KOs worth it?

[theshape]

Question: Am i bad for downloading a scan of the out of print and expensive Generations TF book? (Japanese book with photos of ALL the G1 and G2 toys)

This book is awesome and only way to get it is to pay over $100 on the 2ndary market

[DELTAprime]

Question: Am i bad for downloading a scan of the out of print and expensive Generations TF book? (Japanese book with photos of ALL the G1 and G2 toys)

This book is awesome and only way to get it is to pay over $100 on the 2ndary market

Bad Shape, Bad!

[GoktimusPrime]

Question: Am i bad for downloading a scan of the out of print and expensive Generations TF book? (Japanese book with photos of ALL the G1 and G2 toys)

TFwiki copiously uses scanned images from that book.

This book is awesome and only way to get it is to pay over $100 on the 2ndary market

Ppphhhhhoooaaaarrr!
I lost my book for a while and it really ticked me off. I couldn't even find copies of it in Japan (even at collectable stores). Thankfully I've since found my book.

[Sky Shadow]

I imagine that there is no 'serious' fan here who hasn't done something that's technically dodgy at some point. Heck, I'm pretty sure it was illegal to videotape Saturday morning episodes of the G1 cartoon, so I should have been put in juvie back in the eighties.

[Sinnertwin]

I imagine that there is no 'serious' fan here who hasn't done something that's technically dodgy at some point. Heck, I'm pretty sure it was illegal to videotape Saturday morning episodes of the G1 cartoon, so I should have been put in juvie back in the eighties.

So true. That just took me back to a time when i'd sit by the radio with a blank cassette loaded & have my finger hovering over the record button

[5FDP]

Fine. I won't download any more episodes of future Transformers series then. I guess I'll just have to avoid spoilers until they're available on DVD/BR (which can be a good 9-10 months if I preorder the US R1 set). Thaaat's gonna be heaps of fun. (-_-)

I don't mean to question your means of watching future TF series and I certainly don't mean for you to stop - heck I have over 4TB of downloaded TV shows / movies, I am just genuinely curious as to where someone who so vehemently opposes counterfeit TF draws the line or considers at which point counterfieting is an acceptable practice.

I imagine that there is no 'serious' fan here who hasn't done something that's technically dodgy at some point. Heck, I'm pretty sure it was illegal to videotape Saturday morning episodes of the G1 cartoon, so I should have been put in juvie back in the eighties.

Guilty as charged I see the point you are making and techincally you are correct however you could also argue that there is a difference between acquiring something that has not yet been released in this country i.e. bought and paid for by whichever company that decides to purchase the rights, and recording something that's available locally on free-to-air.

[GoktimusPrime]

I don't mean to question your means of watching future TF series and I certainly don't mean for you to stop - heck I have over 4TB of downloaded TV shows / movies, I am just genuinely curious as to where someone who so vehemently opposes counterfeit TF draws the line or considers at which point counterfieting is an acceptable practice.

So speaking from an ethical (and not legal) POV...

If a person is downloading or still keeping downloaded copies of content that is commercially available, then I can see how that's no better than purchasing counterfeit toys - and that's a practice that I do not do nor condone. But for me, a more ethical way of downloading content would be to only download shows that are not commercially available for purchase, and when it does become commercially available, to purchase it and delete the downloaded copies.

Counterfeits are different because they're copies of legitimate product that's already been made commercially available. For example, if you want an MP Lambor toy, you can go buy an original. But if you want a copy of Transformers Animated Season 3, it's not possible because that product doesn't exist as an official product. TakaraTOMY would have a legitimate grievance over someone making or selling KO MP Lambors, because they're illegally taking money away from their legit toys. The same argument couldn't be made for someone distributing episodes of Animated Season 3 recorded off Cartoon Network, because what are they taking away potential sales from? From DVDs/BRs that they're not producing?

Another difference is money. If someone goes and purchases a KO toy, they're paying for that product. The person who manufactures and supplies these fakes are also receiving money. With downloads, I don't pay for it, and AFAIK the person who uploaded the content isn't getting paid for it either. They're distributed for free by fans for fans. The other thing is deception. Counterfeits by their very nature attempt to deceive consumers into believing that they're the legitimate product. This doesn't happen w/ the kind of downloading that we're talking about.

So for me, "ethical" download practice differs from purchasing counterfeits because:
a) You have every intention of purchasing the legitimate product.
b) You are not paying money to the people who have supplied the illegitimate product (there is no illegitimate profit being made).

Note: This is merely an expression of opinions and not a endorsement of dubious downloading

[millhouse]

So for me, "ethical" download practice differs from purchasing counterfeits because:
a) You have every intention of purchasing the legitimate product.
b) You are not paying money to the people who have supplied the illegitimate product (there is no illegitimate profit being made).

Can I raise (what I feel is) a valid point here? Do you download from torrents?

[GoktimusPrime]

I think so. I'm not familiar with how downloading videos work, only started doing it last year when it was harder to find TF Prime eps to view on YouTube.

[5FDP]

So speaking from an ethical (and not legal) POV...

If a person is downloading or still keeping downloaded copies of content that is commercially available, then I can see how that's no better than purchasing counterfeit toys - and that's a practice that I do not do nor condone. But for me, a more ethical way of downloading content would be to only download shows that are not commercially available for purchase, and when it does become commercially available, to purchase it and delete the downloaded copies.

Counterfeits are different because they're copies of legitimate product that's already been made commercially available. For example, if you want an MP Lambor toy, you can go buy an original. But if you want a copy of Transformers Animated Season 3, it's not possible because that product doesn't exist as an official product. TakaraTOMY would have a legitimate grievance over someone making or selling KO MP Lambors, because they're illegally taking money away from their legit toys. The same argument couldn't be made for someone distributing episodes of Animated Season 3 recorded off Cartoon Network, because what are they taking away potential sales from? From DVDs/BRs that they're not producing?

Another difference is money. If someone goes and purchases a KO toy, they're paying for that product. The person who manufactures and supplies these fakes are also receiving money. With downloads, I don't pay for it, and AFAIK the person who uploaded the content isn't getting paid for it either. They're distributed for free by fans for fans. The other thing is deception. Counterfeits by their very nature attempt to deceive consumers into believing that they're the legitimate product. This doesn't happen w/ the kind of downloading that we're talking about.

So for me, "ethical" download practice differs from purchasing counterfeits because:
a) You have every intention of purchasing the legitimate product.
b) You are not paying money to the people who have supplied the illegitimate product (there is no illegitimate profit being made).

Note: This is merely an expression of opinions and not a endorsement of dubious downloading

That's a reasonably well thought out post and I agree with most of what you have written. There is one point however that's a bit ambiguous and that's "You are not paying money to the people who have supplied the illegitimate product (there is no illegitimate profit being made)". Now while you haven't directly paid for it, someone, somewhere already has. You're just getting it for free. So, by that rationale, if someone were to give you a KO for free, declared that it was in fact a counterfeit, and you had intentions to purchase the official toy when / if released, that would be OK?