lines and development to the ones who have already been established, Prowl, Starscream, Ironhide, HotRod, Kup and Grimlock for example. I don't see AHM breaking this mould, and Ipart of the annoyance with the Character Drift is rather than taking a bot like say Gears and giving him some personality (like Mcarthy did with Blur), they instead give us Drift.


The story's quite good though - and it fits in well with Beast Wars too.

Yeah G2 is one of my favourte TF stories, just because its just so different from everything else out there.

GoktimusPrime
25th December 2008, 09:17 PM
G1 Thundercracker desperately needs character development, but I'm not seeing it in AHM. He got particularly shafted in Machine Wars - what the frell is a Decepticon rebel warrior meant to be? His function is to... rebel? Poor Thundercracker. :(

Sky Shadow
25th December 2008, 09:43 PM
Between the Marvel Comics, Dream Wave and IDW I've read plenty about Prowl, and seen more than few sides of him than just his cartoon role as Optimus advisor so I don't think he's a good example. Gears certainly is and in his case, and I'd agree that yes he desrves a chance to be developed.

Yes, between the last five issues of Furman's US run and the War Within in particular, I'm pretty sure Prowl has gotten more than just a moment in the sun. And Gears?!?

Gears already had a comic spotlight as early as issue #3 of Transformers US. He's Spider-Man's cranky friend and the whole issue is about him. And - according to Spider-Man's co-creator - as far back as 1985, Gears also liked lifting elephants over his head, falling for obvious traps and carrying potatoes to the market.

This is why I find it ridiculous for anyone to play the such-an-such-a-'84-'85-character-never-got-any-exposure card. It's absolute bollocks. Sure, feel free to play the iconic-Transformers-are-better-for-noobs-and-casual-fans trump. But the other argument is going to collapse every time. Kind of like this:

http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/a/a5/Theautobotsmasher-gears.jpg

Or, as the allegedly underexposed Thundercracker would put it:

http://www.insecticons.com/images3/Smasher-09.jpg

http://www.insecticons.com/images3/Smasher-20.jpg

(That's Gears. No, really).

Lord_Zed
25th December 2008, 11:38 PM
That colouring book is vaugely familiar, I think I had it...... once. ;)

FFN
26th December 2008, 01:03 AM
(I like this comment from TFwiki - "inconsistent proportions that'd make Pat Lee proud" :D) IT'S A CHRISTMAS MIRACLE!

GoktimusPrime
26th December 2008, 06:17 PM
I never said that I didn't like the humour in TFwiki, I said that I don't think it's appropriate - and I still stand by it. Just because it's funny doesn't mean it should be there. Anyway, I've already outlined my reasons for why I feel that way and I don't want to be derailing this thread which should just be about AHM.

kup
28th December 2008, 02:27 PM
New Drift Character cover:

http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/all-hail-megatron-6-5-page-preview-now-available/14825/

I can't say I like it. IMO, Drift smells of the typical fan character who is all powerful, 'coolest' and unbeatable. I know its just a cover but based on what we have seen so far I reckon its possible. AHM does feel more like a fan fic overall and the way this Drift character is being promoted seems to point that way from what I can see.

We shall see by the next issue but there is a chance that I am wrong as the Autobots have been the saving grace of this series with their excellent portrayal and book covers have proven (mostly) to be non representative of the actual story so the character could end up being interesting.

STL
28th December 2008, 10:27 PM
I'm not quite sure what you mean here, Transformers comics may be flopping, but AHM's sales numbers don't actualy affect my opinon of it one iota. Most of my favourte issues of the past TF comics series come from when they were near the end of thier runs, this is true for me at least for the US Marvel G1 comic, Dreamwaves G1,Gen 2, and the IDW "ation series" The only exception si the end of the run of the Marvel G1 Uk comic, which bugged me for much the same reasons that AHM does.


What I'm simply trying to say is that there are a lot of fans who live in denial about how brilliant their run was when all it did was tank. There has to be a reason for that. And this bashing of AHM, I feel, is completely unwarranted. What I've tried to point out is that IDW needed to go in a different direction and we need to grow up and accept that. Successful or not, AHM was that step in a different direction. It was necessary but too many seem to be so absorbed with the continuity issues of a miserably tanking series by Furman.

Sales aren't everything but you've got to appreciate it must look pretty bad for IDW to have sales dropping like flies when TFs have an all new level of publicity and success. It'd be downright incompetent to allow Furman continuing without trying something new.


The writters grab a bunch of recognisable G1 favourtes and then give all the lines and development to the ones who have already been established, Prowl, Starscream, Ironhide, HotRod, Kup and Grimlock for example. I don't see AHM breaking this mould,

I don't either but as I tried to point out in the other post, IDW had to try something and it went for the big gun approach which is used commonly across the comic industry by others like DC or Marvel. New Avengers w/ Spider-Man and Wolverine made no sense to me at all. But it worked b/c it took the big names along with a big creative team to make it work. G.I. JOE to me seems to be similar. So what's wrong with a writer grabbing a bunch of recognisable G1 favourites? Do we want a team of the Firecons and Triggercons to really attract a readership? Good luck. I think there needs to be balance between new and old but I have no issue at all if IDW want to try the big fun formula. Good luck to them and I understand why there was a need for a shake up.


