TF Animated General Discussion

[1orion2many]

Maybe no impact to you, but this has the makings of g1 for this generation, and I think you seriously have forgotten that.

Animation atrocious? Give me a break. Your precious beast wars had worse cgi than the last starfighter, and looked like candy land.

And your "point" seems hypocritical when you're the one living in the past.

I actually liked BW and didn't think the CGI was bad, you must remember it is now about 12 years old, what other full CGI cartoon series was around at the same time which made it look lame also the last Star Fighter would of had a larger budget to make thier CGI if you are comparing both inflation and the amount of time that it was actually showing and yes I know the LSF is a lot older than BW's. I personally liked the CGI in BW better than Cybertron. You believe this has the makings of G1 for this generation, I'm not going to dispute you because we will not know for sure for another 20 years. My one real question about the TF animated cartoon is why couldn't they make it in the same quality as the Japanese Anime instead of the cheap style they have chosen, I accept that you like this style of cartoon or at least that is what it sounds like where as I completely detest this cartoon style, the storyline wasn't what I would have liked to see either as I do not believe you need such lame human characters unless of course they are trying to make the TF characters look stronger than what they actually are and yes I know they seem to have a lot of lame human characters in the previous series as well but they are getting worse with each series released. OMG I'm turning into a grumpy old man

[kup]

Like I said earlier MV75, The point is to move forwards not backwards. As mentioned by a couple of people already, Beast Wars was state of the art when it was released and even won an Emmy Award for it. Beast Wars still has arguably better Animation than this when it comes to quality and considering the limitations of the past as you so bluntly put it; they still did an awesome job of it. This new cartoon smacks of cheapness despite the style and looks like everything else on cartoon network, nothing really makes it stand out and feels of a much lesser quality than Beast Wars despite the differen styles of animation. Beast Wars may have aged somewhat in the last decade, but f**k! it looked freaking awesome back in its day. Animated does not when I can look at a 20 year old cartoon (such as Masterforce) and see that it has a distinctly higher quality of Animation and character design than this new cartoon. Animated simply has no excuse.

Now, in that context lets look at G1. What did we have at the time G1 was released? We had Gobots, Scooby Doo, Smurfs, Masters of the Universe, etc.

Heck Yeah! G1 had fantastic and innovative animation compared to most of the cartoons of its time and I remember being blown away as a kid by the more realistic style and animation despite the numerous errors.

Let's see what's so inovative about this new cartoon: Nothing. It looks just like everything else that's on cartoon network.

Your argument is seriously flawed MV75. I respect that you like Animated and that in your view its the "G1 of this generation" but its not enough for you to say you like it, you have to back that up with some critical argument if you are willing to put forth such a statement.
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1958 DODGE

[GoktimusPrime]

The Last Starfighter wasn't completely CGI rendered - it also include actual photography of things actors, location backgrounds, painted matte backgrounds, miniature models etc. Beast Wars on the other hand was entirely CGI animated. And yeah, TLS had a movie budget whereas Beast Wars had a cartoon series budget - a budget which was cut for seasons 2 and 3 and yet the CG got better in spite of having less money (although admittedly seasons 2 and 3 had less episodes).

While I don't think the animation in Animated is necessarily bad, I would agree that it's not terribly innovative either. And there are elements of it which are just too cartoony for comfort and seem to dumb the show down - like how the Autobots can emote in vehicle mode... that works really well in a movie like Disney/Pixar's Cars, but doesn't suit Transformers IMO.

A Transformer should not be emoting in vehicle mode like this

PS: Beast Wars did indeed win an Emmy Award for "best special effects in an animated television series."

[dirge]

And how far will the live action movie go against animated? 1 movie compared to several seasons, and then two years later one more movie, etc.

It's a much stronger continuity reboot, and for me is more likely to stand the test of time as a landmark in the history of Transformers. Okay, it had a much bigger budget, but it still presents a more memorable Transformers story.

But that'll probably only be an american problem as we'll probably get the series shown here in 4-6 months time, which is the perfect timing.

...but the momentum generated by the movie still falls flat, because this series has almost nothing to do with it, aside from obviously being Transformers.

