Im a Hotwheels collector also. And over the years I find myself switching from HW to TFs and back again. Right now Im in my HW phase. TFs are not interesting me one bit at the moment. It will change though:o
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Im a Hotwheels collector also. And over the years I find myself switching from HW to TFs and back again. Right now Im in my HW phase. TFs are not interesting me one bit at the moment. It will change though:o
Thank goodness for other toy collections hehehe:D really helps to "ride" away during these lull momnents in collecting - as I mentioned before I have quite a few others - MOTU, DCUC, GiJoe(Cobra's only actually) and comics;), oh and Ghostbusters ( the old 80s ghosts only), MLs and when I come accross a figure iI might find cheap and want another - another G1 character figure (Ive completed mine US released, except for Overlord):p... but then I army build as well - Insecticons to make a swarm :):) SO as everyone has said, keep the collection, sit on it for a while you never know when the urge will come back and you might feel sorry later that you'd have to repurchase the stuff you sold but now at a higher price ( though I doubt with the newer stuff) than what you previously paid for it. But honestly the newer stuff (Bayverse toys) aren't worth for me huh, I got them packed up in a 94 liter plastic box ini my toyroom closet - I was thinking of reselling em but thought... hmm best to hang on for now, I might later on feel that they should be "on display" once again and well you never know.
Interesting though, through all the heaps of response I haven't seen a reply from daveanix:p:p hope he's mulling it still over and has read all the reply as well before he makes a decision he might regret later...
I think this whole thing about this year being Transformers collecting's "Darkest Hour" is highly exaggerated. Atm the Transformers franchise is enjoying the most popularity it's had since the 1980s - possibly even moreso because the children of the 80s are now adults with more spending power compared to when we just begged our parents.
I understand that we're in quite a lull atm with bugger all new products hitting shelves, no new TV series being aired here and a sporadic toy line for the movie (WHERE are Soundwave, Mirage and Wheeljack, dammmmnnnnnit?!?!?) etc. - but on the whole, while it's not great, it's not that bad. Certainly nowhere near as bad as previous seriously bad years we've had like...
+ 2002: we had next to NO new moulds hitting shelves in both Hasbro and Takara markets. In 2000-2001 we enjoyed all kinds of new toys with Beast Machines and Car Robot/Robots In Disguise -- then suddenly it all kinda stopped. The only new moulds we got were Megatron Megabolt and Air Attack Optimus Primal -- and the last two were "carry ons" that were initially intended to be released for BM but ended up being released in RiD (so they were never purpose-designed for RiD). Takara gave us lots of reissues... but still nothing new (and Japanese fans did complain about this a lot). It wasn't really until Armada came along at the end of that year (which meant that in most other places like Australia it didn't come out until 2003 - so I consider Armada to be a 2003-commencing line) that we finally got new toys. So we spent almost that entire year with bugger all new moulds! You know how frustrating that was?? I bought Robots In Disguise Optimus Prime even though I already had Super Fire Convoy... because I had nothing else to get! I skipped Devil Gigatron previously because it was too similar to Gigatron -- but I got RiD Galvatron which was still shelf-warming, cos again... wanted to get something! Tell me that wasn't a bloody frustrating year for TF collecting... but it gets way worse...
+ 1996: <tumbleweed> Much like 2002 there was BUGGER ALL new TFs out this year. And unlike 2002 where we'd come off the success of the Beast Era and Car Robot/RiD franchises, in 1996 we had just come off the failure of Generation 2. We desperately needed something! Beast Wars came out later that year, I didn't start seeing most stores carry them until 1997. So again, for a long time that year we had sweet bugger all.
So while I understand that we're in a bit of a downturn atm, I don't see the need to "give up" on Transformers. Especially considering that we've remained faithful in MUCH tougher times than this... why give up now?
