A lot of people thought this guy would've been better for the role:Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7xWJHXY8ws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bba_wPdLxp4
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A lot of people thought this guy would've been better for the role:Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7xWJHXY8ws
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bba_wPdLxp4
It's one thing to do a scene-by-scene impression, it's another to play the role independently.Quote:
Originally Posted by MEEEGGGAAATTTRRROOONNN!!!
I actually said that anything from the Lucasfilm group should have been made sacrosanct. However not only has that not happened, but given that Mark Hamill's character in TLJ was referred to by him as "Jake Skywalker", even the movies themselves and the core iconic characters aren't safe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
However your argument about what was created by Lucas is flawed on so many levels. Take Star Wars Dark Forces for example. Wookiepedia notes:
Ergo Lucas clearly had enough of his finger in the pie on it to actively promote it - thereby officially endorsing it as a Lucasfilm Group project.Quote:
George Lucas appeared on CNN's Future Watch show and demonstrated/promoted the game. Lucas and Daron Stinnett also promoted it in Disneyland when they traveled there for the opening of the Indiana Jones train.
Likewise, Lucas was so involved with Shadows of the Empire, that Black Sun was there entirely because Lucas wanted the story to explore the galaxy's underworld.
To argue that these projects didn't come from Lucas and that he had no significant involvement in them, is blatant revisionism.
Then there's the fact that the Star Wars Screen Entertainment Program blatantly falls under the category of an authorised Lucasfilm fact file for 1994. It wasn't a game, but rather a screensaver/entertainment package loaded with character bios and histories, blueprints, etc. Essentially everything it mentioned was official information from Lucasfilm. Heck, the thing all but mentioned the duel between Obi-wan and Anakin at Mustafar a good 11 years before Revenge of the Sith (a duel on a lava filled planet which Anakin lost and wound up needing a portable life support suit because of it).
It may be my opinion, but it has more consistency than your opinion, given that you've claimed that certain things shouldn't be off limits because Lucas had no involvement in them, when the evidence says otherwise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
Yet weren't fans irate at him for doing just that with changing Owen Lars from Obi-Wan's Brother to Anakin's half-brother?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
Actually the third option is for people to say "I'm out" and it's one which seems to be increasingly picking up steam among fans. After all, if even Mark Hamill had his soul destroyed over the Disney treatment of Luke, I fail to see why I should feel compelled to care any more about the new movies any more than he does, or feel any automatic hype for any of the new films.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
And that's the problem; for an increasing number of us, these are no longer the films we love. They'll never kill off love of the older stuff, but it's increasingly becoming a case of "I'm out" with the new movies. Mind you that's fine considering that Kathleen Kennedy clearly wants the older fans to go away and to kill off every single iconic older character there, because they "get in the way" of the story she and others want to tell and take away the limelight from the newer characters.
Dude. Why so angry? You’ll give yourself an ulcer.:)
I'm not angry, it just saddens me to see how the property has been handled under Disney. I seriously don't get how Disney can get Marvel movies so right, while getting Star Wars movies so screwed up.Quote:
Originally Posted by M-bot
Well I'm sorry but Lucasfilm simply doesn't share your views:
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_W...anded_universeQuote:
]Holocron database and canonicity
Historically, Lucasfilm tracked the storylines and content of these media in large black binders, known as bibles. In 2000, Leland Chee was hired as Continuity Database Administrator for Lucas Licensing, and implemented a database to replace the bibles. The database was named the Holocron,[32][33][34][35] a term used within the fictional Star Wars universe for "ancient repositories of knowledge and wisdom" used by the Jedi and Sith.[36][37] Lucasfilm's Holocron consists of over 55,000 entries for franchise characters, locations, species, and vehicles.[32] Chee said of the database in 2012, "What sets Star Wars apart from other franchises is that we develop a singular continuity across all forms of media, whether it be the films, TV series, video games, novels and comics, and the Holocron is a key component to Lucasfilm being able to do this."[38]
The Holocron was divided into five levels of canon (in order of precedence): G-canon, T-canon, C-canon, S-canon, and N-canon.
