Been concerned about this, the “third world” could be hit very badly by this. But my thinking goes to many terrible futures and I’m trying not to think about it too much.
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Been concerned about this, the “third world” could be hit very badly by this. But my thinking goes to many terrible futures and I’m trying not to think about it too much.
The flipside of this for many (not all) of these poorer countries is that they have quite a bottom heavy population pyramid. IE lots of young people.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
Italy & Spain have relatively top-heavy population pyramids & so while they have a lot of medical infrastructure, they also have a LOT of elderly - 23% of Italy's population is over 65. Conversely, Yemen's estimate of over 65s (2010) is 2.6%. So while the vulnerable in Yemen are definitely in the firing line, there's relatively few elderly.
(I know, Yemen isn't the BEST example, as it is also facing a lot of health issues thanks to the ongoing civil war, but I was able to pull the number easily)
The one that worries me is Indonesia. The population is over 230 million (4th in the world) and the over 65s are around 7%. So that's roughly 18 MILLION over 65... in a country with one of the highest smoking rates in the world; some really high population densities (Java has 145 million people and it's smaller than Victoria); a lot of poverty and a relatively undeveloped health infrastructure. It's going to get very ugly in our neighbours to the northwest.
Smoking apparently increases your vulnerability to COVID-19 up to 300%.
Just another out of the many other super good reasons to quit smoking.
^This.Quote:
Originally Posted by dirge
They're not known to invest in good infection surveillance nor do they have a health system that is equitable to all.
They would go through a hastened epidemic once local numbers rise - will be a scary situation when that eventuates and will very likely be under reported as well.
Looking at some reports, the population can be quite resistant to preventative measures due to a knowledge deficit.
Then comes the concern of illegal boats that'll carry the disease across to our shores if numbers peak and the country is overwhelmed... but that's for another day.
The situation with Indonesia is worrying, as they haven't had the best political system in place to control the population, and if their social systems collapses under the strain of a full outbreak of the virus, a lot more people will hop on boats to make the short journey to "safety" in Australia, and our border force boats can only intercept a small number at a time. Not to mention all of those people who are transiting through Indonesia from other countries, they might become more desperate to make the final journey to Australia, and the Indonesian authorities might be too busy dealing with their own problems to stop them.
A positive side effect from the virus in this country (according to some stats on the ABC today), is that since the peak of the virus numbers about 3 weeks ago, total patient numbers in Emergency Departments have fallen by 40%, from a usual 90-110% rate, down to about 60% this week... probably because less people are out in public getting hurt, from things like work or leisure related injuries, alcohol fueled violence, and car accidents, as well as a big drop in annual flu virus infections that would normally see hundreds being hospitalised during the winter months.
If we suddenly had another spike of cases, at least we have more capacity in our hospitals at the moment to handle it.
I would expect this to have a lot to do with reduction in idiotic alcohol-fuelled violence, but I suspect the rate of serious car accidents probably helps. We'll be recording the lowest Easter road toll in decades, I reckon.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
Hey griffin. Did you come up with this doomsday scenario while having tea with Pauline Hanson? Expect a call from Cory Bernardi to appear on his show on Sky News.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
This moron broke out of his hotel where he was being quarantined to visit his family... and now he's looking at either paying a $50k fine or spend a year in gaol.
https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/healt...rules-c-977452
:rolleyes: <slow.clap>
New Zealand is due to end its lockdown in a weeks time; with a decision due on Monday. I am really hoping it is not ended (as much as I want certain things) as I don't feel that we have the testing side of things sorted yet - there are too many "well how did that happen" cases in the last few days.
Japan has finally called a state of emergency for the whole country. What does that mean? They will ask people to stay inside and ask businesses to close. Apparently legally that's the best they can do.
Of course some haven't, like the pachinko parlours that stayed open and were packed with people. Now some of them have closed. I really fear what is going to happen, because the graphs look extremely similar to America's...
Hopefully SOE for the whole country will make people wake up here. So far people have been using it almost as a day off. Lots of kids gathering in parks and playing, mum's clubs etc etc. Crazy.