To say it's atrocous now is kidding yourself. Give it another 12 years then call it bad. :P

I never said that, you were the one calling Beast Wars a badly animated series. I have not expressed an opinion on the quality of the animation, merely the style. Don't falsely accuse others of things they haven't done when you've already done the same thing yourself.

Alternative modes expressive?

I am referring to the fact that these vehicles smile and such. Not much of a disguise. I'm generally not a fan of Transformers that don't transform into something that doesn't pass as an actual disguise. That's not to say I don't like some of them - I loved Transmetal Cheetor - but entire series is filled with Herbie The Love Bug analogues. Not something I want to see.

[GoktimusPrime]

Another thing that limits the appeal of these Transformers is that they're transforming from stylised robots into stylised vehicles which is less creative than transforming from a pre-defined alt mode like a licensed vehicle or existing animal - something realistic looking.

That's not to say that stylised unrealistic alt modes are bad, as dirge pointed out the Transmetals are considered cool by a lot of fans (although they weren't popular in Japan - hence the reversion to more realistic beast modes in Beast Wars Neo), but it is more challenging to engineer a cool stylised robot out of a pre-defined alt mode like a Dodge Viper, Peterbilt, F-22 et al.

The first 2-3 years of G1 were the most popular because that was when the line was still dominated by realistic alt modes like the Datsun Fairlady ZX, Porsche 935 Turbo, F-15 Eagle, Volkswagen Beetle, Lamborghini Countach, Walther P-38 (whose realism has been a continual legal dilemma!) et al. Some fans are only interested in this era - e.g. heroic decepticon. 1986/7 onward saw a significant increase in non-realistic "futuristic" or "Cybertronian" alt modes - e.g.: Headmasters, Targetmasters, Technobots et al.

After that era, interest in G1 dwindled - evidenced by the fact that the G1 cartoon was cancelled after only 3 eps of Season 4 in 1987.

Beast Wars of course breathed new life into Transformers starting off with reasonably realistic beast modes (a theme expanded on in Beast Wars II and Neo).

Car Robot (RiD) was immensely popular amongst collectors despite the fact that the TV show was targeted at a very young audience - and many collectors were getting CR figures long before Hasbro brought out RiD so it was already popular amongst non Japanese speaking fans who didn't necessarily have access to the show.

Armadaverse went back to not so realistic "futuristic" vehicles but then Car Robot's influence went and gave birth to Binaltech (and in turn Alternators) which was incredibly popular with collectors despite not having a TV show - and in the case of Alternators, no supportive fiction at all!

Part of the appeal of the movie Transformers is that (with the exceptions of Scorponok who isn't really a proper Transformer in the movie but a remote drone deployed by Blackout, and Megatron whose circumstances didn't see him acquiring an Earth mode) they have realistic looking vehicle modes.

Movie Bumblebee is a sexy 2008/9 Concept Camaro muscle car which helped Sam get some boo-tay. Animated Bumblebee is some non-descript hatchback who plays seatbelt wrestling with a little girl who probably soiled her seat.

[kup]

Your precious beast wars had worse cgi than the last starfighter, and looked like candy land.

I am sorry but this post did drive the discussion into personal territory as it felt more hostile than anything else discussed, positive or negative.

Also keep in mind that I may have expressed my views on animated a few times on this board but I have always backed it up with descriptions on why I thought something didn't work for me and also happened to mentioned the positive things that did.

Now lets put this behind us and continue a proper discussion on what we think of animated.
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Vapor

[Borgeman]

bloody hell, waaaay too many angry/serious/omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad people here

seriously though, i think i need to hand out some chill pills/weed to you guys....

George

[dirge]

bloody hell, waaaay too many angry/serious/omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad people here

Hey, I'm not angry. I dislike Animated, but I'm fine with that - it gives me time to focus on G1 again. Maybe even Masterforce (which has some ridiculously rare toys like Minerva)

I don't appreciate people throwing accusations around without checking their facts, but ultimately that only hurts their own case

[Borgeman]

no you're not, you're omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad

see, im not being personal cause everyone here fits into that statement of mine - HA!



George

[dirge]

no you're not, you're omg-i-collect-transformers-im-so-sad

Hey at least I don't buy them, sell everything off, buy again, sell it all off.. ad nauseum