The Football (all sorts) Thread

[jacksplatt11]

Ahh just got back from NZ where we watched the AFL grand final, Cat's didn't win the GF, Saints lost it by not taking advantage of their chances, so many missed goals and opportunities. I was going for the cats anyway so didn't bother me, Storm getting through to the GF was pretty epic though and we've done it in good form, so I can't wait for this Sunday. Fingers crossed we'll make it 2 from 4 and not 1 from 3

[i_amtrunks]

I can't think of any top players in the last few years who have been able to serve as true "utility" players. Mannering at the Warriors is very versatile, but he's not quite at the same level that Lockyer is (and Croker and Florimo were).

Luke Lewis is probably the only everywhere player, he might not be in the top 3 players at any position (as a specialist) but put him where you need a player and he won't do you wrong.

Gidley is probably the best ball player in terms of versatility, he can play backs (wing, fullback) and in the halves, and do well enough. (Considering he has this role at Origin level).

Fatbot is right on the money that players are more or less specialised, and this starts at the under 12 level. Only similar roles can be switched (wing, fullback.) Most #7 cannot play at #6, nor can many wingers even play centres these days!

Hayne is like most fullback/wing/centres, great because is young, fast and strong when allowed to run, but in a few years time when he slows down, he'll have to bulk up and move into the forwards, as he doesnt have the ball skills to run the game as a half/ five eighth.

[dirge]

Yeah I forgot Gidley...

Hayne will probably end up in the second row, but the outside back moving into the pack isn't a new trend. Those that tend to stay in the backs are usually those who don't rely on speed in the first place, like Sailor & Mick Hancock. Wendell had speed, but it was never his greatest asset.

BTW Sam, I'm curious. What made you follow the Storm? A 20 something yeah old Sydneysider into league would normally have had a team already by 1998. Did you suddenly start following league (a late bloomer) or did you switch from Norths?

[Bartrim]

Your 100% right, Hayne can only play the two positions, but then they aren't many footballers today who can play more then that. .

DANIEL FITZHENRY!!!!!!

When was the last time you saw a player who has worn 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 and 9

What a champion he was.

[Fungal Infection]

Yeah I forgot Gidley...

Hayne will probably end up in the second row, but the outside back moving into the pack isn't a new trend. Those that tend to stay in the backs are usually those who don't rely on speed in the first place, like Sailor & Mick Hancock. Wendell had speed, but it was never his greatest asset.

BTW Sam, I'm curious. What made you follow the Storm? A 20 something yeah old Sydneysider into league would normally have had a team already by 1998. Did you suddenly start following league (a late bloomer) or did you switch from Norths?

I actually used to support the Doggies but then Super League happened and I became disillusioned with the Doggies for turning their backs on the regular comp. Then when the NRL comp started, and the Dragons were playing the Storm in the 99 finals, everyone around me was going for the Dragons (being Sydney and all) so I decided to go for the underdogs. Been a supporter since.

[dirge]

Fair enough. You do realise the Storm were Superleague's baby, right? (just askin)

[i_amtrunks]

Fair enough. You do realise the Storm were Superleague's baby, right? (just askin)

But at least they never defected from the NSWRL/ARL...

Does anyone else find it sad that Sydney media is waxing lyrical over a team they all were bagging as a spoon contender 2 months ago?

At least it isnt Manly this time!

[Fungal Infection]

Fair enough. You do realise the Storm were Superleague's baby, right? (just askin)

Yup, but as trunks stated, they didn't defect like the dogs did and turn their backs on their fans.

[dirge]

How did the Dogs turn their back on their fans? I know there was the Oasis development thing which would have seen them move from Belmore to Liverpool, but I wouldn't call that turning their back? I'm not disagreeing with you, just not sure what you're referring to.

Of course the whole "loyal" thing is relative - I recall how weird the perspectives got back in 1996/1997.

For instance... when Penrith went to Superleague, Brad Fittler was seen as "loyal" by signing with the ARL (and then being able to sign a big fat contract with Easts). Effectively he dumped Penrith and went to the cashed up club (Easts were spending an awful lot on players in the mid 90s). It's a nice way to walk away mid contract and sign a bigger one. I'm not saying that Fittler went to Easts with this motivation (he might have, he might not have), but yeah, despite walking away from his club he was perceived as "loyal".

Ian Roberts was seen as "defecting" when he left Manly and went to North Queensland, because he went to Superleague. Of course, he was defecting from his club. I doubt that North Queensland would have offered a whole lot more than Manly, but he's really in the same boat as Fittler - both walked away from their clubs.

To me it seemed (and still seems) warped that players were expected to be loyal to a competition rather than the team - after all, it's the _team_ that the player signs for, it's the _team_ that the player sweats for (against other teams).

The clubs were very much walking away from the competition, of course - and in many ways that is disloyal. They weren't contractually obliged to stay with that competition (which is what the Supreme Court ruled when it gave Superleague the green light, anyway), but were certainly disloyal. It could be argued that they had justified reasons for abandoning the ARL (Brisbane certainly felt shortchanged, whether or not their reasons were sound is another matter) although some jumped simply because Superleague had signed all their players (Perth, Cronulla).

[Fungal Infection]

When I can't follow my team because I have to pay extra to do so (with super league being a Pay TV exclusive), then as far as I concerned, they've turned their back on me.

How did the Dogs turn their back on their fans? I know there was the Oasis development thing which would have seen them move from Belmore to Liverpool, but I wouldn't call that turning their back? I'm not disagreeing with you, just not sure what you're referring to.

Of course the whole "loyal" thing is relative - I recall how weird the perspectives got back in 1996/1997.

For instance... when Penrith went to Superleague, Brad Fittler was seen as "loyal" by signing with the ARL (and then being able to sign a big fat contract with Easts). Effectively he dumped Penrith and went to the cashed up club (Easts were spending an awful lot on players in the mid 90s). It's a nice way to walk away mid contract and sign a bigger one. I'm not saying that Fittler went to Easts with this motivation (he might have, he might not have), but yeah, despite walking away from his club he was perceived as "loyal".

Ian Roberts was seen as "defecting" when he left Manly and went to North Queensland, because he went to Superleague. Of course, he was defecting from his club. I doubt that North Queensland would have offered a whole lot more than Manly, but he's really in the same boat as Fittler - both walked away from their clubs.

To me it seemed (and still seems) warped that players were expected to be loyal to a competition rather than the team - after all, it's the _team_ that the player signs for, it's the _team_ that the player sweats for (against other teams).

The clubs were very much walking away from the competition, of course - and in many ways that is disloyal. They weren't contractually obliged to stay with that competition (which is what the Supreme Court ruled when it gave Superleague the green light, anyway), but were certainly disloyal. It could be argued that they had justified reasons for abandoning the ARL (Brisbane certainly felt shortchanged, whether or not their reasons were sound is another matter) although some jumped simply because Superleague had signed all their players (Perth, Cronulla).