GWL-canon or "G-canon" stood for "George Lucas canon": Marked "GWL" after George Lucas (whose middle name is "Walton")[34]. It included Episodes I–VI (the released films at that time), and any statements by George Lucas (including unpublished production notes from him or his production department that are never seen by the public). Elements originating with Lucas in the scripts, filmed deleted scenes, film novelizations, reference books, radio plays, and other primary sources were also G-canon when not in contradiction with the released films.[39] GWL-canon overrode the lower levels of canon when there was a contradiction. In the words of Leland Chee: "George's view of the universe is his view. He's not beholded to what's gone before."[34]
T-canon was Television canon: Referred to the canon level comprising the animated film Star Wars: The Clone Wars and the television series Star Wars: The Clone Wars. Many stories wound up superseding those depicted in continuity canon, and the second Clone Wars animated series and its film also overwrote Genndy Tartakovsky's 2003 Clone Wars animated micro-series.[39]
C-canon was Continuity canon: Consisting of most of the materials from the Star Wars Expanded Universe including the books, comics, and videogames bearing the label of Star Wars.[39] According to a Wired article, the creation of stories that introduced radical changes in the continuity, like The Force Unleashed video-game which introduced Darth Vader's secret apprentice, required Lucas's approval, and he spent hours explaining to the developers anything he deemed necessary for them to know.[34] Games and RPG sourcebooks were a special case; the stories and general background information were themselves fully C-canon, but the other elements such as character/item statistics and gameplay were, with few exceptions, N-canon.[citation needed]
S-canon was Secondary canon: Covering the same media as C-canon, it was immediately superseded by anything in higher levels of canon in any place where two elements contradicted each other, the non-contradicting elements were still a canon part of the Star Wars universe, this included certain elements of a few N-canon stories.[39] The Star Wars Holiday Special is an example of secondary canon.[34]
And here's one from the man himself:
Source: http://www.canonwars.com/SWCanon2.htmlQuote:
“There are two worlds here,” explained Lucas. “There’s my world, which is the movies, and there’s this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe – the licensing world of the books, games and comic books. They don’t intrude on my world, which is a select period of time, [but] they do intrude in between the movies. I don’t get too involved in the parallel universe.”"
- George Lucas, Flannelled One, July 2002 - as reported on the Cinescape site, from Cinescape Magazine
This website makes it clear that George has always acted as a consultant role in the non-movie media - games, books and the like. That doesn't (and has now been established) make it absolute canon.
I'm done debating. You're not going to change your mind, and neither will I. You're entitled to your opinion, and I hope you accept mine. I won't judge you for not wanting to watch the new movies but don't begrudge those who actually wants to see where this new direction of Star Wars is going.
LMAO. Moved on from Rey & Jyn at the drop of a hat. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by reillyd
I enjoyed the movie and this so did the missus. This is her first time watching a Star Wars movie and she loved it.
If Lucasfilm disagree with me on these examples, then they've tripped over themselves in spite of themselves your own quotes here prove my point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
You cite the following:
However you've completely taken this out of context, as Lucas clearly wasn't including the early exceptions here which were not licenced from Lucasfilm. Either that or Lucas had a brain fart when he was saying this.Quote:
“There are two worlds here,” explained Lucas. “There’s my world, which is the movies, and there’s this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe – the licensing world of the books, games and comic books. They don’t intrude on my world, which is a select period of time, [but] they do intrude in between the movies. I don’t get too involved in the parallel universe.”
- George Lucas, Flannelled One, July 2002 - as reported on the Cinescape site, from Cinescape Magazine
Star Wars Screen Entertainment, which is what pertains to Solo here, was a fact-file in the form of a screensaver, which was a Lucasfilm project, took its material straight from Lucas' own notes.
Dark Forces was developed in house and personally promoted by Lucas as a Lucasfilm project.
Shadows of the Empire was developed in house. The original vague idea came from LucasArts employee Jon Knoles (not to be confused with Johnj Knoll) who proposed they do a story between ANH and ESB. The reason it focused on Black Sun and the crime boss Prince Xizor is because it was what Lucas had directed. In fact the only thing it lacked, was an actual movie. Name one other Star Wars story that didn't have a blockbuster movie in the 1990s which got its own dedicated toyline. You can't. They don't exist. So what if Steve Perry wrote the novelisation, it was a project that Lucas actively steered and had creative control over.
If you're going to class these things as licensed, then where do you start and stop. Do you say that Alan Dean Forster's Splinters of the Mind script is merely licensed?
