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Thread: Martial arts discussion thread

  1. #891
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    "Karate" vs "Ninjutsu"
    I honestly can't tell which is the more incompetent fighter. <facepalm>

  2. #892
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    Saw some guys promoting a notorious McDojo at a shopping centre today. This is the same McDojo that I trained at a few years ago desperately looking for something positive to say about it but after months of training I found nothing. Interestingly enough I noticed that none of their advertising material featured the words "Self Defence." Although their website still does.

    My advice to anyone looking to do a martial art is to honestly be skeptical and assume that every school you're looking at is a rubbish school. In other words, apply onus probandi (Burden of Proof). If someone claims that their martial actually works as a fighting form do not believe them unless they can prove it. I know that this sounds incredibly pessimistic, but the problem is that there are so many rubbish schools out there, and I myself am sick and tired of giving schools the benefit of the doubt only to be disappointed over and over again, that it's actually safer to assume that a system doesn't work unless they can prove to you that it does.

    And even after you begin training, continue to be curious, inquisitive and ask loads of questions. Be nitpicky! If you see a technique being shown or demonstrated to you, question it! Only continue to train at the school so long as they can continue convincing you that their techniques actually work. That's what I've been doing, and while I'm quite happy training at my current school it is because the instructor continues to satisfy my skeptical curiosity.

    And I don't mean being skeptical or questioning in a nasty, aggressive or disrespectful way -- you should be able to question what's being taught. And if the instructor doesn't foster a class environment where you feel comfortable asking questions then that's a warning sign. Either what their teaching isn't very good (hence they don't want to allow anyone to question them), or they're just not good teachers! Because every teacher knows that fostering curiosity and inquisitiveness is crucial to good teaching practice. Avoid those "shut up and just do as your told and copy me" style 'teachers.' It astounds me how incompetent so many martial arts instructors are. Imagine if any other sports coach or classroom teacher taught with such reckless abandon for basic learning.

  3. #893
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    No rules BJJ vs Karate - predictably the black belt Karateka gets easily beaten by the Juujutsuka.

    The way that the Karateka lost is all too indicative of how too many martial artists are training these days -- too many restrictions which dilutes the art. Whereas BJJ has actually worked well to maintain much of its tenacity even with competition training. I think the key essence is that BJJ isn't into the whole 'point sparring' thing. They aim to terminate the fight as quickly and with as few moves as possible, which is really the spirit of traditional martial arts anyway. So perhaps this is why, unlike many other martial arts, BJJ has managed to survive relatively in tact even when modified for competition fighting, because they still maintain the core spirit of what martial arts is meant to be about -- ending a fight, not continuing it.

    If I may use a Chess analogy, competition martial arts tends to promote the idea of playing the game where you take pieces and aim to put the opponent in Check, and let's say that for each Check you win a point. So you're encouraged to continually Check your opponent to win a maximum number of points, but in doing so you are prolonging the game and also giving your opponent opportunities to Check you back. This is at complete odds with the traditional martial arts mindset, which is more geared towards enforcing an immediate Checkmate. The objective is to become like a Chess master where you can Checkmate your opponent with as few moves as possible, like say a 3-move Checkmate. And we see this in BJJ -- they execute only a small number of moves before the opponent is locked on the ground. Checkmate.

    This is how Karate is supposed to work. This is how every martial art is supposed to work. The problem is that in the modern age, as competition martial arts have become popular, many schools have simply lost this edge as their training methodology has shifted from "enforce immediate Checkmate" to "get as many Checks as possible and stack those points!" And I almost feel sorry for the Karateka at the end of the fight. Look at his face. The tempered rage and also disappointment... he might be wondering why the hell his black belt Karate training has failed him so miserably. All the years and thousands of dollars that he's spent on this training, only to lose so easily to a random BJJ fighter. He looks to be in a combined state of shock and emotional denial.

    This is why I was floating between schools for so long before I settled on my current one. There's no point in sticking with a martial arts school if their training is bad. Aside from wasting your time and money, it can also be dangerous as they teach you bad habits! I know that I've picked up some bad habits from some of the schools that I've been floating around in recent years. My Karate training made me stop guarding my head. My previous Tai Chi and Bagua training made my 'bridging attack' skills worsen. Any skills that you're not practising or that you're practising incorrectly will make your fighting form worse. It's only been in this year with my Baji training that I've started to re-learn things and correct some of the bad habits I've picked up along the way.