AHM does feel more like a fan fic overall and the way this Drift character is being promoted seems to point that way from what I can see.


I really don't like the term "fanfic" being used in such a derogatory manner. It smacks of a very snobby reader who thinks they can define what is good fiction. You could easily apply "fanfic' to what Furman was doing with his Spotlights and "-tion" series too. It could be viewed he was way too busy with too many plotlines going on, had too much love for that random character that no one cares about who is all of a sudden the big bad or the big hero, no concept of pacing etc,. But no. It'd be better to say he poorly constructed the stories.

Perhaps a better word is "amateurish" but I think that McCarthy has to have some grasp of fiction more than us as its not like we got the call up to write Transformers. AHM, to me, reads like a popcorn flick at the movies. It's there for the thrills and its not very much deeper than that though it does have moments. Not that there's a problem with that, perhaps IDW is aiming for a different flavour to what Furman originally had. I mean, the last thing they'd want is to try and revitalise their line with the same vibe in the comic as the one before it which led to such a decline in sales numbers.

Golden Phoenix
28th December 2008, 10:31 PM
New Drift Character cover:

http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/all-hail-megatron-6-5-page-preview-now-available/14825/

I can't say I like it. IMO, Drift smells of the typical fan character who is all powerful, 'coolest' and unbeatable. I know its just a cover but based on what we have seen so far I reckon its possible. AHM does feel more like a fan fic overall and the way this Drift character is being promoted seems to point that way from what I can see.

We shall see by the next issue but there is a chance that I am wrong as the Autobots have been the saving grace of this series with their excellent portrayal and book covers have proven (mostly) to be non representative of the actual story so the character could end up being interesting.

What do you expect though. He is getting made into a toy right? And since there isn't a cartoon they'll want to make him look cool and everything so we'll go out and buy toy.
I actually think he will be a try hard. He will try to be all cool and unbeatable, and then he will get his ass handed to him on a platter.

kup
28th December 2008, 11:09 PM
What do you expect though. He is getting made into a toy right? And since there isn't a cartoon they'll want to make him look cool and everything so we'll go out and buy toy.
I actually think he will be a try hard. He will try to be all cool and unbeatable, and then he will get his ass handed to him on a platter.

A tired formula but if he gets his butt handed to him on a platter, that would make the character more appealing in the long run as he would have to reflect on his 'awesomeness'

kup
28th December 2008, 11:19 PM
I really don't like the term "fanfic" being used in such a derogatory manner. It smacks of a very snobby reader who thinks they can define what is good fiction. You could easily apply "fanfic' to what Furman was doing with his Spotlights and "-tion" series too. It could be viewed he was way too busy with too many plotlines going on, had too much love for that random character that no one cares about who is all of a sudden the big bad or the big hero, no concept of pacing etc,. But no. It'd be better to say he poorly constructed the stories.

Perhaps a better word is "amateurish" but I think that McCarthy has to have some grasp of fiction more than us as its not like we got the call up to write Transformers. AHM, to me, reads like a popcorn flick at the movies. It's there for the thrills and its not very much deeper than that though it does have moments. Not that there's a problem with that, perhaps IDW is aiming for a different flavour to what Furman originally had. I mean, the last thing they'd want is to try and revitalise their line with the same vibe in the comic as the one before it which led to such a decline in sales numbers.

My comment was not meant to degrade fan fics as many of them are very good particularly if you see the Mosaics but at the same time, there are a huge amount of fan boyish ones that I have encountered on the net which follow a very similar formula that we are seeing in All Hail Megatron in which the author seems to only be aware of the G1 cartoon.

The bottom line is that I wouldn't call AHM a new direction. Its a very old and tired formula as far as the Decepticons are concerned which is most of the story so far. Furman's current (or previous?) direction wasn't making the money either despite being pretty original and unique take on Transformers but going from 'new that doesn't sell' to 'old and tired' wasn't the way to go and it seems that the sale figures are proving that as they are not significantly increased.

Furman in the past has shown the ability to drastically change direction while still maintaining the integrity of the present universe so I don't see why he couldn't of done it this time.

Something else, many of us would have been much more accepting of this new take if it was indeed a new continuity instead of it being shoehorned into the previous one creating so many gaps and discrepancies which mostly serve to as a deterrent to the established reader base than something that will serve to increase reader numbers.

roller
28th December 2008, 11:43 PM
i wonder if this IDW Megatron will ever become Galvatron

im willing to bet an imaginary dollar that, they fix/frick around with the timeline somehow and the invasion of Earth never happens!!!

Golden Phoenix
28th December 2008, 11:44 PM
i wonder if this IDW Megatron will ever become Galvatron

im willing to bet an imaginary dollar that, they fix/frick around with the timeline somehow and the invasion of Earth never happens!!!

They already have a Galvatron. Maybe if he does change his form he will rename himself after him

STL
28th December 2008, 11:59 PM
Furman in the past has shown the ability to drastically change direction while still maintaining the integrity of the present universe so I don't see why he couldn't of done it this time.


I think it comes down to the way the comic industry works. There just needs to be a new name on the title to give it a new chance at life. In the old days, writers could resurrect their series with a good run or change of direction. Now, most don't get that chance and the smart ones don't stay on for more a year. The average comic reader seems to jump around like hotcakes between the new cheese and whatnot. So having the same writer would've been a poor move as retailers would not have had much confidence. It's sad but its the way the comic industry seems to work these days. It's also one of the reasons why I care less and less about comics.


