G1 KO "reissues" - worth it?

I know it is blasphemy to even mention this issue. But I am curious.

Issue: Do you think it is worth it to get the High Quality G1 KO reissues or just not collect g1 at all?


I'll start by saying I've never gotten a KO, but I do purchase 3rd party stuff.

Recently I've been obsessing over G1 stuff I've always wanted and thinking about starting to slowly collect some unreissued g1 figs over time.

The cost to collect these are too prohibitive, and the fact that I like my figures mint. If I cant get them mint, I'd rather not have the figure.


Factors I am considering are:

-Ethical/Moral/Legal- How about the fact that Has/Tak will or can never reissue it? This is a huge factor I've been thinking about.

-Quality/Cost

-Tainting collection/ no fun to collect due to ease to obtain/cheating?


Also: How much difference is the quality from G1 vs Encore/reissue vs HQ KO?


I just want honest opinions. I'm already biased against getting them, but I'd like to hear more pros on acquiring them aswell.

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Originally Posted by gdmetro

The cost to collect these are too prohibitive, and the fact that I like my figures mint. If I cant get them mint, I'd rather not have the figure.

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I don't see the point of knockoffs - if one only wants mint toys (and as a serial G1 toy liberator I totally understand that) and can't justify the price of near-minty originals then I'd rather just not have the toy as you say above. I hate that there are toys I can't buy and feel assured is the real thing or has real accessories (Reflector, Gnaw, Metroplex etc). And I hate the idea that people are selling knockoffs or originals with knockoff parts as originals. Buying knockoffs only makes it a lucrative business for the sellers, which gives them the motivation and finances to knock off more toys, thus eliminating even more toys from the pool of G1 toys that I can feel assured are genuine. I don't want to support this black market for G1 Transformers and so I don't buy the KOs, (plus I feel they have no place in my 'collection' since I'd always know they weren't 'genuine'.) Also, we can never be 100% sure that a mould will never be reissued - Sky Lynx, Omega Supreme and various others have come completely out of left field.

If you can get the KO cheap its great. I have been getting all of them to have out and display. I have all the originals but im putting them away so they are nice and safe. As for Quality most of them are perfect. Wheeljack was not so good. So if your looking for nice display bots that you can handle without living in fear of hurting its the way to go. And most people would not even be able to tell the difference.

It really all boils down to if you are comfortable with owning a KO.

I own a couple but I would never claim them as being legit G1 toys nor would I count them as being part of my collection. They are merely display pieces.

Like you, I considered whether or not we would ever see a reissue before making a decision to buy one e.g. Shockwave. It would be ignorant for me to think that if I took a moral stand and refused to buy a KO that eventually the KO makers would stop producing them as KO's have been around ever since Transformers emerged in the 80's.

The few that I have bought are quite high quality - comparable even to recent Hasbro / TakTom reissues. I have even heard that in some cases the quality is better.

Collecting G1 can be quite expensive as you know especially if you're hunting down that 'mint' piece. KO's offer an affordable alternative and at the end of the day, it's your collection and no one else’s.

I don't collect KOs either for similar reason as Sky Shadow - You know they are not real and unlike most of the 3rd party fan stuff, they are straight rip offs often sold with the intention of deceiving the buyer that it's the real thing. I have tried very hard to avoid them while collecting G1.

However given the circumstances of G1 KOs being constantly released with new ones announced almost every couple of weeks, it's a good idea to keep up with news about them. That way you are well informed in avoiding them. When I was collecting G1, I prioritized which vintage figure to get next based on what KO was announced, that way I was assured to buy the legit figure before the KO hits the market. Like when I heard about the Sunstreaker KO being released soon, the first thing I did was go on ebay and buy a vintage that way I was assured that it was real as the KO was yet to be released.

Out of curio though, those KO G1 cars, do they have diecast parts as well like the original or not.. e.g Wheeljack...

thank goodness Ive completed the G1 figures that are KOd before they were KOd so at least I know what I have is the vintage stuff... but mostly reissues hehehe.

