Universal Counting Method Poll #20: Counting customs

[GoktimusPrime]

Customs should count, be they new characters, or anything similar. A lot of hard work and talent goes into them, if changing a "stock" toy to something new takes it out of a collection, I consider it unfair.

yes but kitbashes based on existing TF characters, or even sporting TF logos are technically illegal as they're infringing on HasTak's intellectual property.

e.g.: if you made a Masterpiece Inferno, even though that toy doesn't officially exist, the G1 Inferno character, name and likeness is property of HasTak and technically what has been made is an infringement of copyright. I think making the custom alone isn't something that HasTak would pursue (BotCon organisers cleared this up before they had their customs competitions) but if you then turned around and sold the custom then you would be doing something dubious... in principle this is what killed BotCon Japan.

And Article01 of the UCM clearly states that only items which are legally classified as Transformers (i.e.: manufactured under licence from HasTak) can count. If we were to remove that article then people would start counting KOs, non-Transformer transforming robot toys (e.g.: Macross) et al.

e.g. Nintendo Crossover - Donkey Kong aka High Score 100 Real Gear

...which would be an infringement against Nintendo's property. Again, making the custom isn't much, but if you then attempted to sell it... (re: BotCon Japan 2000 (-_-)).

If people opt for all customs to count there would have to be a disclaimer that it can only count if it is entirely made from legit TF parts and you did NOT pay for it so that Article20 doesn't contradict Article01.

[jaydisc]

I'm having a hard time choosing one of the above. I think it's all about what materials have been used. If someone makes a custom TF out of a Roadbot, it shouldn't count. If they make it out of a TF, there's no reason they should LOSE that count.

[GoktimusPrime]

For the purposes of this poll let's assume that the kitbash would be entirely made out of Transformers. If the votes favour for kitbashes to count I would enforce the ruling from Article01 so that only kitbashes made from TF parts would count. Basically Article01 would negate kitbashes made from non-TF toys like Roadbots, KOs etc.

hrmmm... my example of kitbash wasn't very good considering that I used a KO Dragoonball GT (that's not a mispelling, it was the name of the toy) toy head, but it's the only kitbash I've ever done. But anyway, let's work under the assumption that we're talking about customs made ONLY from Transformers and nothing else.

P.S.: To that extent scratch built parts and toys (e.g.: using parts made from super sculpey) wouldn't count either as those parts weren't manufactured under licence by TakaraTOMY. For BotCon Japan 2000 fans created a convention exclusive AI figurine that was scratch-built; Takara refused to classify it as an official toy and I remember when I posted an image of that toy I was very quickly told to remove it! Eep!

[roller]

i voted none

i love my Ozformers chainmaster Spectre, but if i ever bothered to count my collection, i would not include him

If i made a figure myself, like my planned War within Kup

i would not count it

same if i reapainted an Acid storm to his show colours, its a custom, not an official toy

[Thanatos]

Perhaps you could just count "bases" as doubles? IE I have a Custom Thundercracker made from a Starscream (Classics). Now I could count it as 2 Starscreams, since technically, that's exactly what it is. Same for Classics Overdrive, made from a Rodimus classics figure. Just count as a second Rodimus.

Yes/No? Maybe?

[GoktimusPrime]

That sounds like poll option #2 to me, Thanatos.

[lcz128]

Only just had a chance to even look at this post and I think it's a great mind poker. :\
What about say - a custom Classics Shockwave that has his arms from a Classics Prime on the base of an Energon Shockwave?
Things like that which is kind of a frankenstein custom... So - not custom built or scratchbuilt per se -

Or a Classics Jazz that is really a prowl - but with say - a robotheroes jazz head- (i've heard of someone doing that )

[GoktimusPrime]

What about say - a custom Classics Shockwave that has his arms from a Classics Prime on the base of an Energon Shockwave?
Things like that which is kind of a frankenstein custom... So - not custom built or scratchbuilt per se -

Or a Classics Jazz that is really a prowl - but with say - a robotheroes jazz head- (i've heard of someone doing that )

Those are kitbashes.

[jaydisc]

I support kitbashes counting, but only if mostly based on TF parts. Unfortunately, defining "mostly" would be an exercise in futility.

[dirge]

Unfortunately, defining "mostly" would be an exercise in futility.

Yeah, this one opens up so many grey areas. Personally, I don't count customs at all - just to keep things simple