Something else, many of us would have been much more accepting of this new take if it was indeed a new continuity instead of it being shoehorned into the previous one creating so many gaps and discrepancies which mostly serve to as a deterrent to the established reader base than something that will serve to increase reader numbers.

That's defintiely true. I don't think IDW helped themselves at all in that regard. They were asking for trouble. The comic reading public (in the broader sense, not just TF fans) is very fickle and unaccomodating of change unless its "big", "bad" and by a star creative team

kup
29th December 2008, 12:56 AM
i wonder if this IDW Megatron will ever become Galvatron

im willing to bet an imaginary dollar that, they fix/frick around with the timeline somehow and the invasion of Earth never happens!!!

That's actually possible. I don't think that there is a serious commitment in AHM to maintain continuity with the former story but if Megatron does turn into Galvatron, I doubt that it would happen in this run, perhaps in the second series assuming AHM gets a sequel.

GoktimusPrime
29th December 2008, 10:44 AM
But IDW continuity has already established Galvatron as an entirely separate character - initially part of the crew of Event HorizonArk-1 under the command of Nova Prime.

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/7/7e/SpotlightGalvatron_Galvytransforms.jpg/300px-SpotlightGalvatron_Galvytransforms.jpg

If that ever happen it would absolutely establish AHM as a separate continuity from the rest of the IDW universe despite McCarthy's vehement claims to the contrary.

Golden Phoenix
29th December 2008, 10:48 AM
But IDW continuity has already established Galvatron as an entirely separate character - initially part of the crew of Event HorizonArk-1 under the command of Nova Prime.

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/transformers/images/thumb/7/7e/SpotlightGalvatron_Galvytransforms.jpg/300px-SpotlightGalvatron_Galvytransforms.jpg

If that ever happen it would absolutely establish AHM as a separate continuity from the rest of the IDW universe despite McCarthy's vehement claims to the contrary.

Megatron could change into a different form. They could re-design Galvatron again and Megatron could simply change his name to honour the Galvatron that went into the Dead Universe

kup
29th December 2008, 10:55 AM
Megatron could change into a different form. They could re-design Galvatron again and Megatron could simply change his name to honour the Galvatron that went into the Dead Universe

I think that if AHM is successful enough, they will slowly drop total continuity with the Furman universe making anything possible as presently the only thing attaching it within continuity is purely PR as the references made in the book are either ambiguous or 'forced' in.

There are already massive enough plot gaps to make this a new continuity despite the official stance on the subject. The only way to make the Furman universe 'fit' with AHM is if they take some retcon liberties to adapt the Furman Universe to AHM or simply 'continue on' from the AHM present story and ignore the 'past'.

griffin
30th December 2008, 02:03 AM
Galvatron was originally a different character to Megatron, according to the original bio-writer Bob Budiansky. It was just the writer for the 1986 Movie that thought it would be a good plot device to have them as the same person, and as such, every comic and cartoon story around it had to match.
Original techspec:
Galvatron is a cold-hearted robotic villain. Determined to lead the
Decepticons. Possesses enough strength to pulverize an Autobot into
scrap metal. Unconquerable. Arrogant and compassionless. Plots
against his allies, thus weakening his position. In robot mode, he
carries a laser that emits chemically-produced, direct-current
electricity.

If he were originally intended to be a new Megatron, the bio wouldn't have him with a rank of 9 and describing him as having ambition to lead the Decepticons.

It's about time we have an official Transformers story that has Galvatron be a separate character, as he was originally meant to be.

kup
30th December 2008, 08:32 AM
Galvatron was originally a different character to Megatron, according to the original bio-writer Bob Budiansky. It was just the writer for the 1986 Movie that thought it would be a good plot device to have them as the same person, and as such, every comic and cartoon story around it had to match.
Original techspec:


If he were originally intended to be a new Megatron, the bio wouldn't have him with a rank of 9 and describing him as having ambition to lead the Decepticons.

It's about time we have an official Transformers story that has Galvatron be a separate character, as he was originally meant to be.

I am sure that many of us (including myself) are hopeful that this concept be carried onto AHM from the Furman universe if Galavatron is ever to appear there.

The Furman IDW stories are actually the most original G1 story we have ever gotten. It didn't follow old clinches and actually tried to bring forth 'forgotten' bio characteristics for the most part even if it begun to go down a bit at the end in this regard.

griffin
30th December 2008, 03:03 PM
Considering Furman was a big driving force behind Galvatron being Megatron in the Gen1 comics, it must have been tough for him to use Galvatron as he was originally intended.

bassbot
7th January 2009, 09:28 AM
The IDW galvatron is awesome, we haven't seen heaps of him, but what we did I really enjoyed. He seems to have his own motivations and enlightenment during the time he is off the reigns of Nemesis Prime. Why would we want Megs to become Galvs?!?

Anyhow - I enjoyed #6 - some more great dialogue, and especially between the cons, cool little bit of Thundercracker. I want more.