What's stopping someone from then turning around and saying that ESB is "Licensed" then, as Lawrence Kasdan wrote it and Irvin Kerschner directed it. Lucas merely produced it.
In fact, Lucas and Kerschner clashed over Han Solo's "I know" line.
The argument which you and the likes of SharkyMcShark are making here is flawed and fails on two grounds. Firstly, as noted, unlike actual EU stuff, none of these projects operated through Lucas Licensing as their main link to the LFL and were ultimately beholden to George's creative vision.
Secondly there's this myopic fallacy. SharkyMcShark writes:
Except where the above are concerned, it's utterly false. SWSE and Dark Forces completely predate even the SE version of the Trilogy, while Lucasfilm used Shadows of the Empire as a marketing dry run for the SE Trilogy.Quote:
Originally Posted by SharkyMcShark
As for the Holocron, taking a myopic approach to it has been a complete cluster****.
You quote:
It's all well and good to want to come up with levels of canon, but you cannot take a medium and automatically presume that it's going to fit neatly into a category based on the form of media it takes.Quote:
GWL-canon or "G-canon" stood for "George Lucas canon": Marked "GWL" after George Lucas (whose middle name is "Walton")[34]. It included Episodes I–VI (the released films at that time), and any statements by George Lucas (including unpublished production notes from him or his production department that are never seen by the public). Elements originating with Lucas in the scripts, filmed deleted scenes, film novelizations, reference books, radio plays, and other primary sources were also G-canon when not in contradiction with the released films.[39] GWL-canon overrode the lower levels of canon when there was a contradiction. In the words of Leland Chee: "George's view of the universe is his view. He's not beholded to what's gone before."[34]
T-canon was Television canon: Referred to the canon level comprising the animated film Star Wars: The Clone Wars and the television series Star Wars: The Clone Wars. Many stories wound up superseding those depicted in continuity canon, and the second Clone Wars animated series and its film also overwrote Genndy Tartakovsky's 2003 Clone Wars animated micro-series.[39]
C-canon was Continuity canon: Consisting of most of the materials from the Star Wars Expanded Universe including the books, comics, and videogames bearing the label of Star Wars.[39] According to a Wired article, the creation of stories that introduced radical changes in the continuity, like The Force Unleashed video-game which introduced Darth Vader's secret apprentice, required Lucas's approval, and he spent hours explaining to the developers anything he deemed necessary for them to know.[34] Games and RPG sourcebooks were a special case; the stories and general background information were themselves fully C-canon, but the other elements such as character/item statistics and gameplay were, with few exceptions, N-canon.[citation needed]
S-canon was Secondary canon: Covering the same media as C-canon, it was immediately superseded by anything in higher levels of canon in any place where two elements contradicted each other, the non-contradicting elements were still a canon part of the Star Wars universe, this included certain elements of a few N-canon stories.[39] The Star Wars Holiday Special is an example of secondary canon.[34]
None of of the examples I listed fit into that categorisation. SWSE, for example, either slots into GWL canon as it's an in-house fact file, directly sourcing GWL Canon material (eg script notes, GL written character bios, etc). Where it is S-Canon, it is S-Canon in the same way that Splinter of the Mind is S-Canon and the only example of this I can think of prior to the buyout is Owen Lars' backstory. However it for the most part falls under the category of GWL-Canon.
Likewise, Shadows of the Empire, though lacking a blockbuster movie, absolutely falls under the category of GWL canon as it was handled the exact same way by LFL as a blockbuster movie by them would be.
Dark Forces, being in the very early days of video games and developed entirely in-house, should actually belong in T-canon rather than C-canon.
In short, your entire argument is myopically fallacious.
And so the point isn't lost in the last post.
What a steaming load of horsecrap!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
I came into this thread saying I was hesitant about seeing the film because I was worried a key established point about Han and Chewie's relationship might have been thrown on the cutting room floor with Disney's track record regarding Luke's portrayal (which even Mark Hamill has described as essentially being a completely different character) and in house Lucas projects which could have been reasonably believed to be safe under the mouse. The response of several people here, including you has been not to debate – not to exchange information to reach deeper levels of understanding, but to shut me up.
You claim “ I won't judge you for not wanting to watch the new movies” but that's complete garbage. Your attitude and the attitude of others here towards me hasn't been one of “let's agree to disagree”. Rather, it's been one of “STFU, be a good boy and watch your movie you uppity fanboy”, which is actually what prompted my comment about businesses giving customers the bare minimum they'll happily fork over money for - not the other way around.
