Vector Sigma / Transmetal Driver

[Verno]

What happens next? What happens next? I want more!

Do the Maximals take up Jhiaxus' research, or rediscover it?

They're shown to not be adverse to some weird experiments of their own. They meddle with Rampage's spark trying to replicate Starscream's inextinguishable one. And then there is Transmutate, who I've always seen as another experiment gone wrong.

I've always wanted to know how Rhinox knew to go offline and could hack into the Matrix/All Spark to get Primal's spark back. Transwarp technology has obviously brought about an ability to do so.

Some great postulating there Hursty. Something i read yesterday about the Cybertronian Empire, under the Liege Maximo, was that with each new TF created through buddying, their contact with Primus was lessened and the 'bot was more sullen and unenlightened or something. That could be explained by your going past the population limit.

[GoktimusPrime]

Primus created 13 Transformers... not sure if all of them were "Primes" (don't know if you'd consider the Liege Maximo and Maccadam to be Primes). In fact, in G1 continuity, being a "Prime" was merely a titled given to Autobot leaders. It wasn't a "genetic dynasty" like in the movie continuity. And even then, according to the movie continuity there were only 7 Primes - so presumably the other 6 original Transformers weren't Primes... which would make sense, because if all the original Transformers were Primes, then wouldn't it mean that all the current Transformers would be their descendants (and not just Sentinel and Optimus)? e.g. Megatron, Bumblebee, Ironhide et al. are most likely descendants of those other 6, since none of them bear the "mark of Prime." But again, all this stuff about the dynasty of the Primes comes from the movie universe - AFAIK this concept isn't a multiversal singularity, so doesn't necessarily apply to other continuities.

[Hursticon]

@Verno: More to come dude , but please throw up some more tidbits as you've done in your last post as it is great food for though.

@Goki:Cheers for the info Goki, that sort of thing helps and I will make some amendments later tonight as what you've said about 7 Primes and 6 Originals is news to me , but makes complete sense on both a Dynastical and Genetical standpoint.
(Remember though, we're trying to create a series of 'Grafts' of Non-Offical Ret-con essentially

[GoktimusPrime]

The thing about 7 Primes and 6 Non-Prime Original Transformers isn't explicitly mentioned in movie continuity, but it's a logical conclusion considering that:
+ Revenge of the Fallen continuity states that in the beginning, the AllSpark created 7 Primes. No other Transformers are mentioned as being created at the time (although it doesn't explicitly disclude them either).
+ The Original 13 Transformers are a multiversal singularity - thus the original 13 Transformers must exist in every Transformers universe.
+ Movie continuity has established that being a Prime is some kind of genetic heritage - i.e. only Transformers who are descendant from one of the original 7 Primes is a Prime; and bear the mark of the Prime somewhere on their body. Sentinel and Optimus are both from the lineage of the Primes.
+ Clearly not all Transformers are descendant of the Primes. In ROTF Optimus was supposedly the last of the Primes (after Sentinel Prime was presumed KIA) -- The Fallen claimed that only another Prime could threaten him and once Optimus was killed, he happily came to Earth, even though there were other Autobots present there. Clearly he didn't feel threatened by the other Autobots, presumably because they're not descendants of the Primes -- and presumably neither are any of the Decepticons, for if they were, The Fallen would probably have them killed too to eliminate them as potential threats to him.
+ In the movieverse comics, Megatron criticises the nepotism of having only Primes being their leaders. He sees himself as a more worthy successor to Sentinel Prime, even though he himself is not of the Prime dynasty.

Perhaps in your fanfic you could establish that each Prime is only able to reproduce once, whereas non-Prime Transformers have a higher "fertility rate"... because this would explain how in the beginning there were 7 Primes to 6 non-Primes, but then later on the number of Primes within the Cybertronian population became near extinct. If Primus intended for the Primes to be leaders, then it would stand to reason that he would limit their reproductive abilities in order to maintain balance amongst the Cybertronians.

But really, this is all looking at it purely from the movie-continuity POV. In all other Transformer universes being a Prime was never a genetic thing -- so if you're writing your thing to graft into the G1, G2 and BW continuity-family, I see no reason to even consider including any elements from the movie universe into it anyway.

13 Original Transformers = multiversal singularity, so you have to include it.
7 Original Primes = only in the movie universe. So feel free to ignore it if you want.

[Hursticon]

Excellent, all great food for thought dude and again, much appreciated.
I like certain elements of the Movieverse, but agree that not all of the original 13 should be Primes.
If all 13 were Primes there would be no room for 'dilution' of the Gene pool, as it were, subsequently no room for non-Prime Cybertronians so this is an excellent fix.

My intention was indeed to limit everyone of the original Cybertronians to a single offspring via Budding, sort of a 1 child policy if you will, as a method of population control (Primus' Will).

It seems to me that whilst there would be descendants of the Primes that would slowly be watered down, it would be these Cybertronians 'of Noble descent' that would fill the 'Ranking or Controlling Casts' with the descendants of the non-Prime originals filling all the other roles - The workers.
Non-Prime descendants could enter nobility by being an offsping of Prime and Non-Prime parents of the Budding Process but also take into account Optimus-

Let's say that as Orion Pax, he was a watered down descendant of a Prime but after his Infusion Reformatting with A3's CNA, this brought him WAY back towards being a full-blown Prime and could help to explain why he becomes such the revered leader he does?

This could also work towards Megatron's disdain for the hereditary rule of the Primes because whilst he believes that just because your of Prime descent, it doesn't mean you'll be an effective leader but deep-deep down he questions this because Optimus is displaying that he is a living example of the opposite.

See? - All great reasons as to why your 7 Primes, 6 Originals suggestion works so well.

[GoktimusPrime]

Non-Prime descendants could enter nobility by being an offsping of Prime and Non-Prime parents of the Budding Process

The Budding Process is strictly asexual - so all the genetic data contained in the offspring comes from a single parent. So if there is a Prime descendancy, then a descendant of a Prime would be a "pureblood" Prime. There's no "halfbloods" when dealing with an asexually reproductive species. Or if there were, it wouldn't be because of budding.

This could also work towards Megatron's disdain for the hereditary rule of the Primes because whilst he believes that just because your of Prime descent, it doesn't mean you'll be an effective leader but deep-deep down he questions this because Optimus is displaying that he is a living example of the opposite.

Yeah, that's pretty much what Megatron says in the movie-verse comics (current DotM prequel stuff).

"You don't vote for kings!"
Monty Python and the Holy Grail

[Hursticon]

You know what?, I can't believe I over-looker that fact about A-Sexual reproduction... More pondering required me thinks.

Ah, good old Python...
I've not read any of the Movie-verse material so to hear that works out nicely, cheers dude.