I just use times like this to take a "breather" from constantly hunting and collecting new toys and just thoroughly enjoy the toys I have. I spent yesterday playing with Animated Leader Megatron and today I'm taking Legends Movie 1 Brawl out for dinner. :) I've spent a lot of time and money building my collection -- it's nice to have time like this toy enjoy it! :D
oh noes Gok, Brawl eats like a tank;) :p:p find someone else to bring to dinner heheheh
bring leader class bulkheadQuote:
Originally Posted by liegeprime
Oh, and for the record, I am glad there are so called 'Bayverse' TFs. I love the majority of them. Im not a G1 collector as Ive been there, done back in the 80s and feel that todays TFs are alot better engineered than the blocky TFs from the 80s........just thought Id add that cos am noticing alot of Bayverse toy knockers in this thread.
Same here, I have purchased several over the last couple of months but really just to complete groups or individual transformers but have kind of lost my interest... heck a friend brought her kid over and I let it (the kid whos 4 not the friend) play with my G1 decoys! Only 1 got some goobers on it. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector Prime
I don't actively collect G1 either - did most of that in the 1980s and 90s (remember that G1 didn't end until 1993) -- I mostly just collect whatever's in shops (been doin' so since '84) ... but in defence of G1, you gotta look at it in context.Quote:
Originally Posted by Decepticon
G1 toys, particularly early G1 toys, were exceptionally well engineered for their time. If you take a lot of toys from the 1984 line like Soundwave, the jets, Jazz, the cassettes, Bluestreak, Mirage, Sideswipe etc. -- by the standards of the day they were bloody impressive toys, especially Optimus Prime who was the biggest and most articulated figure and was also a freakin' playset that interacted with other Transformer figures by either holding cars in his trailer or as part of his combat deck which could also shoot out the Mini-Cars (and Roller of course). Not even DOTM Ultimate Optimus Prime's trailer can boast that level of play versatility -- it just transforms from a trailer into Optimus Prime's butterfly wingalings with a ridiculously oversized MechTech weapon which awkwardly stows below the trailer in truck mode. Without the trailer the cab robot has no weapon. 1984 Optimus Prime had his own rifle which he could use to fight independently of his other two components and of course, the trailer was a fully armed combat deck with missile launchers, radar and a clamping arm (da clamps!!). Okay, Roller just had a fuel hose, but I used to detach it and pretend the mount was a gun. :)
Now you could argue that Ultimate Optimus Prime's trailer does merge with Optimus Prime, unlike 1984 G1 Prime, but then look at 1988 Powermaster Optimus Prime. The trailer not only combines with the cab robot - but it creates a more proper looking "super robot" mode, whereas let's face it, Ultimate OP's butterfly mode is essentially a Mega Pretender Shell (and the Pretenders are considered by some to be the downpoint of G1). Not only that, but PM Prime's trailer can still open up to hold small vehicles and it can transform into a battle platform! Oh, and both the cab robot and the trailer are suitable armed - with Prime having two rifles and the trailer having two dual-barrelled cannons. And in Japan the equivalent toy (albeit different character) could combine with a second trailer (Godbomber) to form a super-super-combined robot with wingalings and missile bazooka. Yeah sure, it's a brick, but by 1988 standards this didn't really count against it... remember that it wasn't until mid to late G2 that articulated robot modes started really coming in -- and even then, it wasn't until Beast Wars that it became a more standard feature.
And Optimus Prime is one of the better engineered movie toys -- arguably among the best. As I said, G1 toys were generally considered to be exceptionally good for the standards of their day... what about movie toys? Do you think they're exceptionally good for today's standards? Compare the average "Bayformer" to say the average "Classicsverse" Transformer (being of similar vintage).
e.g.