“Live and let live”? Maybe you and others making the loudest cries of that here should take your own advice.
And someone here was wondering why I might have come across as a little bit irate in this thread :rolleyes:
Just like in any company you have some good managers and you have some bad ones all under the one roof. Disney isn't so special that it can avoid this.Quote:
Originally Posted by bowspearer
Like when I went to see Rogue One, I've been blown away by Solo and am contemplating a second viewing.
I'm not going to try comparing Rogue One and Solo because they're such different creatures. So here are some points I'd like to make about this movie:
1. This is the third movie to not include reference to the Jedi and the Force. If my memory serves me correctly, the other two are Caravan of Courage (1984) and The Battle for Endor (1985) which are also spin-offs.
2. Qi'ra is a well rounded character (and credit to Emilia Clarke's acting) who is no damsel in distress but a tough chick with a tender side and reminds me of Leia but with treachery thrown in. Which explains why Han and Leia have such a bumpy courtship. Han doesn't want to be burnt again.
3. Oh dear. That L3-37 is the droid equivalent of Jar Jar Binks. Trying so hard to be funny and ends up coming across as annoying and weird. I was happy to see that machine get blown to pieces.
4. After seeing his turn as a villain in Firewall I knew Paul Bettany would deliver the goods once again as Dryden Vos.
5. Considering that Enfys Nest is the founder of what becomes the rebel alliance it would be interesting to see a movie that shows how Enfys turned her rag tag group into the threat to the empire we've all come to know. It would be more entertaining than a movie about Bobba Fett.
6. The scene inside the maelstrom involving the tentacled creature and the maw is a wonderful example of two action set pieces rolled into one and the highlight of the movie.
The work of Mr. Lucas is said to draw inspiration from Tolkien (even though Lucas denies it) and if you've seen the appendices and companion books of/connected to Tolkien you'll see there is a vast amount of rich detail covering languages, races, geography, genealogy, religions and history. Marvel comics are not as detailed in comparison and therefore easier to make into movies. I assume Disney just doesn't have the time for meticulous scholarly detail.Quote:
Originally Posted by bowspearer
Which at the end of the day is a real problem - in fact it's financial suicide. Here's the thing. When a company forks out billions on a property, it's because they look at how profitable it is. Logically, when you're forking out that much on an investment, then you want to maximise your profits by using that property in the ways which made it work to begin with.Quote:
Originally Posted by shockNwave
This strategy of trading on the name and cynically pandering to certain groups, might work in the short term, but it will always have a shelf life. And yes, that's exactly what they're doing is. George Lucas wasn't thinking "end racism" when he made Lando and making him a "black character" - he was simply a good character who happened to be of colour.
George Lucas certainly wasn't thinking "girl power" when he created Princess Leia - she's just a well written female leader. She isn't a Mar-Rey Sue either. Yet look at how memorable, profound, identifiable and powerful a character she is.
When you're shamelessly pandering to a group you go out of your way to make <token character with a label>. When you actually care about those groups and actually want to empower them, you just make them great characters, where <insert group label here> simply exists in the background, but doesn't define them.
And again, it seems that this movie is a casualty of that from what I just read on a Screen Rant article - as in of the time of typing this response. The original story of how Han met Chewie and the life debt should have been kept as is. It was the story of a brilliant Imperial officer who graduated top of his class and could possibly even have been a Grand Moff in his later years. Instead, he committed mutiny on his superiors to save Chewie from cruelty - the EU novelisation which adapted that bit of originally GWL canon - even had him intervening to save Chewie's life.
Everything about hating races deemed inferior, racial cruelty, Social Darwinism, racial enslavement, standing up to institutionalised power against bigotry, no matter the cost: it was all there.
Instead the story was trashed for some cheap escape plot and the need to "make the white jock face his own internal biases and check his human privilege".
It was needless, and it destroyed everything beautiful about the relationship between Han and Chewie and just how special that life debt was and what Han gave up to stand up for a "lesser slave race", when his every vested interest was to look the other way.
Not only did it make the same social commentary as it was, but it was a thing of beauty. It didn't need improving and it didn't need to be made flashier or more exciting. It should have simply been lifted from the original character backstory George wrote and put straight on the screen.