Some theories going around that Kup could be the autobot traitor. He seems to know a bit much and really wants to keep Jazz close who appears to know who the traitor is and isn't.

i_amtrunks
7th January 2009, 09:29 AM
so.....AHM #6

What another fizzer. Nothing solid is added to the series in this issue, purely conjecture from characters within the story, and a very forced 'ZOMG Drift is teh Awezomes!!!1!!1!'. :(

It's taken half of the series to not quite setup the rest of the series, and all of this setup could have been done in about 3 issues had the useless script and terrible pacing been rectified. This issue alone only sees Kup and Starscream speculate on things that have happened and things to come, while Skywarp alludes to something I fear we will be seeing more of in the next few issues.
Kup mentioned that Megatron has killed two Primes, I assume that the second he killed is the Zeta Prime mentioned in Spotlight Blurr, further distancing the AHM universe from the Furmanverse.

Sure there are some rather nice one lines and such, again Cliffjumper shines, but thanks to Perceptor we also get a good line from Tracks. The fact this occurs after the forced "hey how cool is my character Drift" moment does sully it a bit. The fact the Drift moment mirrors what we got with Mirage only last issue also blunts it even further.

However there were 2 pages that stuck in my mind, and not for any good reasons. I love Guido's art, and think he is among the better artists IDW has to call upon, but his work on the two Megatron and Starscream pages that feature a central 'action' shot of Megatron surrounded by poorly placed dialogue panels featuring the two is some of the worst art and indeed worst layout of any transformers comic released by IDW, including Origins.

Not only did the quality in art take a dive, the writing also took a serious nosedive with it, both pages were painful to read and the fact that I had to re-read them 2-3 times before they started making sense did not help.

It almost seems that Prowl was drawn by another artist, at the end of his main scene, all he needed was the giant 'sweatdrop' on his temple to be a sterotypical anime style drawn character, totally out of style with the rest of the cast. The rest of the art is nice, but nothing really outstanding this issue, hopefully we will get more art that looks like the cover for issue #7 featuring Ironhide.

Pro's:
- More good one liners for characters like Cliffjumper and Tracks
- Nice gentle introductions for Roadbuster and not so gentle Perceptor
- A nice bit of insight into the Seekers, who never really get much characterisation, as well s the Insecticons
- A smart Starscream, this isn't the dolt from the Cartoon
- Inter team factions within the Decepticons, are also shown to perhaps be forming in the Autobots
- Kup
- No real focus on Humans for 90% of the book

Con's:
- Terrible pacing and scripting issues continue
- clunky dialogue for Megatron and Starscream
- Too much discussion of events that happened in the break, that will barely have time to be expanded on
- Poor art on various pages, and panel layout on same pages is terrible, design and execution of purple 'thing' leaves much to be desired
- McGuffin of Energon to appear
- Humans in book are boring, and the final line of the comic is so very cliche.
- The final 6 issues have too much to close what the first six opened.

And I'm also slightly peeved that once again the Trade (due Feb) will contain added extras, it's kind of a slap in the face to the people who are buying the single issues.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's a good idea in books that deserve to be bought twice (like Infiltration), but I shouldn't have to buy this crap twice to get bonus items, as compensation for how crap issues 1-6 have been IDW should have been putting all extra cover art, sketches and the like into each issue. :mad:

Sky Shadow
7th January 2009, 10:46 AM
so.....AHM #6

What another fizzer.

I actually think that (except for Drift) All Hail Megatron #6 was good for the first twenty pages. Then the humans were in it again and the last two pages were utter @#!*. But it's a great improvement. (I've realised that one of the other issues I have with humans in this book is that Guidi can't draw them. His blackline approach is great for his Dreamwavey style robots, but it's jarring whenever humans appear.)

Finally the Decepticons got some characterisation (just in time for the last issue of the trade). Skywarp, Bombshell and Thundercracker were well-written as incarnations of their tech spec and Universe profiles. Which is progression... well, as progressive as twenty-something year-old profiles can be. Although now I'm somewhat worried about McCarthy being too adherent to old stereotypes. For the story to be any good, twist-wise, Mirage can't really be the traitor - it has to be someone else. It can't be anything else or it's a bit of a cop-out: it has to be an Autobot who's betrayed them. Preferably Cliffjumper. Unless they want to make Mirage a full-fledged Decepticon after this, which I would be happy with - defectors are great. (Carnivac; Catilla; Blitzwing; Dinobot; Blackarachnia: all awesome.)

Also, McCarthy or the letterer misspelled "feuds". Twice. What the hell is the editor of this book doing? Apparently he's not checking spelling. He's not ensuring the stories don't contradict what's come before. As far as I can tell, all he does is get someone to draw his head on Doubledealer and supply the briefest of replies to letters.

Still, with those exceptions, this was good.

