POLL: Skids, Mudflap. Racist?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

Here's another can of worms: are the twins (or at least one of them) also homophobic? One line that one of the twins (I think it's Mudflap) says to Leo Spitz as he's having a whinge is something along of the lines of "Go cry to your boyfriend."

Is this a homophobic comment? It was delivered as a response to Leo demonstrating weakness, thus implying that any person visibly showing such heightened emotions (i.e.: being a "pussy" as one of the twins also called him) must be homosexual, and therefore implying that homosexuals are highly strung emotional people who are arguably weak in fortitude. In short it's playing along with the gay "queen" stereotype and also using homosexuality as a synonym for stupidity/negativity (as it's like saying to Leo, "Don't be so gay.").

---

I'd have to agree that it is homophobic. It's just one more tick on the List of Wrong that the twins represent. The nearest to a defense that you can come to for the twins is they are not presented as being particularly competent, considerate or experienced, and consequently not figures to emulate. They are however portrayed (well, attempted) as being funny/likeable, which kind of undoes their un-emulatability.

Michael Bay is an asshat. I mean, I knew he was an asshat before the first movie, but he delivered the goods that time. It's almost like he was getting us to let our guard down so he could blind and horrify us with asshattery the second time round.

I believe that's called smack talk, it shouldn't be all hugs and kisses.

Voted No, they are just taking on a sterotype like all the other transformers as explained by Prime in the first movie.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

Here's another can of worms: are the twins (or at least one of them) also homophobic? One line that one of the twins (I think it's Mudflap) says to Leo Spitz as he's having a whinge is something along of the lines of "Go cry to your boyfriend."

Is this a homophobic comment? It was delivered as a response to Leo demonstrating weakness, thus implying that any person visibly showing such heightened emotions (i.e.: being a "pussy" as one of the twins also called him) must be homosexual, and therefore implying that homosexuals are highly strung emotional people who are arguably weak in fortitude. In short it's playing along with the gay "queen" stereotype and also using homosexuality as a synonym for stupidity/negativity (as it's like saying to Leo, "Don't be so gay.").

---

I don't think that it was intended to be intentionally homophobic but it does reflect Bay's jock attitude.

Just to clarify it was Skids who said, "Ah, go whine to your boyfriend."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kup

I don't think that it was intended to be intentionally homophobic but it does reflect Bay's jock attitude.

---

Well it's similar to kids who go around using the word "gay" as a synonym for something stupid/negative without necessarily being consciously aware that it denigrades homosexuals. It seems to be part of Michael Bay's juvenile sense of humour alongside pissing, farting, humping, exposed testicles, random drug use, sexual harassment etc., he's like a child who tries to make these jokes that he sees as funny, some of which borderline being discriminatory, but he seems to lack the maturity to be aware of it or perhaps just doesn't care. In the DVD special features and commentary Bay describes his jokes as things that he finds funny and criticises anyone who doesn't like them as simply being humourles killjoys. This refusal to barely acknowledge criticisms about his jokes can make him appear arrogant.

That's not to say that there are no funny moments in the movies, but I suspect that the better jokes are the ones made by the writers (Orci & Kurtzman) whereas the tackier ones are from Bay. We know that things like the humping and Devastator's balls were Bay's ideas. Some better humourous moments were like the tanked guy telling Sam to move his car and Sam telling him to find a tighter shirt and the other guy's mate saying that there is no tighter shirt, they've checked. See... that was funny without being crass! Ditto Sam's "time out" with Mikaela in the library. Some of the funnier moments were also just made up by the actors via adlibbing between takes, such as in the first movie when Sam trying to show off his muscles while pointing to things in his car as well as the "Sam's happy time" reference.

He should have said "Go whine to your mum" which would have the intended effect in a less derogatory way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

Just to clarify it was Skids who said, "Ah, go whine to your boyfriend."

---

I didn't really see the twins as racist or homophobic. I saw that comment in particular as the equivalent of calling Leo a girl. As in he's whinging and wining, therefore he's a girl, therefore he has a boyfriend instead of a girlfriend.

Overall I saw the twins as people trying hard to show that they can keep up with the other bigger, cooler Transformers (kinda as it explains in one of their card bios). As a result they trash-talk, over-exert themselves, and generally talk tough, but don't follow through in their actions, until Mudflap fights his way out of Devastators mouth.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seraphim Prime

I didn't really see the twins as racist or homophobic. I saw that comment in particular as the equivalent of calling Leo a girl. As in he's whinging and wining, therefore he's a girl, therefore he has a boyfriend instead of a girlfriend.

---

So it's sexist then, rather than homophobic? :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sky Shadow

So it's sexist then, rather than homophobic? :rolleyes:

---

It's a choice between the demon and the devil, but fits better with the bluster and trash talk attitude that Bay gave them rather than trying to bring homophobia into it.

...erm yeah, I'm not sure if misogyny is any better than homophobia. :/