And this is the thing. The problem isn't diversity, it's how Disney is handling it. A person of colour, an LGBTIQ+ individual, those of us with disabilities, men and women - we're all more than just labels. Labels don't tell the entirety of a person's backstory, their character, their interests, their abilities or their future. In fact the very notion that it does, which is what diversity pandering does - despite its claims to the contrary - is a patronising form of homophobia, racism, ableism, sexism, misogyny, and so the list goes on.
If Disney actually cared about doing this franchise justice, they'd simply concentrate on a rich lore, good storytelling and compelling characters - where those labels were simply there in the background but didn't define the characters. That's how you empower minorities - not by slapping a big minority label on the character in some cheap patronising show of pandering, but by presenting amazing characters who are capable of amazing things - and who just happen to fit the label. The former boxes people into labels. The later sends those same minorities the powerful message that contrary to the bigotry they face, their labels don't define them and they can achieve anything they put their mind to. Just look at Static Shock as a great example of that in terms of characters.
And before someone tries to claim otherwise, as a disabled Australian who has faced abuse and discrimination because of it for most of their life, I absolutely have every right to say that and I do know what I'm talking about.
Lucas understood it, hence the idea of the every[hu]man. It's what made it so powerful and resonate so strongly with all of us. Until Disney gets that, they're never going to recapture the magic that was previously there and the hollow shell that remains is going to have a use-by date the moment the lustre fades.
It's a tragic shame really.
Today I came across the news that Solo has flopped at the box office and most heavily outside of America. I knew Solo was going to be fighting an uphill battle due to it's release date being not long after Deadpool 2 (most successful R-rated movie opening weekend) and of course the super epic Infinity War.
So what do Thor:Ragnarok, Black Panther, Infinity War and Deadpool 2 have in common? Innovation and outside the square thinking.
What do The Force Awakens, The Last Jedi and Solo have in common? A struggle to be innovative and outside the square.
As much as I like these three Star Wars movies, I cannot put them as equals to those aforementioned Marvel movies. So bowspearer, at least there's some positivity to be drawn from this.
Yeah I read that it opened worse than Justice League which is not a good sign. Costs blow outs from the reshoots put a higher figure on breaking even (est. $500 million).
People cite franchise fatigue which is doubtful given how well MCU performs. Certainly backlash from TLJ had an effect. There was naff all promotional efforts - trailers and merchandise came in late as well. TLJ had 8 months of ongoing promos.
I'm not so sure there is. Given how much everyone is citing "Star Wars Fatigue", I honestly think Disney will use it as a convenient out, rather than recognising that the real problem is that the glorified accountant they put at the helm of Lucasfilm is no doubt great at handling the financials, but when it comes to creative vision, she's clearly out of her depth (they really need someone like Dave Filoni in the role who does come from a creative background and rose to prominence because of it).Quote:
Originally Posted by shockNwave
The session I was at on Sunday (just three days after its opening), there were only about 15 people in the theatre.
I was really surprised at the low turnout just days into its opening and on a weekend, because it was a lot less than I was expecting, despite not expecting too much from the movie (due to the odd choice of actor and it feeling more like a TV episode than an epic cinema movie).
If this article isn't fake news, then it's pretty bad:
https://mumbrella.com.au/solo-a-mark...r-story-519700
Quote:
After Scott Rhodie received a $77 ticket to watch Solo: A Star Wars Story three hours before anyone else in Australia, he was more than a little disappointed after he realised 400 of the 500-strong crowd were paid actors.
Lol, who the hell would pay $77 for the "privilege" to watch a movie three hours earlier than the rest of Australia, along with some cheap merchandise. If true, no wonder it undersold.Quote:
Originally Posted by MEEEGGGAAATTTRRROOONNN!!!
Watched the Solo movie last night, definitely entertaining, with some cool action / chase sequences. Donald Glover was great as Lando. Woody Harrelson was also pretty solid as Beckett. Alden did a good job performance wise (not entirely happy with some of his dialogue, some lines felt a bit out of character for Han), he did take the character on and made it his own rather than trying to copy Harrison Ford which I think was the right direction to go, BUT admittedly, and this is with no intended criticism of his performance, it was still hard for me to think of him as Han Solo (to be honest I think tyring to remove Harrison Ford from that character is impossible, much like Indiana Jones, those characters are Harrison Ford).