GoktimusPrime
7th January 2009, 05:52 PM
There's a grammatical error it it too (misplaced apostrophe). I did enjoy seeing the Decepticons getting more characterisation. Wasn't impressed with Drift... the panel where he uses his sword was visually badly done IMO because of the way he's holding it. It doesn't look like he's just taken a swipe - the blade is pointing down and the arm looks too relaxed, yet the Insecticon's (Insecticons'?) head hasn't even hit the ground yet... - unless Drift is bloody fast like Blurr, but if so they should've done something with the art to show that he's that fast, like drawing "speed lines" etc. As it is that panel visually makes no sense to me. (-_-)

Lord_Zed
7th January 2009, 07:30 PM
Alas I still haven't goten a hold of #6 yet, hopefully I will tommorow and then I can add my 2 cents.

kup
7th January 2009, 10:16 PM
I don't have #6 either and probably won't be getting it for a while as there are no comic shops near me :(

FFN
8th January 2009, 07:09 AM
And I'm also slightly peeved that once again the Trade (due Feb) will contain added extras, it's kind of a slap in the face to the people who are buying the single issues.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's a good idea in books that deserve to be bought twice (like Infiltration), but I shouldn't have to buy this crap twice to get bonus items, as compensation for how crap issues 1-6 have been IDW should have been putting all extra cover art, sketches and the like into each issue. :mad: So you're gonna buy an entire TPB of nothing happening? :D

There's a grammatical error it it too (misplaced apostrophe). I did enjoy seeing the Decepticons getting more characterisation. Wasn't impressed with Drift... the panel where he uses his sword was visually badly done IMO because of the way he's holding it. It doesn't look like he's just taken a swipe - the blade is pointing down and the arm looks too relaxed, yet the Insecticon's (Insecticons'?) head hasn't even hit the ground yet... - unless Drift is bloody fast like Blurr, but if so they should've done something with the art to show that he's that fast, like drawing "speed lines" etc. As it is that panel visually makes no sense to me. (-_-) But you see, Drift is Japanese! He moves his sword really fast, like a ninja or a samurai or something Japanese involving swords that's in anime or manga.

I think his own name is spelled phonetically on his doors.

GoktimusPrime
8th January 2009, 08:06 AM
I've seen Battoujutsu practitioners cut really quickly - I've seen a guy in Sydney who can leap in the air and slice a target (both straw and bone/flesh - he practices on pig-parts from the butcher) multiple times by the time his jump has finished and the target falls off the stand.

But there is no way he can hold his sword in a relaxed position with the blade pointing downward, even at that speed - especially considering that the Insecticons' head hasn't hit the ground yet. If he could move that fast then there needs to be speed lines or blurring effects added to let the audience know that he's moving at super speed... otherwise it's reasonable for us to assume that he's not. Even with speed effects it would still look bad IMO. He should actually look more like this:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Martial%20arts/misc/battoujutsu.jpghttp://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y227/goktimusprime/Martial%20arts/misc/kenshin_cut.jpg

The edge of the blade is pointing at the same angle as the cut - judging from the position of Drift's shoulder and arm, it ought to be pointing outward, not downward... even with speed effects (as demonstrated in the picture on the right).

Also, why is Drift's body facing square on to his opponent? Was that Insecticons' head attached by silly string? If it was so weakly attached to its neck then you could probably decapitate it with your bare hands... Drift would have to have his waist and shoulders turned in order to gain the torque and momentum required to swing his sword (which ought to be a freakin' heavy weapon) and hit his target with sufficient force to cut through enemy steel.

You wouldn't even draw a punch that way, let alone a sword slash. :/

i_amtrunks
8th January 2009, 08:20 AM
This is a post from the TAAU boards by Dragontail that cast the series in a brand new light for me. I've always believed that AHM is (and will be ) set in an alternate Universe from the "-tion" and "Maximum Dinobots" stories, and I think that had it been I would have received the story better originally, I may have even figured this out myself rather than needing someone else to point it out to me! :D

I've been ruminating on this series for a while and, I think, what it comes down to two things:

1) McCarthy is not as good a writer as he wants to be.
2) The series was marketed poorly.

What I take from the most recent issues is that McCarthy's intent was not to give us a "the Decepticons have won; all must quake in fear!" story but, instead, a more introspective piece on what happens once you've achieved your ultimate goal.

Consider... Megatron is now without a goal or objective; he conquered the Autobots but lost Cybertron - he won the war but has nothing to show for it. Fearful of mutiny, he's trying to keep his mechs occupied with "pointless busywork" - smashing humans - and the strain is showing. Contrast that with the Autobots who have lost their leader and their religious artefact; once they get those back, they will have a link to the "purity" of their pre-war past and be restored, psychologically, in order to save the day.

McCarthy is trying to make a point about the essential differences between the Autobot and Decepticon mentalities. Unfortunately in doing so, he's ignoring a lot of character development and a lot of subtleties in personalities (like Megatron caring about more than just Cybertron, as we've seen time and again), his pacing is off, his dialogue is poor, his grasp of the cast is stuck in the cartoon era and he's ignoring/been told to ignore all Furman has set up.

This should have been an out-of-continuity mini-series.

Like I said earlier: I'm starting to enjoy the series more, but only for what it is - an incredibly flawed attempt to execute an interesting concept.

Unless the 2nd half of the story completely throwns this out on it's head, I too think I may be able to enjoy the series much more than I have been.

Hereticpoo
8th January 2009, 10:49 AM
I agree that reading it like its in a different dimension makes it alot of fun.
Thats the beauty of the TF universe, you can choose what you want to accept as canon because there are so many different TF universe's.

I believe some of you are being a little harsh on AHM. Its like you're expecting a 120 page comic book series to have the depth of Tolkien's Middle Earth and the characterisation / social analysis of Harper Lee's To Kill a Mocking Bird.

Dragon Tail says

"What I take from the most recent issues is that McCarthy's intent was not to give us a "the Decepticons have won; all must quake in fear!" story but, instead, a more introspective piece on what happens once you've achieved your ultimate goal.

