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Thread: SPOILER THREAD: SW: The Force Awakens

  1. #241
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    ^I agree with what you'd highlighted.

    Just caught the movie a couple of days ago... It was entertaining but not the best.

    Finn was way too tubby IMO to be believable as a trained Storm Trooper.

    Ren could've kept his mask on for a lot longer as once that was off, seeing that emo teen just didn't cut it for me as a Sith Lord (or one to be) and kinda ruined the rest of the film.

    Captain Phasma being female kinda surprised me quite a bit... would've preferred a suit more flattering for her or if at least they took off her mask for a second so it kinda registered better in me head

    R2 suddenly waking up and sharing the other parts of the map... Too easy a gap filler in the plot.

    Rey hugging Leia at the end... They haven't even met before

    Entertaining movie and fun to watch nonetheless

  2. #242
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    This one killed me


  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinnertwin View Post
    This one killed me

    Lol

  4. #244
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    i dont know if this has been discussed but regarding the disney infinity game?

    "the final boss fight against Kylo Ren, the villain addresses Rey, saying either "Face me, cousin!" or "Face me!" and then "Curses!" as he's hit by an attack"

    http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/disney-infi...wakens-1534831

  5. #245
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    It was debunked almost the same day by the guy hat first mentioned it on his youtube channel.

    http://kotaku.com/no-disney-infinity...e-v-1749629781

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChlorHex View Post
    Captain Phasma being female kinda surprised me quite a bit... would've preferred a suit more flattering for her or if at least they took off her mask for a second so it kinda registered better in me head
    Not sure if sarcasm or not...
    Dovie'andi se tovya sagain

  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deonasis View Post
    - I hope that Rey is no relation of Luke's or any other established family.
    ^Agree 100%!
    Quote Originally Posted by Deonasis View Post
    Keeping it all in the family is what the The Bold and Beautiful is for.
    And monarchies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tetsuwan Convoy View Post
    I've already seen the story of the death star. Twice. It seems ludicrous to think anyone would think that type of weapon is good idea... surely.
    http://otca.com.au/boards/showthread.php?t=22119
    Quote Originally Posted by Tetsuwan Convoy View Post
    The names were stupid. Snoke or whatever doesn't sound intimidating, but then neither did Count Dooku.
    Neither does Ren. I keep on expecting Stimpy to show up and turn Ren back to the Light Side with his Happy Happy Joy Joy song.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChlorHex View Post
    Captain Phasma being female kinda surprised me quite a bit... would've preferred a suit more flattering for her or if at least they took off her mask for a second so it kinda registered better in me head
    It's armour. It's not supposed to be flattering. Armour worn by women IRL have never been designed to accentuate their feminine features.
    Historical examples
    Joan of Arc
    Nakano Takeko
    Queen Boudicca
    Gozen Tomoe
    Modern-day examples
    Female Australian soldiers
    Australian female submariner
    Female U.S. Marines
    Female Italian soldier
    Female U.S. Army Rangers
    Female pilots from the Japanese Air Self Defence Force
    Female South Korean soldiers
    Kurdish female fighters (they are on the front line fighting against Islamic State)
    As you can see in each of these historical and modern day examples, women are pretty much dressed the same as men in battle. Soldiers may have gender-specific dress uniform, but this is what soldiers wear when they're not on active combat duty. It's a form of military business attire, and is also worn at public and formal occasions.

    As for removing her helmet, the film makes it clear that Stormtroopers are not allowed to remove their helmets while on active duty. With the sole exception of FN-2187, have you ever seen an Imperial or First Order Stormtrooper take his/her helmet off? Prior to this, the only time we've seen someone in Stormtrooper armour without a helmet was in Episode IV when Luke and Han were pretending to be Stormies. But of course, they don't count. For all we know, Imperial and First Order Stormtroopers may have many more females and non-Caucasian looking humans (or near-human aliens) among them. We don't know since we've never seen one without a helmet before. FN-2187 is the first. Poor ol' TK-421 might've been a female Bajoran for all we know. Even the Star Wars Wikia page avoids using any gender-specific pronouns.

    She speaks with a female voice, which tells the audience that she's female. Other Stormtroopers speak with a male voice which tells the audience that their male. Do these male Stormtroopers need more masculine looking armour and be seen walking around without their helmets to remind you that they're blokes? If not, then why should Phasma?