Was doing grocery shopping this morning and saw:
* an old lady having a sneaky nibble on a grape. Ordinarily I wouldn't care about this, but given the current pandemic -- who knows who's touched that grape before. And as a senior citizen, she's in the vulnerable range! :eek:
* an old man coughing without covering his mouth. His hands were empty - so it wasn't like he was holding something and the cough came along too suddenly for him to raise an arm. And heck, when that's happened to me the very least I do is cough into my shoulder.
* an old disabled lady in front of me at the checkout telling the cashier that this was the first time she's bought toilet paper in 8 weeks. :(
(－‸ლ) それどころかパチンコのような賭博場を閉鎖したら、賭博者たちはそんな金の無駄遣いが止められて、別な経済 活動を促進できるんだ。しかしまた問題は、パチンコが法律的に賭博に分類されていない。Quote:
Originally Posted by Tetsuwan Convoy
https://i.ibb.co/0BDphD5/temp.jpg <The stupid thing is that by shutting down gambling outlets, they could stimulate other parts of the economy by the fact that gamblers are now wasting less money through slot machines. But then again, pachinko's not technically classified as gambling.> :rolleyes:
For a country that’s supposedly intelligent & obedient, that’s crazy alright.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tetsuwan Convoy
Many of these countries IMO FAIL to act because they think of economics FIRST than eliminating the virus cases and situation. From my perspective, this is the down fall of many.
1.Closing borders late
2. closing business late < those that have huge groups like pubs night clubs, restaurants and so forth.
3. Not getting clinics prepared, despite hearing of this virus since December. < hey Australia is just as guilty just to be fair.
Many issues involved are due to lifestyle changes that people DO NOT wish to adapt or accept. Refuse to listen to stay in doors.
IMO the faster everyone cooperates and comply, the faster we constrain and restrict who really has the virus and is contained.
Once this is controlled, we know that all new cases are just from cruise ships and overseas flights. I also disagree that flight crew should be exempted, thats garbage, and is no different. (some arrangement are required but in no case they should be walking like everyone else on the streets)
once things are highly contained, we can restart our business. If the country selects Economics as priority, it will not yield any good outcome.
If you're going to "tut tut" Japan don't forget our federal govt once again had to be dragged into lockdown by the states and territories, the media is still trying push "economy first" as well as a PM hellbent on unnecessarily re-opening schools. This virus takes lives regardless of health or age.Quote:
Originally Posted by drifand
Same thing looks to be happening over there tbh - the prefectural/municipal governments are the ones taking it seriously, while the national government will probably have to be dragged along with them once things start getting ugly.Quote:
Originally Posted by SMHFConvoy
Some of my best friends over there are 60-years-old+ teachers, many with some underlying health issues to boot, it's pretty worrying.
On the plus side for me, I have the option to work from home for two days a week (yes, thanks boss!), but my better half is seriously stressing out about all the corona news going around.
It would seem the PM of Japan is concerned about the economy a LOT which is why this has taken so long, which I can kind of understand, but having a look at the bigger picture, Japan's workforce, approximately 12% is classed as senior, if they all die, that too will have a bad effect on the economy as well.
On the plus side though, the govt is supplying two (2) small cloth masks for each HOUSEHOLD:rolleyes: that better be Japanese made, and on a more serious note; my local supermarket has finally started putting the snack type foods in containers, instead of having them lying on the bench in the open. Seriously not even sneeze guards were up. Disgusting! Even before the COVID thing was happening JP people would cough without covering their faces all over these foods.... All people in my family were banned from buying off those displays, only buying the ones in containers!
The national governments are all thinking "those who AREN'T affected will be angry next time they vote if the economy is in the toilet and they'll take it out on us, having forgotten about COVID".Quote:
Originally Posted by Ode to a Grasshopper
Keep in mind Morrison doesn't have direct responsibility for health. It's not "his" problem that the hospital systems are stretched - that's the premier's problem.
Of course, it's kinda BS, but they're acting with an eye on the next election cycle, aware that many people have short memories.
John Howard had my support on the gun control measures early on, but lost me when he followed Dubya into Iraq. I still remember than when it came to how I felt about him/his party at every election he contested since... but many forget these things and just look at the slogans at election time.