Consider... Megatron is now without a goal or objective; he conquered the Autobots but lost Cybertron - he won the war but has nothing to show for it. Fearful of mutiny, he's trying to keep his mechs occupied with "pointless busywork" - smashing humans - and the strain is showing. Contrast that with the Autobots who have lost their leader and their religious artefact; once they get those back, they will have a link to the "purity" of their pre-war past and be restored, psychologically, in order to save the day."

Um thats whats S Mac was going for? Quote on Newrama;

"If they were only after raw materials, sure. However this is less about the immediacy of conquest or the acquisition of resources and more about the psychology that underpins the reason for the Decepticons' very existence. Why do they want Earth? Why do they do anything they do to begin with? I'll be answering these questions as we go along. Like I said earlier, this is very, very far from just being a story about a big old fight."

Then Dragontail says S Mac's attempt is a "seriously flawed attempt at an interesting concept."

Dude WTF your critisism is the objective of the comic!

Dragon Tail I do agree that it should have been marketed as a stand alone one off series. That is more a fault of IDW than S Mac. I believe the story may have been 'smoother' and less 'clunky; is total artistic licence was allowed by S Mac. I honestly can't see the clunkiness and poor panel layout, for me its an easy to read comic.

The series is called ALL HAIL MEGATRON. Not the "lets characterise as many bots as we can half hour"

I can understand the critical eye G1 comic fans have for the series, but here's a news flash THE MAJORITY OF TF FANS ARE CASUAL FANS and the only continuity that really stands out to them is the G1 Cartoon. Before I joined this board the G1 comics were a repressed memory of terrible art and confusing stories.This story has been diluted FOR THE MAJORITY OF FANS.










This is a post from the TAAU boards by Dragontail that cast the series in a brand new light for me. I've always believed that AHM is (and will be ) set in an alternate Universe from the "-tion" and "Maximum Dinobots" stories, and I think that had it been I would have received the story better originally, I may have even figured this out myself rather than needing someone else to point it out to me! :D



Unless the 2nd half of the story completely throwns this out on it's head, I too think I may be able to enjoy the series much more than I have been.

FFN
8th January 2009, 11:53 AM
This is one of the times where I can say the MAJORITY OF THE FANS taste in comics blows chunks.

Note: When FFN types in caps, most likely he is taking the piss.

Hereticpoo
8th January 2009, 01:26 PM
This is one of the times where I can say the MAJORITY OF THE FANS taste in comics blows chunks.

Yeah what would the majority know. My advise to all the unique, well read, Transformers connoisseurs would be to stop reading AHM, and leave all the mainstream morons who like it to thier undeveloped trash mags.

Its pathetic that people are still saying how much they don't like it, but they are always the first to buy and review or opinionate on it.

I'm going to sit down and enjoy this comic with the rest of the drooling hoards, have fun blogging about something you hate but still purchase :D

GoktimusPrime
8th January 2009, 01:46 PM
Its pathetic that people are still saying how much they don't like it, but they are always the first to buy and review or opinionate on it.
How else are we to know what the comics is like unless we buy it and read it? Unlike Japan, we don't have places like libraries, cafés, restaurants etc. where we can borrow and read comic books for free - so if you're interested in reading the comic you can either:
1/ Wait for someone else to buy it and read it yourself, then if you do like it, hope that it's not sold out otherwise wait for the TPB.
2/ Buy it, read it and form an opinion.

I don't think anyone here is collecting this series expecting to dislike it. I know I bought this series hoping to enjoy it, but finding myself somewhat disappointed. Now that I've started I feel obliged to finish it - read it all the way through and give the story the benefit of the doubt that once I've finished reading it the whole series that it will make sense and be more enjoyable. Who knows, the story might redeem itself in the end... I for one am reserving judgement about this series one way or the other until I finish reading the whole thing.

Thats the beauty of the TF universe, you can choose what you want to accept as canon because there are so many different TF universe's.
Unless official sources specifically state that it is within the same canon, which is what IDW and Shane McCarthy have said about this series on this very board.

I believe some of you are being a little harsh on AHM. Its like you're expecting a 120 page comic book series to have the depth of Tolkien's Middle Earth and the characterisation / social analysis of Harper Lee's To Kill a Mocking Bird.
Or maybe expecting it to be like other TF comic series that have come before... like G1. :)

This is one of the times where I can say the MAJORITY OF THE FANS taste in comics blows chunks.
+1 QFT. And I don't agree that a comic has to be "watered down" in order to succeed like this. A lot of Furmans' other series within IDW feature a lot of lesser known characters (like Skram!) yet I wouldn't say that those comics are worse than AHM (I prefer them). I don't know what the sales for those are like compared to AHM though.

AHM will win big bonus points with me though if they continue to make an attempt to make further character development with Thundercracker, something no TF writer has ever done before. :)

Hereticpoo
8th January 2009, 02:26 PM
All good points Gok.

I understand what you're saying about buying the comic to find out if you like it. But we're six issues in. Consider the horse flogged. Its not going to get up now.

Am I the only one on this board that actually likes AHM? :eek: I find this thread embarrasing for OTCA because its so negative. Its like Macrossworld!