I'm against collecting KO G1 because of moral reasons and as a matter of principle. However if one were a collector of KO toys in general for some quirky reason then it would be different.

I believe the only decent use for KO transformers is for kit bashing.

Your all like a moral G1 God squad (Just joking I dont care less)

But yes all have the Die Cast all are the same or better. They copy the original version before Hasbro made them cheap.

Remember if Hasbro shut then KO people down they would use these moulds for their own reissues. The moulds are that good.

Put it this way Look at the Takara reissue of Rumble next to the original. Its a totaly new mould that just looks like the real one. Different head and hands and other stuff.

I used to beleive in KO's.
I learnt that just waiting and getting the real thing is best.

While out shopping one day I came across an obvious ko set of constructicons. They were cheap so brought them. Regretted it the moment I opened them. Poor plastic and construction, lacking paint and smaller then the real thing. For a short time o displayed them then took them down. This experience influenced me to stay away from ko's. I'd rather the real thing.

I later found out that my g1 rumble and ragbat were ko as well and was furious that someone sold me one while trying to pass it off as real. I was only starting out when I brought it. On the plus side it taught meto use caution.

Yeah the cheap Constructicon set is junk. Good only for....Well not much. What is the quality like on the Ratbat and Frenzy? Would rather that then the crap Takara tried to pass off. :D

I have an older KO Ratbat that I mistakenly bought on ebay a couple of years ago. The quality isn't bad, about as good as an Encore tape reissue.

Since I have gotten a legit Ratbat and it is of a better plastic quality than the KO but still close enough to fool anyone not familiar with the small differences.

Thanks Kup, Im just not Happy with the Rumble Frenzy Encore moulds. They are different sculpts than the Originals. Very close but not the same. Im sure I will Bite the Bullet and find out what the KOs are like with the tapes one day.

High end KO's - really awesome (and dangerous) such as the KO japanese headmaster set. very hard to tell without close inspection!!
"Supposedly" high end KO's - can be pretty sh*tty sometimes like the wheeljack. you will never confuse this guy with the real deal! this range is a hit and miss.
Cheap Chinese KO's (typically carded) - some are just nasty. others are solidly built and really great for custom projects when you need spare parts or if you dont want to chop up that genuine $150 etc...
Unique KO's - oversized stuff can be pretty enjoyable due to the novelty. (like my two Bruticus'... oh yeah!!!)

Get the high end G1 KO's if you already have the original and want to educate yourself on how to identify the fakes. nothing beats hands on experience.
However, dont buy KO's if you are desperately wanting/needing that figure for your collection, as you will be unsatisfied when you get it due to that nagging feeling and the potential chance of getting something that is poor quality. Only buy it if you really dont mind it and will enjoy it.

Its entirely up to you, but i would try to hunt for genuine G1 versions first as they are more rewarding to own.
If you only want minty G1 figures then you must save up for them or try harder to find the bargains. you will be much more satisfied when you put the effort in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LordCyrusOmega

While out shopping one day I came across an obvious ko set of constructicons.

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There was a yellow KO Constructicon set sold in Kmarts about 5 years ago along with the Protectobots and Aerialbots. I'm surprised that they were allowed to sell them because of the quality (or rather lack of) with parts that would snap off with minimal force.

I'd rather NOT own a toy than buy a counterfeit because to me, that would go against my standards as a collector and just... "defile" my collection by their very presence. I'm a collector of Transformers... not a collector of fakes. I'd rather live with the dignity of just not owning a certain G1 toy rather than living with the shame of owning a KO.

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Originally Posted by bruticus

High end KO's - really awesome (and dangerous) such as the KO japanese headmaster set. very hard to tell without close inspection!!

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I must confess that I was tempted by that set for a while... then I decided against it. That's the closest I've ever come to going to the Dark Side. Thank Primus I managed to resist the temptation in the end!

But yeah, I would hold more respect at seeing a small collection of authentic G1 toys over a big collection of fakes. Quality* over quantity IMO.

Just my 2c.

