A report on Hasbro factory

[VERT]

Thats right hahahahahahah

[GoktimusPrime]

Of course the main differences being that:

1. Robin Hood stole from the rich and gave to the poor. When was the last time anyone here received free counterfeits from counterfeit manufacturers? Fansubbers create and distribute their works for free and stop fansubbing/distribution once licence is acquired by a company like ADV. I might understand KOers selling their products at a cost that just covers their manufacturing costs, but not making a profit - that's what a lot of fan artists do, like people who make/sell doujinshi. One example was Ichikawa Hirofumi who sold his Cybertron Chronicles comic at BotCon Japan 2000; the price calculated for him to break even and cover his costs... he had no intention of profiting. Takara then stepped in and ordered him to give his comics away for free which generated massive negative fan backlash against Takara because Ichikawa was clearly providing a product made by fans for fans (and also, it was his own original works and not a pirated product). Takara have since made amends by letting Ichikawa work with them on several projects. But as I understand it, KO toys are sold with a profit margin... so unless KO makers reduce the price of their toys so as to reduce their profits to around break even points (as is the case with doujinshi), then I really cannot see how they can take any kind of moral high ground. It puts them in the same boat as Hasbro -- people out to make a profit; and there's nothing necessarily wrong with this... but we do question profiteering when it comes at an unacceptable expense -- in the case of the allegations regarding Hasbro's factory, it's a human expense, in the case of KO makers, it's at the expense of intellectual property. Two wrongs don't make a right.

2. The Sherriff of Nottingham consciously knew and permitted his practices to worsen the lives of the people. So far it doesn't seem apparent that Hasbro were consciously aware that these questionable practices were happening, and to Hasbro's credit, they did say that they will investigate (whereas please for the Sherriff to help people fell on deaf ears).

3. The story of Robin Hood is about an uprising against corrupt authority - much like say the Rebel Alliance or the movements we saw in Tunisia, Egypt and Libya recently. Hasbro may be a big toy corporation... but they're hardly a government. But I understand that corporations do have massive influence over governments... hence the suggestion to #occupyHasbro. If I were a single dude without needing to worry about a family... I'd seriously consider pitching a tent in Epping (or Pawtucket Rhode Island if I lived around there).

Could Hasbro have been more proactive rather than reactive? Absolutely... but it's not like they're ignoring the problem and doing nothing about it.

[VERT]

don't think anyone said a thing about ko stuff gok.

[SkyWarp91]

Yes we know it's horrible and harsh what these workers endure to make us our beloved toys, and we do wish somehow they are better off - but at the end of the day, i.e. realistically, do we care enough and are willing to dedicate ourselves to changing these conditions?

We could somehow contribute to having toys being made in much better circumstances, but if in that situation the costs arise would we be willing to pay higher prices at our expense?

Some of us would, some of us won't. It's one of the odd ways how societies and the values they hold works.

Slave labouring has been around forever unfortunately and though we would like to think we can put an end to it, it's much, much easier said than done.

I don't know a solution to this problem, but in the meantime I guess the best I could do is to take greater appreciation for all the toys I have. We do live in a very privileged side of the world after all...

[colin78]

Hey boys and girls,

Here is a pdf link to the complete report. I downloaded it a few days ago before it got removed.

http://www.globallabourrights.org/ad...-by-Hasbro.pdf

[GoktimusPrime]

don't think anyone said a thing about ko stuff gok.

Simplified overview (for more detail, please review the actual posts themselves):

Post #9: reillyd said he feels less guilty now for buying cheap toys stolen from Hasbro's factory.

Post #12: reillyd said he wondered if anyone was going to continue supporting Hasbro's IP considering the recent allegations regarding their factory workers.

Post #24: I said that I didn't see the logic behind this - i.e. how Hasbro having poor factory employee standards justifies stealing from Hasbro. Two wrongs don't make a right.

#29: kup responded with his post of Robin Hood.

#31: you implied agreement with this analogy.

#32: I discussed the differences between the analogy and what's actually happening here with Hasbro (and those who choose to steal their property for profit).

Likewise those who steal toys from factories sell them later at profit. When I was in China I found one collectable toy store that sold out-of-factory DotM toys for close to what we would pay here for the toys MOSC! Although hopefully if working conditions/wages in Hasbro's factory improved it may discourage workers from stealing in the first place... they probably do it to make more money to supplement their paltry wages/conditions.

Again, I really hope that if this happens Hasbro won't pass the cost onto consumers. Considering the massive profit margins Hasbro already makes on these toys, they should be able to absorb the costs without passing it onto customers. After all, we see chocolate manufacturers improve the ethical standards of their cocoa harvesting without increasing the cost of their chocolates (the companies having publicly admitted that they are absorbing the added costs themselves).

[Sutton]

I wouldn't just be thinking about your TF collection. Look around your house at all the plastic appliances and knick-knacks you have that are made in China and cost a lot less than they should. We're all pretty good at blinding ourselves to the evil we perpetrate every time we buy a cheap toaster or kettle. It's like the defense that sickos who look at kiddie porn use, 'I didn't abuse the kid personally so it doesn't count'. But the kids are abused in the first place because the market exists. We buy these cheap items in the first place and continue to buy these things. It's our fault, there's no way around it. It's the failing of a capitalist society.

I wouldn't worry about having to do anything about it as such, China is close to hitting critical mass in terms of population/food supply/power supply. When that happens and the rapid expansion stops, things will change. Big companies may look to other developing nations for a time, but it won't last long. Boycotting Hasbro will only mean something if you're prepared to forgo all the other items in your house bought so cheap.

People talk about Hasbro being proactive rather than reactive, but in the history of society this just doesn't happen. No country or company ever does anything until after a critical event happens. Germany built up military equipment and personnel and marched them right to the French border in complete breach of the existing treaties. No one did a thing until they rolled through Belgium. We've been talking about ozone layers, el ninos and global warming since the early 80's, and only now talking about doing something.

We're the mouse that keeps coming back to the electrified cheese.

I wonder what the cost of a deluxe TF would go up to if they moved production back to the US, or improved conditions and wages in asia? Would you be willing to pay $35 - $40 for a deluxe TF? Add to that the rising cost of oil and it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect a $50 price tag in the next decade.

Your TFC Hercules suddenly doesn't seem so expensive.

[kup]

#29: kup responded with his post of Robin Hood.

Note that my post with Robin Hood was in direct response to what you said (which is quoted on the same post).

What you basically said there is the reason why figures such as Robin Hood are admired. However there may not be a Robin Hood in this situation but Hasbro (along with several other US corporations) do behave like Prince John or the Sheiff of Naughtingham not through direct evil but outright amorality and selfishness.

What the Sheriff wanted was to fill up his coffers without any regard for how this action was affecting their peasant class. Hasbro is pretty much doing the same thing and I am pretty sure that their 'we'll investigate' is pure PR. Once this blows over it will be 'business as usual'.

[Sutton]

Hasbro is pretty much doing the same thing and I am pretty sure that their 'we'll investigate' is pure PR. Once this blows over it will be 'business as usual'.

Absolutely.

I'm astonished they replied at all, since that can sometimes dig a deeper hole...

[Arcee]

What the Sheriff wanted was to fill up his coffers without any regard for how this action was affecting their peasant class. Hasbro is pretty much doing the same thing and I am pretty sure that their 'we'll investigate' is pure PR. Once this blows over it will be 'business as usual'.

Exactly. Both classic and modern economics advocate that the only purpose of companies is to profit; and corporate value lies in the maximization of shareholder value, which is the residual profit anyway. Performances of executives and staff and share prices are all linked to revenue increase and cost reduction. Those executives are brought up in an economic morale and profit is their only belief; whoever even tries to uphold social responsibilities (beyond what their local legislation requires) would never end up climbing to their executive chairs in the first place.

And yes, to be fair, indeed the Hasbro factories' working conditions are far from the worst in China. Nor is Foxcom for Apple, whose product many of us cannot live without, and whose workers are not opting for suicide only because they were forced to sign the agreement to no compensation. White collar workers in China are nowhere near better off; >18hrs of continuous stressful work per day that last for most months of the year has caused death rate among young people aged 22 to 35 to soar, and they are not getting paid one extra cent for putting their blood into their work.

Yes there is legislation and all that. But what choice do you have when there are one billion population (with 8 million fresh uni graduates each year adding to the ever growing work force) fighting their life for far less jobs, there's always someone who's willing to kill both you and themselves to get the job? Let alone say the whole system is bureaucratic and inefficient and rotten as hell. Western companies are shifting manufacturing to Vietnam as China has gradually becoming slightly more expensive; and the whole nation's (not just the government) mentality is to maintain the current high GDP growth rate at ANY cost.

For someone who's born and raised in that very country, I know the origins of problems and difficulties of changes there. It'll sure evolve over time; but that's a historical process taking place in hundreds of years. China boasts that it's leaped the historical process in 50 years; it has not. No country ever can. Simply applying the western way wouldn't help in a country like that, as its government is only one of the product of its most original problems, but not the origin itself.

For the near future that's relevant to our life, I see no way out of the problem, peaceful or not.