Why not release G1 in mainstream toy market?

[kup]

yeah but we're talking about G1 reissues. I suspect that they don't need to pay royalties for reissuing existing moulds. The royalties and permission would have already been obtained at the time the toys moulds were created and patented, and after that I think that's it.

One reason why I suspect this is so is because look at Bumblebee. We know that for a long time Volkswagen has persistently refused to allow any of their vehicles to be associated with war, which is why the only post-G1 VW Transformer mould we've seen has been the Donald Duck Disney Label TF (since Donald Duck isn't portrayed as being a warrior/soldier in that toy). Yet HasTak have been able to reissue the original Bumblebee mould ... repeatedly! And they were able to reuse the mould for Glyph and Bug Bite.

I agree that G1 reissues probably don't apply as the molds were made ages ago. However I disagree that there was any licensing obtained back then in regards to toys. Back then the corporate culture of suing anybody for whispering your trademark didn't exist at the ridiculous level that exists now.

For example, Porche back then didn't care if you made a kid's toy matching their car model as long as you weren't making cars yourself or cutting into their profits. If Porche knew about it, they would probably feel complimented at the gesture and as a form of free advertisement. Nowadays there is a somewhat industry which is dedicated to tracking down any form of trademark infringement to sue for profit.

In regards to the VW beetle, people are way over sensitive these days with all the PC bullcrap and that's why VW is afraid of anything that vaguely resembles war given their role during WWII

[SkyWarp91]

In regards to the VW beetle, people are way over sensitive these days with all the PC bullcrap and that's why VW is afraid of anything that vaguely resembles war given their role during WWII

Yeah, somehow Bumblebee is an ethnical cleansing warrior.... **looks at Decepticons**

[GoktimusPrime]

but kup, HasTak have reissued Bumblebee and Jazz in recent times and I don't think either Porsche or Volkswagen took legal action against them for it. There must be some legal clause that allows HasTak to reissue Transformers based on licensed vehicles where the mould was made a long time ago -- cos otherwise why hasn't HasTak been sued for their reissues of Jazz, Bumblebee, Sideswipe, Red Alert etc.? These reissues only came out fairly recently (especially Encores).

[kup]

but kup, HasTak have reissued Bumblebee and Jazz in recent times and I don't think either Porsche or Volkswagen took legal action against them for it. There must be some legal clause that allows HasTak to reissue Transformers based on licensed vehicles where the mould was made a long time ago -- cos otherwise why hasn't HasTak been sued for their reissues of Jazz, Bumblebee, Sideswipe, Red Alert etc.? These reissues only came out fairly recently (especially Encores).

As I mentioned, that's because those molds are old. The mold itself is now owned by Hasbro not VW, Porche, etc. Legal ownership was taken by Hasbro way before the corporate world turned trademark infringement prosecution as a viable form of revenue. It would be too messy to sue someone who legally took ownership of something 25+ years ago.

[Tetsuwan Convoy]

As I mentioned, that's because those molds are old. The mold itself is now owned by Hasbro not Porche, etc. Legal ownership was taken by Hasbro way before the corporate world turned trademark infringement prosecution as a viable form of revenue. It would be too messy to sue someone who legally took ownership of something 25+ years ago.

Yeh, but this is talking about G1 re-issues and trademarks, not classics. I only referred to classics as a reference for how they get around it now. My initial thoughts were on them having to pay royalties on re-issued G1s (such as, as Gok pointed out, the Encores etc.) as they are definitley a copy of real vehicles.

I am sure they would have royalties on the movie, alterntors and alterniteis, as they have the logo and tradmark stuffs all over the packet, but this thread is talking about G1.

[SharkyMcShark]

Apparently actions brought for basing something on a vehicle without licensing it is a viable source of revenue now.

[kup]

Yeh, but this is talking about G1 re-issues and trademarks, not classics. I only referred to classics as a reference for how they get around it now. My initial thoughts were on them having to pay royalties on re-issued G1s (such as, as Gok pointed out, the Encores etc.) as they are definitley a copy of real vehicles.

I am sure they would have royalties on the movie, alterntors and alterniteis, as they have the logo and tradmark stuffs all over the packet, but this thread is talking about G1.

I am also talking about G1 reissues. A comment was made onto why Classics or any new mold they make needs to have some sort of licensing attached if it resembles a real car while reissues do not. This is why Classics and other toys 'resemble' real car models but are actually very different in order to avoid infringement (same tactic FansProject uses with their toys) while this isn't a problem with reissues.

As mentioned, I don't think this applies to G1 for the reasons in my previous post. The reason they don't release G1 toys onto the mainstream have nothing to do with trademarks or licensing. It's rather the present scope of Hasbro's business model which focuses on the mainstream/Retail market rather than the collector market.

[kup]

Apparently actions brought for basing something on a vehicle without licensing it is a viable source of revenue now.

I am pretty sure there is a bit of an industry with law firms on the look out for any form of copyright infringement which they can make a case out of. They then take the proposed case to the company being 'infringed' and they tell them how much money they can make if they win with the firm taking a cut.

http://tcattorney.typepad.com/ip/

http://www.artlaws.com/

As mentioned (and back on topic): I believe that the factor of having to pay royalties to car companies has little or nothing to do as to why Hasbro doesn't release G1 toys. Those molds were already legally owned by Hasbro/Takara 25+ years ago. It's about collector pieces not being part of Hasbro's business model when it comes to retail.

[SkyWarp91]

I read somewhere about how Porsche no longer wanted to be associated with Transformers as TF was about destructive war-fighting robots.

Good on you Porsche, now you can keep your only reputation of selling cars to men who are having a mid-life crisis!

[GoktimusPrime]

That's only partially true. Porsche/Volkswagen don't want their cars "associated with war" -- and since the majority of Transformers series are associated with an intergalactic civil war, then yeah, they can't be associated. But there's been at least one exception to this and that was Transformers Disney Label's Donald Duck. It's a Transformer and it's a VW. This was obviously permitted because Disney Label Transformers are not tied-in with any other Transformer continuities which are associated with war.