^ Traditionally when the economy is strong voters are less likely to elect a leader. But when the economy is bad people are far more likely to elect a new leader.
And the 2013 election outcome was engineered by pushing the narrative that Labor were children (Rudd, Gillard, Rudd), there was a budget emergency (a falsehood) and that the coalition were excellent economic managers (again, a falsehood, we were headed into a recession before the pandemic.)Quote:
Originally Posted by DELTAprime
The current uptick for Morrison as preferred PM, is down to Labor's contribution to the stimulus package and JobKeeper, not because of anything the coalition has actually done.
I am seeing a lot more plush toys and chalk drawings/messages on footpaths as I go for walks. :D
I've heard of people doing that. Any other time I'd assume it was the work of a crazy person.Quote:
Originally Posted by Autocon
As I'm seeing more stores catching up with things like toilet paper and mince meat, I'm now seeing a lot of grocery stores (both Coles and Woolies) being completely empty of all eggs in the last week. Something seems to be disrupting the supply of eggs to Coles and Woolies, as almost everything else is starting to show up in decent numbers now.
I feel really sorry for those in America, stuck with a president who just doesn't seem to understand basic science and common sense, which is costing thousands of lives because he doesn't want states to shut down to prevent the virus, and the ones that have shut down he wants them to start re-opening within weeks just as the virus numbers have only just start coming back down... rather than waiting until the virus numbers are at zero or close to it.
It doesn't help that Trump has a major conflict of interest as American President, due to being a businessman with billions invested in real estate and the share-market, he is too focused on protecting the economy or talking it up (to keep the share market in positive territory), because he needs to protect his fortune and family's fortune. Other career politicians are focussed on saving lives right now and worrying about the economy after the virus is eradicated or contained. Trump on the other hand, was not bothered when he was casually announcing that there is a potential for up to 100,000 Americans dying from Covid-19, instead of being saddened by that possibility, or committing to a much lower figure or strategies that could prevent that huge number of deaths. He often tells the media at the press briefings that states don't need as much testing and medical equipment, pointing out that states with very few cases don't need the equipment, while claiming that states with lots of cases are over-estimating the amount of equipment they need (and now that they are just a few days past the highest number of deaths, he's now less interested in helping states, because he is always saying that the virus is just going to die out on its own, as if it will suddenly stop being passed on to new people). So many of the deaths were preventable, but he will just go on blaming everyone else. I don't think Trump has ever taken responsibility for anything wrong during his presidency, claiming to be the smartest, most perfect person in the world, and as long as Fox News is there to keep reassuring him that he is perfect, anything that goes wrong is someone else's fault.
He's so worried about being re-elected, Trump has not only used his Covid-19 update press conferences to promote or defend everything he thinks he has done right, but now he has managed to mobilise his supporters in swing states to go out in public to protest the lockdowns, because it is affecting the economy (which affects his personal fortune), but the protesting will just increase the spread of the virus among the groups of people protesting together.
To top it all, Trump just announced his intention of shutting down Congress (as a right in the constitution that has never been used), because they are preventing him from appointing people to roles that they are not suited for, as they are the only ones with the power (outside of an election) to be able to stand in his way. Removing congress (which is like having our Prime Minister shutting down a minority hostile parliament... something that happened just before the last Federal Election), and discrediting the media (as well as prohibiting some from even attending the press briefings) leaves the American President taking on the role of dictator. Something Trump has admired (being friendly with the "presidents" of Russia, China and Nth Korea - all of which have control of their media, police/military, and/or elections, and have kept themselves in power for decades), and hasn't kept it a secret that he would love to have that same power in America, proposing changes to the constitution to allow him to stay as president.
If Trump loses the election this November, he is not going to go quietly... he will be a constant voice in the media and social media, criticising everything his replacement does... and expect him to run for the 2024 election, and every election after that until he dies of old age, as his power in the Republican party will prevent anyone well-known from running against him if they want to keep their current job in politics (anyone who has spoken out against Trump in the past has either been removed by him, or lost the support of their party and the voters who support Trump). While Trump is alive, I don't think there will be another Republican president, because he won't stand aside to allow someone else whom he would see as inferior to him (everyone is inferior to him), to be the Republican candidate.