+ Voyager Movie 1 Optimus Prime vs. Voyager Classics Optimus Prime
+ Movieverse Deluxe Jazz vs. RTS Jazz
+ ROTF Deluxe Sideswipe vs. Universe/Henkei Sideswipe
+ DOTM Deluxe Starscream vs. Classics/Universe/Henkei Starscream
+ ROTF Ravage vs Universe/Henkei Ravage -- while the latter may be a small "accessory" figure that came with Hound, I'd say it was relative to its size/cost, it could be seen as a better toy. For one thing, it transforms into a proper alt mode (cassette tape) whereas ROTF Ravage just folds up his robot mode into a "Huh?!" -- so-called "Re-Entry" mode
Now I know there are lots of really nice movieverse toys which are well made by today's standards, like Deluxe Movie 1 Bumblebees, the Leader Optimus Primes, Bludgeon, Powerglide, Wreckage... and heck, I think Fast Action Battler Decepticon Frenzy doesn't get enough love. And sure, there are plenty of G1 Transformers which were poorly executed even by the standards of their days, e.g. Battlechargers (the Jumpstarters which came before them were better designed), Firecons, 1988 Pretenders (what epically fail alt mode designs), Action masters (<shudder>) etc. - and to be fair to some movie toys, they have the additional challenge of being based on screen models (highly complex ones at that) which are difficult to translate into toys - whereas the majority of G1 toys were designed as toys first (thus HasTak had more creative freedom)... but even then that only covers the toys that appear in the film. We have had some movieverse toys which didn't appear in the film and were designed as toys first which are still sub-par by contemporary standards, e.g. Breakaway (I like this toy cos I got it for free as a bday gift, but I probably wouldn't be so fond of it if I'd paid money for it - esp. full retail). And I'll give credit to HasTak that they are - in general - getting gooderer at designing movie toys.
But on the whole, I don't think movieverse toys are generally as well designed by today's standards compared to early G1 toys by the standards of their day. There are exceptions on either end, but generally speaking when examining both lines on the whole, that's how I feel.
Put it this way, when I first saw 1984 Jazz my first reaction was like "Wwwhhhooooaaaaa! This toy is AWESOME!" -- when I first saw 2007 Movie Deluxe Jazz I thought this toy was mediocre at best by the standards of the day.
And just what exactly do you expect in today's standard of toy engineering Gok?
During the quiet times of Transformer collecting, I aim my sights towards another love of my childhood: LEGO.
Lots of LOTS of Lego!
All I can say is - I look forward to seeing more sale threads on the forum :D
heh. :)
Beast Wars set the standard of giving us highly detailed and articulated Transformer toys, and standards have improved since then. Car Robot/RiD took the engineering developed during BW and applied it with licensed vehicles. Armada/Energon kinda went wonky because they were so heavily gimmick-laden, but then Cybertron showed great improvement - even with the Cyber Planet Key gimmick, it didn't overwhelmingly compromise the toy - we still had a lot of great figures even with the gimmick (e.g. Downshift).Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWarp91
Then HasTak further developed the engineering with G1-inspiration giving us Classicsverse which ran parallel with the movieverse toys, so I tend to look at the standard in Classicsverse in terms of which can be achieved in TF toys by current standards - hence the movieverse/Classicsverse comparison in my previous post.
I actually think that the movie toys did considerably well for today's standards because you had real life vehicles that transformed into such alien like robots. Sure the classics verse toys had vehicles as well but they were generic vehicles and the robot modes were blocky as - nothing wrong with that but admittedly it does not require the complex engineering as needed for the movie toys. Despite my name being of decepticon cause i am in this situation the optimus :D
Yes, hence my comment:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime
I agree with Gok on this, but I am biased as I absolutely loathe the Bay movies. Particularly the last 2. The standard for today's Transformers has been set I think by the Binaltech line and of course the Masterpieces. Whereas back in the 1980s G1 was the standard! There was nothing else. Well, Machine Men. Little more than glorified minibots!
I wouldn't use Masterpiece as a standard... I like the MP Convoy mould, but some people criticise the truck mode for not looking very realistic -- although I like it and I think it's a marvel of engineering. Other MPs on the other hand...
+ Megatron: far too fiddly for its own good. I've only transformed it _once_ (and a small tab snapped off)... and that's it. Then there's the issue of rust. The shoulder panels pop out way too easily too. Craphouse action figure to play with.