And the 'its not as good as G1' is so tedious. Nothing is or ever will be as good as G1 because for most of us fans it is an emotionally valuable aspect of all our lives. We are all comparing what we thought was good when we were 8 to what is available now. Our brains have changed (hopefully :D). The relativity doesn't match.

Yes official sources say its in the same canon as tion's, official sources also say we went to the moon. :)

"Roller pass me those gloves"

"Why?"

"I'm going start pushing this sh...stuff...uphill" :D






How else are we to know what the comics is like unless we buy it and read it? Unlike Japan, we don't have places like libraries, cafés, restaurants etc. where we can borrow and read comic books for free - so if you're interested in reading the comic you can either:
1/ Wait for someone else to buy it and read it yourself, then if you do like it, hope that it's not sold out otherwise wait for the TPB.
2/ Buy it, read it and form an opinion.

I don't think anyone here is collecting this series expecting to dislike it. I know I bought this series hoping to enjoy it, but finding myself somewhat disappointed. Now that I've started I feel obliged to finish it - read it all the way through and give the story the benefit of the doubt that once I've finished reading it the whole series that it will make sense and be more enjoyable. Who knows, the story might redeem itself in the end... I for one am reserving judgement about this series one way or the other until I finish reading the whole thing.


Unless official sources specifically state that it is within the same canon, which is what IDW and Shane McCarthy have said about this series on this very board.


Or maybe expecting it to be like other TF comic series that have come before... like G1. :)


+1 QFT. And I don't agree that a comic has to be "watered down" in order to succeed like this. A lot of Furmans' other series within IDW feature a lot of lesser known characters (like Skram!) yet I wouldn't say that those comics are worse than AHM (I prefer them). I don't know what the sales for those are like compared to AHM though.

AHM will win big bonus points with me though if they continue to make an attempt to make further character development with Thundercracker, something no TF writer has ever done before. :)

i_amtrunks
8th January 2009, 02:54 PM
I bought the 3rd issue onwards hoping for the story to kick in, and the promised improvement that McCarthy and Tipton assured us that would happen. Now I'm buying them for three reasons:
- I started this series and thus want to finish it, to see if it does get better
- To support IDW so they continue to survive (I like having TF comics to buy), and partially because of all the other great TF comics they have out
- For the art, which for the most part has been great

That being said I still do not hate AHM, I just do not think it is anywhere near as good as it was hyped to be, nor is it as good as any of the other IDW Titles (bar Megatron Origins. :p) have been/are.

Paulbot
8th January 2009, 03:05 PM
I think that there is a fair mix of people liking and disliking the series and no outright "this is so bad I must buy the next issue so that I can complain about it on the Internet" :)

I like the robot art, the colouring is great, the covers have been excellent, the story concept is fine.

My only real issue is that it is sold as the next IDW story but ignores the IDW stories that went before it, but if I view it as an alternate reality/future type story then no real dramas.

Sky Shadow
8th January 2009, 04:45 PM
I can understand the critical eye G1 comic fans have for the series, but here's a news flash THE MAJORITY OF TF FANS ARE CASUAL FANS and the only continuity that really stands out to them is the G1 Cartoon.

This isn't true. For the majority of casual Transformers fans, the main continuity that stands out is not going to be the G1 Cartoon. The G1 cartoon ended twenty years ago. The majority of today's 'casual' Transformers fans would be too young to remember the G1 cartoon and would have grown up on Beast Wars or the 2007 film or Transformers Animated (all of which are better than All Hail Megatron or the G1 cartoon.)

Its pathetic that people are still saying how much they don't like it, but they are always the first to buy and review or opinionate on it.

Because unlike these casual fans of whom you speak, we've been buying Transformers comics for over two decades and we're not going to stop just because they've dipped in quality. What we are going to do is buy and read the issues and criticise everything that's wrong in the hope it will be improved so we can voice our positive opinions when things get better. And as consumers, that's our right. We do the same thing whenever we buy a toy that's flawed. Also, notice that I don't write anything but praise about... say... the Transformers Animated cartoon. That's because I think it's great. The problem with All Hail Megatron is that it's not.

And the 'its not as good as G1' is so tedious. Nothing is or ever will be as good as G1 because for most of us fans it is an emotionally valuable aspect of all our lives.

The problem isn't that All Hail Megatron is not as good as G1, the problem is that it is G1. It's a comic of antiquated Decepticons taking New York - the same thing Galvatron and the Pretender Monsters managed to do in a few pages in a comic from eighteen years ago. And unfortunately, after six whole issues, the characters from AHM haven't managed to do much of anything else.

We are all comparing what we thought was good when we were 8 to what is available now.

No, compared to Beast Wars; Transformers Animated; Masterforce; the G1 comic; compared to Transformers at any age, All Hail Megatron is flawed. But it's getting better and I've acknowleged that. I always say that I like everything that's happening on Cybertron (except Drift). And, hopefully, by issue #12 the comic will be completely praiseworthy.

Hereticpoo
8th January 2009, 05:46 PM
Hnn, I didn't really want to reply to this one. But I need to....

This isn't true. For the majority of casual Transformers fans, the main continuity that stands out is not going to be the G1 Cartoon. The G1 cartoon ended twenty years ago. The majority of today's 'casual' Transformers fans would be too young to remember the G1 cartoon and would have grown up on Beast Wars or the 2007 film or Transformers Animated (all of which are better than All Hail Megatron or the G1 cartoon.)

