What is the greatness of Transformers UK?

[STL]

Imagine it's 1986, you're Australian and you're nine years old.

I was like two then at most.

This is just before the movie (and thus Season Three of the cartoon) has come out. You rock up at a newsagent and instead of the usual Transformers comics there's this new one with painted art that comes with free posters, stickers and sticker books. And - instead of the simplistic stories in the cartoon or the other comic's stories about subjects like a white guy with an afro who claims to control the Transformers - you're reading something completely new. For the first time in any medium we're reading stories about Ultra Magnus and Galvatron. The Autobots are led by Jetfire and Megatron against bad guys who include Scourge and Jazz. On Cybertron there are characters like Roadbuster, Octane and Twin Twist. And all these characters are wrapped in a complex epic story about time travel, Cybertron and Earth that's unlike anything that has *ever* happened in any genre of Transformers before. And in the UK comics it turns out that this sort of thing happens every week.

To this day, 'Target 2006' still ranks amongst the best Transformers stories ever told. (They even just released some toys that were a homage to it.) And then, for years after that first Australian storyline, we went back to the newsagents week after week and picked up yet another well-written chapter in the tapestry of a massive ongoing storyline. Try to find another single Transformers medium that lasted for three hundred or so stories. (I'm pretty sure there isn't one.)

The Wreckers; Transformers changing sides; time travel - that stuff all began here before other continuities. You're looking at this with a hindsight of an extra couple of decades of Transformers history, much of which is just ripping off the stuff Furman did for the franchise anyway. If you don't get it, maybe you had to be there. But it shouldn't be that way. Transformers UK is empirically awesome.

I think some of the stuff stands up some of it doesn't. The art definitely does not but having read issue #2 of Time Wars, it was rock solid. Art aside, it was very well written and the dialogue was very good. Perhaps as Paulbot poiinted out those were simply the filler issues that weren't pertinent to the story line. Space Pirates was very cool too. Target 2006 I couldn't get into as the art just ruined it for me. Not very robotic.

I think that with any thing thats written, its whether it can withstand the test of time. Some things stand up in their context and some don't. I think the better TF stories will withstand the test of time while the others will be frowned upon. it's the same for most comics really. Unlike fiction, comics has never withstood the test of time as well. A lot has to do w/ technological advances I'd imagine but yeah, some of the UK stuff has been excellent but some of it is cringeworthy.

They actually sat and listened intently and some admitted that they were quite fascinated by the story even though they had no personal interest in Transformers.

Really? Even as a Transformer collector, I'd totally shrug and roll my eyes if this was considered riveting conversation. Unless of course it was a soliloquy.

[Sky Shadow]

I think some of the stuff stands up some of it doesn't. The art definitely does not but having read issue #2 of Time Wars, it was rock solid. Art aside, it was very well written and the dialogue was very good. Perhaps as Paulbot poiinted out those were simply the filler issues that weren't pertinent to the story line. Space Pirates was very cool too. Target 2006 I couldn't get into as the art just ruined it for me. Not very robotic.

I don't understand the art concerns - visually, Target: 2006 is still great. It's painted and drawn by artists who make Dan Khanna look like a fingerpainter. Obviously, putting out a weekly meant they had to rotate artists, but over a quarter of the issues were even drawn by Geoff Senior - Transformers have never been any more robotic! Personally, I think Space Pirates was leagues weaker as a storyline (although it was good to see a female Transformer get some comics development for the first time) and I know it had Wheelie rhyming and some Dan Reed art - that man's art is to robots what antimatter is to matter.

Unlike fiction, comics has never withstood the test of time as well.

Um... STL... either I have some serious comprehension issues or you might need to reread this sentence, since I'm not sure that what you've written is what you wanted to say. Comics are still fiction, right? (If not, I'm off to find me a radioactive spider...)