    When Star Wars Episode II came out, some people were surprised to see Jango and Boba Fett being portrayed by Maori actors. But why not? We never see Boba without his helmet in the Original Trilogy. And some fans got upset when they saw that FN-2187 was a black Stormtrooper, but again, the entire Clone Army were of Pacific Island appearance. I think part of the idea of insisting that the Stormtroopers don't remove their helmets in the presence of anyone else is to help visually suppress any diversity.

  8. #248
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    Gok, chill out man... You're getting worked up for nothing
    I've been in the army in my youth and I've had female colleagues there who've donned whatever gear the blokes do.
    Thing is, this is a fictional universe we're taking about...
    Didn't need all the effort you went through to give so many examples from the real world. Lol.
    I get what you're saying dude... chill

  9. #249
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    Watched it for a 3rd time today. I found that I can suspend disbelief for most things in the film, but that interminably long pause while Ren and Rey are sabre-locked is still ridiculously unbearable. The visual narrative of that scene played out like this...

    Kylo Ren: "Die, scavenger scum!"
    Rey: "I'm le tired. Do you mind if I shut my eyes for a few seconds and power up?"
    Kylo Ren: "I suppose."
    Rey: "Cheers, mate. Much obliged."
    Kylo Ren: "I've got a bad feeling about this..."

    I hadn't really noticed/remembered from my previous viewings, but there's actually at least one female Stormtrooper other than Phasma. The Stormtrooper who reports to Ren about their search for Ren on Starkiller Base has a female voice (and Ren tells her that the longer that they take to find her, the stronger she gets. He seems to have failed to heed his own advice during the sabre lock ) A subtle way to letting the audience realise the diversity within the Stormtrooper ranks of the First Order (and the Empire may have been equally diverse; most Stormtroopers never speak in the Original Trilogy).

    ===============================================

    P.S.: Rey's Force Potential

    I must confess that when I first watched this movie, it struck me as odd that Rey would be able to display Force abilities such as using the Jedi Mind Trick, resisting and countering Kylo Ren's Force interrogation, and of course, her competency with a lightsabre. However, upon closer examination, the film does make repeatedly elude to Rey having exceptional skills and abilities beyond that of a normal being. It also demonstrates that she is a super-fast learner and is highly adaptable, much like Skids.
    We see this in several demonstrated abilities, such as:
    • Rapid adaptation to languages; although this isn't an exclusively Jedi trait, as non-Force users such as Han Solo display the same ability; although even Han still needed Threepio to interpret at times (e.g. Ewoks).

    • Rapid learning of new systems. Rey was able to successfully pilot the Millennium Falcon single-handed (despite it requiring a co-pilot), including executing aerial combat manoeuvres and taking the Falcon into space-flight. She was also able to initiate emergency repairs, including bypassing the compressor on the hyperdrive faster than Han Solo could. Rey's ability as a pilot clearly impressed both Solo and Chewbacca, as Solo offered to allow her to join their crew. And Chewbacca later accepted her as the Falcon's new pilot. Rey was also able to rapidly figure out how to operate controls on the Eravana; initially accidentally unleashing the Rathtars, but later also remotely closing a blast door to save Finn (where the timing had to be exact). Rey was also able to quickly figure out how to open a panel on Starkiller Base where she temporarily hid herself to evade detection.

    Thus given these precedents, I think that it is within reason that she would also be able to rapidly learn how to use new Force abilities.

    She observes, she learns, she adapts.
    Kylo Ren tells Snoke that Rey is, 'untrained but stronger than she knows,' and as mentioned before, Ren also tells one of his Stormtroopers that the more time that passes, the more powerful Rey becomes; hence his urgency for quickly capturing her (and also the big tantrum in the interrogation room when he discovered that she'd escaped).

    As I said before, the film also shows that Rey demonstrates exceptional abilities, which one could attribute to her Force potential. These include:
    • Extreme scavenging. We don't see anyone else taking great risks in scavenging like Rey does. The first moment that we see of her, she's able to rappel like a professional from the inside of a fallen Star Destroyer. Now it's possible that Unkar Plutt or Teedo or someone else may have taught her these skills, but even then, it appears to be a rare ability. Because otherwise you'd think that something as huge as an Imperial Star Destroyer would be crawling with scavengers. The fact that it's not seems to indicate that retrieving parts from something like that is no easy feat. Other scavengers are portrayed as being far more passively opportunistic than Rey; e.g. Teedo tries to capture Beebee-Eight after happening upon him, when Finn shoots down one of the TIE fighters, we see a group of scavengers quickly run up and begin picking out parts. They pretty much behave just like scavengers in nature -- they scavenger! But Rey isn't really a scavenger, but rather a hunter of salvage. And the fact that we never see anyone else on Jakku hunting for salvage suggests that this is not a common practice.