+ Seekers: maybe nice display pieces but craphouse action figures. The original Takara Starscream was especially bad, although HasTak did improve the plastic quality with subsequent uses of that mould.
+ Grimlock: A nice toy, but way overpriced for what is essentially a "quasi" Masterpiece toy; i.e. half the toy features fairly MP-esque complex engineering, but the other half is too much like the G1 toy (too simple). This isn't necessarily a bad thing, but not worth the asking price IMO. I find Grimlock offers the best play value alongside Optimus Prime... but just doesn't justify the price.
+ Rodimus: The original Japanese version is plagued with various flaws -- it can't slot into the trailer without scratching the spoiler and forget about getting it to hold its own guns. The trailer is essentially just an oversized version of the G1 trailer/deck - nice, but not worth the price tag. The Hasbro version improved some of the issues, but there are still some problems with it -- some of the tabs on mine has stress marks on it, indicative of poor quality plastic. Offshoot's pretty neat though. I find Rodimus has the 3rd best play value other than Optimus and Grimlock... but let's face it, there's not much competition here. (-_-)
Masterpiece TFs seem more like articulated statues rather than playable action figures. :( :mad: :( Binaltechs are better in this regard, but I still don't find them as fun to pay with as regular TF figures... mostly because they're kinda clunky, and let's face it, who wants to play with a toy that takes half an hour to transform?? Kinda kills the thrill of an intense battle... Some movieverse toys are guilty of this too (e.g. Leader Class Optimus Prime).
So I find Classicsverse to be an arguably more suitable comparison because:
+ Similar price points
+ Both designed with similar play patterns (and not as overglorified display pieces)
I always thought of Masterpiece as articulated statues, squarely aimed at the display collector market.:cool:
As did I, playing with them is the very last thing I've considered - They're too bloody expensive! :o:pQuote:
Originally Posted by UltraMarginal
Hmmm... I just read this. So will go back and answer the original question / issue.
On the issue of Bay-formers - I've had enough since after the first wave of Movie toys in 2007.
Classics, MPs, BTs are great and I am a big G1 fan.
Like liegeprime said earlier, there are other ways deals with the lull and best of all give your wallet a rest.
Maybe set yourself a new aim like collect all the BTs MIB or better yet, collect G1 MIB/MOC. That'd keep one entertained for years I'd imagine. :D
Fixed.Quote:
Originally Posted by heroic_decepticon
I wouldn't worry about it too much - if this year's product doesn't appeal to you, then it doesn't appeal to you, and that's the extent of it. There aren't many collectors, completests aside, who bought the majority of every single year's releases back to G1. Just take a break, maybe look at filling in some older holes in your collection, and take a look back over the last five years of releases to see if there's anything you wanted but missed.
Before you know it, there will be another reboot, another cartoon, another toyline, and the aesthetic will have changed yet again - maybe to something that appeals more.
I've found it can also be fun wandering through the kitbash threads on a lot of forums. Almost all of them deal with older characters and designs, and it can be a fun nostalgia kick. Occasionally you might even find one that really showcases one of the newer toys in a great light, and have second thoughts about picking it up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prowl
cup noodles for eternity anyone? :D:p;)
Although Transfomers as a franchise has become very popular I can't say that the line from a toy perspective is doing too well right. A lot of the current toys seem to be shelfwarming and a huge majority of the stuff being sold is barely transformers and more like merchendise.
With a lot of stuff to buy like Kreo Transformers and lots of other stuff, there is a much to choose from but not much that would appeal the 'traditional' Transformers collector. At least with Armada, Energon and Cybertron despite their flaws, those were dedicated TF lines and not as 'merchandise instensive' or 'play set intensive' like the current movie line. For lack of better word, to me it feels like the line is somewhat 'diluted' with it's current wave of popularity.
Anyways, as mentioned, this phase will eventually pass and the new thing will come around that may be more appealing like the first wave of TF:Prime toys that don't look half bad or other collector lines.