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*By this I don't just mean the physical quality of the toy, I also mean authenticity.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bruticus

High end KO's - really awesome (and dangerous) such as the KO japanese headmaster set. very hard to tell without close inspection...

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There is the fact that the KO headmaster warriors don't have the original date stamps which I think is a pretty obvious difference.

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Originally Posted by 5FDP

It really all boils down to if you are comfortable with owning a KO.

I own a couple but I would never claim them as being legit G1 toys nor would I count them as being part of my collection. They are merely display pieces.

Like you, I considered whether or not we would ever see a reissue before making a decision to buy one e.g. Shockwave. It would be ignorant for me to think that if I took a moral stand and refused to buy a KO that eventually the KO makers would stop producing them as KO's have been around ever since Transformers emerged in the 80's.

The few that I have bought are quite high quality - comparable even to recent Hasbro / TakTom reissues. I have even heard that in some cases the quality is better.

Collecting G1 can be quite expensive as you know especially if you're hunting down that 'mint' piece. KO's offer an affordable alternative and at the end of the day, it's your collection and no one else’s.

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Very valid point about moral stand -

And the fact that moulds such as Shockwave/ wheeljack/sunstreaker or jetfire - Highly unlikely to be ever released under the transformers brand again.

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Originally Posted by kup

I have an older KO Ratbat that I mistakenly bought on ebay a couple of years ago. The quality isn't bad, about as good as an Encore tape reissue.

Since I have gotten a legit Ratbat and it is of a better plastic quality than the KO but still close enough to fool anyone not familiar with the small differences.

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Ahh.. this makes me slightly disappointed since I got a few of the encores:
-Omega Supreme, Metroplex, jazz, ratchet/ironhide, optimus prime, soundwave, starscream, sky lynx.

Most of them, I think are decent quality. But starscream really disappointed me alot- maybe mould deterioration? I dont have any g1s except jetfire so I cant really make a comparison. But if the quality of even official Takara reissues are this low, if this is true than... sad day when KOs are of comparable quality.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bruticus

High end KO's - really awesome (and dangerous) such as the KO japanese headmaster set. very hard to tell without close inspection!!
"Supposedly" high end KO's - can be pretty sh*tty sometimes like the wheeljack. you will never confuse this guy with the real deal! this range is a hit and miss.
Cheap Chinese KO's (typically carded) - some are just nasty. others are solidly built and really great for custom projects when you need spare parts or if you dont want to chop up that genuine $150 etc...
Unique KO's - oversized stuff can be pretty enjoyable due to the novelty. (like my two Bruticus'... oh yeah!!!)

Get the high end G1 KO's if you already have the original and want to educate yourself on how to identify the fakes. nothing beats hands on experience.
However, dont buy KO's if you are desperately wanting/needing that figure for your collection, as you will be unsatisfied when you get it due to that nagging feeling and the potential chance of getting something that is poor quality. Only buy it if you really dont mind it and will enjoy it.

Its entirely up to you, but i would try to hunt for genuine G1 versions first as they are more rewarding to own.
If you only want minty G1 figures then you must save up for them or try harder to find the bargains. you will be much more satisfied when you put the effort in.

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Yeah- one of the figs I really wanted was wheeljack- surprise surprise. I definitely think waiting on acquiring them is better since, well I don't think KOs are the way to go.

The quality of the KO is really tempting, but I've been looking at the prices and they are still quite high- and that nagging feeling I think I will get after spending decent dosh on these, instead acquiring better stuff.

I really wanted to complete some subgroups i.e. Dinobots, autobot cars-mirage + wheeljack, gestalts, shockwave and other random figs.

But I don't think I want to get KOs, and the fact legit ones are too hard to acquire means I think i'm just going to give up getting g1 now. Its just too much hassle and money that would be potentially wasted.

My solution: Hope they release most of the ones I want in masterpiece- esp dinobots :D sometime in the next few years..hopefully...:(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eruntalon

I'm against collecting KO G1 because of moral reasons and as a matter of principle. However if one were a collector of KO toys in general for some quirky reason then it would be different.