[STL]

[QUOTE=Sky Shadow;70410]I don't understand the art concerns - visually, Target: 2006 is still great. It's painted and drawn by artists who make Dan Khanna look like a fingerpainter. Obviously, putting out a weekly meant they had to rotate artists, but over a quarter of the issues were even drawn by Geoff Senior - Transformers have never been any more robotic! Personally, I think Space Pirates was leagues weaker as a storyline (although it was good to see a female Transformer get some comics development for the first time) and I know it had Wheelie rhyming and some Dan Reed art - that man's art is to robots what antimatter is to matter.

I guess that comes down to a preference thing then. I've been known on these boards and abroad not to like Senior very much. For me, they tried way too hard to make them human and they don't inspire my imagination very much. I'm more of a modern guy I guess despite having crazily pursued many 80s runs of various comics.

Um... STL... either I have some serious comprehension issues or you might need to reread this sentence, since I'm not sure that what you've written is what you wanted to say. Comics are still fiction, right? (If not, I'm off to find me a radioactive spider...)

You're chronologically challenged. Me? I'm logically challenged and probably a lot of other things too.

What I meant was that comics unlike other forms of fiction haven't withstood the test of time as well.

[GoktimusPrime]

So between the G1 cartoon, G1 US comics and G1 UK comics, which do you think have withstood the test of time the best? I dunno about you, but when I go back and watch the G1 cartoons, they feel really campy and often goofy to me. There are a few good episodes here and there (I like most of the episodes written by David Wise), but overall the series feels quite camp to me. The US comics not so bad - IMO Budiansky was the best writer in G1 in terms of making the Transformers feel other-worldly... I agree that Furman does make them too human at times. But there are a lot of other moments in Budiansky's writing that makes me cringe (like Optimus Prime & the floppy disk!). Overall I prefer Furman over Budiansky though. So between those three, I would personally rate the UK comics as the best overall.

[heroic_decepticon]

STL,

I'd think that the greatness of Transformers UK was because it was the best TF medium at that time, and for many of us- we grew up with that.

Reading through the thread, I realise that it's the younger members who question its 'greatness'. Bash me if I'm unfair in saying this, but you weren't there . Gok, Kup, Paulbot and Sky Shadow were probably there, and I was too.

I mean, we've got to feel what we gotta feel. Saying that TF UK is not better than the TF comics of today is like me telling my mum that Cliff Richard is outdated but Axel Rose kicks a**. Similarly, I might today be told that Fergie is so much more delectable than Axel Rose. Or its like me telling a 60s comic fan that Jack Kirby is a lousy artist but Jim Lee and Todd McFarlane rocks.

In the end, its what we grew up with, its what's close to heart. And its all subjective.

We can say "...imagine it's 1986, you're Australian and you're nine years old. This is just before the movie (and thus Season Three of the cartoon) has come out. You rock up at a newsagent and instead of the usual Transformers comics there's this new one with painted art that comes with free posters, stickers and sticker books. And - instead of the simplistic stories in the cartoon or the other comic's stories about subjects like a white guy with an afro who claims to control the Transformers - you're reading something completely new." (quoted from Sky Shadow, and I completly agree with you mate. It was the same for me too so I'd say this experience happened in many parts of the world at the time).

You might try to imagine, you might even understand it, but you will never know- because you weren't there.

I think that if you've had your shot at G1 UK and found it wanting, maybe its time to leave and spend your time on other TF mediums which you find more appealing. No point reading something and getting disappointed or worse still, reading something with the preconceived notion that you will be disappointed.

I'd recommend giving "Prey" and "Second Generation" a shot too.

[kup]

I noticed that a lot of people don't take the context of the time something was released into account when evaluating it.

Its like saying that Charlie Chaplin films don't compare with modern comedies because they lack color and are mute.