  4. #894
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    MMA vs Wing Chun
    This is the same MMA fighter who beat the tar out of the Tai Chi "master" a while back. Watch him again easily trounce a Wing Chun fighter. There is no contest here.

    Even as a pro-traditionalist myself you just have to give credit where credit's due. This MMA guy, who I think is an absolute thug, is the superior fighter. And he's putting here his money where his mouth is. He is also doing the traditional martial arts world a favour by exposing one our most critical flaws -- a lot of people aren't practising the traditional arts properly anymore! And quite frankly if you're not training properly in any style then you pretty much deserve to have your butt handed back to you in a fight like this. And if this MMA guy can discredit as many rubbish martial arts "masters" as possible and drive them out of business then GOOD.

    This MMA fighter is like a predator who's going around challenging all of these traditional Kung Fu masters and taking them down. The only ones who'll survive are the ones who are fit to continue teaching their art. Survival of the fittest.

    One reason why many martial arts (traditional and non-traditional) have gotten so weak is because there is no impetus to keep our skills sharp. We don't use martial arts in modern combat because it cannot compare to modern weapons technology (e.g. assault rifles etc.). People can prove their martial arts in fixed and controlled settings like tournaments and competitions because it's not a realistic fighting environment. And MMA isn't a completely realistic fighting environment either, and this MMA guy isn't even an exceptional MMA fighter. Which is all the more damning for these Kung Fu masters who are losing to him!

    I haven't bothered reading the comments for this video, but I remember when the MMA v Tai Chi video came up, a lot of butt hurt Tai Chi fighters made excuses like criticising the MMA fighter's technique and attitude. Yes, the guy seems like a meathead. Yes, his technique isn't the greatest. But he's still kicking everyone's butts! Quite frankly the traditional martial arts community - my martial arts community - needs to put up or shut up.

    At the end of the day the better fighter is the one who can beat you. The question of "which style is better" is utterly irrelevant next to the question of "Can you fight?" That is the only question that we should preoccupy ourselves with. Traditional, non-traditional, competition, non-competition, Kung Fu, Tai Chi, Karate, Juujutsu, boxing, Krav Maga, wrestling, Taekwondo, Hapkido, Aikido etc. - it doesn't matter what you do. All that matters is whether or not you can stand your ground against an opponent, especially an opponent who doesn't give a flying hoot about your fighting style and rules and will do whatever it takes to floor you. Can you defend yourself against a superior opponent? If your answer isn't yes then you need to rethink your training.

  5. #895
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    MMA Fighters Try Women's Self Defence -- a humorous but clever way of road-testing some really bulldust self-defence techniques. This highlights what I find is wrong with 99% of martial arts demonstrations that I see, not only those for women's defence.

  6. #896
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoktimusPrime View Post
    Saw some guys promoting a notorious McDojo at a shopping centre today. This is the same McDojo that I trained at a few years ago desperately looking for something positive to say about it but after months of training I found nothing. Interestingly enough I noticed that none of their advertising material featured the words "Self Defence." Although their website still does.
    I take this back. I saw the same McDojo guy at another nearby shopping centre today and I got a direct look at their signage which absolutely does claim to teach "self defence." Incredibly dangerous false advertising.
    Last edited by GoktimusPrime; 29th April 2018 at 11:07 PM.

  7. #897
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    An excellent video explaining the value and application of practising forms, as well as why so many people who do forms practice can't fight. Essentially it's about function over form, not form over function.

  8. #898
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    I tried Krav Maga today for the first time ever. It was... interesting.

    One the plus side, it's a very no-nonsense approach. No forms, no competition training - pure focus on self defence. There are informal forms, kinda like shadow-boxing, but not in the formal sense where it would foster people to become form collectors.

    The drawback that I encountered was that the art assumes that your opponent isn't superior to you. The techniques I did tonight might work quite well on Joe Average who has little to no martial arts or combat training/skill... but against a competent fighter? Yeah, I'm not so sure.

    For example, they taught us how to get out of a headlock, but this technique makes what I consider to be 2 critical flaws:
    1/ It relies on the attacker NOT completing the headlock. i.e. you have to move and get out of it in time. The technique would probably be useless if the attacker were a skilled grappler and quickly completed the lock.
    2/ It assumes that the attacker won't pursue you! We were told that once the defender gets out of the headlock, in the role of the attacker we were just meant to stand there and let them escape rather than chasing them.

    The funny thing is that they told me this after we did a bit of a free spar session for escaping headlocks. I got one guy in a headlock and he tried the Krav Maga counter, but I stuck with him so that he couldn't escape and dragged him down to the mat where I pinned him.