I believe the only decent use for KO transformers is for kit bashing.

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I agree with Eruntalon :cool:

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Originally Posted by VERT

Yeah the cheap Constructicon set is junk. Good only for....Well not much. What is the quality like on the Ratbat and Frenzy? Would rather that then the crap Takara tried to pass off. :D

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Ratbat is good quality but frenzy is awful. Stickers fell off straight away and hs arms are splitting along the seams.
The ko devastator was my own fault. Picked him up at paddies markets. Should have known better.
In the end if you're going to collect my as well buy the real thing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LordCyrusOmega

Ratbat is good quality but frenzy is awful. Stickers fell off straight away and hs arms are splitting along the seams.
The ko devastator was my own fault. Picked him up at paddies markets. Should have known better.
In the end if you're going to collect my as well buy the real thing.

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Oh so the Frenzy is about as good as my original Hasbro. Stickers bad in 5 min and the arms splitting. You know my First TF was Rumble and he had all that and even came with two right hands. Yay Hasbro

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Originally Posted by gdmetro

But I don't think I want to get KOs, and the fact legit ones are too hard to acquire means I think i'm just going to give up getting g1 now. Its just too much hassle and money that would be potentially wasted.

My solution: Hope they release most of the ones I want in masterpiece- esp dinobots sometime in the next few years..hopefully...

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That would pretty much be my solution if I didn't already have a G1 collection (which I'm assuming, correct me if I'm wrong, is your position).

I collected most of my G1 toys during the 1980s and 1990s. My Hasbro G1 collection is approx 96% complete, so I'm not really an "active" G1 collector - but rather an opportunist who will pick up the odd G1 toy that I need if I get the opportunity to get it for a decent price. I seldomly actively go hunting for a G1 toy... hence why I don't even have an eBay account. :)

But if I didn't already have a sizable G1 collection, I seriously would NOT bother starting to collect G1 now. As you said, it's a big hassle and expensive too. Buying current Transformers is expensive enough as it is -- I don't know how I'd be able to afford retro-collecting G1 today. If I really wanted a "G1" collection I'd just go for things like Classics, Binaltech and Masterpiece. They're more fun to play with than the vintage G1 figures anyway.

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Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime

That would pretty much be my solution if I didn't already have a G1 collection (which I'm assuming, correct me if I'm wrong, is your position).

I collected most of my G1 toys during the 1980s and 1990s. My Hasbro G1 collection is approx 96% complete, so I'm not really an "active" G1 collector - but rather an opportunist who will pick up the odd G1 toy that I need if I get the opportunity to get it for a decent price. I seldomly actively go hunting for a G1 toy... hence why I don't even have an eBay account. :)

But if I didn't already have a sizable G1 collection, I seriously would NOT bother starting to collect G1 now. As you said, it's a big hassle and expensive too. Buying current Transformers is expensive enough as it is -- I don't know how I'd be able to afford retro-collecting G1 today. If I really wanted a "G1" collection I'd just go for things like Classics, Binaltech and Masterpiece. They're more fun to play with than the vintage G1 figures anyway.

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Yeah, you are right- and that was my thought too. I started off collecting a few of the encores and reissues- to start to acquire g1 from scratch now, is impossible unless one is filthy rich. I only wanted to complete some sub groups of g1.

With this goal, even with reissues, it cannot be fulfilled without the use of KOs, hence this thread. But I've decided its not feasible.

As you suggested, classics is one line to solve this and I love it. For that reason, I ravenously started collecting Henkei/classics and have almost completed the line. Luckily I bought alot in bulk, and chanced on some of the pricier figs - i.e. smokescreen/red alert at decent prices- now they've gone up even further in price.

As for binaltech- they are really nice figs, but I don't care for them that much to collect.

As for masterpiece, well Ive gotten grimlock so far, but dont know if ill collect the entire line. They're pricey, out of scale, and even if i got all the releases now, at the rate they are released, is it really possible for them to release all the major characters any time soon?

Having said that, Ill eventually buckle next year and get em :o