Universe Starscream

[jaydisc]

Yawn. That philosophy is ridiculous and self-centered and this has been covered 10,000 times before. Hasbro does not make business decisions based on collectors.

[GoktimusPrime]

Not all, but some decisions would factor collectors into it.

Choosing to consistently release better repaints of existing toys has to factor in collectors, cos kids honestly wouldn't care that much about it. My wife's friend's son got Premium Decepticon Brawl, not because he particularly cared for the baby-blue or anything, but because it was easier for him to find. The variation is irrelevant to him. I reckon most kids would be thinking along similar lines to these variations.

When we were kids did we really care that much about G1 variations? I remember a lot of kids back in 1984 not even caring about red vs yellow Bumblebee and Cliffjumper, even after the comics and cartoon came out (popularising the yellow version of Bumblebee and red version of Cliffjumper). In fact, as a kid I new more kids who had yellow Cliffjumpers than red ones, and probably and even number of kids who owned a red Bumblebee as well as a yellow. Quite frankly, most kids didn't really care. I did, but that was probably the only variant I cared about. And in spite of that, my first Cliffjumper was a yellow one.

When I got Optimus Prime, yes I noticed that I got a blue roller instead of a grey one... but I really didn't give a flying rat's bottom. Did you? My Long Haul was an early release with the rather useless slot on the front grille whereas other kids who got later Long Hauls didn't have the slot. Again... care factor nil. Even when I saw Targetmaster Hot Rod, Kup, Blurr, Cyclonus and Scourge in the 1987 catalogue, they were just variants to me and I really wasn't interested in getting them. Of course, those toys were never released in Australia, but I didn't notice at the time because I just wasn't interested in them.

Anyway, you get the idea - most kids aren't really into collecting variants. That's a collector thing.

If Hasbro was making this decision for kids alone, they could just reissue the toy the same as before. For example, when Hasbro reissued G1 toys as part of the "Classic" line in 1990-91, the toys were almost identical save for packaging and copyright stampage (and lack of rub signs & indents in some figures). It was a great opportunity to pick up earlier G1 figures that we'd missed - I was able to complete Menasor with reissue Wildrider and Dead End!

Making the re-release a variant - and a significant variant at that reeks of collector-appeal there. Especially when you're going to repaint Starscream in old school G1 colours. That's not trying to appeal to kids who were born long after G1... that's trying to appeal the nostalgia of the children of the 80s who grew up with G1.

And the Classics/Universe line is absolutely one where collectors are factored into the decision making. That is undeniable. I'm not saying that it's the only factor or even necessarily an overwhelming factor - I'll admit that Classics/Universe/Henkei is still primarily a kid-marketed line... but IMO collectors do play a significant part in the decision making when it comes to these lines.

If not, why bother doing G1 tributes at all?? Just release entirely new characters.

[jaydisc]

Making the re-release a variant - and a significant variant at that reeks of collector-appeal there. Especially when you're going to repaint Starscream in old school G1 colours. That's not trying to appeal to kids who were born long after G1... that's trying to appeal the nostalgia of the children of the 80s who grew up with G1.

And the Classics/Universe line is absolutely one where collectors are factored into the decision making. That is undeniable. I'm not saying that it's the only factor or even necessarily an overwhelming factor - I'll admit that Classics/Universe/Henkei is still primarily a kid-marketed line... but IMO collectors do play a significant part in the decision making when it comes to these lines.

If not, why bother doing G1 tributes at all?? Just release entirely new characters.

That's fine and true, but you seem to insinuate that there was this devious meeting a few years ago when Starscream was originally developed where the evil Aaron Archer came along and said to the designer, "Are you serious? You can't put that many paint applications on? That looks WAAAAAAAYYYYY too good. And that gray? No freakin' way! Let's use a much more dull, shallow gray... you know, like the KO manufacturers use. THEN, we'll pretend we CANCEL the Classics line and we'll let Funpub release the remaining seekers, and finally years later, we can release the premium version and sucker all these stupid collectors in again!!!!!!!! HOO HOO HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Collectors make up a small market percent of the target market. Don't even get me started about Australian collectors When Hasbro planned to release Classics Starscream, they're probably solely focused on how competitive the price tag on the Walmart shelf is. The American market is EXTREMELY more price conscious than the Australian market, and boy aren't TFs the best example of that. So much to Hasbro's surprise, they have unprecedented success with Classics. As we all know, Classics was to be cancelled, and the surprising success is what has delivered us what we know to be Universe.

Additionally, we all know that Hasbro has to make repaints. We also know that they consistently re-release their most renown characters. So, as you say, Hasbro could have easily simply re-released the same version of Starscream. But you're upset because they offered collectors a variant? You're upset because they improved it?

As long as you think they intentionally withheld this product in order to sell you a lesser product first, I can see the problem. Personally I think that's ridiculous, and I think in this specific case, since Classics was cancelled, that's been proven wrong.

And lastly, you need to refresh your understanding of what a corporation's purpose is. Hasbro doesn't exist to serve "fanboy faps". They sell product to make money.

[jaydisc]

P.S. Allspark Brawl ≠ Premium Brawl

[GoktimusPrime]

Oops, I meant the Brawl with the baby blue.