    On the whole I do like the no-nonsense attitude and I reckon an average person who does say 1 year of Krav Maga would probably beat a person who does 1 year of Karate or Tai Chi at your typical/average school. But your typical Brazilian Jujutsu fighter would most likely smash a Krav Maga fighter.

    P.S. What The Simpsons said about Krav Maga is very true - "No groin no Krav Maga!"

  9. #899
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    How to NOT defend yourself against a knife attack...

    Note: the top left image shows the trajectory of a typical "rake" attack commonly seen in crazy frenzied attacks (and the kind that is typically found in cases causing multiple stab wounds)

    How I would defend against a downward straight incoming knife attack

    Note: images on the right show how the technique would still keep you relatively safe* even if you are unable to execute the rest of the technique (e.g. opponent is too fast, you're too slow etc.). The knife slips past your outside rather than leaving your arm and your body directly in harm's way.

    ----------------------------------------------
    *Well... as safe as one might be in a knife attack which is always super-bloody dangerous. If a person attacks you with a knife then expect to be cut. But at least with the method I'm suggesting you would get nicked on the outside of your arm. Still sucks and you're gonna need stitches but it's not as devastating or deadly as the alternative scenarios seen in the first set of images

  10. #900
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    This video shows a Taekwondo fighter trying to show how TKD is effective in a street fight. The intention of the video is to prove this, but it actually ends up disproving it when you look properly. The TKD guy repeatedly admits that...
    * his kicks only work if they are executed flawlessly -- critical mistakes in his techniques will make his entire fighting form useless.
    * his opponent isn't expecting his moves; that he's unfamiliar and won't know how to counter them properly

    (sigh)

    He's assuming that he's fighting an inferior opponent, which is a dangerously stupid assumption to make in a fight. It's always safer to assume that your opponent is superior to you - stronger, faster, better trained. If they turn out to be inferior then that's okay, you'll cope. But if you assume that your opponent isn't better than you and they are, then you're screwed.

    Telling people that these kinds of techniques work, teaching them and taking people's money for it is reckless and dangerous. It's giving people dangerous false confidence. Now interestingly enough, this guy is closing down his Aikido Dojo because he's come to the realisation that he's been cheating his students. He's a black belt in Aikido and he's been taking people's money to teach them Aikido, but he's come to realise that he cannot fight. How can a person who cannot fight teach a martial art? That's like having a maths teacher who lacks numeracy skills, or a language teacher who cannot speak the target language etc.

    Now to this Aikido instructor's credit, I do admire his honesty and decision to do the right thing by closing his school down to take a sabbatical. The reason why he's done this is because just over a year ago he got into the ring with an MMA fighter and lost really, really badly. It's embarrassing to watch and bear in mind that this guy gets paid to teach martial arts. To his further credit, this guy spent the next year trying to refine his Aikido in preparation for a rematch. He was determined to prove that Aikido can work in a real fight. So a few months ago he had a rematch with the MMA fighter, and again, he lost really badly. Not quite as badly as a year ago, but still pretty damn bad. Even I can fight better than this Aikido guy, and quite frankly, if a fat and unfit bugger like me can beat you then you're doing something seriously wrong!

    So yeah, I can respect the fact that he's self-reflected and decided to, at least for now, close his Dojo to re-evaluate himself and think about whether or not he can return to teaching Aikido or if he needs to do something different. So many other martial arts teachers don't do this. They will continue ripping off their students. And I do feel bad for this Aikido guy. He's just come to the realisation that the martial art that he's dedicated years and years of training to, goodness knows how much money he's invested into... is BS. He's come to realise that he has been living a lie, and I'd say that he first came to that realisation back in May 2017 but he's been in slow denial since then. But the second defeat a year later has opened his eyes.

    And another problem is that even if he does come back a year later after having reformed his Aikido and re-opens his school, you're going to have all of these Aikido purists hate on him. Because the Aikido community's attitude is that if you change Aikido then it's not Aikido anymore. Which is ironic because Aikido evolved from a sub-branch of Jujutsu. Aikido's founder (Ueshiba Morihei) developed Aikido by modifying Jujutsu (and possibly mixing in other styles like Bagua Kung Fu).

    But yeah, if the Aikido community is going to "disown" him for trying to improve his Aikido then he's better off just renaming his martial art and pretend that it's a whole new thing. That's what Hapkido did. And quite frankly, it's not as if "Aikido" is a trademarked term anyway.

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