My bad I should have said adult fans. Its what I meant.


Because unlike these casual fans of whom you speak, we've been buying Transformers comics for over two decades and we're not going to stop just because they've dipped in quality.

Lol thats why they don't bother appeasing you. You'll still buy it! :D



The problem isn't that All Hail Megatron is not as good as G1, the problem is that it is G1. It's a comic of antiquated Decepticons taking New York - the same thing Galvatron and the Pretender Monsters managed to do in a few pages in a comic from eighteen years ago. And unfortunately, after six whole issues, the characters from AHM haven't managed to do much of anything else.

Haha now the problem is because of G1. Do you realise how ironic that statement is coming from an adult TF fan?

Again, most adult fans never read those particular few pages. What should the character's be doing? The story's focus is Megatron. The point of the story is the the emptiness of the decepticon cause. The Autobots aren't able to do anything except reel in shock, and Megatron is consolodating and trying to give his existenece meaning. Wow, thats totally boring....:rolleyes:


No, compared to Beast Wars; Transformers Animated; Masterforce; the G1 comic; compared to Transformers at any age, All Hail Megatron is flawed. But it's getting better and I've acknowleged that. I always say that I like everything that's happening on Cybertron (except Drift). And, hopefully, by issue #12 the comic will be completely praiseworthy.

Every Transformers story is flawed. But to say that AHM is more flawed than all of the above is a big call, even arrogant.

FFN
8th January 2009, 06:10 PM
I want my gosh-darn* proper resolution to Furman's storyline. I did not appreciate this being shoved into continuity, which I've made abundantly clear here and across other boards.

*was originally something else.

Yeah what would the majority know. My advise to all the unique, well read, Transformers connoisseurs would be to stop reading AHM, and leave all the mainstream morons who like it to thier undeveloped trash mags.

Its pathetic that people are still saying how much they don't like it, but they are always the first to buy and review or opinionate on it.

I'm going to sit down and enjoy this comic with the rest of the drooling hoards, have fun blogging about something you hate but still purchase :D Hey, I've never bought a single issue of AHM. Never will. I suspect a friend at a comic store will give me a copy one day as a practical joke.

He gave me the DK's Transformers: The Ultimate Guide as a practical joke Christmas present, knowing how much I disliked it.

Hereticpoo
8th January 2009, 06:55 PM
haha fair enough! At least you know what you want :)

I want my gosh-darn* proper resolution to Furman's storyline. I did not appreciate this being shoved into continuity, which I've made abundantly clear here and across other boards.

*was originally something else.

Sky Shadow
8th January 2009, 07:17 PM
Haha now the problem is because of G1. Do you realise how ironic that statement is coming from an adult TF fan?

That isn't irony. Adult fans are allowed to think Transformers should have progressed beyond what it was nearly two decades ago. Particularly when All Hail Megatron's idea of G1 doesn't progress beyond 1986.

The story's focus is Megatron. The point of the story is the the emptiness of the decepticon cause. The Autobots aren't able to do anything except reel in shock, and Megatron is consolodating and trying to give his existenece meaning. Wow, thats totally boring....:rolleyes:

That's all good and well to claim that's what's in the comic. But that's not what's there on paper in the first six issues, even if that's what the writer intended. As I said in this thread way back in August last year, if "this was going to be a comic about an Earth ruled by the Decepticons with Megatron as a dictator. That would have been a great comic." Maybe the next few issues will deal with that and your supposed point of the story. And as I said, that would be great. But it hasn't done it yet.

Every Transformers story is flawed. But to say that AHM is more flawed than all of the above is a big call, even arrogant.

Some texts are empirically better than others, I don't care if it's arrogant, but to say Beast Wars isn't better than All Hail Megatron would be like saying Hamlet isn't better than a week's episodes of Neighbours. This is the review section of the forum. That's what we do... review. What I find ridiculous about this is that nobody would have a problem if we said Classics Grimlock is better than Animated Grimlock or vice versa. How is it any different to say X comic book is worse than Y comic/TV show?

Hereticpoo
8th January 2009, 08:16 PM
That isn't irony. Adult fans are allowed to think Transformers should have progressed beyond what it was nearly two decades ago. Particularly when All Hail Megatron's idea of G1 doesn't progress beyond 1986.



That's all good and well to claim that's what's in the comic. But that's not what's there on paper in the first six issues, even if that's what the writer intended. As I said in this thread way back in August last year, if "this was going to be a comic about an Earth ruled by the Decepticons with Megatron as a dictator. That would have been a great comic." Maybe the next few issues will deal with that and your supposed point of the story. And as I said, that would be great. But it hasn't done it yet.



Some texts are empirically better than others, I don't care if it's arrogant, but to say Beast Wars isn't better than All Hail Megatron would be like saying Hamlet isn't better than a week's episodes of Neighbours. This is the review section of the forum. That's what we do... review. What I find ridiculous about this is that nobody would have a problem if we said Classics Grimlock is better than Animated Grimlock or vice versa. How is it any different to say X comic book is worse than Y comic/TV show?

You're right this is the review section. (Apologies to the mods, other users)

I totally disagree with you and I think you're wrong in so many ways. You totally disagree with me and think I'm wrong. We could go in circles.

Its been a fun arg....discussion.