That's fine and true, but you seem to insinuate that there was this devious meeting a few years ago when Starscream was originally developed where the evil Aaron Archer came along and said to the designer, "Are you serious? You can't put that many paint applications on? That looks WAAAAAAAYYYYY too good. And that gray? No freakin' way! Let's use a much more dull, shallow gray... you know, like the KO manufacturers use. THEN, we'll pretend we CANCEL the Classics line and we'll let Funpub release the remaining seekers, and finally years later, we can release the premium version and sucker all these stupid collectors in again!!!!!!!! HOO HOO HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

...I don't remember saying anything like that. :/

Collectors make up a small market percent of the target market.

I don't recall ever denying that. But at the same time it's evident that the Classics line does take collectors into account, hence the whole G1 homage thing. G1 is not for kids.

We also know that they consistently re-release their most renown characters. So, as you say, Hasbro could have easily simply re-released the same version of Starscream. But you're upset because they offered collectors a variant? You're upset because they improved it?

I'm disappointed that they didn't release Classics Starscream in better colours. And not just choice of colours, but a better application too.
Look at Henkei Starscream - that was released straight off with a nice looking colour scheme, G1 colours aside... the application just looks cleaner.

As long as you think they intentionally withheld this product in order to sell you a lesser product first, I can see the problem. Personally I think that's ridiculous, and I think in this specific case, since Classics was cancelled, that's been proven wrong.

I never said that they intentionally withheld the product. (?_?)

And lastly, you need to refresh your understanding of what a corporation's purpose is. Hasbro doesn't exist to serve "fanboy faps". They sell product to make money.

...again, this was never my point.

I'm just saying that collectors would have been taken into some level of consideration for Classics/Universe. Ditto Henkei. Both are still predominantly kid-oriented toy lines, no doubts there... but the fact that these lines are heavily rooted in G1 tributes means that they are thinking about collectors at some level even if not at a primary level.

[kup]

The packaging of these new Premiums reeks of an attempt at 'Collector's Appeal'. So does the basic concept of the Movie Premiums.

Like Kelvin said, a kid's parent would not buy the same toy twice. To the mom or dad, its the same toy as before.

IMO its hard not to see this as a blatant attempt at consumer exploitation, specially coming after the Movie Premiums.

What's next? Animated Premiums with better plastic and paint applications?

They just want to make you buy the same toy twice.

[jaydisc]

Every toy that Hasbro releases is the culmination of an attempt on their behalf to find the best balance between:

1. Cost
2. Quality
3. Marketability

Based on their expectations at the time, they made the original Starscream, which many of us agree... sort of sucks.

Based on their current evaluation of those same criteria, they've released Premium Starscream.

How can you call it exploitation if they didn't know about Premium Starscream (or Movie Toys) when they made the originals? Would you rather another Offroad Ironhide?

There seems to be a consistent vocal minority that just likes to complain. If Hasbro chose to use the mold as a completely different character, they'd complain the character was ill-imagined or misnamed. If they choose to improve an existing character, it's exploitation. If they choose to release a female, obscure, irrelevant homage to a gobot, it's handbags in the air.

[jaydisc]

Like Kelvin said, a kid's parent would not buy the same toy twice. To the mom or dad, its the same toy as before.

I agree with this completely. What you call exploitation, I consider thoughtful. Hasbro expects to resell Starscream to the NEXT set of parents. They'd probably happily release the same drivel, but instead they mix it up FOR the collector.

Your ability to complain would no be hampered by this . You'd just modify the tune to "Hasbro keeps releasing the same stuff over and over."

What you consistently fail to understand IS HASBRO DOES NOT EXPECT YOU TO BUY EVERY VARIANT. If you're annoyed that you like the version that comes out after the first version, cool your heels and stop buying everything right away and have some patience so you can sit back and make the best choice!

For you to keep complaining about what is obviously the current process shows a severe lack of understanding and learning on your behalf.

[GoktimusPrime]

If you're annoyed that you like the version that comes out after the first version, cool your heels and stop buying everything right away and have some patience so you can sit back and make the best choice!

For you to keep complaining about what is obviously the current process shows a severe lack of understanding and learning on your behalf.

That would work if we were clairvoyant, in which case we would stop working and become obscenely rich by winning the Powerball every week.

I agree that if you have the knowledge available that there will be a better variant, then yeah, be patient and wait for the nicer one. That's what I'm doing with Universe/Henkei atm - I prefer Henkei, so I'm willing to wait for the Henkei versions of the current Classics-Universe figures.

But in 2006 we had no knowledge of Henkei or Classics-Universe so we had to make a decision based on the knowledge available to us at the time. When the movie toys came out I didn't know that they would do a Premium Series afterwards.

Not being able to predict the future is not a sign of impatience.

[jaydisc]

But in 2006 we had no knowledge of Henkei or Classics-Universe so we had to make a decision based on the knowledge available to us at the time. When the movie toys came out I didn't know that they would do a Premium Series afterwards.

Neither did Hasbro, which is why I fail to comprehend The Complainers' perspective on this one:

Hasbro's so naughty for:

1. Improving a product
2. Trying to make money

Or in your case, it's an armchair criticism where you are unable to comprehend why it wasn't done that way the first time. You simply aren't aware all of all the parameters needed to properly comprehend the situation. Granted, neither am I, but I'm not passing judgement or alleging exploitation.