Goki's Rantage Engine: Alice In Wonderland

[roller]

No you're not wrong... We all just like different things

yeah thats true

i like Headmasters and Breastmasters compared to Brainmasters

[SOUNDBLASTER]

If I had to place myself into a continuity in the TRANSFORMERS world I would definatly be a BREASTMASTER

[liegeprime]

Well her "transformation reminds me of Mystique more than a tf, but the end result ( hideously fugly bot mode) reminds me of that Alien chick which kill men after mating with em. I dont care if she's hot, I aint liplocking with no man killing chick...

[kup]

We should all classify her as 'Never do it again and forget it ever happened'

[GoktimusPrime]

While it was the intention of the film's producers for Alice to be a Pretender, I don't recall her ever being referred to as one in the movie itself. Then again, the Constructicons were never called Constructicons in the movie either yet I happily classify them as Constructicons.

So if Alice qualifies as a Pretender in the movie universe, does this mean:
1/ All Transformers with a vehicle mode classify as Pretenders too? (Pretender Vehicles)
2/ If one follows the argument that in the movie-verse only Transformers with organic alt modes count as Pretenders, then hypothetically speaking if any Transformer were to appear in the movie with a true beast mode then shouldn't they count as Pretenders too? (Pretender Beasts)

Bring on movie Gunrunner and Carnivac!!

And you've got Lander pictured as your example of a Pretender - a character who morphs from a human to robot without any trace of a shell - just like Alice.

Yeah I know - I couldn't find decent pics of Landmine's robot and vehicle modes in a hurry so I just grabbed pics of Lander.

The only difference between the two is that we don't know whether Alice has a vehicle mode... or what passes for a vehicle mode amongst Pretenders, anyway - basically just lying down and spreading one's le... Oh hey - she does have a vehicle mode!

"I was wondering if I could ride you home, I mean give you a ride home!"
- Sam Witwicky

Shes freakin hott ....

I dont care what she is

ALICE & MEGAN.... OK I'm gonna stop thinking about that just b4 I go to bed .

But I still want her in my bed . lol

If I had to place myself into a continuity in the TRANSFORMERS world I would definatly be a BREASTMASTER

Down boy!

Also, am I wrong in saying that she just doesn't do it for me?

I totally agree with you.

[GoktimusPrime]

We should all classify her as 'Never do it again and forget it ever happened'

I really like the concept of Alice. If Transformers can transform into anything that they can scan, why not humans? It makes them suddenly much more dangerous too. In the first movie a Decepticon could be a police car or a CD player aboard Air Force One, but with Alice, she could be a girl sitting next to you in class! That's way freakier!

Now we still don't know if Transformers can actually scan organic objects or just facsimiles of organic objects, because according to the ROTF comic book adaptation, Alice scanned her alt mode from a mannequin of Alice In Wonderland from some amusement park ride; which seems implausible if she look and felt (but not tasted) realistic enough to pass of as a real human. Based off the film alone it did seem that her beast mode was scanned off an actual human with the real Alice killed shortly after.

But give me more movie Pretenders over any of Bay's attempts at lewd juvenile humour any day! Alice >>>>>>> Jetfire farting a parachute

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

She's a Bayverse pretender - just a hunch but chances are if they ever do a true Beastformer it won't be considered a Pretender but rather a Beast-mode transformer.
Just one more thing to thank Mr Boy-&-His-1st-Car Bay for mauling remaking/reintroducing to the mythos - try not to think about it too hard is my advice.

[GoktimusPrime]

I don't blame Bay for not introducing a real Pretender into the movie, because it would require either:
a/ Mass shifting; as seen in the G1 animation; Pretenders were able to grow to Transformer size before phasing out of their shells, then shrinking down to human size when inside their shells.
b/ Gigantic humans; as seen in the G1 Marvel comics. The Pretenders were only able to pass off as human(oid)s when they were on places other than Earth where other giant humans lived/frequented such as Grand Central Space Station, Femax, VsQs, Pz-Zazz, Cheyne etc.

But for the live action movie; being set on Earth and where mass shifting would look stupid, I can understand why Bay didn't go with a true G1-style Pretender. But in modifying/adapting the Pretender concept for the movieverse he has inadvertantly created - at least in my eyes - a beast moded TF rather than what is traditionally considered to be a Pretender.

[Sky Shadow]

So if Alice qualifies as a Pretender in the movie universe, does this mean:
1/ All Transformers with a vehicle mode classify as Pretenders too? (Pretender Vehicles)

Of course not: since the vehicles of Pretender Vehicles can't transform into robot mode, the only way the movie bots with vehicle modes could be Pretender Vehicles is if they're all the transforming inner robots of PVs and they left their vehicle shells at home. And to believe that would be really ignoring Occam's Razor to the Nth degree.

2/ If one follows the argument that in the movie-verse only Transformers with organic alt modes count as Pretenders, then hypothetically speaking if any Transformer were to appear in the movie with a true beast mode then shouldn't they count as Pretenders too? (Pretender Beasts)

If someone in power says they're Pretender Beasts then yes, that's what they are. Seriously, it's not like what happens in the movie universe is the same as what happened in G1. In Revenge Of The Fallen, a Seeker is a member of a group of individuals including Jetfire and Ransack who seek the Allspark. The Matrix Of Leadership is a key to a thingy that destroys stars. A Pretender's robot form may or may not have a vehicle mode. And a plot is... well... nobody knows what a plot is.

[Lord_Zed]

I really like the concept of Alice. If Transformers can transform into anything that they can scan, why not humans? It makes them suddenly much more dangerous too. In the first movie a Decepticon could be a police car or a CD player aboard Air Force One, but with Alice, she could be a girl sitting next to you in class! That's way freakier!

Alice did add some suspense to the movie with the Library scene that was largley lacking in most other scenes actualy. And it's about the only new addition of Bay's that I've seen film critics praise. I don't mind her robot form either, as it reminds me of the robot from Metropolis.

Seriously, it's not like what happens in the movie universe is the same as what happened in G1. In Revenge Of The Fallen, a Seeker is a member of a group of individuals including Jetfire and Ransack who seek the Allspark. The Matrix Of Leadership is a key to a thingy that destroys stars.

The Matrix got upgraded from something that destroys Unicron, to something that destroy's stars, everything is bigger and balstier in the Bayverse!