I also agree with the comment that there really was no character development with Han throughout this movie, basically he is the same at the end as he was at the beginning, so it doesn’t really give any insight on how he became the character we all love, its sort of like he was just always that way.
In terms of plot, a lot of things I didn’t get and thought were a bit ??? (i.e. a certain hologram at the end), but I think a lot can also be put down to its direction, which really does feel like belonging to two completely different directors with different visions in some parts, and it most definitely comes across as being “Disneyfied”.
But all up it’s a fun movie (which might be where it kind of falters with my personal taste for this particular kind of flick), I personally wouldn’t rank it better than Rogue One (that definitely felt more like a proper Star Wars movie), even though I enjoyed watching the Han and Chewy friendship development and the interactions with Lando.
If you’re a Star Wars fan, I think its worth a watch at the cinema’s, the visual effects are still great, the throw in's to previous references are pretty cool (although I didn’t think were entirely necessary) and like I said at the start, it is a fun and entertaining movie.
I take it this 'glorified accountant' you're referring to is Kathleen Kennedy. It remains to be seen if she succeeds in doing to Star Wars what the greedy executives at Atari did to Atari and the golden age of consoles. Which was to send them into a tail spin from which they never recovered.Quote:
Originally Posted by bowspearer
BTW Did Mr. Lucas sell the Star Wars franchise because he nor anyone else would ever be able to restore it to it's former glory?
Yes I am referring to Kathleen Kennedy. Her role has always been as an Executive Producer prior to this, so her role was to handle the finances. Considering I've heard others refer to her as "George Lucas' coffee lady", I think "Glorified Accountant" is on the incredibly tame end of things she could be called.Quote:
Originally Posted by shockNwave
I've heard people say he was sick and tired of the fan hate. Personally I think the prequel trilogy's problems fall into two categories if what I've heard is true. I forget where, but I recall hearing that the plan with Jar Jar was for him to be a dark foreshadowing of Yoda (which if you actually stop to imagine it playing out with an open mind, is actually pretty awesome and leads you to hating the character for the right reasons - because of how cruel, sadistic and nasty he actually winds up being), but in a moment of shortsighted stupidity, Dennis Muren talked him out of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by shockNwave
The other thing is that while I think TPM would have worked better than it does if he'd stayed the course with the alleged Sith Jar Jar plot, he clearly forgot what worked with the OT. While George directed ANH, he gave the reigns over to others when the movies took on a different tone. I recently read that Irvin Kerschner would have jumped at the chance to direct one of the prequels and the one I think he should have directed, should have been AOTC and possibly even ROTS as well. I think that his directorial sensibilities would have probably done a better job of giving us the intensity Lucas wanted out of Christensen, but in a much more palatable way, which resonated with audiences more.
I actually don't think it's impossible for Star Wars to find new glory days. However if the PT and the current Disney era are lessons of what not to do, I think that there are a couple of key points which should be looked at.
Firstly, whoever does this needs to understand mythology and have such a profound understanding of it and the heroes journey that they can apply it to this vast sprawling universe. Anyone who challenges that and clearly can't see the forest for the trees, needs to be told to move to one side; they'll be proven wrong once it all hits the big screen anyway.
Secondly, make sure the director is the right fit. ESB was what it was because Lucas recognised that his style wouldn't work for it, but Kerschner's would. That's the key here, someone whose style fits and who can put their ego aside long enough to recognise their movie's place in the larger scheme of things (yes Rian Johnson, I'm looking at you).
If those things happened, I think there's no reason we couldn't see Star Wars heading back to it's former greatness.
Since I know how crazy the whole thing I said about Jar Jar might sound, try this on for size.
I'l admit part of it is rough as I was filling in gaps as I typed it, but this is basically how I envisaged AOTC ending if they went with the Sith Jar Jar plot - where Jar Jar is a cruel, sadistic and manipulative Sith, who passes those very mind games onto his apprentice - Darth Sidious - with great success.Quote:
Geonosis.
Anakin and Obi-Wan charge into the hangar bay of the caverns, expecting to find Count Dooku and confront him.
To their shock, dressed in black sith robes and turning around to face them is none other than Jar Jar Bink.
As the two Jedi stand dumbfounded at the unbelievable sight, Jar Jar addresses them.
JAR JAR: [somber tone] Games up now huh?