For me, the 3rd party stuff is keeping my interest in Transformers collecting as otherwise I would seriously be reconsidering if I wanted to continue. The current official stuff is very uninteresting to me with good appealing stuff too few and far between to keep me interested.
There is also other lines to collect like MOTUC and I am slowly getting into GI Joe.
I think that once TFP figures hit the shelves things will pick up again. I agree that the movie line has been getting tedious and the DOTM figures have been pretty unexciting, but since I've been watching Prime I'm itching to get my hands on some new figures
I've lost a lot of interest in TFs in the past year. I think the movies are what started the decline for me, but I agree with others here that the toys have been lacking in some aspects. There have been some highlights (for me, they were in the CHUG and Masterpiece lines), but I find myself not particularly inspired or excited by any current/upcoming figures except MP-10, MP-11. Thank goodness I collect other lines!! I also think Hasbro Aus and their terrible release schedule are partly to blame for my loss in enthusiasm... I've actually purchased most of my newer TF figures online as a result.
I agree with your sentiment, but I just have to say... Machine Men are much better than that! I have a huge collection (as do many other members on these forums), and while the cartoon was not great, many of the toys were brilliant... much, much better than many similarly sized Transformers. Minibots are terrible by comparison to Machine Robo/Men/Gobots for the most part, and are well below their standards in terms of engineering.Quote:
Originally Posted by jimoinj
Fixed x2 :DQuote:
Originally Posted by heroic_decepticon
It's definitely lost its luster for me for some time. I used to be heavily into it - heck, I even defended Beast Machines, but with the exception of IDW, the media just doesn't do it for me anymore.
Then there are the toys. The more time goes on; the more I see TF ripping off its own past gimmicks in the form of some pitiful rehash- be it the minicons being essentially Powermaster Micromasters, Energon essentialy milking half a toyline out of the Multiforce toys from Victory, or Cybertron ripping off Magneman from the Microchange line. Don't even get me started on the Power Core Combiners being a rehash of a rehash.
Then there's Classics that seem to have as many hits as misses, while the movie toys look like they should be a part of a Super Gobots redux while ripping off the Machine Wars toy gimmick (yes technicaly BW came before MW, but the small MW toys were unreleased G2 prototypes IIRC).
I definitely agree about BT although the line was let down by so many changes to it over time due to licensing.
Honestly, the last series I find working in any way shape or form was Robots in Disguise. Prime seems ok, but it's no Beast Wars.
Also like Gok said, the 1984 TFs were ahead of their time, not to mention that there was a version of Prime which could combine with his trailer, released in the Diaclone line in in the early 1980s anyway.
They, the 1992 Euro G1 TFs, Beast Wars and Car Robots, were the last milestones when there was a toyline for TFs that had a wow factor that really grabbed me.
That's not even going into distribution issues in this country.
I have my doubts that we'll see another milestone like those ever again. The older I get, the more nostalgic I find I get.....
i have lost some interest in transformers in the past couple of months or so i think botcon may have burned me out a little to be honest but as some others have stated it cycles around.
I usually go from buying Transformers then i concentrate on my Amazing Spiderman comic collection and then onto my classic cars and then back to Transformers again all three of these addictions have highs and lows and im okay with that.
Also i have found that the customising side helps alot it gives me a creative outlet for a franchise that i adore and something extra than just buying a toy and taking it out of the package.
Do you know what I miss? When buying a Transformer didn't actually mean anything.
I had random figures from whatever line was out at the time: Drag Strip, a Classic Snarl, some purple Actionmaster Base...
There was no pressure to get all of them, to get only one line.
I miss being naive.
I can't enjoy them anymore.
