The Random Transformers Thoughts Thread

Gok, in that image, Seaspray/Monty is clearly larger than Windcharger, Beachcomber, and Pipes - three toys from the modern "era" of Transformers design. The only other recent toy is probably someone like Brawn (and hence Outback).

In that paradigm, Seaspray is somewhat of an anomaly - larger and heftier than other toys in his "weight division".

The fact that he is comparable (in terms of size and weight) with Shortround and Breacher - a twelve year old and eight year old toy respectively - is remarkable.

Indeed... deluxes are getting smaller and lighter to combat inflation, so comparing toys from the same size class from several years apart will be flawed. Comparing among one series or year is more scientific because it eliminates more variables that aren't the focus of the study. If you then find one significantly larger or smaller in THAT sample, it is indeed an anomaly and warrants further discussion or investigation to find out why.

(I would normally focus on weights when comparing toys or looking at size-class shrinkage, as the altmode and kibble can make something deceptively bigger or smaller.)

That was a quick pic that I snapped after just grabbing a random assortment of Basic/Scout/Legends class figures off my shelves. For a more thorough study I would also use some fine scale to measure the weights, but I don't own a scale that's so precise so I'd just go by size. I'd also have different groups which might be:
* Seaspray vs sample of figures from 1996-present
* Seaspray vs sample of figures from 1996-2010
* Seaspray vs sample of figures from 2011-present

IIRC 2011 was when toys started getting smaller.

Now weight is a tricky thing because we often think that these toys are getting lighter, especially with the hollowed out parts, but this isn't necessarily the case. Ben Yee did a weight comparison between the Combiner Wars Constructicons vs some heftier looking older Generations Voyager Class figures using a precision scale, and he found that the CW Voyager Constructicons were actually heavier than the older Voyagers without the hollowed out parts. Obviously just holding stuff with your hands isn't a precise means of measuring weights, especially when the differences are in milligrams.

Might put this down as a future pet project though, but I'll need to buy some kitchen scales first (might as well record both size and weight at the same time while I'm at it). If anyone wants to do their own tests and present their findings in the meantime, please feel free. :) My hypothesis is that Seaspray around the average size for a Legends/Basic/Scout class toy, but I'll get around to testing this hypothesis probably in the next school hols. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by griffin

(I would normally focus on weights when comparing toys or looking at size-class shrinkage, as the altmode and kibble can make something deceptively bigger or smaller.)

---

Makes me think of Generations Sky-Byte's calves.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

Now weight is a tricky thing because we often think that these toys are getting lighter, especially with the hollowed out parts, but this isn't necessarily the case. Ben Yee did a weight comparison between the Combiner Wars Constructicons vs some heftier looking older Generations Voyager Class figures using a precision scale, and he found that the CW Voyager Constructicons were actually heavier than the older Voyagers without the hollowed out parts. Obviously just holding stuff with your hands isn't a precise means of measuring weights, especially when the differences are in milligrams.

Might put this down as a future pet project though, but I'll need to buy some kitchen scales first (might as well record both size and weight at the same time while I'm at it). If anyone wants to do their own tests and present their findings in the meantime, please feel free. :) My hypothesis is that Seaspray around the average size for a Legends/Basic/Scout class toy, but I'll get around to testing this hypothesis probably in the next school hols. :)

---

Super-nerdy here: In addition to weight, I guess a more definitive way of measuring across years should include other value-factors that could be missed by the scale - points of articulation, number of steps for transformation (some points of articulation need to be turned or rotated several times to make a tight squeeze), number of paint aps/tampos, number stickers (negs value?). I'm missing moulded detail here, but have no idea how we can quantify that (per square cm? lol). I can't be bothered with this, but it's not that much extra work for your average YouTube reviewer as most of them are fumbling with words as they're fumbling with their figs anyways.

Random thought.

I had TR Trypticon out today with an army of TR Decepticons. It got me thinking about Fortress Maximus.

TR Fort Max has a reputation for being under armed compared to his G1 version. But when I had the army of Cons out they had a whole bunch of guns with seats in them which I was able to site all over Trypticon. I assume Fort Max is just the same. Perhaps we are looking at a feature rather than a fault? The arsenal comes from playing with Fort Max alongside the other Autobots?

Trypticon is a new/unique mould whereas Fort Max is a retooled Metroplex. Apples and oranges.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

That was a quick pic that I snapped after just grabbing a random assortment of Basic/Scout/Legends class figures off my shelves. For a more thorough study I would also use some fine scale to measure the weights, but I don't own a scale that's so precise so I'd just go by size. I'd also have different groups which might be:
* Seaspray vs sample of figures from 1996-present
* Seaspray vs sample of figures from 1996-2010
* Seaspray vs sample of figures from 2011-present

IIRC 2011 was when toys started getting smaller.

Now weight is a tricky thing because we often think that these toys are getting lighter, especially with the hollowed out parts, but this isn't necessarily the case. Ben Yee did a weight comparison between the Combiner Wars Constructicons vs some heftier looking older Generations Voyager Class figures using a precision scale, and he found that the CW Voyager Constructicons were actually heavier than the older Voyagers without the hollowed out parts. Obviously just holding stuff with your hands isn't a precise means of measuring weights, especially when the differences are in milligrams.

Might put this down as a future pet project though, but I'll need to buy some kitchen scales first (might as well record both size and weight at the same time while I'm at it). If anyone wants to do their own tests and present their findings in the meantime, please feel free. :) My hypothesis is that Seaspray around the average size for a Legends/Basic/Scout class toy, but I'll get around to testing this hypothesis probably in the next school hols. :)

---

Re weight, in the benscollectibles review of SS Leader Blackout, he compared the weight of that figure to ROTF Leader Megatron.

Blackout was a few grams over being literally half as heavy (~300g v ~600g)!

Now to be fair, ROTF Megatron has batteries and electronics, and to be even more fair Blackout was made as an intentionally slightly smaller Leader Class figure. Still though, Hasbro should be selling diet programs with progress like that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

Trypticon is a new/unique mould whereas Fort Max is a retooled Metroplex. Apples and oranges.

---

Why so negative? :(

Simple question. Does he have 5mm holes all over him as most larger TF do? If yes start arming him.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jellico

Why so negative? :(

---

I was not aware that stating facts was negative. :eek: I have no problem with Fortress Maximus being a retool of Metroplex at all. But the fact is that he is a retool for Metroplex. I was just saying that since he is and Trypticon is a whole new mould that it's not really fair to compare these two toys.

In answer to your question, yes, there are some 5mm holes on Fortress Maximus such as on the arms (inherited from Metroplex) and on the shoulder.

I have a real bee in my bonnet about fake parts on toys to mimic a character model.

I've watched a video review for SS Optimus Prime, and I'm picking mine up tomorrow. It looks like it has an amazing transformation, marred only subjectively in my mind by having fake pectoral windows (over the real windows, no less).

It makes me wish that HasTak would remold characters that have faux parts into other characters that can just have standard robot greebles there.

Like, give us a movie Motormaster or something with a standard molded breastplate part there instead of the fake windows or seomthing.