Before the two can respond and with the slightest move of his wrist, he force grabs Obi-Wan and slams him hard by the head twice against the ceiling, then drops him on the floor, before bringing that section of the ceiling crashing down on him.
Anakin, confused and compromised, tries to plead with Jar Jar.
Anakin: I sense the Dark side in you, but this isn't like you. It's not too late to turn back.
Jar Jar adopts a seemingly sorry expression.
JAR JAR: Oh no, meesa so sorry Ani, you so right....
Jar Jar's expression then turns malicious.
JAR JAR: You pathetic.
Jar Jar's eyes gesture to the bludgeoned and unconscious Obi Wan on the floor.
JAR JAR: Can't save Master....
Jar Jar adopts a gleefully sadistic grin.
JAR JAR: Can't save Ma-mi!
Anakin is shaken, trying to regain his composure, the anger rising within him, starting to drown his gaze and his expression, struggling to maintain control. Before he can respond, Jar Jar's expression becomes even more sadistic, making it all too clear he was responsible for Shmi's.
JAR JAR: How you like meesa gift?
Anakin: No.....
JAR JAR: Meesa feel yousa anger. Good. Strike meesa down, make meesa pay.
Anakin: I wont fight you.
Jar Jar sneers implyingly, with a gaze of mock concern
JAR JAR: Then Padme go all bombad.
Anakin explodes in a sea of rage, confusion and betrayal, charging in with his lightsaber ignited, ready to strike down his former childhood friend. As he lunges down with his lightsaber, Jar Jar trips backwards, sidestepping the blow, as he brings his own crimson lightsaber up, striking back with a force which knocks the young apprentice off balance. Anakin recovers, delivering what should be successful blow after blow, only to have Jar Jar make seemingly clumsy steps each time a blow is about to be landed - the Sith Master seemingly dodging each blow miraculously and striking back in a way which sends the apprentice off balance. After a few blows, a sadistic sneer forms on the Sith's face, not merely blocking this time, but scratching the jedi's leg with just enough of the end of the blade to scorch the skin.
Anakin howls in agony.
JAR JAR: Good meesa feel yousa hate; let it grow!
Anakin, tries lunging again, this time his mobility greatly limited, only for Jar J to this time dodge, slice off half his arm and force throw him hard against the rubble next to Obi-Wan.
Jar Jar's expression changes to one of seriousness.
JAR JAR: Meesa sense yousa, old man.
Suddenly Yoda walks into the room on his cane.
YODA: Drops his mask, the fool does - I see. Ends now, your reign of terror does- Jar Jar Binks, or should I say, Darth Plageus
JAR JAR: Meesa mask sure fool yousa - old bombad.
Jar Jar flickes his wrist, only for Yoda to hurl the force to the side, cratering the side of the wall. Irritated, Jar Jar then sends a large wave of lightning at Yoda immediately catches it with his hand, the ball 3 times the size of his hand once he has collected it all, then fires the ball back at Jar Jar, who sends it exploding up into the ceiling.
YODA: Strong with you, the Dark Side is, fight well you do.
JAR JAR: Meesa see da force not settle this.
Yoda sudddenly charges in with his lightsaber drawn, sommersaulting in with blow after blow, as Jar Jar stumbles out of the way, but before he can throw Yoda off balance with a blow, the Jedi Master leaps in the air and strikes from a new angle. The two are evenly matched; one cannot best the other. Suddenly as the two stand deadlocked with sabers clashing, Jar Jar brings a pillar crashing down upon Anakin. Jar Jar sneers.
JAR JAR: Yousa so wise. Choose.
Yoda focuses on lifting the pillar while Jar Jar escapes in the nearby shuttle.
She's trying:Quote:
Originally Posted by shockNwave
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/29/disn...s-prequel.html
This movie is at least twice better than last Jedi. I felt it was better than Rogue one for me. And yes the twist in the end is a way to make people excited what’s next. I didn’t feel this in last Jedi one bit. Is a shame that their pr screwed up and to be still in the wondering why solo done so bad when people can just google and say why says a lot about denial.
I feel sad for Star Wars. Transformers isn’t a worry, bay can stuff it up it doesn’t bug me a single bit as the cartoon will always remain intact and true.
I can’t say the same for Star Wars as what is shown affects past and present.