When I posted that I was like "Haha! Because that would be silly!". But people actually act like this? Daaaaaaaamn.Quote:
Originally Posted by Me
+1. If I felt like giving up on Transformers at the first sign of the franchise losing steam, I probably would've stopped collecting around 1990-91 when Action Masters came out! :p Thankfully I didn't. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Quickstrike
We've stuck with this franchise for 27 years now... I hardly see the current lull as any reason to abandon it now. We've faced MUCH tougher times than this. I don't even consider this time to be even remotely tough at all really. Sure it's not fantastic, but "tough"? Nah. To suggest that this may be the end of the franchise? Things have to get a LOT worse than this before I'll even entertain that thought. 1995-96 and 2002 were tough and frustrating years. Compared to those years 2011's really not that bad (not great, but not bad IMO). :)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y22...s/melbmeet.jpg
Above: Melbourne fan meet, December 2001. (Look at all those peg-warming Beast Machines toys!) Little did we know that we were in store for a year of massive frustrating disappointment... :(
I have to disagree. Things are starting to get stale, Hasbro Aust hasn't been the same in years, the Aaron Archer is more GIJOE fan than TF fan as I understand it, Walmart rather than toy designers dictate lines and Hasbro has simply gotten so large that much like the Cybertronian Empire as Grimlock put it in G2 Issue 1, they see too large a picture- to the point where they can't see the cracks in things.
Theoretically, Hasbro could come up with some way to come back from this as they did with Euro G1, BW and RiD. I just can't see them being in a position to initiate what is required to make it happen.
Well with the toy sale on at Target and new things advertised in their cataloge I'm going to head on over and see what I see.
I'll always love Transformers. Always have. It felt like this between the Animated and RotF lines, also between Cybertron and Classics. Something new will come and there will be stuff to buy again. It just sucks that we are missing out on things, eg Human Alliance, that we may never see. I tend to avoid online buying as I'm impatiant but it looks like that's what I'm going to have to do.
Makes it worse that I tried to buy some comics to experience other media but recieved an email saying they were out of stock and shouldn't have been available.
I'm not sure I understand. What do you mean the franchise is stail or that it might be the end of it? Didn't the latest TF movie bring massive profits for Hasbro? With WFC and FOC they've remained a new universe that I think a lot of fans love. TF Prime isn't too bad, could have been much much worse (it could have been in the Bayverse). There's an abundance of toys out at the moment (unfortunately they are basically the same as TF2007). The MP line is looking great. What's not to like at the moment?
Beast Machines was stale, with about 30 toys released in the year, and shelfwarming for years afterward. The last 4 years of the new Movies is definitely the opposite of stale. It might be the same main characters and forms for the last few years, boring many fans, but Hasbro profits (and Transformers being their largest earner for the last 5 years) would give them no reason to change anything.
Beast Machines was not a (money) winning formula, so they changed their direction, axing the line and cancelling Transtech... bringing in Vehicles from the JP Car Robots line.
Movie Universe on the other hand, is a (money) winning formula... and what business that wants to stay in business is going to change, or walk away from a winning formula.
We certainly aren't their meal ticket, so they're just gonna keep producing product for the kiddies and parents who are, no matter how repetitious it is.
Despite not many new toys coming out or not coming out fast enough, perhaps it's time to cherish all the toys we already have? :o
I think that although the collectors aren't their main money maker they haven't forgotten us with new reissues coming out and new MP's on they way. I don't think they should have made a new starscream but the new optimus was great (good size, great alt mode and poseability) and the ultra Magnus prototype looked fantastic. So I think we are in for some treats next year. I'm hoping for some Fall of Cybertron toys and continued Generations releases.
One good thing about now new TF purchases atm... I can put money aside for when Encore Devastator comes out (supposedly end of this month). ;)
Or scoring MIB pre-tfs for the price of an ultra :pQuote:
Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime
More like they milked an angle dry (as the shelfwarming of the DOTM line proves). Fans make up a large minority of their total market globally, yet the only people who are going to buy upteen dosen variants of a single character are completists.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
Most parents are going to take a look at the latest version of Bumblebee and decide that their child already has that toy and pass it over.
It's amazing that they didn't have those main characters shelfwarming with ROTF.
I honestly can't see this Hasbro being able to declare pumping out more versions of the same character at this point or later on, a victory.