    • Competent melee fighting ability. When Finn first sees Rey, she's being assaulted by two attackers. You don't need to have any martial arts knowledge to know that fighting multiple opponents is bloody, bloody hard, even for a trained fighter. It's unlikely that anyone trained Rey in melee combat (as it's not really a directly useful skill for scavenging), so I'd say that it's an ability that Rey has developed on her own. Again, the whole super-fast learning thing. Now couple this super-learning ability with her seasoned melee combat skills, and it's not that far a leap to see that she would be relatively competent with a lightsabre.


    "He can see things before they happen. It's a Jedi trait."
    - Qui-Gon Jinn

    Comparison with other pre-Jedi
    Previous Star Wars canon has shown us that it is possible for a being with Force potential to independently develop uncanny super-abilities without any formal knowledge of the Force. We see this in characters such as:
    • Anakin Skywalker; Even as a slave boy, Anakin also demonstrated skills like being able to fix anything that he sees (again, rapid learning; Anakin quickly observed, learnt and adapted). Watto didn't recognise the adult Anakin at first until he quickly fixed a droid that he was struggling to repair. This unique ability then suddenly made Watto recognise him. Anakin was also able to build a protocol droid and at least two pod racers. He was also able to pilot a pod racer, which the film states is a rare skill and should be impossible for humans to perform (let alone a human child). And finally, Anakin was able pilot a Naboo fighter and take out the Separatist Control Ship. Even Obi-Wan Kenobi later tells Luke, "When I first met him, your father was already a great pilot." Anakin also demonstrates the ability to quickly improvise and adapt to new situations, sometimes at Obi-Wan's frustration ("I hate it when he does that.")

    • Luke Skywalker; living a relatively easier (and mundane) life as a farm boy, Luke's life didn't provide as much stimuli to awaken his Force potential (which was most likely deliberate to avoid the chances of Vader finding him). But even so, Luke still managed to develop extraordinary skills as a pilot despite a lack of formal training (which he desperately longed for, but Uncle Owen kept on holding him back). Luke also demonstrates the ability for rapid super-learning. He becomes reasonably competent with wielding a lightsabre after only one quick lesson aboard the Millennium Falcon. He also quickly learns how to use the Force to help him hit the Death Star exhaust port (where a previous pilot had failed). Luke even surprised his fellow Rebels when he deactivated his targeting computer. In the time between A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back, Luke also manages to acquire new Force abilities, such as being able to pull his lightsabre out of the snow and into his hand. Luke gained even more skills after his training with Yoda, which couldn't have been easy considering that it was in a swamp, devoid of the resources of training at a Jedi Temple.


    Necessity is the mother of invention.
    Anakin already had greater super-abilities than Luke because he was raised in a far harsher environment that stimulated the hyper-development of this Force potential. Rey was also raised in an incredibly harsh environment; in many ways even harsher than Anakin's life as a slave. Watto was a relatively benign master who never abused his slaves and kept them reasonably well housed, fed, clothed etc. Anakin even had enough time to pursue interests such as building a droid and pod racers (the latter of which Watto gladly exploited). Rey literally struggled every day just to stay alive. No salvage = no food. And very importantly, no loving parental figures. Anakin was raised by his loving mother and later Obi-Wan became like a surrogate father to him. Luke was raised by his caring Aunt and Uncle. Rey was abandoned as a child and effectively had to fend for herself. Rey would likely not have survived to adulthood if not for her exceptional talent and skills.
    Last edited by GoktimusPrime; 12th January 2016 at 10:47 PM.

  10. #250
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    Rey's force abilities are just an easy out for the writers and Disney.
    If she can accomplish what she did without any formal training, imagine what she could in her fathers care -She'd make Snoke, Ariel & Palpatine's ghost all look like 3 year olds in the ring with Ali in his prime.

    It's bad enough we had to sit through the Death Star battle for the 3rd time, I'm just glad they skipped Rey standing on her head levitating rocks in a swamp, while Maz gave her tutorage

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