Same guyQuote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
https://youtu.be/oOmyuweolqY?t=9m10s
Also acted in flashbacks for Harrison Ford's character in a film but I don't remember what it is called and "Chewie get the pipes" is the example I'd go with anyway.
Yeah voice acting is still different, but closer than an impression.
As it is I though Alden was alright, though any chance of an objective opinion for this film went out the window the second that hologram turned on. Can't trust my own thoughts now because they are absolutely biased and I really wasn't expecting this character to cause that reaction after they've already done what I wanted to see done with them elsewhere.
Can we get a spoiler tag added to the title? Would really like to discuss the hologram scene without any complaints of spoilers.
Note: It can also be spoiler for Episode nine.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Wiggum
If I understand your second point correctly, it looks like bringing more of a dark feel to the proceedings is a breath of fresh air and if so, then Rogue One is a good example as it ends with many good guys dying and the rebel fleet being smashed (which is more acceptable thanks to the impact made by Game of Thrones capacity to turn storytelling on it's head).Quote:
Originally Posted by bowspearer
Probably not, the hologram "ends" in Star Wars Rebels.Quote:
Originally Posted by drifand
Its an epic arc and must watch.
ah...but I am not talking about the hologram. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetfire in the sky
It's a shame this has bombed. I saw it on the weekend in a packed cinema that seemed to be having a great time, but apparently that's an anomaly. I loved it. It's obviously a different kind of film, but it's not trying to be part of the core trilogies. It's just pure Star wars-branded fun.
L3 is obviously going to be divisive but I think she was brilliant and I've been pleased to see other people in the fandom saying the same, though again obviously that praise will not be universal!
When the movie was announced and after they cast Ehrenreich, I did certainly share the entire planet Earth's concern that you can't replace Harrison Ford and this obviously wasn't going to work, but once I got into the cinema there was not a single second where I didn't buy Ehrenreich as Han. It's certainly no worse than McGregor as Kenobi.
It's not a perfect movie but for the sheer level of fun (and absence of dry, boring crap) I would call it one of my favourite SW movies and I think it will be one of my favourite movies of the year.
Still, there's clearly a powerful lesson here for Disney... even a Star Warsmoviestory can flop.
So another year another divisive Star Wars film, seems everything has to be divisive these days.
Anyway Solo didn't fly with me, while there's was nothing really terrible about it, there was nothing daring or interesting about it either, it was so mediocre I found myself falling asleep in the cinema, as well as just forgetting what happened while I was watching the movie.
While many of the flaws are shared by Rogue One, unlike Rogue One nothing in this film thrilled me, and for some reason the lighting in almost every shot was really dark so it wasn't even interesting to look at. The whole thing could have been a lesser episode of Rebels.
So far my least favourite of the Disney Star Wars films as well as those films I've seen this year.
I really hope they try something new for the next spin off.
As always, Bob Chipman nails it.
Brutal. But I loved his impression of millenial youtubers the best.Quote:
Originally Posted by SMHFConvoy
Saw the movie last night. Quite liked it! I didn’t think it was necessary to cram in explanations for every single facet of Solo’s past referred to in other films (ie the Kessel run, meeting Chewie, how he got his blaster, etc) but it’s certainly no worse than River Phoenix’s turn as young Indiana Jones in the Last Crusade film.
As I said before, I went into the film with a fairly open mind and choosing to ignore the “hobgoblins of continuity” and lo and behold! Ended up having a pretty good time.
As a film it is at least competent. Not Earth-shatteringly brilliant. I think it’s no wonder that those that were expecting the latter are so embittered.
Agreed, at first I wasn't sure, but he won me over in the end.Quote:
Originally Posted by SMHFConvoy
Time to take Star Wars of the pillar we nerds put it on.
'Solo' Will Lose $50M-Plus in First Defeat for Disney's 'Star Wars' Empire
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/he...empire-1116927
This is due to Kathleen with poor decision making etc....
So? It hasn't ruined anything or even hurt the brand. They put the movie out at the same time as Infinity War and some other movies, they'll still make Episode 9 and a bunch of other SW movies.Quote:
Originally Posted by drifand
They'll probably do well at Christmas with the Solo home release.
For every dollar they might lose with this movie, they will make 10 or more from licensing of toys and merchandise.
It was a long time investment by Disney, and as I had mentioned previously, they will (over)milk the brand as much as possible.... and movies are just one avenue.