[Lord_Zed]

So between the G1 cartoon, G1 US comics and G1 UK comics, which do you think have withstood the test of time the best? I dunno about you, but when I go back and watch the G1 cartoons, they feel really campy and often goofy to me. There are a few good episodes here and there (I like most of the episodes written by David Wise), but overall the series feels quite camp to me. The US comics not so bad - IMO Budiansky was the best writer in G1 in terms of making the Transformers feel other-worldly... I agree that Furman does make them too human at times. But there are a lot of other moments in Budiansky's writing that makes me cringe (like Optimus Prime & the floppy disk!). Overall I prefer Furman over Budiansky though. So between those three, I would personally rate the UK comics as the best overall.

Yup, that's pretty much where the greatness of the Uk Comics lies, compared to the Cartoon, and the US comic overall the UK comic was the best, and the one that still stands best today. It has many dodgy plotlines and some so-so art at times. But the UK comics gave the young Transformer fans of the time something the cartoon and the US comic couldn't a weekly fix of exciting Transformers stories. As a kid the UK comic was always an exciting read for me, you could never tell which TF might turn up or who would suddenly be offed they had a real sense of drama at the time, compared say to the Cartoon where unless it was a 2 parter the story would always end with the good guys winning and the Autobots laughing at somelame joke. The US comic, while having some thrills and spills failed to make them particularly dramatic, at least in the early issues.

The other thing I like about the UK comics is they featured such a broad range of characters, and gave some interesting personalities. While there are definate issues I have with some of Furmans stories, he seems to be one of the only TF writer who doesn't focus exclusively on TF chracters from the first 3 years.

[STL]

So between the G1 cartoon, G1 US comics and G1 UK comics, which do you think have withstood the test of time the best? I dunno about you, but when I go back and watch the G1 cartoons, they feel really campy and often goofy to me. There are a few good episodes here and there (I like most of the episodes written by David Wise), but overall the series feels quite camp to me. The US comics not so bad - IMO Budiansky was the best writer in G1 in terms of making the Transformers feel other-worldly... I agree that Furman does make them too human at times. But there are a lot of other moments in Budiansky's writing that makes me cringe (like Optimus Prime & the floppy disk!). Overall I prefer Furman over Budiansky though. So between those three, I would personally rate the UK comics as the best overall.

I have a strange amalgamation of the US cartoon and comics in my mind with bits added from DWs stuff, WW especially. Personally, continuity bothers me very little and its more about the broader TF universe.

I noticed that a lot of people don't take the context of the time something was released into account when evaluating it.

Yet those who sit in the past fail to ever move forward. Something that is good should not just be good for those times, it should withstand the test of time. I often appreciate the issue of timing but it doesn't go a long way to compensating a poor story.

Heroic, I don't mind delving into it. Its a part of the TF mythos and I do want to see where it sits in that. I don't necessarily have to like it but I do enjoy seeing where we've come from as well as trying to see for myself what others like in it. I just got through #3 of Time Wars and I did enjoy that. I enjoyed #2 too. #1 is still off but now I see why those reprinted parts were included.

I can see the whole "if you were there" angle. I know it all too well especially since I read a lot of comics. I was with Marvel's Thunderbolts from issue#1 and then it underwent radical changes with issue #76. In that time, I grew to love the characters, the changes that they went through and it was a part of me growing up. I personally still hold onto the series quite fondly b/c I grew up with it. It's since changed and is a much more mainstream Marvel book now with many changes I do not agree with, many characters I don't care about. I still follow it b/c it has one or two original cast members and the stories aren't too bad but that doesn't change the fact I don't like the new approach. Newer/modern readers like this new approach though and don't care much for the old older which makes me a bit sad. So that's where you guys are coming from and I can appreciate that.

[roller]

So can anyone show me where the greatness is?

well... a lecturer asked this question to his class at UNSW in 2009

It was agreed that, the reason was this:


"It gave the british something to read about during 'tea time' while munching down on some scones with jam rollypolly for 'ellevensees' and at the same time remembering their brutal empire...that they lost!

[kup]

I think that its safe to say that much of what was introduced and transpired in Marvel Transformers (particularly UK) has stood the test of time or we wouldn't be talking about it now nor would we see so much of its influence in modern mythos.