Any excuse to segway to Trump trouncing... Carry on.
The dude needs trouncing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicran
Needs to cut back on eating carrots. ;) Perhaps carrots is the panacea to COVID-19.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trent
Gotta love the protests to end the lockdown. Just waiting for natural selection to run its course....
I think Trump and his blind followers have earned the Darwin Award for 2020.
It just shows how little he cares about others, for sacrificing his republican voters just to target democrat states as part of his re-election strategy (encouraging them to go out in public in crowds to protest the life-saving lockdown measures, in the same week that had the biggest number of deaths the USA has had so far)... and those people who are protesting are too stupid to see that they are just being used for his own political and financial benefit.
My workplace has applied for the Jobkeeper program, and even though they haven't yet been accepted, they sent out emails to us workers yesterday to have us fill in a form if we want to participate, which suggests that they will close down our worksite as soon as they are accepted by the government (which would mean, no more money until the Jobkeeper payments start in about 6 weeks time (which is meant to backdate the payments to when you were laid off).
Obviously we would want the payments if the company isn't going to be paying us anymore, so why ask us if we want to be part of the program.
Ironically, I would expect businesses (and shops) would be allowed to go back to work by the end of May (as the virus numbers should have bottomed out by then), so we would end up being closed down for the next 4-5 weeks, only to be told we can go back to work just before the Jobkeeper payment starts.
I wonder - if the government say that we can relax our lockdown to let people go back to shopping and work before the end of May, would they still pay out the Jobkeeper money to people who were out of work for several weeks, but were back to work when the payments were to be sent out in about 6 weeks time.
I might have to do some reading up on this before I sign up to anything.
When you see people shooting pictures of people they disagree with, you really have to question how low can people go and how stupid people really are.
Ah Trump, the guy who wouldn't let those pesky victims of 9/11 derail his interview* on that tragic day. So instead of cancelling the interview out of respect he went ahead and the closest he came to showing condolences was to express disappointment that the stock exchange had to be closed due to the attacks.
And now Trump wants to cut the WHO's funding because he see's the corona outbreak as a China vs. USA thing with WHO guilty of siding with China.
*Phone interview given to Alan Marcus (his former publicist).
I can't wait to stop hearing about Trump. Just 8 more months, Just 8 more months.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DELTAprime
Ahahahahaha. You think he’ll lose the election.
That’s cute.
Just saw a commercial on channel 7 reminding me of their impending new series of Big Brother.... as if people are going to want to watch other people trapped in a house at this time.
All you can eat Sausages, T&A... Yes they will.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
Didn’t the joint burn down recently?
People in America are out protesting against the forced lockdowns saying it goes against their freedoms. You can't get any more stupid than that. Maybe this virus is mother nature's way of purging. Unfortunately innocents die and stupidity thrives.
Can Joe Biden live til then? :pQuote:
Originally Posted by DELTAprime
New Zealand moves to Level 3 after the long ANZAC weekend; slightly larger bubble if you need it (though think!), construction, forestry and schools, and businesses that can do contactless delivery and payments (so, drive through McDonalds etc). Fingers crossed that our tracing is actually up to standard and we don't get more and more cases and have to go back into lockdown again. I just wish we had fines like Australia and Singapore do, but we don't - just police "informing" and saying please.
The fines are pretty good. My cousin nearly got a $13000 fine for not doing the 1.5m thing. The threat of a massive fine works wonders.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zippo
Sorry to hear this griffin. Here is the government link.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffin
https://treasury.gov.au/coronavirus/jobkeeper
From the fact sheet.
Quote:
EMPLOYEE OBLIGATIONS
Employees will receive a notification from their employer that they are receiving the JobKeeper Payment.
To be eligible, an employee must then complete a nomination form that indicates they meet the eligibility
criteria and agree to a claim by the employer. Employees with more than one employer must only
nominate with their primary employer, and a permanent employee can only nominate with their
permanent employer (even if they have another long-term casual job).
What? That seems excessive. :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by DELTAprime
Well, those who don't listen / care can be putting the lives of others at risk. In that context, a $13,000 fine seems reasonable, given lives are at stake.Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzcomp