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Old 30th October 2014, 09:30 PM
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Default The Pros & Cons of Michael Bay - discussion topic

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Originally Posted by Bidoofdude
Bay's films aren't awful, they have their moments and some of the character designs are nice. It is good to see that they'll be given a fresher perspective, since the whole Bayformers mood is losing its shine IMO. Not as special as the first film.
+1, the first movie was excellent! As it contained nothing but TF's kick'in butt. As they progressed it concentrated more on the human side, which lost it's perspective of the whole transformers purpose. In which i mean that they should have focused more on the transformers, but in all i have to agree that they are movies that have defined the whole transformers universe in which we should hopefully see a return to a more autobot and decepticon race for survival.
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Old 30th October 2014, 09:37 PM
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I'll be waiting for confirmation from Bay himself.

If it's true, I'm hoping Transformers 5 isn't a reboot - AoE laid the groundwork for a fifth movie, so audiences probably won't like being left hanging by an unresolved storyline. Plus, I personally feel that not only is it far too soon for a reboot, but that reboots are an 'easy way out' for studios.

Yeah, there has been criticism of the plots, but really, I feel that it's misplaced; criticism should really be levelled at the writers, not Bay himself.


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Originally Posted by UltraMarginal View Post
I don't get the Michael Bay hate, as much as his movies aren't Oscar winning dramas they are still entertaining films and they've made the transformers franchise so much bigger than it was before 2007.
+1. His movies are good escapism/entertainment, which is what you'd expect for a movie franchise based on a toy line. Ok, so his movies aren't exactly critically acclaimed, and he seems to be an easy target for haters, but I get the impression that as far as he's concerned, moviegoing audiences are his critics, and audiences like his work.
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Old 30th October 2014, 09:51 PM
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I enjoyed all of the TFbay movies, despite all of the flaws.

The only thing that annoyed me in the last movie was the blatant advertising, I know this has been happening through all other movies but in AOE it was just totally over the top, I didnt need to see some dude sitting in his car with a close up of his sunglasses or all of the beer all over the ground.

I am not sure what to expect until a new director is announced, but I am hoping for 5 - 6 to be filmed together.
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Old 30th October 2014, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by UltraMarginal View Post
I don't get the Michael Bay hate, as much as his movies aren't Oscar winning dramas they are still entertaining films and they've made the transformers franchise so much bigger than it was before 2007.
The problem isn't that they're not-G1 enough, or not striving for some exceptional artistic recognition. it's that they're stupidly scripted, racist/sexist and downright bad. Sure, you can have giant alien robots fighting over mountain dew/xbox/whatever. Sure, go spend $150-300 mil doing CGI/good VFX. But for god's sake, don't make a film based on a first draft done by a scab and a 45-50 year old frat boy. The problem there is that since ROTF came off the success of a not too bad film (TF1), it was going to pretty much guaranteed to be a success anyway (powers that be, all that). Which means that since then it's actually potentially made other films dumber. I dunno.

(That being said, enjoy what you like It's just I know big budgeted action films have and can be both trashy, enjoyable AND not downright insulting, and we all know that Transformers can be better than other people expect/anticipate. So it'd just be nice to see the flagship of the franchise/whatever be something that isn't just dumb as heck (despite it's premise (bracket (small joke))))
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Old 31st October 2014, 07:21 AM
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Call me when a new director is announced. Then I'll party.

But yes, it is undeniable that Bay did great things for the franchise. But imagine what someone with actual directing talent could've achieved!

And I too haven't as yet seen TF4. It is sitting on my hard drive, I just haven't been that bored yet.
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Old 31st October 2014, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Trent View Post
Call me when a new director is announced. Then I'll party.

But yes, it is undeniable that Bay did great things for the franchise. But imagine what someone with actual directing talent could've achieved!

And I too haven't as yet seen TF4. It is sitting on my hard drive, I just haven't been that bored yet.
Lockdown is really awesome, single best thing about the movie.
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Old 31st October 2014, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by UltraMarginal View Post
I don't get the Michael Bay hate, as much as his movies aren't Oscar winning dramas they are still entertaining films and they've made the transformers franchise so much bigger than it was before 2007.
Plot. Continuity reboots. Essential plot elements cut/not explained.
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Old 31st October 2014, 02:15 PM
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Isn't the issue with the movies really with the story/plot rather than Michael Bay himself? I mean, I'm sure he has some input into the story but he's only working with what he's been given so shouldn't the writers take the blame for the supposed issues with the movies? I have no issues with the movies myself, granted they are not the most intellectually stimulating films but as a spectacle and as escapist entertainment, they succeed at what they do. Which for the studios, is what they want Michael Bay to do. So I dont see why there is so much hate for the man especially when he's doing exactly what he's been hired to do.
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Old 31st October 2014, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Fungal Infection View Post
Isn't the issue with the movies really with the story/plot rather than Michael Bay himself? I mean, I'm sure he has some input into the story but he's only working with what he's been given so shouldn't the writers take the blame for the supposed issues with the movies? I have no issues with the movies myself, granted they are not the most intellectually stimulating films but as a spectacle and as escapist entertainment, they succeed at what they do. Which for the studios, is what they want Michael Bay to do. So I dont see why there is so much hate for the man especially when he's doing exactly what he's been hired to do.
We've had some of the best Hollywood writers on the Transformers movies, so scripting shouldn't be an issue. It's how the script is interpreted and modified when setting up individual scenes... particularly by a Director who focuses more on the "money shots" that you'd normally see featured on Trailers or to investors, and then later has to tie them together to make some sense out of why something suddenly happens just for a spectacular visual effect.
He's a great director for those intense action shots, and has been a pioneer in that field. But he seems to be stubborn about it, in that he doesn't like sacrificing an action shot from his imagination if doesn't fit easily within an existing coherent story. He'd rather sacrifice the logic of the story, to keep his exciting action shots that often appear and disappear without reason.

By the time Bay had his hands on the fourth movie, he had so much creative control... and we saw it from the generic looking robots (that don't have car kibble on them on screen anymore), to about an hour of Trailers released (of all his money shots) that didn't leave anything left unknown when watching the Movie.
He's so focused on the action of each scene rather than the "bigger picture" of the whole movie - he's like a gardener who focuses more on the individual trees that tickle his fancy instead of the whole forest or garden. Sure, each tree might look spectacular on its own, but the forest makes no sense as a whole, and some trees don't go well with others.

Like I said, he's a great director for action movies and draws in the money to prove it, but he's not a good story director... which is why he's never won any serious awards for his movies, like Oscars, Directors Guild or Emmys.
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Old 31st October 2014, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin View Post
He's a great director for those intense action shots, and has been a pioneer in that field. But he seems to be stubborn about it, in that he doesn't like sacrificing an action shot from his imagination if doesn't fit easily within an existing coherent story. He'd rather sacrifice the logic of the story, to keep his exciting action shots that often appear and disappear without reason.
Look at the chase through the carpark where Marky Mark and Tess and the man with the underage girlfriend drive off the top of the complex and onto a perfectly positioned ramp.

Are we meant to assume he knew it was there? Did he set it up earlier? He mentioned that Tessa was a good team member - had they driven around that abandoned industrial complex before? What is happening? Why does Michael Bay get to keep making movies?
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